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Ken Burch

(50,254 posts)
9. The Zionist side had been discussing forcible transfer for years.
Sat May 19, 2012, 01:51 PM
May 2012

Last edited Sat May 19, 2012, 04:03 PM - Edit history (2)

Here are some quote from the Wikipedia page on pre-1948 attitudes on both sides of the issue

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Zionist_and_Palestinian_Arab_attitudes_before_1948

The cultural Zionist Ahad Ha'am 'saw the historical rights of the Jews as outweighing the Arabs' residential rights in Palestine'[13].
Herzl's companion Max Nordau, a political Zionist, declared that Palestine was the 'legal and historical inheritance' of the Jewish nation, and that the Palestinian Arabs had only 'possession rights'.[14]
David Ben-Gurion, labour Zionism's most important leader, held that the Jewish people had a superior right to Palestine,[15] that Palestine was important to the Jews as a nation and to the Arabs as individuals, and hence the right of the Jewish people to concentrate in Palestine, a right which was not due to the Arabs.[16]
Zeev Jabotinsky, leader of the more radical revisionist Zionists, held that since Palestine was only a very small part of the Land held by the Arab nation, "requisition of an area of land from a nation with large stretches of territory, in order to make a home for a wandering people is an act of justice, and if the land-owning nation does not wish to cede it (and this is completely natural) it must be compelled".[17]


There were some in the Zionist movement who dissented from this mindset, and I'd also like to mention some of them in this passage below from the same Wikipedia page:

The dissident Zionists in Brit Shalom and Ihud thought differently. Hugo Bergmann wrote in 1929: "our opponents [in mainstream Zionism] hold different views. When they speak of Palestine, of our country, they mean 'our country', that is to say 'not their country' [... this belief is based on the concept that in a State] one people, among the people residing there, should be granted the majority right."[18], and Ernst Simon held that the historical right "is binding on us rather than on the Arabs" and therefore an agreement with the Arabs is necesarry.[19]


And once again, shira the State of Israel is not "The Jews". Please stop using rhetoric that implies that anyone who disagrees with you is an antisemitic whackjob.

(on edit) I shouldn't have to say this, but I DO support Israel's right to exist. It's just that I reject the idea that it can only go on existing if it keeps treating Palestinians like this. Can you accept that as a reasonable position?

You don't have to pay to read full articles at Ha'aretz oberliner May 2012 #1
Thanks. I must have been trying to read one that was part of their premium content... Violet_Crumble May 2012 #2
No problem oberliner May 2012 #39
Thanks and it's true in attempting to outlaw the Nakba azurnoir May 2012 #3
There's simply no excuse in outlawing Nakba Day Ken Burch May 2012 #4
Isn't Nakba Day a day of mourning for the failure of Israel's neighbors... shira May 2012 #5
As usual, yr wrong. The Nakba was the dispossession of around 700,000 Palestinians... Violet_Crumble May 2012 #6
So you know that if no war on the Jews was declared in 1948... shira May 2012 #7
The Zionist side had been discussing forcible transfer for years. Ken Burch May 2012 #9
Very unlikely for many reasons. One being that Ben Gurion wouldn't do it. n/t shira May 2012 #10
Ben-Gurion on transfer: Ken Burch May 2012 #12
Context. Where is it? shira May 2012 #15
It was from testimony to the Peel Commission. Ken Burch May 2012 #22
Still no context, and yes it matters. Here's Benny Morris... shira May 2012 #23
why no citation? n/t azurnoir May 2012 #24
Sorry...here's three sources for the second quote: Ken Burch May 2012 #28
I don't think you understand what a source is oberliner May 2012 #37
Do you even know what the Peel Commission is? oberliner May 2012 #40
I stand corrected on the date. Ken Burch May 2012 #46
How confident are you of the validity of that quote? oberliner May 2012 #16
I believe it came from here azurnoir May 2012 #25
I do believe he said no such thing and in fact said something else entirely oberliner May 2012 #26
I'll have to rememberthis the n ext time you attempt to delegitimize wiki however azurnoir May 2012 #27
and the first quote by Ben-Gurion was rather a non-sequator azurnoir May 2012 #35
See post #28 Ken Burch May 2012 #29
There are not multiple sources for the quote oberliner May 2012 #36
ah you mean the wiki quotes from 1919 and 1920 ? azurnoir May 2012 #38
Is there something you didn't understand about the information I gave you? Violet_Crumble May 2012 #17
You say you know what 1948 was about. Hmm.... shira May 2012 #19
Yeah, their land.... Violet_Crumble May 2012 #20
No land was being taken prior to the wars of 1948.... shira May 2012 #21
But they did not have the right Ken Burch May 2012 #30
Do you hear yourself? They did not have the right.... shira May 2012 #31
The Palestinians weren't against Jews living in Palestine Ken Burch May 2012 #32
It wasn't up to them. The Turks allowed Jews to live throughout the mideast.... shira May 2012 #42
The issue with Jerusalem is EAST Jerusalem, not ALL of Jerusalem Ken Burch May 2012 #33
Both Hamas and the PA are calling for all Jerusalem.... shira May 2012 #43
No, it isn't, and yes, you're wrong. Ken Burch May 2012 #8
It's only about being dispossessed? shira May 2012 #11
If they had been allowed to return, without retribution, after the war was over Ken Burch May 2012 #13
Oh stop it... shira May 2012 #14
Of course I knew there were two wars Ken Burch May 2012 #34
Yes, and the first was a civil war. And you cannot understand why Israel was reluctant... shira May 2012 #41
They could at least have let the oldest come back. Ken Burch May 2012 #44
Ken, a few posts back you said that Israel should have let all refugees back in.... shira May 2012 #45
Very interesting article LeftishBrit May 2012 #18
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