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Carson (560 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Thu Jun-24-04 11:57 AM Original message |
Hitchen's Orwell quote...how to refute? |
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JHBowden (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Thu Jun-24-04 11:59 AM Response to Original message |
1. I'm not a pacifist |
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hiphopnation (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Thu Jun-24-04 12:01 PM Response to Original message |
2. spot on |
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hiphopnation (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Thu Jun-24-04 12:06 PM Response to Reply #2 |
5. except to say |
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Nevernose (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Thu Jun-24-04 12:01 PM Response to Original message |
3. Someone in Slate's reply section refuted it thusly: |
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rinsd (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Thu Jun-24-04 12:58 PM Response to Reply #3 |
23. Animal Farm was written in 1945. |
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hiphopnation (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Thu Jun-24-04 01:05 PM Response to Reply #23 |
25. I guess I would be of this stripe: |
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RandomKoolzip (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Thu Jun-24-04 12:04 PM Response to Original message |
4. Hitchens quoting Orwell? Ha. |
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Fenris (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Thu Jun-24-04 12:07 PM Response to Reply #4 |
7. His book "Why Orwell Matters" isn't bad. |
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librechik (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Thu Jun-24-04 12:15 PM Response to Reply #7 |
17. Hitchens has been corrupted by power |
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RandomKoolzip (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Thu Jun-24-04 12:17 PM Response to Reply #7 |
19. I know, Hitchens used to have a brain. |
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Fenris (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Thu Jun-24-04 12:19 PM Response to Reply #19 |
20. He drinks way too much. |
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RandomKoolzip (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Thu Jun-24-04 12:26 PM Response to Reply #20 |
21. I just can't see how Hitch can't see the similarities between |
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Fenris (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Thu Jun-24-04 12:28 PM Response to Reply #21 |
22. Seagram's and Philip Morris, I suspect. |
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rinsd (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Thu Jun-24-04 12:59 PM Response to Reply #20 |
24. Oh c'mon....some of the best writers are drunks.... |
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Fenris (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Thu Jun-24-04 01:20 PM Response to Reply #24 |
30. Yes, but in their cases alcohol improved them |
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rinsd (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Thu Jun-24-04 01:45 PM Response to Reply #30 |
34. LOL (nt) |
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patdem (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Thu Jun-24-04 12:07 PM Response to Original message |
6. Does he NAME any of the 'younger intellectual pacifists'? |
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rumguy (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Thu Jun-24-04 12:08 PM Response to Original message |
8. Look - there is something to what he says at the end |
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fdr_hst_fan (853 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Thu Jun-24-04 12:08 PM Response to Original message |
9. I'm not a pacifist; |
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cprise (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Thu Jun-24-04 12:09 PM Response to Original message |
10. Why can't he say... |
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roper (41 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Thu Jun-24-04 12:09 PM Response to Original message |
11. First shot: |
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Cat Atomic (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Thu Jun-24-04 12:09 PM Response to Original message |
12. Orwell believed so strongly in Socialism that he fought for it |
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Fenris (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Thu Jun-24-04 12:11 PM Response to Reply #12 |
14. Having read "Homage to Catalonia" I feel I can say |
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Vickers (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Thu Jun-24-04 12:10 PM Response to Original message |
13. How many of your "warmonger friends" are in the military? |
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Fenris (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Thu Jun-24-04 12:12 PM Response to Reply #13 |
15. Orwell was not in the military, but fought on the side of the Marxists |
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Vickers (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Thu Jun-24-04 12:13 PM Response to Reply #15 |
16. Yeah, I was deleting that while you posted |
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Fenris (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Thu Jun-24-04 12:15 PM Response to Reply #16 |
18. Yup. And as a policeman in Hong Kong, if I remember correctly. |
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Book Lover (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Thu Jun-24-04 01:50 PM Response to Reply #18 |
37. Burma |
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pschoeb (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Thu Jun-24-04 01:08 PM Response to Original message |
26. It's from Orwell's "Notes on Nationalism" from 1945 |
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hiphopnation (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Thu Jun-24-04 01:11 PM Response to Reply #26 |
27. I agree. |
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indigobusiness (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Thu Jun-24-04 01:13 PM Response to Original message |
28. I AM a pacisifist... |
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HFishbine (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Thu Jun-24-04 01:16 PM Response to Original message |
29. Jesus |
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Jim__ (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Thu Jun-24-04 01:38 PM Response to Original message |
31. I'd like to seesome documentation of the allegation |
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pschoeb (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Thu Jun-24-04 01:45 PM Response to Reply #31 |
35. He is qouting Orwell, so this is 1945 pacifists |
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robertpaulsen (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Thu Jun-24-04 01:42 PM Response to Original message |
32. Context, baby, context. |
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Bridget Burke (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Thu Jun-24-04 01:44 PM Response to Original message |
33. Reading the quotation in context would help. |
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NewEmanuelGoldstein (94 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Thu Jun-24-04 01:49 PM Response to Original message |
36. Reply with more Orwell |
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pschoeb (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Thu Jun-24-04 01:52 PM Response to Reply #36 |
38. The best refutation is actually later in the essay |
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Zorra (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Thu Jun-24-04 03:27 PM Response to Original message |
39. "......there is a minority of intellectual pacifists..." |
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