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HuckleB

(35,773 posts)

154. If the communication isn't supported by a science-based justification, it's meaningless.

Sun Mar 27, 2016, 10:58 AM

Mar 2016

And it is a waste of government resources. Meaningless information is disinformation.

http://fafdl.org/blog/2014/08/16/a-principled-case-against-mandatory-gmo-labels/

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The organic industry’s GMO hoax [View all] ZombieHorde Mar 2016 OP

I just don't see how providing consumers with more information is bad. Socal31 Mar 2016 #1

Every law is a threat. ZombieHorde Mar 2016 #3

Food labeling laws aren't a threat to anyone except businesses. Socal31 Mar 2016 #4

If there's one thing the left and right agree on in the US, ZombieHorde Mar 2016 #7

So you admit that laws like nutritional information are OK. Socal31 Mar 2016 #8

Nutritional information labels have a scientific reason. ZombieHorde Mar 2016 #9

GMO labeling is coming to the US nationally. Socal31 Mar 2016 #11

So true & the good news is - Vermont wins manditory GMO labeling womanofthehills Mar 2016 #90

Honestly, I'm neutral on the GMO labeling issue unless its a big, obvious "warning" label that... Humanist_Activist Mar 2016 #95

One industry using the power of government to adversely affect another is a threat to everyone Major Nikon Mar 2016 #118

At least one does. Socal31 Mar 2016 #121

... Major Nikon Mar 2016 #122

Requiring labeling enables choice. "Cancer!!!" isn't the only concern about GMO's. MH1 Mar 2016 #30

Labeling laws informed by what corporations want aren't about giving consumers choice. kcr Mar 2016 #50

It would allow people like you to buy those "superior" GMO food CentralMass Mar 2016 #48

HA! Touche! SusanCalvin Mar 2016 #70

I just want science-based policy. nt ZombieHorde Mar 2016 #146

Foods are either genetically modified or not. It's very simple. The public has a right to know. CentralMass Mar 2016 #166

The public has a right to not be disinformed. HuckleB Mar 2016 #168

Public opinion strongly favors labelling. CentralMass Mar 2016 #169

Let's play "name that logical fallacy." HuckleB Mar 2016 #170

Your corporate funded studies are irrelevant. Public opinion strongly favors labelling.. CentralMass Mar 2016 #172

Hundreds of them are not funded by any corporation. You are choosing ignorance. HuckleB Mar 2016 #230

Do you think we should use the scientific definition of gmo, ZombieHorde Mar 2016 #175

Well, no, that's precisely the issue Recursion Mar 2016 #207

WTF? Monsanto trolls lagomorph777 Mar 2016 #235

Conspiracy theory nutcases, yes, we are all paid by Monsanto, but the benefits suck. Humanist_Activist Mar 2016 #242

Bullshit. Allowing me to know a food contains GMO is deceptive? lagomorph777 Mar 2016 #243

You're allowed to know it. HuckleB Mar 2016 #244

"Seed development technology?" lagomorph777 Mar 2016 #245

Oh, goodness. HuckleB Mar 2016 #246

Now you just sound silly. lagomorph777 Mar 2016 #250

In other words, you prefer to ignore the actual content of my posts, not to mention science. HuckleB Mar 2016 #252

So I had a look at your posts, and I see you are pro-pesticide, pro-GMO, and anti-organic lagomorph777 Mar 2016 #254

I am pro-science, pro-environment, pro-earth. HuckleB Mar 2016 #255

This is entirely too fucking funny Major Nikon Mar 2016 #269

Is Neil deGrasse Tyson a Monsanto troll? ZombieHorde Mar 2016 #259

Sure Major Nikon Mar 2016 #267

Yeah, MSG is one of the most prolific amino acids that is present in foods, if its poison... Humanist_Activist Mar 2016 #14

If it's already in the food. Then why add more? Hugin Mar 2016 #45

Why add more? For the taste, maybe? Thor_MN Mar 2016 #49

Taste is subjective. Hugin Mar 2016 #54

In other words, you don't understand it, so you fear it. Thor_MN Mar 2016 #56

No, no fear at all. Hugin Mar 2016 #57

So you don't use salt, or sugar, or any of a hundred spices then? Thor_MN Mar 2016 #58

I see nowhere in my replies that I've said or even implied such a thing. Hugin Mar 2016 #60

Your selective reading due to your bias will never let you see anything you don't agree with. Thor_MN Mar 2016 #61

Yes, I am biased. I'm just not into woo. n/t Hugin Mar 2016 #63

What woo? Seeing this little conversation thread... Humanist_Activist Mar 2016 #69

Funny you should bring that up... Because, I've done that very thing. Hugin Mar 2016 #108

I'd prefer to buy it locally if possible, I am curious if your observations are accurate... Humanist_Activist Mar 2016 #112

The spice industry INVENTED deceptive marketing centuries ago. Hugin Mar 2016 #147

True - dump MSG into low quality food womanofthehills Mar 2016 #197

+1 Hugin Mar 2016 #200

Sorry, denial. You are precisely spouting woo. Thor_MN Mar 2016 #73

It's amazing to find that some people are so emotionally invested in defending MSG. n/t Hugin Mar 2016 #109

There's nothing to defend really, you are just being silly. n/t Humanist_Activist Mar 2016 #110

I'm not defending MSG. I'm arguing against woo. Thor_MN Mar 2016 #111

It adds a 'savory' flavor to food. Vaguely equivalent to adding meat. (nt) jeff47 Mar 2016 #65

It adds a flavor to food that has no flavor womanofthehills Mar 2016 #198

MSG will close up my throat womanofthehills Mar 2016 #85

So you don't eat tomatoes, most Cheeses, mushrooms, etc. Humanist_Activist Mar 2016 #88

By the way - glutamate has nothing to do with gluten womanofthehills Mar 2016 #98

Nothing to do with intelligence, just education, there's nothing in MSG to cause the symptoms... Humanist_Activist Mar 2016 #103

When I found out that the fear of MSG was based on nothing, I was pissed off Blecht Mar 2016 #127

Did you know MSG is a good weed killer womanofthehills Mar 2016 #190

I didn't know that because I'm pretty sure it's complete nonsense Major Nikon Mar 2016 #270

I believe some people have nasty allergies to MSG. ZombieHorde Mar 2016 #248

I believe some people claim to have nasty allergies to MSG Major Nikon Mar 2016 #271

Huh, that's interesting. ZombieHorde Mar 2016 #278

They don't seem to like MSG in Sri Linka womanofthehills Mar 2016 #192

Well, what they "don't like" is East Asian cuisine taking over traditional Sinhala and Tamil cuisine Recursion Mar 2016 #208

MSG is a weedicide in Ceylon because glyphosate is banned womanofthehills Mar 2016 #193

And? Its interesting that it has more than one use. Not relevant to the argument... Humanist_Activist Mar 2016 #209

Hydrogen hydroxide is a commonly used food additive that's also used as an industrial solvent Major Nikon Mar 2016 #272

Then you should only buy foods that... meaculpa2011 Mar 2016 #17

Define genetically modified mythology Mar 2016 #36

If providing more information was the goal, they'd be pushing a GMO-free label. jeff47 Mar 2016 #64

Can you provide a source for your claim? Blecht Mar 2016 #128

Not conveniently. jeff47 Mar 2016 #135

Actually it will also kill you weeds womanofthehills Mar 2016 #195

So I take it you don't eat salt or vinegar Major Nikon Mar 2016 #277

I need to know if MSG is in my food womanofthehills Mar 2016 #91

You do realize that foods with MSG in it aren't all labeled as such, correct? Humanist_Activist Mar 2016 #93

I eat mostly fresh foods womanofthehills Mar 2016 #99

Uhm, those aren't all other names for MSG, MSG is Monosodium Glutamate... Humanist_Activist Mar 2016 #104

What if it doesn't? HuckleB Mar 2016 #251

Yup! longship Mar 2016 #2

You disagree with Obama nationalize the fed Mar 2016 #5

See, this belies what should be the purpose of labeling, you want GMOs banned, for no better... Humanist_Activist Mar 2016 #15

Candidate Obama was pandering rjsquirrel Mar 2016 #27

Personally Geronimoe Mar 2016 #6

Should the label include soil content? ZombieHorde Mar 2016 #145

You want to keep people from getting information they say they want. It's as simple as that. DisgustipatedinCA Mar 2016 #150

The information they want isn't the information they would be getting from a gmo label. ZombieHorde Mar 2016 #173

I disagree with the basis of your argument. DisgustipatedinCA Mar 2016 #174

GMO labeling in the US isn't currently mandatory, so of course there's no harm there. ZombieHorde Mar 2016 #176

I meant that I don't believe you or anyone could show harm if this became a law. DisgustipatedinCA Mar 2016 #179

The exact same labeling argument can be made for "fertilized with cow shit" Major Nikon Mar 2016 #184

Ah. I should have guessed your intent, but I was posting right before leaving for work and ZombieHorde Mar 2016 #205

Examples from Europe nationalize the fed Mar 2016 #210

I would say I have less of a problem with those labels, most people will end up ignoring them as... Humanist_Activist Mar 2016 #211

There's also a good chance in Europe your hamburger contains horse meat Major Nikon Mar 2016 #275

GMO labeling is about to be mandatory in Vermont womanofthehills Mar 2016 #187

I think food should be labelled rpannier Mar 2016 #10

This message was self-deleted by its author AxionExcel Mar 2016 #12

Hah! The magazine writer got suckered into parroting a standard GMO industry lie. Foof. AxionExcel Mar 2016 #13

And only 97% of scientists believe in climate change mythology Mar 2016 #41

the author is a conservative, so her facts come straight from her ass yurbud Mar 2016 #52

Is Neil deGrasse Tyson a sucker on the subject of science? ZombieHorde Mar 2016 #260

I think they should have to label Eko Mar 2016 #16

Certified Organic vegetables, particularly low to the ground ones, should have a... Humanist_Activist Mar 2016 #18

If we are going Eko Mar 2016 #20

Organic does label itself organic WDIM Mar 2016 #181

Non GMO doesnt mean organic at all. Eko Mar 2016 #194

Some organic food is also GMO. ZombieHorde Mar 2016 #257

Selective breading is not GMO WDIM Mar 2016 #264

Let Neil deGrasse Tyson explain GMOs... ZombieHorde Mar 2016 #265

Thanks for the after school special. WDIM Mar 2016 #266

Neither is hybridization, cell fusion, mutation breeding, polyploidy, or several other methods Major Nikon Mar 2016 #276

I only eat organic womanofthehills Mar 2016 #188

The plural of anecdote is not data. HuckleB Mar 2016 #236

Meanwhile, back at the ranch, real energy going to GMOs should be harnessed to LuckyLib Mar 2016 #19

How does that work? We are living longer and healthier lives than... Humanist_Activist Mar 2016 #23

that could be because of or in spite of any one particular factor yurbud Mar 2016 #33

Uhm, non-smokers live longer than smokers, generally due to complications from smoking.... Humanist_Activist Mar 2016 #74

Lots of communities. Here are a few. LuckyLib Mar 2016 #114

Of course, but these are, generally, localized events affecting few people... Humanist_Activist Mar 2016 #212

Agreed - Check this recent report on France banning neonicotinoid pesticides womanofthehills Mar 2016 #102

well.... ellennelle Mar 2016 #21

I'd like to Rec your post... druidity33 Mar 2016 #32

Well said lagomorph777 Mar 2016 #268

And that's why the vast majority of scientists also understand that GMOs are safe. HuckleB Mar 2016 #273

Anti-GMO activists are the ones practicing “tobacco science”. HuckleB Mar 2016 #274

This debate is not about science WestMichRad Mar 2016 #22

^^^THIS!!! U4ikLefty Mar 2016 #80

Actually, based on the content of your post, for you, it's about the propaganda of some marketers. HuckleB Mar 2016 #237

Maybe labeling soil content would give more information than a GMO label. ZombieHorde Mar 2016 #249

Monsanto's Zombies and Hucklesters lagomorph777 Mar 2016 #256

Your subject line made me smile. ZombieHorde Mar 2016 #258

Also included with those foods ... Autumn Colors Mar 2016 #24

One of the problems is: what exactly does "GMO" mean? Thor_MN Mar 2016 #37

Science isn't "scary" katsy Mar 2016 #115

Do you understand that most people don't know what a GMO is? Thor_MN Mar 2016 #134

I don't care if corporations suck at effectively katsy Mar 2016 #148

Required labeling is not corporations communicating, it's the goverment communicating Thor_MN Mar 2016 #149

If the communication isn't supported by a science-based justification, it's meaningless. HuckleB Mar 2016 #154

It's their fucking products katsy Mar 2016 #156

I'm one of the people speaking out against woo and anti-science... Thor_MN Mar 2016 #182

And I repeat katsy Mar 2016 #183

You don't get to play both sides of the coin. Thor_MN Mar 2016 #185

Childish. katsy Mar 2016 #204

Yes, you are being childish, trying to quote science while adovcating woo. Thor_MN Mar 2016 #217

I also am so sick of DU'ers using the word Woo womanofthehills Mar 2016 #222

Stop using woo, and others won't point it out. HuckleB Mar 2016 #231

No, no breaks, you use arguments from ignorance, discredited studies, and cognitive bias... Humanist_Activist Mar 2016 #240

Woo is an appropriate label when one can not support an argument. Thor_MN Mar 2016 #262

You say you wants science yet you seem to believe that there is a mass conspiracy against GMOs GreatGazoo Mar 2016 #25

I think it's a marketing ploy by big organic. ZombieHorde Mar 2016 #261

Do you work for Monsanto or are you just paid by them? classykaren Mar 2016 #26

Is this argument about Organic vs. GMO monicaangela Mar 2016 #28

If GMO foods are so good for us the industry should be happy to label them. Scuba Mar 2016 #29

Did she cite these 1700 studies? yurbud Mar 2016 #31

GMO modifications only serve one purpose randr Mar 2016 #34

You seem to not understand what "GMO"s are. Thor_MN Mar 2016 #38

We have been selectively altering plants and animals to our benefit randr Mar 2016 #39

Are you kidding? Thor_MN Mar 2016 #47

No, we have been altering nature for profit for centuries. jeff47 Mar 2016 #66

ROFLMAO Odin2005 Mar 2016 #78

you mean like mopinko Mar 2016 #46

the last thing on earth I would want to eat womanofthehills Mar 2016 #189

well the last thing i want to see is wasted food. especially food that is fine to eat. mopinko Mar 2016 #199

Your definition of "fine to eat" is womanofthehills Mar 2016 #223

that's just bull. mopinko Mar 2016 #239

This bit about science for hire sounds like something only a bigger industry than organics could do: yurbud Mar 2016 #35

I'm tired of this righteousness Trajan Mar 2016 #40

Yeah, but they are out there polluting the Intertubes relentlessly AxionExcel Mar 2016 #42

If I'm concerned about GMOs, I assume anything without the label "100% Organic% has GMOs. Hoyt Mar 2016 #43

"Organic" is not the opposite of "GMO" Thor_MN Mar 2016 #113

Organic is nothing more than a marketing term Major Nikon Mar 2016 #119

wow this could rank up with should we declaw our cats when they get circumcised dembotoz Mar 2016 #44

I've noticed that 'GMO' threads in GD look an awful lot like 'gun' threads petronius Mar 2016 #62

A) I don't care what anyone thinks, I still want the information. SusanCalvin Mar 2016 #51

You have the information... meaculpa2011 Mar 2016 #53

Nope. I also want it labeled if is GMO. SusanCalvin Mar 2016 #59

Okay then... meaculpa2011 Mar 2016 #71

I'm not writing the law, so I hadn't thought about it in depth. SusanCalvin Mar 2016 #72

How about Tangelos... meaculpa2011 Mar 2016 #81

Are you telling me tangelos were created in a lab, by directly manipulating DNA? SusanCalvin Mar 2016 #83

Directly manipulating DNA means more control, unlike with mutation breeding, where the effects... Humanist_Activist Mar 2016 #92

Tested?? TESTED?? By the corporations pushing them?? SusanCalvin Mar 2016 #100

Uhm... Humanist_Activist Mar 2016 #105

Don't particularly trust them either. SusanCalvin Mar 2016 #106

I've been on feedlots, poultry breeders... meaculpa2011 Mar 2016 #94

I think a lot of this push for not just GMO labeling but food denialism in general is due to... Humanist_Activist Mar 2016 #96

I grew up in NYC where most people think that... meaculpa2011 Mar 2016 #97

I see your point. SusanCalvin Mar 2016 #101

How about those produced by exposing seeds to mutagens including chemicals and/or radiation? X_Digger Mar 2016 #124

You're right - I don't like those either. nt SusanCalvin Mar 2016 #151

Link us to your advocacy for labels for MBOs, then. HuckleB Mar 2016 #158

What's this "us," Bub? SusanCalvin Mar 2016 #160

Us = DUers. ... So, you admit your claim is false. HuckleB Mar 2016 #163

There are more GMOs than RoundUp resistant GMOs. (nt) jeff47 Mar 2016 #67

I am aware of this. I still want them labeled. SusanCalvin Mar 2016 #68

You have no justification for this "want." HuckleB Mar 2016 #143

OK, but I'm far from the only one with the "want." SusanCalvin Mar 2016 #153

Europe has nothing like the labels proposed for the US. HuckleB Mar 2016 #155

Whatever. SusanCalvin Mar 2016 #161

You are promoting something that can't be justified by logic or science. HuckleB Mar 2016 #164

It's a start in the US - Vermont will soon be labeling GMO's womanofthehills Mar 2016 #224

And you won't know any more about your food than you already do. HuckleB Mar 2016 #232

Um, the whole point of GMOs is to use less Roundup, not more. Deadshot Mar 2016 #130

No, they use more. SusanCalvin Mar 2016 #152

So you want harsher herbicides? HuckleB Mar 2016 #157

Don't want 'em at all. SusanCalvin Mar 2016 #159

That's not going to help you. HuckleB Mar 2016 #162

Growing organically keeps all those pesticides womanofthehills Mar 2016 #191

No, it doesn't. HuckleB Mar 2016 #233

I echo your dislike of Roundup phylny Mar 2016 #171

a big part of the modifying is to make it "Round Up ready" & that stuff is bad for you yurbud Mar 2016 #55

What is bad for you? And how? n/t Humanist_Activist Mar 2016 #75

Round Up? Google Round Up human health effects. NIH has one study that says it messes up embyos yurbud Mar 2016 #79

Gilles-Eric Seralini is a fraud who has been on an Anti-GMO crusade since 1999... Humanist_Activist Mar 2016 #82

I wonder why NIH would post his article then... yurbud Mar 2016 #116

Because they publish everyone with only minimal oversight, anyone can get published.... Humanist_Activist Mar 2016 #117

He also gets financed and paid by the organic/supplement industry Major Nikon Mar 2016 #142

You might want to know more about the story. HuckleB Mar 2016 #165

People are idiotically scared of GMOs in general when the actual issue is the fucking Glyophosate... Odin2005 Mar 2016 #76

Not sure why glyphosate would be the problem, the problem is with... Humanist_Activist Mar 2016 #84

Cuba farms without pesticides womanofthehills Mar 2016 #87

And they import 84 percent of their food as of 2007, not exactly a model for sustainability... Humanist_Activist Mar 2016 #89

Nonsense Major Nikon Mar 2016 #133

Actually that's not the issue that drives the irrational fear Major Nikon Mar 2016 #120

A little "chemophobia" might protect our waterways womanofthehills Mar 2016 #225

Actually your link encourages more data, not more bullshit Major Nikon Mar 2016 #227

Some anti-gmo groups actually tried convincing diabetics... Lancero Mar 2016 #144

Umm. HuckleB Mar 2016 #167

I prefer organics from small local farms Marrah_G Mar 2016 #77

Yes they are, farming is one of the most environmentally destructive things we can do... Humanist_Activist Mar 2016 #86

Personally, I believe consumers should be provided with as much information as possible. OZi Mar 2016 #107

If it's such a great thing to fertilize food with cow shit, why not advertise that fact? Major Nikon Mar 2016 #123

So you prefer to poison the environment - sounds like a Republican thing to me womanofthehills Mar 2016 #203

Not sure of your argument, you do know the Organic industry uses pesticides as well, right? Humanist_Activist Mar 2016 #213

If you are going for the non sequitur award, you have my vote Major Nikon Mar 2016 #214

The label is going to tell you absolutely nothing. Deadshot Mar 2016 #132

Until the law requires that ALL GMO research be published, not just that favorable pnwmom Mar 2016 #125

Is there some other industry where such a requirement exists? Major Nikon Mar 2016 #126

There should be such a requirement for the pharmaceutical industry, too, and any other industry pnwmom Mar 2016 #131

You didn't answer the question Major Nikon Mar 2016 #136

It does for some drugs and biologics, but researchers apparently have been lax pnwmom Mar 2016 #137

No such requirement can be found in your link Major Nikon Mar 2016 #139

I added another link. And it talks about how researchers conducting registered trials have NOT been pnwmom Mar 2016 #140

Neither can the requirement be found there Major Nikon Mar 2016 #141

Follow the money. Deadshot Mar 2016 #129

From the USDA website: Major Nikon Mar 2016 #138

Prices from Whole Foods this week womanofthehills Mar 2016 #201

I'm sure you consider Consumer Reports a shill for the industry, but here's what they said... Major Nikon Mar 2016 #219

I only shop organic womanofthehills Mar 2016 #226

Sure, because anecdotal "evidence" always trumps data Major Nikon Mar 2016 #228

Grab your fire retardent clothing tymorial Mar 2016 #177

Oh wait, its already happened. tymorial Mar 2016 #178

Label it then if its so great! WDIM Mar 2016 #180

Actually organic foods are better for the planet/waterways womanofthehills Mar 2016 #196

Evidently you didn't even read your own source Major Nikon Mar 2016 #215

Never trust a huge conglomerate to have the clients best interest at heart. That is universal. Rex Mar 2016 #186

THERE HAVE NOT BEEN 1700 STUDIES ON GMO SAFETY Blue Meany Mar 2016 #202

"The biggest scientific fraud of our age" nationalize the fed Mar 2016 #206

Actually I'm surprised it took this long for someone to channel Seralini in this thread Major Nikon Mar 2016 #218

Perhaps you should... nationalize the fed Mar 2016 #220

So does this mean the book doesn't rely on Seralini's pseudoscience? Major Nikon Mar 2016 #221

You have no idea what you're talking about Major Nikon Mar 2016 #216

I went through it. It's a "hodgepodge of articles," like Blue Meany says. immoderate Mar 2016 #229

You are correct, there is no claim of safety, which is why Blue Meany's assertion is strawman Major Nikon Mar 2016 #234

Shit, you asked a really good question, in my opinion. ZombieHorde Mar 2016 #247

I have no problem, in theory, with GMO crops eniwetok Mar 2016 #238

Umm. HuckleB Mar 2016 #241

I share your prejudice. ZombieHorde Mar 2016 #253

Eat only gmo foods and you will become a zombie. Dont call me Shirley Mar 2016 #263

Shirley you don't mean that. nt ZombieHorde Mar 2016 #280

Evolution = GMO food = GMO people So Far From Heaven Mar 2016 #279

If I Were a Food Activist HuckleB Mar 2016 #281

Some good points in there. nt ZombieHorde Mar 2016 #282