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In reply to the discussion: Do you consider Thom Hartmann a Democratic leader/figure/supporter? [View all]lapucelle
(19,495 posts)327. I taught logic mcar.
Last edited Wed Aug 9, 2017, 10:42 PM - Edit history (1)
The poster you're responding to actually provides evidence to support your claim. He didn't read carefully.
...[Hartmann] expanded the show to an hour, and also licensed the show to RT , partially in exchange for use of their television studios and facilities.
"Partially"...how very interesting. Studio time was only a partial payment for the license. There must be something additional going on between Mr. Hartmann and RT. Thom needs to be more transparent.
Not only have you provided evidence of payment, but even if you hadn't, his argument would still be dubious because the absence of evidence for one claim does not necessarily prove the validity of the other claim.
As for the snark about "binary logic", Boolean reasoning involving the disjunctive or is tricky and best left to people who understand these things. Here's the argument:
If A then either B or C.
A is true.
B is false.
Therefore C must be true.
There's a logical flaw in your responder's thinking. He assumes without evidence that B and C (paid and unpaid) are the only two possibilities. There's a third option: that Thom is paying RT to allow him to broadcast.
If that sounds improbable, then you should read this post from a Hartmann apologist:
[Thom]doesn't get paychecks from them....he pays them for time on the network.
https://www.democraticunderground.com/1017451788#post5
The snarky poster is committing the fallacy of bifurcation by excluding third possibilities.
He is right about somethinf though. Somebody here doesn't understand binary logic.
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Me too. He is a very decent person, thoughtful and caring - here in Portland, Oregon I remember
Akamai
Aug 2017
#8
You know full well. The information was posted in great detail in your other thread.
yardwork
Aug 2017
#144
He isn't promoting any such thing. He's on RT under the condition that he has control
Hun Joro
Aug 2017
#135
"Did NATO Promise Not to Enlarge? Gorbachev Says No" Read it, I don't spoonfeed the unwilling.
FreepFryer
Aug 2017
#298
Read Akamai's original post. I'm not spoon feeding you what you already know and ignore.
FreepFryer
Aug 2017
#301
Plenty of proof provided, your dishonesty & obtuseness is revealing and isn't fooling anyone. (n/t)
FreepFryer
Aug 2017
#307
I've watched him on RT and he seems the same to me. It's weird when Russians run a station and not
The Wielding Truth
Aug 2017
#156
No! His continued presence on Russia Today settled that once and for all. n/t
Tarheel_Dem
Aug 2017
#4
Haven't listened to the blowhard in over ten years. I know his schtick. n/t
Tarheel_Dem
Aug 2017
#30
Have fun. I know why Ellison is well received in TH land. I'll leave it at that.
Tarheel_Dem
Aug 2017
#236
I totally respect how he played it down the middle between Bernie and Hillary,
earthshine
Aug 2017
#13
I didn't know he paid for air time there. That sure should change the perception of many.
Akamai
Aug 2017
#22
Buddy Roehmer has joined with some progressives with a basic goal of -
womanofthehills
Aug 2017
#249
I am not going to *prove* anything to you. You present no evidence to the contrary.
earthshine
Aug 2017
#296
You make an accusation without evidence. Further, you do not seem to understand binary logic.
earthshine
Aug 2017
#314
He never "played it down the middle between Bernie and Hillary." I stopped listening to him during
wasupaloopa
Aug 2017
#115
No, but it spares me from accidentally wasting my time reading inane opinions.
earthshine
Aug 2017
#220
If you don't want to ever read someone's posts, it is _you_ who should put them on ignore. n/t
PoliticAverse
Aug 2017
#266
But why is he on RT? Is it money? He certainly can find another outlet for his show.
brush
Aug 2017
#116
You know lots of people watch RT - maybe it's good to have some dems on RT
womanofthehills
Aug 2017
#248
Sounds like infiltration to me. So now it's fashionable to be on Putin's payroll
brush
Aug 2017
#335
Charlatan? That's a personal attack. Anything more specific? Obama was accused of
Akamai
Aug 2017
#10
So you think RT should go into 85 million households in America and have no progressive viewpoint
womanofthehills
Aug 2017
#250
Weren't gold dealers big sponsors on Fox News and many right wing radio talk shows?
George II
Aug 2017
#150
A lot of Bernie people were very pissed that Thom wouldn't take sides in the primary. nt
earthshine
Aug 2017
#14
I have never heard him put his liberal credentials at jeopardy -- indeed, he regularly advances
Akamai
Aug 2017
#18
Got anyone better than he? maybe you're too critical. Me, too, John from Mineapolis has
Akamai
Aug 2017
#20
Oh, thank goodness - I thought I was the only one who noticed John gets quite a long
phylny
Aug 2017
#28
Short answer?....No...He's been the leading lefty talker for years & there's a reason for that
whathehell
Aug 2017
#69
Yes, he is, and he handles virtually all of them with calm and intelligence. n/t
whathehell
Aug 2017
#155
Randi is back - you can buy a podcast or livestream on Facebook, YouTube, or randirhodes.com M-F
womanofthehills
Aug 2017
#253
His presence on that network validates it as a source of news. He's wrong to do that.
pnwmom
Aug 2017
#47
Are you belng deliberately obtuse? I was responding to a person who mentioned his being on RT.
pnwmom
Aug 2017
#50
The other alternative of course is that without RT he wouldn't be on the air at all.
WoonTars
Aug 2017
#183
TYT, etc distribute on YouTube. Thom could hire some TV students and produce a polished show.
emulatorloo
Aug 2017
#209
wow! you really are dodging my question -- let me repeat, what specific information do you have?
Akamai
Aug 2017
#278
Nope bluepen is right - your posts reek of bad faith - evasive, disingenuous & repetitive. (n/t)
FreepFryer
Aug 2017
#341
By ignoring other users, and repeatedly ignoring their replies to your inanity. (n/t)
FreepFryer
Aug 2017
#342
You're in contempt. You've asked over and over, and ignored the answer. (n/t)
FreepFryer
Aug 2017
#344
So what of his shows do you have criticisms of? He has tried to get on national tv but has been
Akamai
Aug 2017
#21
Orleans' post #15 said it better than I could on why I don't listen/watch his program.
rogue emissary
Aug 2017
#31
He has very, very often talked about gun control, and for several months has been promoting the
Akamai
Aug 2017
#261
You bet it's ridiculous! He supported Bernie and then, once Bernie lost, strongly supported Hillary.
Akamai
Aug 2017
#33
No. He went off the deep end with his JFK assassination conspiracy theory, then joined RT.
SunSeeker
Aug 2017
#26
He does have several points of view that may not be the same as all of us - who doesn't?
Akamai
Aug 2017
#29
Bernie would argue that a democratic socialist economy provides a safety net to protect
Akamai
Aug 2017
#262
"Democratic Socialist". There seems to be a concerted effort afoot to drive DU in that direction...
Tarheel_Dem
Aug 2017
#34
Yes, and it is really not helpful to accomplishing progressive goals in the US.
SunSeeker
Aug 2017
#37
He's a self-proclaimed Democratic Socialist who, unlike Bernie Sanders, chooses to
pnwmom
Aug 2017
#43
I sure agree with you on this. Thom has a lengthy history of sophisticated insight into many
Akamai
Aug 2017
#269
The lack of outrage can most likely be attributed to the fact that even fewer DU'ers listen to Lush
Tarheel_Dem
Aug 2017
#321
I agree with you Akamai ... I like Thom and definitely don't doubt his progressive bona-fides ...
mr_lebowski
Aug 2017
#64
Still relitigating the last election and finding someone -- anyone -- to blame, I think.
Akamai
Aug 2017
#263
LOL! Nice try. You can't squeeze him in under the "Don't bash Democratic public figures" rule.
NurseJackie
Aug 2017
#73
In this day and age, you simply can't work for RT and be trusted by Democrats. Simple
Squinch
Aug 2017
#86
Except no it isn't. How can you possibly be considered a Russian propagandist...
WoonTars
Aug 2017
#190
You just created a false equivalency between Russian Dressing and the OFFICIAL Russian Media
Foamfollower
Aug 2017
#194
Bingo! Bingo! Bingo! Bingo! Bingo! You are keerect! (about anger about who he backed in the prima ir
Akamai
Aug 2017
#265
LOL! It needs no refutation. That statement was so obviously false that it refutes itself...
NurseJackie
Aug 2017
#176
ms Liberty -- accusations like these are without foundation -- throwing mud at Thom and running
Akamai
Aug 2017
#267
Can you provide a link to proof that he works FOR them, they are paying him, and what amount?
ms liberty
Aug 2017
#173
And what he says goes against what others who have actually left RT have said.
MrsCoffee
Aug 2017
#182
When others left the station after Putin's actions in Ukraine, they described how RT works.
MrsCoffee
Aug 2017
#196
She was mentioned in another article I read about him not leaving RT after Putin's
MrsCoffee
Aug 2017
#217
Thom has repeatedly said that there have been no attempts to manage his content on RT.
Akamai
Aug 2017
#268
You are correct. They're now down to hypercritical hair-splitting as a last-ditch "defense" ...
NurseJackie
Aug 2017
#188
He's on their air, hence they are paying a license fee to cover the production budget of the show
Maven
Aug 2017
#210
If he's filling their air time, he's working FOR them, and promoting their existence.
George II
Aug 2017
#244
disillusioned -- not surprising at all that they want to blame someone for Hillary's loss, even
Akamai
Aug 2017
#271
You do know that "leader/figure/supporter" is not a list of synonyms, right? I'M a "supporter."
WinkyDink
Aug 2017
#112
and a Democratic supporter is what the title indicates. He is always telling people to get inside
Akamai
Aug 2017
#140
I've tried listening to Thom Hartmann, but I usually can only handle about 10 minutes of him until
Snake Plissken
Aug 2017
#119
He was very patient with idiot callers to his show who hate Democrats and blame them for everything.
betsuni
Aug 2017
#125
The reason I post is that Thom does, I think, enormous good for the people of this country.
Akamai
Aug 2017
#142
I'll post links leading to some of his latest written pieces -- tell me which ones you disagree with
Akamai
Aug 2017
#270
Plus he has some of the best callers on talk radio. Are we to believe they are RT bots?
GusBob
Aug 2017
#139
Why would a "progressive" focus so relentless on a wealthy media personality
BainsBane
Aug 2017
#138
Are you being paid by Hartmann or RT for promoting him in numerous such threads? (n/t)
FreepFryer
Aug 2017
#145
Nope - I just think that in this war of ideas, we shouldn't give up our best weapons.
Akamai
Aug 2017
#273
By "our" I assume you mean Putin, given your post yesterday and ongoing refusal to admit his lie. nt
FreepFryer
Aug 2017
#288
no one who draws a paycheck from Vladimir Putin is any kind of leader in the party
geek tragedy
Aug 2017
#160
I wouldn't be at all surprised if he started selling Hartmann branded nutritional supplements...
NurseJackie
Aug 2017
#215
He's a talkshow host and commentator. He's not a "Democratic Leader". Don't be silly.
emulatorloo
Aug 2017
#180
you must not watch MSNBC as I've heard them discuss big Pharma and net neutrality. RT equals TrumpTV
emulatorloo
Aug 2017
#201
I guess, but what about people working for corporate media? Why isn't that a serious stain in the
JCanete
Aug 2017
#230
corporate media has been fairly deliberate, and what has had a worse impact on the misconceptions of
JCanete
Aug 2017
#340
So you would rather not have a liberal on the air, than have him on RT.
womanofthehills
Aug 2017
#258
Since this is a question of "purity", I expect much rancor to bubble to the surface.
Binkie The Clown
Aug 2017
#208
Wow! Thom's face would probably be blushing if he read your words -- but I think your deep
Akamai
Aug 2017
#275
Progressive Liberal FDR Democrats and Independents know Hartmann is a Democrat's Democrat.
Trial_By_Fire
Aug 2017
#287
Actually him repeating Putinist lies, on RT's payroll like the Reagan bs in yesterday's post is why.
FreepFryer
Aug 2017
#289
See post 186. I and others provided the Brookings institution debunk of the lie yesterday. Ciao!
FreepFryer
Aug 2017
#293
Already did. Post 186, and post 7 of the linked post. I said good day, sir.
FreepFryer
Aug 2017
#305
Considering his buddies were there, I wonder if Thom's invitation got lost in the mail?
Tarheel_Dem
Aug 2017
#328
If it walks like Russian, talks like a Russian on Russian state tv, it's a damn Russian asset.
Tarheel_Dem
Aug 2017
#337
Absolutely. I knew him when he lived in Portland and have only good things to say about him. He's
Amaryllis
Aug 2017
#338
RT has been decrying/dismissing US anger over Russian attack on the election as McCarthyism
FreepFryer
Aug 2017
#363
Maybe you can put those who oppose Russian active measures in a gulag! (n/t)
FreepFryer
Aug 2017
#382