Hilary Clinton far from finished, according to polls

[unlawflcombatnt]

Hilary Clinton is far from finished, according to multiple polls, especially in the next 3 primary states (Kentucky, West Virginia, and Oregon).

Below is a composite graph showing the polls in the 3 upcoming primaries;



Below is a direct link to the polls and the site:

http://www.realclearpolitics.com/epolls/2008/president/democratic_delegate_count.html#upcomingstates

Democratic super-delegates and the Democratic Party has better think hard before they simply hand the primary to Obama, especially when big and strongly pro-Clinton states have been excluded from the primary. If the election were held today, Obama would lose both Florida and Ohio. And if Pennsylvania's razor-thin margin for Obama did not hold, he'd lose Pennsylvania as well. If the Dems lost those 3 states, McCain would definitely be the next President. Even if Dems lost "only" lost 2 of these states, Florida and Ohio, McCain would likely win the election.

[shadowknows69]

1. Yeah.....Um, No.

[PoliticalAmazon]

98. Just more of the same with the Hillary campain. I'm glad Obama's moving forward...

Hillary's campaign is just one giant quagmire that America cannot afford to get mired down in.

[psychopomp]

135. **Here's a poll: Superdelagates - O:279 C:270.5**

http://demconwatch.blogspot.com/2008/01/superdelegate-list.html

[Jersey Devil]

2. Great! She can be President of West Virtucky

Who is going to be veep?

[Name removed]

12. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[riskpeace]

20. Perfect irony is

this post and your user name plus your signature line.
That guy gets to vote too.

[BeyondGeography]

26. As do eggheads and African-Americans

:thumbsup:

[Heather MC]

23. STOP it! STOPit ! I can't breathe!!!!!!

[theHandpuppet]

27. And it's exactly these kinds of posts...

...that lead some to level a charge of elitism against a certain faction of Obama supporters.

As a West Virginian myself, the continuing stream of bigoted, hateful posts against Appalachians here on DU is beyond shameful. Do these kinds of posts reflect the attitudes among the majority of Obama supporters? Are you proud of these attitudes and prejudices?

SHAME!!!!!!!!!

[Carni]

50. It's really a bunch of BS

The rude and obnoxious behavior of some of these posters is offensive, but they don't get it. Maybe this fall they will begin to realize that you cannot randomly offend large blocks of people without repercussions!

[Cha]

99. Maybe hilary will realize she insulted

LARGE BLOCKS of voters with her fucking lying and smearing..do you think it will enter that clueless head of hers?

[unlawflcombatnt]

109. Clearly Obama's lies have gotten through to you

And you've bought into every one of them.

[Cha]

111. Clearly you're drunk on whatever hilary's drinking at the moment.

"Why Hillary’s Lies are Important"

- March 24, 2008, 9:53PM
Hillary Clinton has been caught in a series of lies and misrepresentations during the primary campaign. To some of her supporters, these lies may seem trivial and insignificant and even politics-as-usual. However, please consider the serious impact of these lies by placing them in the context of the past seven years of the Bush Administration and the legacy of expanded executive power that he leaves behind. In particular, consider the dangerous message that the Clinton campaign sends by employing similar tactics to achieve her political goals.

1. The Florida and Michigan Primaries / The Delegate Count
Hillary agreed to honor the DNC’s decision to strip Florida and Michigan of its delegates after their primaries were moved up into January in express violation of the DNC rules. She did not change her position on the validity of these primaries until she found herself unexpectedly behind in the delegate count and desperately needed to claim the delegates that she had won in these unsanctioned contests. As her chances of winning the nomination became increasingly slim in recent weeks, we have been presented with threatening and desperate lines of reasoning for why these primary results should count as is. At the same time, Clinton and her surrogates continue to propose different metrics for determining who should win the nomination even though there is and has been a clearly defined process in place for several decades.

Please think about the implications of changing election rules after the fact. We have suffered through at least one stolen presidential election and the manipulation of untold numbers of Congressional and state elections through various vote tampering and voter intimidation schemes used by the Republicans and their allies. The American people (and especially Democratic voters) have lost faith in the integrity of the election process. The Clinton strategy to continually change the rules for determining the Democratic Party nominee sets a dangerous precedent that could lead to increasingly un-Democratic elections in the future if it is allowed to succeed. If anything, we need more transparency and methods of accountability in our elections in order to repair the damage done in recent years and to restore our confidence in the Government.

2. The Bosnia Fabrication / Exaggerated Experience Claims
Hillary fabricated a story about a dangerous, life-risking visit to Bosnia in order to gain stature as an experienced negotiator in international conflicts and war. While this type of embellishment can seem almost comical, it represents a willingness to distort reality in order to influence the public perception. This is the same type of distortion that the Bush administration used to justify the war in Iraq, although the magnitude of the lie is certainly on a different scale. The Bush administration falsified reports, cherry-picked intelligence, used unreliable sources, and employed fear-mongering tactics to convince the American public that our safety was at risk and as such, you were either with us or with the terrorists. The lies used by President Bush and Vice President Dick Cheney are impeachable offenses and should be condemned by all Americans. Sadly, the Clinton campaign seems to have shown a shocking willingness to employ the same tactics to create a more favorable reality and to rely on divide-and-conquer rhetoric to weaken opposition. Her attempts to frighten the American people by conjuring up 3 AM phone calls are bad enough, but her vote of confidence in John McCain over Barack Obama should be seen as treason against the Democratic Party.

3. NAFTA
Hillary lied about her position on NAFTA and used her lies in a calculated way to influence the Ohio primary. Recently released White House documents confirm that Hillary had been an active proponent of NAFTA prior to its passage, and she has continued to support it publicly in her speeches and memoir. However, while campaigning in Ohio, she claimed to have been privately against NAFTA during the Clinton presidency and believes that it should be rewritten to protect American jobs and workers. This type of maneuvering is reminiscent of the behind-closed-doors policy-making that the Bush administration has used during the past seven years. Specifically, Bush and Cheney have made policy decisions without providing transparency to Congress or the public, and President Bush has repeatedly ignored the rule of law by issuing signing statements and disregarding the parts of the laws that he doesn’t agree with. If we cannot trust Hillary to be truthful about her positions on critical legislative issues now, how can we trust that she will be truthful as president?

These are just three examples that illustrate the concerns we should have with a candidate who demonstrates a sense of entitlement to the nomination and is willing to lie, misrepresent, threaten, and divide in order to obtain the nomination. President Bush and the neoconservative movement have greatly harmed this country by the creation of an imperial-like presidency. This election is not just about whether a Democrat or Republican wins but if the checks and balances are restored to the three branches of government. The framers of the Constitution were in such fear of an imperial president that mechanisms for impeachment are prominently and explicitly included in the Constitution. If Hillary Clinton is willing to use lies and deceit to win the Democratic nomination, what assurances do we have that she will not continue to use them once she is president?
http://tpmcafe.talkingpointsmemo.com/talk/2008/03/why-h ...

<snip>

"Her response to being caught lying to a military audience, when she invented a story about being under sniper fire in Bosnia, was to say it wasn't surprising she got some things wrong, seeing how she spoke millions of words every day. What a magnificent idea, that if you say lots of words some of them are bound to be fantastic lies. So if you listen carefully to horse-racing commentators they say things like "And it's Teddy's Boy still leading three furlongs out as they come up to the fourth last fence with Nip and Tuck two lengths behind by the way I fought a tiger once, punched it clean out and they're all safely over."


<lots more>
http://www.belfasttelegraph.co.uk/news/opinion/article3 ...

"It's not that lying to pad the resume, avoid Indictment or to advance her political fortune is anything new for Hillary Clinton. She famously said she was named after Sir Edmund Hillary (debunked); she told New Yorkers she was a Yankee fan when she lived in Chicago (debunked); she told rural New Yorkers that she was a "duck hunter" (debunked); she claimed that her daughter Chelsea was jogging around the World Trade Center at the time of the 9/11 attack (debunked by Chelsea herself.) And, those subpoenaed Rose Law billing records just happened to show up one day on a hallway table in the most monitored home in America!"

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.ph...

[unlawflcombatnt]

117. You Obama Liars Take the Cake

Talk about the pot calling the kettle black.

Obama has been lying his fanny off since the election started.

Meanwhile, you Obama cultists continue to dishonestly invent lies about Clinton that never occurred. A classic Obama-tard lie is the one you dishonestly posted below.

"3. NAFTA
Hillary lied about her position on NAFTA and used her lies in a calculated way to influence the Ohio primary."

3 separate people have stated unequivocally that Hilary was never a true supporter of NAFTA. These are people who actually knew her, including David Gergen and a long-standing Clinton hater, author Carl Bernstein. This is not "here-say." They both said so on television, and millions of Americans, such as myself, actually heard them live.

"However, while campaigning in Ohio, she claimed to have been privately against NAFTA during the Clinton presidency and believes that it should be rewritten to protect American jobs and workers."

Obama is a pathological liar. He's also a spineless, cowardly crybaby.

He has no redeeming qualities whatsoever.

[Cha]

120. You're full red herrings while you don't address hilary LIES..

You musta been with hilary in Bosnia and got Sniped on the head..my condolences to you.

[unlawflcombatnt]

125. Because they've been exaggerated and completely made up in many cases

And some have no consequence, unlike Obama's bald-faced lie about telling the Canadians that they shouldn't worry about NAFTA (being repealed or revised). Obama's globalist buddies have nothing to worry about if the Great One is elected. He won't let the rich become less rich. That's his main goal.

[Cha]

129. That's a hilary lie...but you knew that..btw, which one are you?

[unlawflcombatnt]

134. No, you're claim is the lie

Obama's advisors most certainly DID talk to Canadian officials about their lack of conviction about opposing NAFTA, while Obama continued lying about it until evidence came out proving he was lying. And now you're espousing the same, already disproven lie.

Obamatrons can't seem to remember when they've already been busted for lying, as evidenced by the re-emergence of this lie.

The Obama camp unquestionably did tell Canadian officials not to worry about Obama's phony opposition to NAFTA.

I suppose the next lie you'll come up with is that Obama never even knew Reverend Wright. Or maybe he never knew Tony Rezko.

[Zhade]

178. Another lie on your part. The Canadian government confirmed that your allegation NEVER HAPPENED.

NT!

[Zhade]

177. Tuzla video. Government records of her pro-NAFTA meetings.

Those aren't made up. Those are proof of her lies.

Your delusions are worrisome.

[MyNameGoesHere]

155. I am wondering. Are you incapable of spelling

Hillary's name correctly? Or maybe you are a "passer"? You know not educated and making under 50,000.00 Shhhh. I will keep your secret. I know it must be hard to belong to that crowd. How long have you been "passing"?

[Zhade]

176. You have no evidence of Obama's "lies". The other poster spanked you with evidence of clinton's.

You lost this round, ace.

[Carni]

156. So the Freepers were right ?

Because that is apparently what you and some of your more militant Hillary hating cohorts here on DU are saying...that all those years the freepers et all were right all along about the Clintons.

The logic of some of the most insulting of you here is amazing...if you want to show Obama in a good light you might not want to froth at the keyboard and attack with cartoons and other freepesque type bullshit about HRC...I saw enough of that to last me a lifetime throughout the late 90's.

I still maintain that strategically you Obama supporters just don't get it.

[JoFerret]

174. This is so true.

Sore winners at best. (Not all of course. But the lunatic fringe will still be frothing two years into the next president's term. Bad strategy. Appalling tactics.)

[rodeodance]

110. you and your smearing are an insult to this board.

[donheld]

143. Now there's a pot calling a Kettle black if there ever was one

[unlawflcombatnt]

181. Which applies to the Obama camp even more

Obama and his supporters cans sure dish it out. But they can't handle the slightest bit of criticism.

[unlawflcombatnt]

150. They certainly haven't caught on yet

The Obama cult continues to viciously attack Hilary supporters at every turn. And then they start crying like babies when even the slightest criticism goes in the Great One's direction.

[Name removed]

75. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[A-Schwarzenegger]

80. Yep.

:-(

[unlawflcombatnt]

88. Yes

And that's one of many reasons why Clinton should be the nominee.

[eridani]

127. The Tuzla liar vs an ex-POW? You're kidding, right? n/t

[unlawflcombatnt]

137. What?

What point are you making?

[eridani]

148. Clinton continued to lie about being under sniper fire in Tuzla

--on three separate occasions after the YouTube video demonstrating the contrary had already had a million hits. An excellent campaign tool for the Repukes, no? Framing herself as having faux "military" experience is the biggest gift she could possibly have given to McCain. In making "experience" and military "toughness" the issues vs Obama, she's just lost big time to McCain, against whom she can't possibly compete in those areas.

[Zhade]

179. Notice how they stop talking about it once you point out the evidence?

NT!

[unlawflcombatnt]

92. Just Like Pennsylvania

They're taking the same attitude toward West Virginians as they did against rural Pennsylvanians. Obamatrons look down on all blue collar working Americans.

[MrRobotsHolyOrders]

93. For maximum effect

Really, you shouldn't limit yourself so much with your use of punctuation.

Try this:

SHAME!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

But seriously, I would totally vote Republican because... wait, what was your reason again?

[stillcool]

103. And where does all this shit come from?

I'm 50 years old, and I have never heard an entire state declared "hard working blue collar uneducated white people'. Divide and Conquer..the American way. Next thing you know we'll be just like Iraq. But then...I support Obama, so I don't 'count'..even though I am a hard working uneducated white person. I guess I'm in the wrong state.

[IsItJustMe]

121. No, they do not. A very few in fact. But that is life isn't it. There are always a few idiots in

every crowd. Ever notice that. It is what it is. I am sorry if you are offended.

[unlawflcombatnt]

122. They certainly DO represent many Obama supporters

And it represents the views of elitist Obama himself.

[IsItJustMe]

124. I support Obama, I don't feel that way. How do know for sure? Just saying.

[unlawflcombatnt]

147. You may be an exception

But it's quite apparent here on DU that Obama does have a lot of elitists in his camp. Just take a look at all of the alleged jokes about West Virginians, and how backward and out-of-touch they're portrayed as being. It sounds just like the speech Obama gave to a bunch of rich elitist snobs in Northern California, where he ridiculed Pennsylvanians for wrongly blaming free trade and illegal immigration for suppressing their wages and costing them jobs.

Obama's attitude in that speech typifies the attitude of a large number of his supporters.

[backscatter712]

44. That's about right.

The only demographic she has left...

[unlawflcombatnt]

95. That and the majority of non-elitist, non-affluent working Americans

Obama represents the elitist, pro-globalist, hot-air lobby.

The media loves him because he talks so "articulately," while saying nothing of substance. Just like media commentators do.

[eridani]

128. Both candidates are triangulating centrists

One organizes voters and can manage a campaign; the other doesn't and can't.

[ej510]

69. Lol!

:rofl: :rofl: :rofl:

[2rth2pwr]

76. Funny. If that guy's skin color was black, would you still think it was funny?

[unlawflcombatnt]

115. No, the Obamatrons would be crying racism if he was Black

Another prime example of the hypocrisy of the Obama cult.

[ampad]

83. Thanks a lot

Now the theme song to Deliverance will be in my head all day.

[DerekJ]

91. ..

:rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl:

[Cha]

97. She has this dude on the ropes, too..

[unlawflcombatnt]

138. Great way for Obama to win over rural Americans -- Not

Very clever. I'm sure voters in West Virginia and Kentucky will appreciate being made fun of.

[NJmaverick]

24. LOL!

:rofl:

[David__77]

70. I love it!

It's so funny that some are still clinging to some notion that it's like this election is just beginning, when indeed it's almost over. 169 delegates is impossible to overcome at this point...

[Shakespeare]

81. LOL!!! Here's a VP suggestion:

[Carni]

157. This is pretty F'ing sick

Making fun of an indigent kid with physical disabilities...how are you people so *progressive* anyway?

The hypocrisy around this place is AMAZING!

[unlawflcombatnt]

158. That's for sure

The Obama camp certainly has no respect for West Virginians.

[unlawflcombatnt]

87. And Obama can be President of the few states he'd win in the General Election

And he'd be lousy even then.

[InAbLuEsTaTe]

96. Good one!

[unlawflcombatnt]

183. Good one?

How so?

[book_worm]

3. she's finally discovered she likes small red states afterall as long as she wins them!

[sellitman]

10. LMAO!!!

Great reply!


:rofl: :rofl: :rofl:

[babylonsister]

25. Funny how that's working for her now, isn't it. My neck is sore

from my head spinning!

[unlawflcombatnt]

107. And Obama still hates blue collar working people

That's why he wants to increase globalization and free trade, so he can put more blue collar American workers out of jobs, and help his rich globalist campaign contributors profit from replacing American workers with cheap foreign workers.

[eridani]

130. So why are Bill and Mark Penn shilling for the Columbia "free" trade act?

And trying to sell our port security to Dubai?

[unlawflcombatnt]

139. Why is Obama himself always saying we need more Globalization?

Why are Obama's 3 economic advisors all unrepentant pro-globalist free traders?

Is it because the Great One himself is a globalist one-world government advocate, and would like to outsource as many American jobs as possible?

Maybe that's why blue collar working Americans dislike Obama so much.

[eridani]

149. Clinton's economic advisers are not the slightest bit different

Bill Clinton himself is pushing the Columbia deal. Mark Penn is shilling for Columbia, Blackwater and the Aquadots poison toy people among others. There is no corporate scumbag that his firm has NOT worked for. That Clinton chose him as chief strategist does not speak well for her intentions about helping blue collar Americans.

You and Clinton are functionally Republicans, as is everyone who pushed the Repuke "elitist" frame that has been used for 30 years against any and all Dems, no matter how populist. And you are so very proud of yourselves for being textbook shillers for the real elite, as described in What's the Matter with Kansas? If blue collar workers are too tired after work to look up information that does not have an MSM filter, why are you happy about that situation?

[depakid]

4. Hillary will win 2 out of 3

She'll lose Oregon handily -my guess would be by 6-7 points, possibly a bit more.

[Rosa Luxemburg]

14. I agree

[Tippy]

21. I think that has been a given since early on...

[unlawflcombatnt]

145. Maybe even more, but she'll win much bigger in WV & Kentucky

Current polls have Clinton beating Obama over 2:1 in West Virginia. The same is true with Kentucky.

[Meshuga]

5. She will be back in full force when she wins the vast majority

of the 39 delegates from WV. It is going to be HUGE!!!


:rofl:

[MyNameGoesHere]

8. We like to think our 39 are just as important as

everyone else.

[trumad]

11. They are

but Hillary sure didn't think that way at the beginning when she thought she'd blow away Obama.

[Meshuga]

13. It was going to be

If Clinton won by a large margin in Indiana and had better results in NC. But that was not the case so it is not going to be much help to Hillary. That's the reality of the system we have in place.

[Hawkeye-X]

106. 39 = 28?

That's how many ACTUAL pledged delegates WV has to offer for otmorrow.

More HillaryMath.

[MyNameGoesHere]

154. My mistake and HRC did not say that. I just took the op's words and

went with it. See your blind hatred of HRC shines like a beacon. Can i have some more of that hope, unity, and change horseshit you guys have?

[unlawflcombatnt]

162. No

It's all reserved for the Great One.

[tekisui]

146. It's 28, and IF she gets 75%, she'll net 14 Delegates,

No where near what Obama has pulled in this week alone:

25. 3 of those switches FROM Hillary.

Sure WV delegates count, they just don't change the game.

[joeybee12]

6. She needs to go to the end, if nothing more than to let these people vote

and feel as if their vote matters...and not just the votes in Iowa. The primary system needs serious revamping.

[my3boyz]

9. Yeah but their votes won't change the math! They can't make her win just because they voted for her.

ALSO, she could suspend her campaign ala Edwards and her supporters could still vote for her because her name is on the ballot.

[Rosa Luxemburg]

15. yes

[Ronnie]

39. Thoughtful post.

A rarity these days.

[msallied]

54. They can still vote for her even if she's out of the race. Remember Edwards?

[cali]

7. Sorry, it's already over. SDs have made clear that they're going for

Obama. Last week it wasn't so much a trickle as a steady stream. That will continue this week. Obama now only needs 159 delegates to get to 2024. The trend for dems in November is strong. Even if he lost FL and OH, Obama could win by picking up VA, CO and NM. NC is also possibly in play. Hillary is done. Time to move on. Oh, and she wouldn't win FL anyway.

[Life Long Dem]

16. Obama is headed to Florida next week to campaign.

OH, I think Obama ended up reducing her double digit lead.

[VotesForWomen]

141. i'm sure he'll get a warm welcome there. NOT. nt

[lojasmo]

151. I bet he attracts more people than a vast majority

of Clinton rallies ANYWHERE.


20K V 4K in Minnesota, for example.

[Exultant Democracy]

159. 10k or 20k people will probably show up everywhere he goes, you need to come back to earth.

[cosmik debris]

17. Looks bogus to me

Your graphic shows different polls in different states.

To be valid, you need to use the same polls in the different states.

That graphic compares apples and oranges.

It gives the impression that the producers of that graphic searched for the data that would best fit their theory rather that looking at all the data objectively.

[unlawflcombatnt]

118. It's the way they do it

And when they have polls showing Obama doing better, they stick them right in there and average it in with the total.

The most reliable single poll to date has been the Survey USA poll

[Rosa Luxemburg]

18. I'm curious to see what the latest polls are

if they have any.

[WeDidIt]

19. Hillary completely finsihed according to delegates

She has already been mathematically eliminated.

[crankychatter]

22. Delegates are elected... they represent voters... and we're much MORE than math, eh? n/t

:-)

we're only math when we don't help Hillary

[oasis]

28. The dozens of generals and admirals who now support Hillary will likely

back McCain if she drops out. That's another reason for her to stick it out.

[bowens43]

31. Evidence to back this up?

[roguevalley]

57. they don't need evidence. delusional candidate, delusional supporters.

[Inuca]

38. Oh, really?

Come back when Clark for instance endorses McCain. I understand that having the candidate you believe in lose and being ridiculed in the media (and by many here) is difficult, but why do you have to spout such nonsense?

[oasis]

66. Nonsense? Get a clue. Who do they believe is strongest on national defense?

[Inuca]

67. They claim Clinton. So?

Does this imply that with her out of the race they will endorse McCain?!?!? Does not compute.

[eridani]

131. That frame is Repuke, and it causes us to lose elections

Military force is utterly useless against the most serious security threats we now face. What our military is doing has absolutely nothing to do with defending US citizens.

[MrRobotsHolyOrders]

94. And they'll do it because of super mean messages on DU

"Admiral, did you see that vile, hateful post by IhAtEhIlLaRy4u last night?"
"I did! That really turned me off to Obama. Let's endorse a senile candidate pledged to endless war instead!"

[lojasmo]

29. OREGON?11!!1!!!1!!! ZOMG!

Give me a break.

[bowens43]

30. Nope. She's finished.

She could win ALL of the reminaing states and she still won't win get the nomination.

[high density]

32. Hillary Clinton finished, according to math.

Survey USA and ARG do not elect our candidates.

[FlaGranny]

33. Funny thing about polls - -

they don't decide elections.

[AZSlacker]

34. She has been projected to have blowouts in these 2 states since polling began there

Assuming the polls turn out to be accurate, it still isn't going to fundamentally shift the math into her direction. Sorry. Oh, and the election isn't going to be held today. It is still 6 months off, so allot can happen between now and then to change those #'s.

[EmperorHasNoClothes]

35. Hillary only has to win 94% in every remaining state to have the nomination tied up!

And then, On To The Whitehouse!!!



:eyes:

[MikeDJohn]

37. Yeah, she can do THAT, no sweat! eom

[Apollo11]

36. If Hillary wins Oregon, it would make many superdelegates think again.

But no recent poll has Hillary leading Obama in Oregon (No - January is not recent).

[Arugula Latte]

48. We won't let that happen. You can count on us dirty Birkenstock-wearing hippies!

I'm off to get my organic latte with soy milk now ...

:patriot:

[onenote]

40. This may come as a surprise to you, but the election is not being held today

And therefore, your speculation about what will happen in November is, well, just speculation.

Y'know, if the World Series was held today....well, I have no idea who would win. And neither do you.

[Seabiscuit]

41. A Yogi-ism that bears repeating: "It ain't over 'til it's over".

And it definitely "ain't over" yet.

[scheming daemons]

73. Yogi called.....

[Kittycat]

42. Winning WV & KY doesn't change anything

Why is that so difficult for some people to understand?

[marcus3xw]

43. Hillary Needs An Oregon Upset With Huge Wins in W.V. & Kentucky

.

[Tierra_y_Libertad]

45. She's fouled out of the game but is still practicing free-throws.

[libbygurl]

46. It ain't over till the lady in the pantsuit says it is!

The naysayers do NOT want the millions of other Dem primary votes to count. Is that democratic?

[roguevalley]

58. good grief. they will vote and count. it WON'T MATTER! She's

over, now or later. Over.

[eridani]

132. They haven't counted for over 30 years. Why should this year be different? n/t

[unlawflcombatnt]

170. You're right. It is not Democratic

For Hilary to drop out, or for the superdelegates to commit before the primaries are over, deprives those states of any influence on the outcome.

That certainly is not Democratic.

[libbygurl]

47. B0 is also counting on those extra 7 (of the 57) states' superdelegates, methinks.

[susankh4]

49. Thanks!

My friends in KY and West Va would like to be heard on this.

I sure wish people would quit telling them their votes "don't count" to the Dem party. Cuz they sure as hell will count to the GOP come fall.

[swishyfeet]

51. Nobody says they don't count - they just don't matter

Here in Oregon they don't matter either. This thing is over.

[susankh4]

53. If they matter then....

let the voting continue!

Nothing is over until we see who wins in the G.E. in November.

[swishyfeet]

60. The voting absolutely will continue

Nobody can stop it.

Most people here probably don't even mind that she's in the race until the primaries are finished - as long as she isn't attacking a Democrat.

[alcibiades_mystery]

62. Is somebody arguing that they should be prevented from VOTING???

:rofl:

You people are fucking hilarious. The delusions of victimhood are boundless.

[susankh4]

63. Somebody (you?) is arguing that it is *over.*

No point in voting.

Just send money.

Uh, no. I don't think anyone should send money to a candidate they don't get to vote for.

[unlawflcombatnt]

180. Amen

There's no reason not to continue the primaries.

[unlawflcombatnt]

185. You've got that right

As will the votes in Florida and Michigan.

[1776Forever]

52. With HRC's negatives, debts, and lose of SD's it might just come to this........

[TexasObserver]

55. won't change the math

[Hamlette]

56. Problem is, she's down 169 votes and those 3 states only get 131 votes

I agree it should play out. Too many volunteers have given time and energy to pull the rug out now but its over.

[jenmito]

59. Holy cow! Obama started at just 28% in OR and now he's going to kick Hillary's butt!

Thanks for the link!

[whatchamacallit]

61. Oh... I saw the title and thought it was a "Polack joke"

Oops.

[iamthebandfanman]

64. actually, yes she is ...

seeing as the results ultimately dont put her in the lead... so... she still lost.

i really wish you guys would get over this dillusional hype...
we really need to move onto the GE.


heck, i live in kentucky and even i know better.

[OPERATIONMINDCRIME]

65. Kentucky, West Virginia And Oregon Don't Count.

Ahhhhhh that felt good to say lol.

[Name removed]

74. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[theHandpuppet]

78. I can count at least one asshole posting on this thread

And since you probably consider me an asshole that makes two of us.

See, we CAN count.

[Name removed]

86. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[unlawflcombatnt]

161. Ignorance is Bliss

"Ahhhhhh that felt good to say lol."

[TexasObserver]

68. Yes, she is finished, and thank God for that.

Once again, however, you prove that neither her nor her supporters can do grade school math.

[libbygurl]

85. Go. To. Hell.

[unlawflcombatnt]

90. Amen

And well put, I might add.

[TexasObserver]

102. one plus one equals two

two plus two equals four

four plus four equals eight

[unlawflcombatnt]

119. And you point is?

That you can do addition?

[TexasObserver]

123. that if you can do simple math, you know Hillary has lost

Isn't the whole point of this thread you can't do simple math?

[Hawkeye-X]

108. Here. Take a bankie. You're gonna need one.

http://bp2.blogger.com/_nsLM7ib6zRI/RdffNwoG1rI/AAAAAAAAAPg/69qVk-B-mJ4/s400/Bankie+1972_pencil.jpg

[NashVegas]

113. While You Prove Obama Supporters Have No Grammar

[MindMatter]

71. Yet another for my ignore collection

[oasis]

72. OOOOoooooh.

:cry:......:eyes:

[unlawflcombatnt]

89. Yeah, I'm all broke up about it too

But I'm not going to cry about it, like Obama supporters do every time their idol gets even the slightest criticism.

[pointsoflight]

77. We choose our nominee by polls?!? Seriously?

I was under the mistaken impression that our nominee was chosen according to delegates. Silly me.

[anonymous171]

84. Polls gave us John Kerry.

[PresidentObama]

79. Polls < Math

[casus belli]

82. They showed Indiana a no-contest also and.... n/t

[democrat2thecore]

100. These small states MATTER now? --- OMG! - nt

[AtomicKitten]

101. Hilly don't need no stinkin' delegates.

[Blarch]

104. your right.

This race is based on the polls...not the delegates.

Jeeesh, will the spin ever stop ?

[PsycheCC]

105. interesting thread

[Auntie Bush]

112. K & R

[crankychatter]

114. Hillary Clinton is COMPLETELY done

wtf are YOU smokin?

[SoCalDem]

116. Like being promoted to first chair trombone in the Titanic band..on 4-12-14

:rofl:

[eridani]

126. If California held its election today, Obama would win n/t

[unlawflcombatnt]

165. What B.S.

If California held its election today, Obama would lose by 20 points.

Californians now know what a sleezeball he really is.

[eridani]

173. Google is your friend

http://liberalvaluesblog.com/?p=3254

The logic behind the Clinton argument that she is more electable than the presumptive nominee is based upon the assumption that Clinton would win the big states whose primaries she has won but Obama cannot. I’ve noted several flaws in the big state argument in the past. New Jersey has already provided one example of where Clinton won the primary by ten points but a subsequent poll in late April showed Obama leading Clinton by seven. California now provides another example.

A recent poll shows that, “California voters would change their February primary vote for Hillary Clinton to a vote for Barack Obama if the vote were held again.” Clinton won the primary by ten points, but the poll shows that if they could vote again, California voters prefer Obama by seven points.

This has no bearing on the primary which already occurred, but like the poll in New Jersey does demonstrate that Obama can pick up support over time and win the states in November which Clinton won in the winter and spring. Obama would also do better in a general election race in these states than Clinton would since there is a different population of voters in the general election than in the primary.

[Gore1FL]

133. According to past polls taken inside of election booths

she is very close to finished.

[unlawflcombatnt]

136. Polls Of Florida: Clinton vs. McCain; Obama vs. McCain

http://www.realclearpolitics.com/epolls/2008/president/fl/florida_mccain_vs_clinton-417.html#polls

Florida

Clinton vs. McCain

RCP Average 03/15 - 04/29 -- 44.0 45.7 Clinton +1.7
Quinnipiac 04/23 - 04/29 1411 RV 41 49 Clinton +8.0
Rasmussen 04/10 - 04/10 500 LV 44 45 Clinton +1.0
Quinnipiac 03/24 - 03/31 1136 RV 42 44 Clinton +2.

____________________________________


http://www.realclearpolitics.com/epolls/2008/president/fl/florida_mccain_vs_obama-418.html#polls

Florida

Obama vs. McCain

Poll Date Sample McCain (R) Obama (D) Spread
RCP Average 03/15 - 04/29 -- 49.0 40.0 McCain +9.0
Quinnipiac 04/23 - 04/29 1411 RV 44 43 McCain +1.0
Rasmussen 04/10 - 04/10 500 LV 53 38 McCain +15.0
Quinnipiac 03/24 - 03/31 1136 RV 46 37 McCain +9.0

[iamthebandfanman]

140. oh no! quick!

change the will of the people because a poll says something!

........

[Goodnevil]

142. This ignore feature rules!

[unlawflcombatnt]

144. Then why don't you just use it

That way you can easily prevent reality from seeping into your fantasy world of Obamamania.

[livingmadness]

152. Far from finished? Try 3 weeks ...

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2008/05/13/superdelegates-put-obama-_n_101443.html">AP At Current Pace, Obama Will Win Nomination In Three Weeks

[Jawja]

153. It's Over.

Hillary will get a chance to blabber the "I can get the white vote... I'm more electable... blah, blah, blah.." mantra after predictable wins in Kentucky and West Virginia; then Obama slams the door SHUT with wins in Oregon and Montana.

It's over.

[unlawflcombatnt]

160. West Virginia, 64-29 Clinton Lead, 35% of votes in

She's ahead by over a 2-to-1 margin.

[eridani]

166. "hardworking" "white" people all

Nonwhites don't ever work hard.

[unlawflcombatnt]

169. Nice Spin

It's nice to see the politics of divisiveness and race-baiting are alive and well in the Obama camp.

[eridani]

175. Clinton supporter Charlie Rangel called her on it

Are you disagreeing with him?

[HuffleClaw]

163. one reason she's still in the race

though the biggest reason is the media is still promoting her as being in the race, and why? because the republican owners of the media are thrilled at how successfully they've managed to engineer a split in the democratic party, a split that is most likely going to put mccain in the white house.

[unlawflcombatnt]

164. What a classic Obamanoid falsehood

You must be living on another planet.

The media has been trying to get Clinton to drop out of the race since the very 1st primary.

The media has a disgusting and unabashed love-affair with Obama.

To say the media is "trying to keep Clinton in the race" is idiotic. The exact opposite is true.

[eridani]

167. Explain pastorbaiting 24/7 for weeks on end

Why don't we ever hear about the whackjob winger who leads Clinton's prayer group? Or about anti-Catholic McSame endorser Hagee?

[michaz]

168. It really is finished. The problem is just as Chris Matthews said.

The media likes the fact that Hillary does not drop out. It is "good" for the media. It works for them. They can go on and on and have "something" to really pick at. It is always about the media.

[unlawflcombatnt]

182. Categorically Wrong and Dishonest

The mainstream media has been trying to get Hillary to drop out ever since Iowa.

Rocket scientist Alan Combs said the night before the NH primary she would probably be finished the next day.

He sure was perceptive, wasn't he.

The media should be getting paid by the Obama camp for their relentless efforts to get Hillary to drop out.

[krabigirl]

171. She needs to drop out, now.

[MzNov]

172. You forgot the Hillary Clinton Denial Poll.

[rove karl rove]

184. it's far from over n/t