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Zynx (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sat Jan-19-08 01:03 PM Original message |
Caucuses are total bullshit. |
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Eurobabe (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sat Jan-19-08 01:04 PM Response to Original message |
1. Welcome to our world |
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yourout (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sat Jan-19-08 01:04 PM Original message |
I like it......stand up and be counted.....and you dont have to worry about Diebold. |
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Zynx (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sat Jan-19-08 01:09 PM Response to Original message |
6. I prefer the risks involved in the secret ballot to this. |
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durrrty libby (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sat Jan-19-08 02:44 PM Response to Original message |
48. lol |
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thunder rising (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sat Jan-19-08 01:04 PM Response to Original message |
2. One thing is for sure, the vote count is accurate. |
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durrrty libby (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sat Jan-19-08 01:09 PM Response to Reply #2 |
9. Accurate? Ha Not by those intimidated into voting a certain way. |
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suston96 (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sat Jan-19-08 01:10 PM Response to Reply #2 |
11. Stand up and be counted? Sure, as long as you can do it in secret. |
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Evergreen Emerald (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sat Jan-19-08 01:28 PM Response to Reply #2 |
31. they don't have to prove residence, or citizenship |
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Critters2 (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sat Jan-19-08 03:19 PM Response to Reply #31 |
77. They were only accusations. Unless you have proof. |
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AGirl (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sat Jan-19-08 01:06 PM Response to Original message |
3. I totally agree. |
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HeraldSquare212 (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sat Jan-19-08 01:06 PM Response to Original message |
4. It's partly about party building |
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gdaerin (402 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sat Jan-19-08 01:08 PM Response to Original message |
5. I agree, it's harder to rig caucuses as people's actual bodies are being counted, boo! nt |
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Zynx (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sat Jan-19-08 01:10 PM Response to Reply #5 |
10. Standing in a room so all your friends and neighbors can see how you |
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DU9598 (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sat Jan-19-08 01:24 PM Response to Reply #10 |
27. Perhaps if you are ashamed of your vote |
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Zynx (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sat Jan-19-08 01:28 PM Response to Reply #27 |
30. What the hell? |
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Critters2 (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sat Jan-19-08 02:50 PM Response to Reply #30 |
52. Repugs don't caucus with Dems. They wouldn't know if you were |
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VotesForWomen (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sun Jan-20-08 02:29 AM Response to Reply #27 |
112. man, you are clueless; violence can and has resulted from people voting the 'wrong' way; jeezus |
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Critters2 (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sat Jan-19-08 02:49 PM Response to Reply #10 |
51. Bullshit!! If you don't have the balls to stand by your decision, |
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VotesForWomen (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sun Jan-20-08 02:33 AM Response to Reply #51 |
113. what are you going to do? kick little old ladies asses if they don't vote the way you want? |
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ElizabethDC (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sat Jan-19-08 01:09 PM Response to Original message |
7. I agree, I think there are many drawbacks |
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Critters2 (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sat Jan-19-08 03:18 PM Response to Reply #7 |
76. It's not a public election. It's a party meeting. |
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zulchzulu (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sat Jan-19-08 01:09 PM Response to Original message |
8. Having been an observer in Iowa caucuses in 2004 and 2008, I think they are pretty cool |
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Zynx (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sat Jan-19-08 01:12 PM Response to Reply #8 |
14. If the presidential election were like that in my home town I might be killed. |
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zulchzulu (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sat Jan-19-08 01:15 PM Response to Reply #14 |
16. Caucuses are for each party |
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Zynx (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sat Jan-19-08 01:20 PM Response to Reply #16 |
21. Within a party the same thing applies. |
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Critters2 (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sat Jan-19-08 02:53 PM Response to Reply #21 |
57. Then you're a coward. Convictions take courage. nt |
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Critters2 (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sat Jan-19-08 02:53 PM Response to Reply #14 |
55. AGain, your Repug neighbors wouldn't even know. |
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THUNDER HANDS (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sat Jan-19-08 01:10 PM Response to Original message |
12. i like caucuses for this reason |
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ruggerson (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sat Jan-19-08 01:15 PM Response to Reply #12 |
17. It's all about pressuring people |
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DU9598 (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sat Jan-19-08 01:27 PM Response to Reply #17 |
29. Examples please? |
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madrchsod (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sat Jan-19-08 02:04 PM Response to Reply #17 |
44. ohhhh those big bad scary unions,,,,,, |
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Orangepeel (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sat Jan-19-08 03:24 PM Response to Reply #17 |
81. unions don't have that kind of power anymore n/t |
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Zynx (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sat Jan-19-08 01:15 PM Response to Reply #12 |
18. Stolen elections are not my primary concern as I think that is an overblown |
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Critters2 (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sat Jan-19-08 02:55 PM Response to Reply #18 |
58. People have to set priorities. If it's important to you, you get there. |
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1corona4u (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sat Jan-19-08 01:20 PM Response to Reply #12 |
20. And, I kind of like my privacy.... |
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THUNDER HANDS (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sat Jan-19-08 01:30 PM Response to Reply #20 |
34. well, if we could ensure that our votes were counted by machine correctly |
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1corona4u (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sat Jan-19-08 01:32 PM Response to Reply #34 |
37. Then you're part of the problem, not the solution. |
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Colobo (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sat Jan-19-08 01:11 PM Response to Original message |
13. I wish every state used the caucus system. |
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Zynx (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sat Jan-19-08 01:14 PM Response to Reply #13 |
15. I watched it on C-Span and I was not impressed. |
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DU9598 (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sat Jan-19-08 01:28 PM Response to Reply #15 |
32. You do realize the difference between an election and a nomination, right? |
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Zynx (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sat Jan-19-08 01:31 PM Response to Reply #32 |
36. I know that. I am applying the principle to a more extreme example to make a point. |
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DU9598 (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sat Jan-19-08 06:13 PM Response to Reply #36 |
100. So manipulate and smear |
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bellasgrams (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sat Jan-19-08 01:29 PM Response to Reply #15 |
33. I watched on C-Span also, |
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Critters2 (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sat Jan-19-08 02:56 PM Response to Reply #15 |
60. I'd be fine with that. I'm committed to my principles. nt |
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1corona4u (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sat Jan-19-08 01:35 PM Response to Reply #13 |
39. Bullshit. |
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Orangepeel (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sat Jan-19-08 03:30 PM Response to Reply #39 |
83. You know, even in primary states, a candidate has to get 15% in a district to get delegates |
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Critters2 (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sat Jan-19-08 03:45 PM Response to Reply #83 |
85. Which is precisely why caucuses work better. |
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Orangepeel (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sat Jan-19-08 03:56 PM Response to Reply #85 |
88. I'm not disputing that |
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1corona4u (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sat Jan-19-08 06:26 PM Response to Reply #85 |
104. YEAH, I UNDERSTAND PRIMARIES... |
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Jennifer C (760 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sat Jan-19-08 03:40 PM Response to Reply #39 |
84. Well said. |
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1corona4u (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sat Jan-19-08 04:30 PM Response to Reply #84 |
93. Yes, it is. |
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DU9598 (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sat Jan-19-08 06:14 PM Response to Reply #39 |
101. You can vote your preference |
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no name no slogan (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sat Jan-19-08 01:19 PM Response to Original message |
19. If caucuses are bullshit, then so are political party conventions |
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Zynx (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sat Jan-19-08 01:21 PM Response to Reply #19 |
22. That can be taken care of separately. |
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no name no slogan (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sat Jan-19-08 01:33 PM Response to Reply #22 |
38. A party primary is not the same as an open primary or open general election |
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Critters2 (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sat Jan-19-08 03:00 PM Response to Reply #22 |
63. Why should it? nt |
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Perky (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sat Jan-19-08 01:22 PM Response to Reply #19 |
26. The cauceus system will be in full force at this years brokered convention. |
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no name no slogan (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sat Jan-19-08 01:30 PM Response to Reply #26 |
35. It won't be brokered. This will be done with by Feb 6. |
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Critters2 (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sat Jan-19-08 02:59 PM Response to Reply #19 |
62. Exactly. Thank you. |
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no name no slogan (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sat Jan-19-08 03:14 PM Response to Reply #62 |
72. And it's sad that people don't see that firsthand |
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Critters2 (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sat Jan-19-08 03:17 PM Response to Reply #72 |
75. It doesn't happen. Trust me. |
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robbedvoter (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sat Jan-19-08 03:53 PM Response to Reply #19 |
87. True too - doesn't help your argument. Conventions are mostly rubber stamp |
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grantcart (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sat Jan-19-08 01:22 PM Response to Original message |
23. I like going to precinct caucuses |
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loyalsister (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sat Jan-19-08 04:40 PM Response to Reply #23 |
94. Precinct caucuses are effective |
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boston bean (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sat Jan-19-08 01:22 PM Response to Original message |
24. I agree wholeheartedly. Too easily manipulated. nt |
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DU9598 (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sat Jan-19-08 01:22 PM Response to Original message |
25. It is for the state party's members to decide |
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1corona4u (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sat Jan-19-08 01:40 PM Response to Reply #25 |
41. It DOES NOT work. |
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no name no slogan (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sat Jan-19-08 02:42 PM Response to Reply #41 |
46. Just because your candidate doesn't win doesn't mean it's "undemocratic" |
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1corona4u (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sat Jan-19-08 02:56 PM Response to Reply #46 |
59. Thanks for that convoluted, |
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no name no slogan (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sat Jan-19-08 03:00 PM Response to Reply #59 |
64. Never been to a caucus, I can tell, because you don't get it. |
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1corona4u (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sat Jan-19-08 03:01 PM Response to Reply #64 |
65. I totally 'get it' |
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no name no slogan (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sat Jan-19-08 03:23 PM Response to Reply #65 |
80. Watching it on TV is not like "being there" |
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Critters2 (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sat Jan-19-08 03:03 PM Response to Reply #59 |
68. Oh yeah. This century. With electronic voting. That works so well. nt |
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1corona4u (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sat Jan-19-08 03:06 PM Response to Reply #68 |
69. Then make it a fucking paper ballot, |
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Critters2 (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sat Jan-19-08 03:14 PM Response to Reply #69 |
73. It's easier and more accurate to raise your hand. nt |
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1corona4u (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sat Jan-19-08 04:27 PM Response to Reply #73 |
91. It's not "more accurate" |
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Critters2 (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sun Jan-20-08 12:06 AM Response to Reply #91 |
109. How is a public show of hands more accurate than what you so famously do in Florida? |
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DU9598 (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sat Jan-19-08 06:18 PM Response to Reply #69 |
103. Swearing doesn't help win an argument that you are losing |
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DU9598 (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sat Jan-19-08 06:17 PM Response to Reply #59 |
102. Then be a f'ing republican if you like their vote counting better |
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Critters2 (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sat Jan-19-08 03:01 PM Response to Reply #41 |
66. You live in Florida. So, don't do it in Florida. |
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1corona4u (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sat Jan-19-08 03:07 PM Response to Reply #66 |
70. You don't even live in Iowa... |
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Critters2 (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sat Jan-19-08 03:15 PM Response to Reply #70 |
74. I was an observer in my old precinct. |
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1corona4u (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sat Jan-19-08 04:29 PM Response to Reply #74 |
92. Figures you're from Iowa. |
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Critters2 (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sun Jan-20-08 12:05 AM Response to Reply #92 |
108. All that stupidity in Florida can really wear a person out, can't it? nt |
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DU9598 (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sat Jan-19-08 06:08 PM Response to Reply #41 |
97. It worked perfectly |
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no name no slogan (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sat Jan-19-08 02:49 PM Response to Reply #25 |
50. Precisely. It is a PARTY BUILDING exercise. |
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Phoebe Loosinhouse (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sat Jan-19-08 01:25 PM Response to Original message |
28. I agree. It guarantees disenfranchisement. nt |
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1corona4u (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sat Jan-19-08 01:47 PM Response to Reply #28 |
42. Exactly. |
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no name no slogan (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sat Jan-19-08 02:52 PM Response to Reply #28 |
54. Just because you lose doesn't mean you're "disenfranchised" |
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Phoebe Loosinhouse (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sat Jan-19-08 03:02 PM Response to Reply #54 |
67. I'm speaking about the people who aren't able to attend period. |
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no name no slogan (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sat Jan-19-08 03:09 PM Response to Reply #67 |
71. They CAN still participate, even if they can't attend |
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cynthia (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sat Jan-19-08 04:07 PM Response to Reply #71 |
90. Keep in mind that this year we will have a presidential preference |
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no name no slogan (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sat Jan-19-08 04:45 PM Response to Reply #90 |
96. Just like in 2004. But they still break out the county-level delegates by caucus (if needed) |
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Critters2 (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sat Jan-19-08 03:20 PM Response to Reply #28 |
78. How so? nt |
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davidwparker (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sat Jan-19-08 01:40 PM Response to Original message |
40. no. it has to stay. I like it to our primaries. I think they are more interesting. |
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F.Gordon (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sat Jan-19-08 01:59 PM Response to Original message |
43. One Person - One Vote |
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CK_John (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sat Jan-19-08 02:20 PM Response to Original message |
45. You have major flaw in your argument, the DNC has nothing to do with where a state has |
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Carrieyazel (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sat Jan-19-08 02:43 PM Response to Original message |
47. Absolutely. Caucuses suck, and second-tier candidates reap the worst. |
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1corona4u (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sat Jan-19-08 02:56 PM Response to Reply #47 |
61. Yep. |
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dkf (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sat Jan-19-08 02:45 PM Response to Original message |
49. Harry Reid, who's family is backing Clinton up the wazoo, wanted a caucus |
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La Lioness Priyanka (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sat Jan-19-08 02:51 PM Response to Original message |
53. i agree. |
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ProSense (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sat Jan-19-08 02:53 PM Response to Original message |
56. Hillary believes caucuses |
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NoPasaran (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sat Jan-19-08 03:21 PM Response to Original message |
79. I hope all the people who are upset about the viability threshold for caucuses |
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Critters2 (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sat Jan-19-08 03:26 PM Response to Reply #79 |
82. Another example of why caucuses are better. |
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robbedvoter (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sat Jan-19-08 03:48 PM Response to Original message |
86. hear! hear! Vote needs to be SECRET. And EQUAL . Primitive. Undemocratic. Wrong. |
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Critters2 (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sat Jan-19-08 04:00 PM Response to Reply #86 |
89. Party business in mu county is done at times and in places I have no idea about. |
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goodgd_yall (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sat Jan-19-08 04:43 PM Response to Original message |
95. It disenfranchises many potential voters |
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DU9598 (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sat Jan-19-08 06:11 PM Response to Reply #95 |
98. It is easy to disenfranchise in a primary state |
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dajoki (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sat Jan-19-08 06:11 PM Response to Original message |
99. Here, Here!! |
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Essene (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sat Jan-19-08 06:29 PM Response to Original message |
105. Plus... the delegate ratios are blatant gerrymandering |
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BadgerLaw2010 (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sat Jan-19-08 07:58 PM Original message |
That's a fact. It's undemocratic by definition. |
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Critters2 (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sun Jan-20-08 12:09 AM Response to Original message |
110. So don't do it in Wisconsin. nt |
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BadgerLaw2010 (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sat Jan-19-08 07:58 PM Response to Reply #105 |
106. That's a fact. It's undemocratic by definition. |
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Zynx (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sat Jan-19-08 10:38 PM Response to Original message |
107. Someone look me right in the face and tell me the convoluted result out of Nevada |
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VotesForWomen (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sun Jan-20-08 02:25 AM Response to Original message |
111. yep, it's bulls**t. nt |
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eridani (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sun Jan-20-08 07:44 AM Response to Original message |
114. States with caucus systems have much stronger Democratic parties |
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BadgerLaw2010 (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sun Jan-20-08 08:59 AM Response to Original message |
115. Agree 100%. |
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