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Home » Discuss » Archives » General Discussion: Presidential (Through Nov 2009) |
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stevenleser
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Tue Feb-26-08 05:35 PM Original message |
The problem with the 'Sexism' Label... |
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RandomKoolzip
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Tue Feb-26-08 05:40 PM Response to Original message |
1. I beg to differ. |
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zanne
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Tue Feb-26-08 05:43 PM Response to Reply #1 |
4. I'm a feminist and I use the word "bitch". |
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hfojvt
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Tue Feb-26-08 06:15 PM Response to Reply #1 |
11. so do I, but in the other direction |
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stevenleser
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Tue Feb-26-08 06:19 PM Response to Reply #11 |
13. "a serious charge like that should not be made on questionable evidence." |
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RandomKoolzip
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Tue Feb-26-08 06:47 PM Response to Reply #11 |
24. So the patriarchy's been overthrown because men are making fewer decisions |
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hfojvt
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Tue Feb-26-08 07:07 PM Response to Reply #24 |
33. the patriarchy is a myth to me |
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stevenleser
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Tue Feb-26-08 07:12 PM Response to Reply #33 |
37. Well, I was rather offended by the use of the word "list" in your post, so... |
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RandomKoolzip
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Tue Feb-26-08 07:18 PM Response to Reply #33 |
45. Even men with no insitutional power are repositories of privilege. |
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hfojvt
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Tue Feb-26-08 07:30 PM Response to Reply #45 |
47. and women do not know what it is like to be male either |
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misanthrope
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Wed Feb-27-08 04:17 PM Response to Reply #47 |
58. I agree with this as well... |
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DemBones DemBones
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Fri Feb-29-08 11:14 AM Response to Reply #47 |
117. Sorry you're not getting your full RDA of male privilege but |
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hfojvt
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Sun Mar-02-08 02:10 PM Response to Reply #117 |
146. good points kinda |
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DemBones DemBones
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Fri Feb-29-08 09:46 AM Response to Reply #45 |
116. Exactly, just as white people don't realize the privileges |
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stevenleser
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Sat Mar-01-08 03:05 PM Response to Reply #116 |
136. But in various cases, whites, males, straights, christians, etc... |
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stevenleser
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Sat Mar-01-08 03:04 PM Response to Reply #45 |
134. Not necessarily... |
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uppityperson
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Tue Feb-26-08 07:14 PM Response to Reply #24 |
41. Thank you. Common courtesy. eom |
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misanthrope
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Wed Feb-27-08 04:09 PM Response to Reply #11 |
57. Good post**nm |
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leftofthedial
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Thu Feb-28-08 03:51 PM Response to Reply #1 |
96. racist |
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formernaderite
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Sat Mar-01-08 03:05 PM Response to Reply #1 |
135. you know what...I'm going to come around and agree |
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SoFlaJet
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Tue Feb-26-08 05:40 PM Response to Original message |
2. thanks Steve |
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stevenleser
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Tue Feb-26-08 06:02 PM Response to Reply #2 |
7. And there really isnt any reason why you should |
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HiFructosePronSyrup
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Tue Feb-26-08 05:42 PM Response to Original message |
3. I want to extend my formal apologies. |
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DJ13
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Tue Feb-26-08 05:47 PM Response to Original message |
5. Im a guy who's wife is constantly telling me to stop bitching |
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stevenleser
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Tue Feb-26-08 06:50 PM Response to Reply #5 |
28. Interesting how none of the folks trying to paint me as wrong have responded to you |
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Der Blaue Engel
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Tue Feb-26-08 06:00 PM Response to Original message |
6. "But every other thread I have read critical of Hillary had zero sexism in it." |
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stevenleser
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Tue Feb-26-08 06:06 PM Response to Reply #6 |
9. Never heard of Picaninny before, didnt know that "cotton-picking" had racist |
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uppityperson
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Tue Feb-26-08 06:20 PM Response to Reply #9 |
14. What about if someone tries to shortchange someone else? |
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stevenleser
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Tue Feb-26-08 06:30 PM Response to Reply #14 |
17. Because it is impossible to live life that way |
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uppityperson
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Tue Feb-26-08 06:36 PM Response to Reply #17 |
19. I guess you have superior wisdom and don't want to learn. |
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stevenleser
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Tue Feb-26-08 06:49 PM Response to Reply #19 |
26. Really? You have seen HR at a firm come by and escort someone out for saying "bitch"? |
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uppityperson
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Tue Feb-26-08 06:52 PM Response to Reply #26 |
29. You can call someone a bitch at work and not get fired? |
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stevenleser
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Tue Feb-26-08 07:06 PM Response to Reply #29 |
32. Sure I can. |
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uppityperson
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Tue Feb-26-08 07:13 PM Response to Reply #32 |
40. A teacher calls a student "bitch". A doctor calls a patient "bitch". |
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xmas74
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Tue Feb-26-08 08:31 PM Response to Reply #32 |
48. In most fields you would |
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stevenleser
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Sat Mar-01-08 03:11 PM Response to Reply #48 |
138. It depends on usage... |
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Der Blaue Engel
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Tue Feb-26-08 07:16 PM Response to Reply #17 |
44. Obviously, you don't have to ask before every word you say |
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Der Blaue Engel
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Tue Feb-26-08 06:26 PM Response to Reply #9 |
16. Funny, your failure to understand that convinced me that I'm right |
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stevenleser
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Tue Feb-26-08 06:34 PM Response to Reply #16 |
18. But you so obviously arent. |
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uppityperson
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Tue Feb-26-08 06:37 PM Response to Reply #18 |
21. As a female, I've been the object of a lot of bigotry. "Bitch" is often sexist. |
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stevenleser
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Tue Feb-26-08 06:47 PM Response to Reply #21 |
25. But that is not the only use of the word, so, you are still not right... |
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uppityperson
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Tue Feb-26-08 06:53 PM Response to Reply #25 |
30. "This isnt like the N word or similar epithets." Wrong. Plain and simple. Wrong. |
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stevenleser
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Tue Feb-26-08 07:08 PM Response to Reply #30 |
34. Really? Wont calling someone the N word here get you tombstoned? |
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uppityperson
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Tue Feb-26-08 07:11 PM Response to Reply #34 |
35. No, it won't. It depends. It is the same. |
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Der Blaue Engel
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Tue Feb-26-08 07:12 PM Response to Reply #34 |
39. So because one kind of bigotry is acceptable to many |
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stevenleser
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Wed Feb-27-08 05:37 PM Response to Reply #39 |
76. Nice straw man, no, I never said that... |
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uppityperson
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Wed Feb-27-08 08:00 PM Response to Reply #76 |
82. I think you do not understand what that word means. |
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stevenleser
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Thu Feb-28-08 06:43 AM Response to Reply #82 |
89. Oh, I know what a straw man argument is: |
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Der Blaue Engel
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Thu Feb-28-08 10:58 AM Response to Reply #89 |
94. It's only "incorrect" because you don't even understand what you're saying |
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stevenleser
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Sat Mar-01-08 02:51 PM Response to Reply #94 |
130. Sorry to embarass you by showing your use of logical fallacies, but it is what you did |
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uppityperson
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Sun Mar-02-08 01:51 PM Response to Reply #130 |
143. Bwahahahahaha. You slay me. |
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DemBones DemBones
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Sun Mar-02-08 05:51 PM Response to Reply #143 |
147. You nailed him! |
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Der Blaue Engel
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Thu Feb-28-08 01:32 AM Response to Reply #76 |
85. Since I've used neither, I'm starting to understand your lack of comprehension |
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stevenleser
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Thu Feb-28-08 06:43 AM Response to Reply #85 |
90. Yes, you did. To wit: |
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xmas74
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Tue Feb-26-08 08:33 PM Response to Reply #25 |
49. And I would tell a man off if I heard him say the |
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ContinentalOp
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Wed Feb-27-08 04:43 PM Response to Reply #25 |
62. Actually it does have gender implications when used between two men. |
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uppityperson
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Wed Feb-27-08 05:00 PM Response to Reply #62 |
67. Exactly. You are accusing "him" of acting like "her", with etiology of "bitch" being FEMALE dog in |
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stevenleser
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Wed Feb-27-08 05:36 PM Response to Reply #62 |
75. No, it doesnt. |
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DemBones DemBones
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Fri Feb-29-08 11:23 AM Response to Reply #75 |
118. HELLO, you're male. You don't get to decide what is offensive to women |
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stevenleser
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Sat Mar-01-08 02:48 PM Response to Reply #118 |
128. yes, in some cases, I definitely do... |
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Der Blaue Engel
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Tue Feb-26-08 07:11 PM Response to Reply #18 |
36. You don't actually get to decide what's not bigotry simply because you're a member of |
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stevenleser
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Sat Mar-01-08 02:59 PM Response to Reply #36 |
133. Rational people, whether minorities or not, can decide that, yes... |
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hfojvt
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Tue Feb-26-08 06:36 PM Response to Reply #9 |
20. there is a question of intent meant or intent taken |
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uppityperson
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Tue Feb-26-08 06:04 PM Response to Original message |
8. It depends on usage and intent. You seriously believe asshole and bitch carry same weight? |
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stevenleser
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Tue Feb-26-08 06:13 PM Response to Reply #8 |
10. I think you said it in your subject, it depends on usage and I think the mods agree |
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uppityperson
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Tue Feb-26-08 06:17 PM Response to Reply #10 |
12. In answer, yes, it does. Being called a bitch implies sexist thinking. |
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stevenleser
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Tue Feb-26-08 06:25 PM Response to Reply #12 |
15. But if there are a lot of people who dont see it that way, including the people |
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uppityperson
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Tue Feb-26-08 06:49 PM Response to Reply #15 |
27. Let's try this again. |
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stevenleser
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Tue Feb-26-08 07:03 PM Response to Reply #27 |
31. You immediately start from a flawed premise which I pointed out much earlier in our discussion |
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11 Bravo
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Tue Feb-26-08 06:40 PM Response to Original message |
22. Did you miss the "hysterical wifey" thread? How about the "PMS" thread? |
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stevenleser
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Tue Feb-26-08 06:42 PM Response to Reply #22 |
23. PMS thread was the sexist one I mentioned in my OP... |
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COFoothills
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Tue Feb-26-08 07:12 PM Response to Original message |
38. What's wrong with being sexy? |
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MonkeyFunk
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Tue Feb-26-08 07:14 PM Response to Original message |
42. Yes, I understand why people |
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Der Blaue Engel
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Tue Feb-26-08 07:20 PM Response to Reply #42 |
46. As evidenced by this thread, it's not that they can't see, it's that they refuse to acknowledge it |
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Marie26
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Tue Feb-26-08 07:15 PM Response to Original message |
43. You appear to be a guy |
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stevenleser
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Wed Feb-27-08 03:22 PM Response to Reply #43 |
50. I would say that it depends... |
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uppityperson
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Wed Feb-27-08 04:58 PM Response to Reply #50 |
66. You are seriously comparing "black" with "bitch"? omg. |
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stevenleser
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Wed Feb-27-08 05:39 PM Response to Reply #66 |
77. Yes, yes I am... |
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uppityperson
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Wed Feb-27-08 07:52 PM Response to Reply #77 |
80. If you don't know in your heart what's sexist, then... |
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casus belli
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Thu Feb-28-08 04:57 AM Response to Reply #80 |
87. The problem is you can change the definition to suit whatever purpose you want. |
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stevenleser
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Thu Feb-28-08 06:49 AM Response to Reply #87 |
92. Ouch. Very well said... |
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uppityperson
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Thu Feb-28-08 05:13 PM Response to Reply #92 |
98. Some of us sleep during the night, or work. Patience grasshopper. |
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uppityperson
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Thu Feb-28-08 05:04 PM Response to Reply #87 |
97. I think you are replying to the wrong person since I never said that. |
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Marie26
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Thu Feb-28-08 09:55 PM Response to Reply #97 |
104. Is that me? |
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uppityperson
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Fri Feb-29-08 12:20 AM Response to Reply #104 |
106. Yes, I think it was you and how DARE you call someone male because their profile says they are! |
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casus belli
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Fri Feb-29-08 03:27 AM Response to Reply #104 |
109. You miss the point. |
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Marie26
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Fri Feb-29-08 09:46 AM Response to Reply #109 |
115. See post #114 |
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uppityperson
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Fri Feb-29-08 01:40 PM Response to Reply #109 |
123. Congratulations. After using the word incorrectly elsewhere, you did a strawman! |
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uppityperson
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Fri Feb-29-08 12:27 AM Response to Reply #87 |
107. psst, that user's profile SAYS he is male. |
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casus belli
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Fri Feb-29-08 03:24 AM Response to Reply #107 |
108. "I'm sorry, men really don't get a say in what..." |
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Marie26
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Fri Feb-29-08 09:17 AM Response to Reply #108 |
114. Please respond to me |
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uppityperson
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Sat Mar-01-08 02:54 PM Response to Reply #114 |
131. can't reply because is ignoring you. Somehow can read what you write though. |
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uppityperson
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Fri Feb-29-08 01:35 PM Response to Reply #108 |
122. That part I consider wrong. The part where she called him male wasn't wrong. |
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casus belli
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Sat Mar-01-08 02:34 PM Response to Reply #122 |
125. I replied to you... |
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uppityperson
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Sat Mar-01-08 02:49 PM Response to Reply #125 |
129. "I can't respond to the original poster since she's currently ignored." |
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DemBones DemBones
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Fri Feb-29-08 11:37 AM Response to Reply #87 |
120. You might want to learn how to |
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casus belli
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Sat Mar-01-08 02:12 PM Response to Reply #120 |
124. But like far too many men at DU, you don't get it that you don't get to say what's sexist.... |
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DemBones DemBones
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Sun Mar-02-08 09:45 AM Response to Reply #124 |
140. I'm just crushed that you put me on Ignore, being |
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uppityperson
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Sun Mar-02-08 01:56 PM Response to Reply #140 |
144. Did you see this post? |
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Marie26
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Thu Feb-28-08 09:45 PM Response to Reply #50 |
103. This is true |
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hfojvt
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Wed Feb-27-08 03:38 PM Response to Reply #43 |
52. hath not a man eyes, or logic circuits? |
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Beausoir
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Wed Feb-27-08 03:36 PM Response to Original message |
51. We know it when we see it. And we've seen enough of it here. |
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Breeze54
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Wed Feb-27-08 03:41 PM Response to Reply #51 |
53. Ditto |
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stevenleser
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Wed Feb-27-08 04:04 PM Response to Reply #51 |
55. No, I wont, because I am right |
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Beausoir
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Wed Feb-27-08 05:27 PM Response to Reply #55 |
71. I'm shouting?? Did I shout at you? That's considered shouting? |
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stevenleser
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Wed Feb-27-08 05:33 PM Response to Reply #71 |
73. Take your comments elsewhere is a form of "shouting someone down" |
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uppityperson
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Wed Feb-27-08 08:03 PM Response to Reply #73 |
83. Who is shouting? Who has used THE MOST CAPITAL LETTERS SHOUTING!!!11 |
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VotesForWomen
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Wed Feb-27-08 04:03 PM Response to Original message |
54. uh no, the sexism charge is not used against any clinton criticism. and dude, the examples you gave |
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stevenleser
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Wed Feb-27-08 04:05 PM Response to Reply #54 |
56. I see, so you would join me in going from thread to thread saying that those examples |
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LostinVA
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Wed Feb-27-08 04:21 PM Response to Original message |
59. Those are all sexist terms -- no matter how much you try to justify their use |
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stevenleser
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Wed Feb-27-08 04:26 PM Response to Reply #59 |
60. As I said in my OP, I have on more than one occasion been called a Banshee |
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LostinVA
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Wed Feb-27-08 04:27 PM Response to Reply #60 |
61. No -- it was always sexist |
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VotesForWomen
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Thu Feb-28-08 04:22 AM Response to Reply #60 |
86. uh, using female terms to denigrate males is hardly an argument * against* the existence of sexism. |
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uppityperson
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Thu Feb-28-08 05:13 PM Response to Reply #86 |
99. shhh, don't confuse him with logic. |
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stevenleser
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Thu Feb-28-08 08:06 PM Response to Reply #99 |
101. Since terms are not 'female' or 'male' I would say the logic was decidedly poor... |
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uppityperson
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Thu Feb-28-08 09:01 PM Response to Reply #101 |
102. Back to saying "bitch" isn't female. Gotcha. |
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VotesForWomen
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Fri Feb-29-08 04:52 AM Response to Reply #101 |
111. oh god. nevermind. nt |
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stevenleser
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Thu Feb-28-08 08:05 PM Response to Reply #86 |
100. They arent 'female' terms, but nice try (n/t) |
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cooolandrew
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Wed Feb-27-08 04:46 PM Response to Original message |
63. As much as I disagree to sexist terms yeah it is open to interpretation. Still let's try to be |
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stevenleser
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Wed Feb-27-08 04:56 PM Response to Reply #63 |
64. I agree with you, open to interpretation. But the Hillary supporters arent saying that... |
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uppityperson
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Wed Feb-27-08 05:01 PM Response to Reply #64 |
68. So now this is not about sexism but Hillary supporters over using "sexist"? |
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stevenleser
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Wed Feb-27-08 05:20 PM Response to Reply #68 |
69. What do you mean 'now'? Read my OP again,,, |
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uppityperson
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Wed Feb-27-08 07:55 PM Response to Reply #69 |
81. How about this quote from your OP? |
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stevenleser
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Thu Feb-28-08 06:49 AM Response to Reply #81 |
91. But this other argument by you is wrong and I keep pointing it out |
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Name removed
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Wed Feb-27-08 04:57 PM Response to Original message |
65. Deleted message |
Sparkly
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Wed Feb-27-08 05:22 PM Response to Original message |
70. The problem with the "it's being used for every criticism" statement is |
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stevenleser
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Wed Feb-27-08 05:28 PM Response to Reply #70 |
72. So now you are going to split hairs with me. Fine... |
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uppityperson
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Wed Feb-27-08 08:06 PM Response to Reply #72 |
84. Quoting your OP is "split hairs"? OMG, I love you. |
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Whisp
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Wed Feb-27-08 05:33 PM Response to Original message |
74. I have a question, for all of you... is it ok to call your female enemies sexist names? |
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stevenleser
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Wed Feb-27-08 06:18 PM Response to Reply #74 |
78. I would say the answer is 'No' |
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Whisp
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Wed Feb-27-08 06:35 PM Response to Reply #78 |
79. It's either never okay or always okay. |
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stevenleser
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Thu Feb-28-08 07:05 AM Response to Reply #79 |
93. I would agree, but it also assumes everyone is on the same page |
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leftofthedial
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Thu Feb-28-08 04:59 AM Response to Original message |
88. you can't win on this one, I'm afraid. Not around here. |
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stevenleser
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Thu Feb-28-08 03:10 PM Response to Reply #88 |
95. That is probably true, unfortunately... |
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crawfish
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Fri Feb-29-08 11:27 AM Response to Reply #95 |
119. Here? |
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AtomicKitten
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Thu Feb-28-08 10:00 PM Response to Original message |
105. "Sexism" is her default setting of excuses. |
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casus belli
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Fri Feb-29-08 04:38 AM Response to Reply #105 |
110. You forgot... |
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Darth_Kitten
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Fri Feb-29-08 08:15 AM Response to Reply #110 |
113. Oh, but aren't some Obama supporters such put upon victims? |
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Darth_Kitten
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Fri Feb-29-08 08:13 AM Response to Reply #105 |
112. When you grow out of your need to please any man out there..... |
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DemBones DemBones
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Fri Feb-29-08 11:40 AM Response to Original message |
121. Newsflash: Banshees are female. Here's the reference. |
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dkf
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Sat Mar-01-08 02:43 PM Response to Reply #121 |
127. Yeah but screaming like a banshee |
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uppityperson
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Sat Mar-01-08 02:57 PM Response to Reply #127 |
132. Yup, and "acting like a bitch" doesn't mean you are an animal. It means you |
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stevenleser
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Sat Mar-01-08 03:09 PM Response to Reply #132 |
137. Wow did you miss what that person was saying. Probably intentionally.. |
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uppityperson
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Sat Mar-01-08 03:13 PM Response to Reply #137 |
139. I bow to your superior wisdom. Try it now... |
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DemBones DemBones
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Sun Mar-02-08 10:18 AM Response to Reply #132 |
141. You know, I've only seen dogs (males) act irrationally |
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stevenleser
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Sun Mar-02-08 10:38 AM Response to Reply #141 |
142. Well, technically, yes, but... |
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uppityperson
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Sun Mar-02-08 01:57 PM Response to Reply #142 |
145. If you can find anything more beneficial or prejudicial or stereotype fostering about being called a |
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stevenleser
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Sun Mar-02-08 06:59 PM Response to Reply #145 |
148. Except that this mini thread has gotten far away from anything to do with the OP (nt) |
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AtomicKitten
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Sat Mar-01-08 02:38 PM Response to Original message |
126. The Clintons have injected the "isms" into the race and they are failing, just as it should be. |
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DU
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Tue Jun 25th 2024, 06:08 AM Response to Original message |
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