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Denzil_DC

(7,216 posts)
5. I don't think a coalition with the SNP has ever been on the cards.
Sun Jul 10, 2016, 08:36 AM
Jul 2016

Not only, as you say, would it be poison "down south", as it seems it was in 2015 (not helped by Labour joining in the demonizing of Sturgeon and the SNP, but spilt milk and all that), but Scottish (and Welsh and NI) MPs can't vote on "England-only"* legislation after EVEL, so unless that is repealed, there would be key votes where the partner party couldn't have any input.

And one of the sticking points for the SNP in anything more than a confidence and supply arrangement (all that's ever realistically been a prospect) would be Trident and the Trident replacement. I think Salmond might have budged on the existing Trident programme tactically as a bargaining chip during independence negotiations (withdrawal would be a long and fairly complex process anyway). Sturgeon is a lifelong opposer of nukes, and she couldn't do it without losing her own integrity and a vast swath of her voters. Just can't see it happening.

* Scare quotes because the definition of that seems conveniently fluid.

By 2020, Scotland will either be on its way to independence, have already achieved it, or still a no-go area for Labour unless there's a very unlikely collapse of the SNP, or an even more unlikely resurgence of Labour in Scotland (you'd have to see the state of the Scottish Labour leadership close up to understand just how unlikely ...).

Labour needs to focus on its electoral problems outside Scotland. The rest of my attitudes seem very similar to yours.

I've said it before, and I'll say it again, FWIW. Corbyn's less of a problem for Labour than the current PLP taken as a whole. What an incompetent shower of self-absorbed backbiting careerist idiots.

First corollary question yes; second no... LeftishBrit Jul 2016 #1
Agreed Dworkin Jul 2016 #2
I pretty much agree with all of that muriel_volestrangler Jul 2016 #4
I don't think a coalition with the SNP has ever been on the cards. Denzil_DC Jul 2016 #5
The Labour establishment, in Scotland and Westminster, STILL don't get why the SNP broke through. Ken Burch Jul 2016 #11
I've done what I can on this group to offer some perspective on all that. Denzil_DC Jul 2016 #12
I will check out your journal n/t. Ken Burch Jul 2016 #14
Angela Eagle isn't the ideal choice.... T_i_B Jul 2016 #3
No sign of the former so far. non sociopath skin Jul 2016 #15
Owen Smith (since he's also in the running) Spider Jerusalem Jul 2016 #6
Kinnock only needed a handful of nominations, though-ten MPs, rather than 50. Ken Burch Jul 2016 #7
Owen Smith is to the left of Eagle (not as far left as Corbyn) Spider Jerusalem Jul 2016 #9
Easily avoidable? T_i_B Jul 2016 #13
In 1945, Churchill was defending an enormous majority and had just won a war. Ken Burch Jul 2016 #21
Yep, historical revisionism T_i_B Jul 2016 #23
During the 1945 campaign, nobody in the UK thought Labour had a chance. Ken Burch Jul 2016 #25
I remember 1987 and 1992 (even if I'd rather not); and the reasons were rather different LeftishBrit Jul 2016 #24
The Sheffield thing certainly didn't help. Ken Burch Jul 2016 #26
They changed the rules since the days of Kinnock. Denzil_DC Jul 2016 #8
Labour's NEC set to ensure Jeremy Corbyn is on leadership ballot Denzil_DC Jul 2016 #10
A few reminders about recent past Labour leadership challenges Denzil_DC Jul 2016 #16
Looks like the NEC will be voting by secret ballot RogueTrooper Jul 2016 #17
They are. Denzil_DC Jul 2016 #18
BTW, in case anyone's on tenterhooks, Denzil_DC Jul 2016 #19
Latest: Denzil_DC Jul 2016 #20
Thanks for the updates. Ken Burch Jul 2016 #22
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