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quinnox Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Oct-01-07 09:06 PM
Original message
Poll question: Hillary vs Giuliani
Who would you vote for for president?

And those who pick Giuliani, don't be shy, I'd love to hear your reasoning. (this ought to be good)
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Trajan Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Oct-01-07 09:07 PM
Response to Original message
1. You think it will be good ?
I think it will be kinda silly ....

and extremely tilted .....
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OHdem10 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Oct-01-07 09:13 PM
Response to Original message
2. While I can see Guilliani's appeal, he strikes me as too
authoritarian. You think GWB has clamped down--just watch
Guilliani.

I have heard some Democrats say they would consider voting for him.
I hope they get a grip and consider his authoritarianism
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quinnox Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Oct-01-07 09:15 PM
Response to Reply #2
3. even my solid republican friend
can't stand Giuliani because of his ego and arrogance. He said he might have to vote for Hillary if Giuliani is the republican nominee.
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Pushed To The Left Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Oct-01-07 09:41 PM
Response to Reply #2
8. Guiliani wants to stack the Supreme Court with the same type of justices that Bush nominated.
Edited on Mon Oct-01-07 09:41 PM by Pushed To The Left
He's definitely not the liberal some make him out to be.
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Purveyor Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Oct-01-07 09:15 PM
Response to Original message
4. A "none of the above" would have made this poll more entertaining...
I didn't vote...
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mark414 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Oct-01-07 09:45 PM
Response to Reply #4
9. that's my vote
how do we even know that either will be the nominee, with the first primary still months off?
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Dawgs Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Oct-02-07 09:16 AM
Response to Reply #4
27. Or a choice for "other". I would write in Gore.
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tomreedtoon Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Oct-01-07 09:28 PM
Response to Original message
5. Giuliani. Because he IS Hillary Clinton.
Or haven't you noticed they dress alike? Behave alike? Hold the same support of the Iraq/Iran War?

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Sparkly Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Oct-01-07 09:29 PM
Response to Reply #5
6. Oh this is just getting ridiculous.
:eyes:
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Semper_FiFi Donating Member (452 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Oct-02-07 10:48 AM
Response to Reply #5
30. Delusional.
No other way to describe it.
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superkia Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Oct-01-07 09:37 PM
Response to Original message
7. What if you put democrat instead of Clinton , I think you would...
get the same result no matter who it is. Actually, you would see more votes for the democrat and still 0 for the republican because more people look at Clinton as a republican more than they think that of the other democrats running. So is the poll just to continue the propaganda that Clinton is the inevitable so Americans will give up on their candidates before the primary? Useless poll unless you added in some polls with other the other democrats against Giuliani so we as a democratic party can see who the best choice for our party is instead of the continued ramming of Clinton down everyones throats. I would really like to see some useful polls versus more of the same thing the media has provided us with. Is our goal here on DU to elect our favorite candidate or the one best for our country?

I know that I don't have to take part but I just wanted to give my point of view of this campaign to force democrats to vote for only one candidate or they are traders theme thats been going around. I think our country is much better served if we stick to the democratic process where we have choices.

Ok, now you can all scream at me for my point of view. And yes I do know that I didn't have to chime in but I feel allot of people feel this way and I wanted to give myself a voice.
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JVS Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Oct-01-07 09:53 PM
Response to Original message
10. Is this supposed to prove that HRC is more electable than RG? Because it doesn't.
Edited on Mon Oct-01-07 09:53 PM by JVS
I remember that she was running a very tight race with him in NY before he had to quit due to cancer and she got to put the smackdown on n00b Rick Lazio. But it would have been interesting to see what would have happened if RG had stayed healthy. Maybe we will get to see a rematch in fall of 2008
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jmp Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Oct-01-07 10:00 PM
Response to Original message
11. I'd probably vote Green or ...
write in Kucinich.

I am really really tired of this phony "two party system". There are no elephants and donkeys ... just a whole lot of bull.

:grr:


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Auntie Bush Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Oct-01-07 10:45 PM
Response to Reply #11
14. Well the Elephants make more bull than the Donkeys.
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jmp Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Oct-01-07 10:50 PM
Response to Reply #14
15. I don't know about that.
This Congress is shoveling it with the best/worst of them.



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Imagevision Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Oct-01-07 10:25 PM
Response to Original message
12. Rudy knows the swiftboaters already began Hillay attacks usning Vince Foster allegations,this
will make Kerry's attacks seem like the Simpsons attacking
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fenriswolf Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Oct-01-07 10:42 PM
Response to Original message
13. im abstaning
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silverojo Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Oct-01-07 11:26 PM
Response to Original message
16. What's your next poll going to be called?
"Which bucket of buzzard puke do you want to drink from?" LOL! :rofl:

(Just kidding)
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Douglas Carpenter Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Oct-01-07 11:54 PM
Response to Original message
17. I'm no Hillary fan,,but anyone who cannot understand the catastrophe of a Giuliani Presidency is
Edited on Tue Oct-02-07 12:24 AM by Douglas Carpenter
IS OUT OF THEIR FUCKING MIND!!!!!!
(sorry I know its out of character for me to use such language)

BUT IT'S THE FUCKING TRUTH!!!

ONE WOULD HAVE TO BE FUCKING DEAF, FUCKING DUMB AND FUCKING BLIND NOT TO RECOGNIZE THE FUCKING CATASTROPHIC DANGER OF A FUCKING GIULIANI ADMINISTRATION!!!!!!!

a Giuliani Presidency would be far, far, far more dangerous than Bush/Cheney

Admittedly it is hard to imagine a presidency that could be more disastrous for the world than Bush/Cheney. But Rudy Giuliani leads all other Republicans by significant margins. And in polling of possible general election match-ups he is well within striking distance.

To put some context on just how extreme Giuliani actually is..he just appointed Daniel Pipes -- a racist extremist nut just as far out in his extremism as David Duke is in his particular brand of fanaticism -- AS HIS LEADING ADVISER ON MIDDLE EAST MATTERS.

some links:

http://www.motherjones.com/news/update/2003/05/we_420_01.html

From Harpers: Pipes Joins Up With Giuliani by Ken Silverstein

http://www.harpers.org/archive/2007/08/hbc-90001048

"I think it’s fair to say that Pipes is even further out ideologically than Norman Podhoretz, another Giuliani adviser. Readers unfamiliar with Pipes can check out his profile at Wikipedia."

------------

This Article from Huffington Post by Stephen Schlesinger

Giuliani: Worse Than Bush

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/stephen-schlesinger/giuliani-worse-than-bush_b_61412.html

"The Republican presidential front runner, former New York mayor Rudy Giuliani, has just written his foreign policy credo for Foreign Affairs magazine. It is a truly unnerving pronouncement -- even worse than Bush-ism. Not unexpectedly, Mr. Giuliani backs all of the most brazen features of the Bush administration's global agenda. But he tosses in several deeply scary initiatives of his own that George W. never touched."

"He promises to pursue Bush's strategy in Iraq relentlessly to "eliminate the export of terror," and warns that, as in Vietnam, any withdrawal would be a sign of weakness and "an invitation for more war." He does not conceive of, admit to, or even mention the possibility of a region-wide political settlement which even now the Bush Administration is apparently contemplating. In addition, he would "press ahead" with an anti-ballistic missile system -- regardless of its out sized costs or ineffectiveness. And he would, as he says, "pursue the gains made by the USA Patriot Act and not unrealistically limit electronic surveillance or legal interrogation." Sounds a lot like an embrace of unrestricted presidential power and possibly torture.

For Israel, he now opposes the "creation of another state" in Palestine -- a repudiation of Bush's own stance. On Iran, "should all else fail," he would destroy that nation's nuclear infrastructure -- a mini-Cheney on steroids. More broadly, though, he would ratchet up our public diplomacy, expand the old Cold War radio stations, ditto with Internet networks, and insist that our US ambassadors "clearly advocate for US policies" -- a kind of in-your-face proselytizing of the sort the former mayor practiced so fervently when he ran New York City.

But Mr. Giuliani's most peculiar innovations are with the United Nations and NATO. Predictably, he is anti-UN -- as he was as mayor of NYC. But he goes further and argues that the UN has "proved irrelevant to the resolution of almost every major dispute of the last fifty years." This is a breathtaking display of incomprehension. Just a reminder: the UN stopped the invasion of South Korea; settled the Suez crisis of 1956; assisted in the ending of the Cuban missile crisis of 1963; ousted Saddam Hussein from Kuwait in 1991. It brought peace to conflicts in Guatemala, Angola, Mozambique, El Salvador, Cambodia and helps keep the peace in Cyprus. More recently, it aided Haiti in holding an election and ending violence, pushed the Syrians out of Lebanon, enforced a ceasefire between Israel and Lebanon and presently supports a dozen or so other peacekeeping missions.

Now we come to the ex-mayor's most bizarre suggestion -- that NATO be encouraged to act "globally," be reconfigured to confront "significant threats to the international system," and "we should open the organization's membership to any state" -- though it is a European-based body. Is Mr. Giuliani thus proposing that NATO replace the UN as the world's arbiter? And why not? Since the US dominates NATO, this would give Washington a direct means to extend its security purvey over the entire planet. This is a vision consistent with the authoritarian instincts with which Mr. Giuliani governed NYC. Still his retro-policies appear to be out of kilter with the times. He will have a lot of explaining to the American electorate about his foreign policy weltanschauung. It should be an illuminating exercise that may actually remind voters of why the only elected post he has ever risen to is mayor."

-------------

Giuliani's proposal for endless Middle East wars" by Glenn Greenwald

link (by paid subscription but a free 24 hour pass is available):

http://www.salon.com/opinion/greenwald/2007/09/21/giuliani_israel/index.html?source=newsletter

"Plainly, the last thing most Americans want is for the U.S. to expand its involvement in Middle East wars, particularly when doing so is on behalf of the interests not of the U.S., but of another country. Yet here is Giuliani advocating that we do exactly that -- embrace an obviously radical strategy opposed by the overwhelming majority of Americans, likely vehemently opposed -- and the silence is deafening."

-------------------

A Giuliani presidency would actually be more dangerous than the Bush/Cheney debacle; much more dangerous. What is scary is that many Americans mistakenly believe that Giuliani is a moderate because of his position on some social issues. But make no mistake about it -- a transition from Bush/Cheney to Giuliani would be a transition from out of the frying pan and into the fire. A Giuliani presidency would mean a dark and sinister future for those who strive for peace.

And it could happen ...just check a cross section of polls..he is leading all other Republicans by significant margins..and his chance of winning if nominated cannot be dismissed:

Republican Primary Polls:

http://www.pollingreport.com/wh08rep.htm

General Election Polls:

http://www.pollingreport.com/wh08gen.htm

It would not be an exaggeration at all to say that electing Giuliani would be like electing David Duke with better p.r. cosmetics:

DNC Condemns Rep. King (top Giuliani adviser) for saying there are too many Mosques in the U.S.

Rep. King is Rudy Giuliani's Homeland Security Adviser

CBS News
DNC Condemns King's Mosque Comments
By Daniel W. Reilly

Sep 19, 2007

http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2007/09/19/politics/politico/thecrypt/main3279950.shtml

"(The Politico) Not long after Politico released its interview with Rep. Peter King (R-N.Y.) , the top Republican on the House Homeland Security Committee, the Democratic National Committee attacked King's comment that "there are too many mosques in this country."

"Congressman King's comments are deplorable and he should apologize immediately," said DNC press secretary Stacie Paxton. "This type of bigoted language has no place in public discourse."

The DNC went one step further, calling on GOP presidential hopeful Rudy Giuliani to dump King as his campaign's homeland security adviser."

-------------------
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CarolNYC Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Oct-02-07 07:06 AM
Response to Reply #17
25. Thank you, DC!
I certainly hope those Giuliani votes up there are not serious.

Anyone who would vote for Rudy or abstain from voting for the Democratic nominee, WHOMEVER that may be, if Giuliani's the Republic nominee deserves to live in a country ruled by the lunatic madman but the rest of us don't, especially those too young to vote.

A couple of months of a Rudy Presidency and people will be pining for the wonderful days of the Bush Administration.

Yet, there is no shortage of absolute stupidity among Dems so maybe there are some who vote for Rudy just to show their displeasure or hatred or whatever of Hillary....
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LSdemocrat Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Oct-01-07 11:59 PM
Response to Original message
18. Giuliani is just about the only mainstream candidate more dangerous than Bush
But by all means, if you want to see the unitary executive taken to new extremes, then by all means vote for Giuliani (either directly or indirectly).
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Naturyl Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Oct-02-07 12:03 AM
Response to Original message
19. 6 for Guiliani? Are you kidding?
Edited on Tue Oct-02-07 12:05 AM by Naturyl
I'm assuming those are protest votes.

Hillary is one of my least favorite Dems, but come on...
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RedG1 Donating Member (389 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Oct-02-07 01:09 AM
Response to Original message
20. crossdresser Rudy, of course...keen sense of fashion...










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IndianaGreen Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Oct-02-07 02:16 AM
Response to Original message
21. How about moving to another country?
The only thing worse than a Hillary v. Giuliani race, is a Hillary v. Jeb Bush race.
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DemocratSinceBirth Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Oct-02-07 04:33 AM
Response to Original message
22. Hillary Will Rip G(h)ouliani A New Face
That will be an improvement over the face he now has.
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saltpoint Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Oct-02-07 05:21 AM
Response to Original message
23. Would prefer these two not be the noms but if they are I vote for Sen. Clinton
over America's thug.

I'd greatly prefer her SCOTUS picks to his, and the next president will likely have 2 or 3 to make.
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LWolf Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Oct-02-07 06:47 AM
Response to Original message
24. Neither. n/t
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Egnever Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Oct-02-07 07:13 AM
Response to Original message
26. I pick Rudi!
Cause this poll is retarded.
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invictus Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Oct-02-07 10:34 AM
Response to Original message
28. If Giuliani wins, kiss goodbye to our civil rights ...
Edited on Tue Oct-02-07 10:36 AM by invictus
There is no civil or human right that guy would not be willing to strip away in the name of "national security." America will also be at perpetual war in the Middle East. Just look at the guy. Giuliani is a jerk and a creep. Those who know him best - his children - hate him. I don't care much for the Clintons but given the choice between Hilary and Rude E(vil), it is a no brainer. Make no mistake, Giuliani is the most evil of the Repub candidates.
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Nimrod2005 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Oct-02-07 10:40 AM
Response to Original message
29. Rudy, stronger leadership...My biggest issue with him is about him liking
more wars, but so does she!
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NaturalHigh Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Oct-02-07 10:59 AM
Response to Original message
31. Neither.
I'd either go third party or skip the vote for president. I actually like Giuliani better than Mrs. Clinton, but I wouldn't want him as president.
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