General Discussion

Fringe

(175 posts)

183. Most people?

Fri Jul 19, 2013, 09:40 PM

Jul 2013

Last edited Sat Jul 20, 2013, 08:07 AM - Edit history (1)

I don't think you really know whether most people are better off or not.

In fact many of the people I work with make more than they did in 2009 and constantly complain all a while spending gobs of money on trinkets and bobbles that then end up giving away or throwing in the trash.

Some people are better off and some people just perceive that they are not. I work with lots of people who have gotten themselves into to debt and end up paying so much in interest that they don't have any money except for food or bills.

These are the people I work with presently and the same with the people I've worked with in the past.

Yes, people do struggle but many people create problems of their own making.

As far as unemployment especially with people who are over 40 and especially over 50, age discrimination is a big problem and with so much of the population getting older= a lot of unemployed older folks.

I also lost my job in 2007 and I am over 50 and it took me almost 3 years to get a full time job. Because of the programs in the last 4 years, i was able to get free training, extended unemployment and food stamps all while taking any minimum wage job I could find.

It was a very hard time for me. I have years of experience and I was passed over by younger less experienced people twice and even though I have a job it still happens when I apply for promotions.

I've struggled and many like me are doing better today because what Obama and the democrats made available with programs and assistance.

(Also please excuse, any mistakes. I'm on an Ipad, I don't have the internet, just my Ipad)

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There hasn't been ANY economic recovery since 2009 [View all] DemocratForJustice Jul 2013 OP

No "corporations" have been given "$2.5 trillion" from the public treasury Kolesar Jul 2013 #1

The GDP number is dependent on inflation DemocratForJustice Jul 2013 #3

Except that there is no inflation to speak of, as witnessed by 2% yields on 10-year U.S. Treasuries HardTimes99 Jul 2013 #15

Disagree to this extent: The official rate of inflation is below what the FED aims for but the byeya Jul 2013 #35

The 2% yield on 10 year Treasury notes is entirely the creation of the Federal Reserve private bank DemocratForJustice Jul 2013 #50

"Federal Reserve private bank" - where do you get this rubbish? - nt HardTimes99 Jul 2013 #54

What everyone should know about the Federal Reserve private bank DemocratForJustice Jul 2013 #66

Every American Marblehead Jul 2013 #79

Yep DemocratForJustice Jul 2013 #101

Yup! NT pizzadave Jul 2013 #152

Go to Free Republic and lurk for a few posts. You will hear the exact same description bluestate10 Jul 2013 #159

It's not rightwing BS and it's not left wing BS DemocratForJustice Jul 2013 #185

Labling facts as right or left wing does not make a fact go away. dixiegrrrrl Jul 2013 #207

The Federal Reserve System..."our" central bank. roamer65 Jul 2013 #174

The overhwhelming majority of my expenses are snot Jul 2013 #84

EXACTLY (nt) DemocratForJustice Jul 2013 #124

On which grocery aisle can I find these "T-bills" lumberjack_jeff Jul 2013 #104

All goods and services are subject to inflation. As it happens, core CPI HardTimes99 Jul 2013 #133

Freeper arguments Benton D Struckcheon Jul 2013 #202

You are being generous using 1990 math ... HumansAndResources Jul 2013 #19

And where would the profit be in this pipe dream???? socialist_n_TN Jul 2013 #160

Don't forget the " Jobless Recovery " and the Historic propulsion of orpupilofnature57 Jul 2013 #2

Thats a hard sell to the millions who have found decent jobs since being laid off.. DCBob Jul 2013 #4

But millions of well paying jobs HAVEN'T been created DemocratForJustice Jul 2013 #10

Certain groups have been left out of the ranks of employed. African American unemployment is byeya Jul 2013 #36

Of course there are still big problems but alot of folks are much better off than they were in 2009. DCBob Jul 2013 #123

For the 1%, yes Hydra Jul 2013 #146

I am not the one percent... Fringe Jul 2013 #155

Me too...at the edge of the poverty line, but still much better off bhikkhu Jul 2013 #186

I am much better off now than I was in 2009. Fringe Jul 2013 #156

Bully for you!.... socialist_n_TN Jul 2013 #166

Most people? Fringe Jul 2013 #183

And WHO is responsible the that? Can you bring yourself to say republicans? nt bluestate10 Jul 2013 #161

Nope, I cannot say that because it would not be the truth. DemocratForJustice Jul 2013 #187

The graphs are ugly enough. Boomerproud Jul 2013 #190

Stock market is trading is actually flat, meaning only the 1% are really trading and it's really Katashi_itto Jul 2013 #5

Hunh? I'm no Pollyana about today's economy but the stock market indices are all HardTimes99 Jul 2013 #16

No, I'm talking trading volume. Your quite right about the market going up Katashi_itto Jul 2013 #27

+1 The stock market is increasingly irrelevant to most people's lives. reformist2 Jul 2013 #26

I think the opposite is true. spooky3 Jul 2013 #30

Only something like 15% of Americans have 401Ks. reformist2 Jul 2013 #33

I think at one time there used to be more people with 401ks Quantess Jul 2013 #34

Please provide links. Most people have >1 spooky3 Jul 2013 #45

The number I keep getting is 65 million accounts, but many people have more than 1 account. reformist2 Jul 2013 #48

Again, provide links. spooky3 Jul 2013 #53

I'm pretty sure you can do a google search. reformist2 Jul 2013 #57

I'm pretty sure you can admit you were wrong. spooky3 Jul 2013 #108

More facts ipaint Jul 2013 #154

How safe do you think that's going to be .... socialist_n_TN Jul 2013 #171

Yep. All we have left is Social Security. And we're going to have to fight tooth and nail to keep it reformist2 Jul 2013 #181

That is true. roamer65 Jul 2013 #180

That's not true, not by a long shot bhikkhu Jul 2013 #222

Most Americans have very little in the stock market - certainly nothing to retire on. reformist2 Jul 2013 #224

"very little" is still a lot, to those who have put something aside bhikkhu Jul 2013 #225

Why would you say it is flat? Fringe Jul 2013 #157

But wait - earnings for commercial banks including BOA are way up!! geckosfeet Jul 2013 #6

Well said DemocratForJustice Jul 2013 #8

Foolish moron? Who do you think he works for ... Us?? HumansAndResources Jul 2013 #13

For the most I am sure you are correct. geckosfeet Jul 2013 #14

that opportunity extends to his children datasuspect Jul 2013 #24

"banks are rolling in taxpayer dough"-You have no idea what you are talking about Kolesar Jul 2013 #144

Another errrp. Please google quantitative easing and get back to me. geckosfeet Jul 2013 #177

Such command of the English language you have! Kolesar Jul 2013 #205

Errrp again. Not up front. But do you think the Fed is just doing this out of a sense of decency? geckosfeet Jul 2013 #209

This should be an OP, woo me with science Jul 2013 #167

I do not need models quaker bill Jul 2013 #7

Here's the way an economist friend explained the recovery to me OnlinePoker Jul 2013 #41

I see people investing in housing and buying products like ranges and air conditioners. bluestate10 Jul 2013 #163

My stuff is affordable to mid range jewelry quaker bill Jul 2013 #178

Your absolutist "ANY" undermines your credibility as an analyst. grantcart Jul 2013 #9

Bravo! I was getting ready to reply to the OP with Disraeli's quip about HardTimes99 Jul 2013 #18

There may be some hyperbole and questionable references but the base meaning is correct. geckosfeet Jul 2013 #22

There's no question that the fruits of the recovery have been disproportionately HardTimes99 Jul 2013 #25

I do think that some of the buyback money has escaped the confines of Wall street and seeped geckosfeet Jul 2013 #29

The excessive concentration of wealth in the hands of a small elite is seldom HardTimes99 Jul 2013 #32

Bailing out the people instead of bailing out the banks??? God forbid! reformist2 Jul 2013 #43

I agree that the base meaning is correct, that is why it is too bad his presentation grantcart Jul 2013 #111

Counter arguments DemocratForJustice Jul 2013 #31

"Nobody wants to borrow" or really almost nobody wants to borrow or use their corporate largesse byeya Jul 2013 #38

Yes DemocratForJustice Jul 2013 #75

Thanks. Bernacke knows a lot about the Great Depression; he wrote a pretty good book about byeya Jul 2013 #77

Yep DemocratForJustice Jul 2013 #85

question: Did you read Bernacke's book or familiar with it through general review and grantcart Jul 2013 #112

You are new to DU so here are some tips: grantcart Jul 2013 #110

TY for the tips - I am new here DemocratForJustice Jul 2013 #132

I am not going to respond to your sweeping conclusions because they just are not grantcart Jul 2013 #134

This is lot of information. truedelphi Jul 2013 #203

FCUK FACTS!!! We hate them, better to listen to the M$M...they never steer us wrong dangit!!! uponit7771 Jul 2013 #125

The OP used lots of rightwing buzzwords and fact dismissals. The text became so bluestate10 Jul 2013 #165

Your point "d" needs refinement. roamer65 Jul 2013 #182

Lol. nt AllINeedIsCoffee Jul 2013 #11

Well aren't you a ray sunshine this morning? n/t leeroysphitz Jul 2013 #12

NO NO NO! Everything is great!!!! progressoid Jul 2013 #17

k&r for exposure. n/t Laelth Jul 2013 #20

Troll Android3.14 Jul 2013 #21

the rich are getting richer and that is ALL that matters datasuspect Jul 2013 #23

Why are you using graphs showing median family Progressive dog Jul 2013 #28

Charts showing wages against REAL inflation DemocratForJustice Jul 2013 #40

Should be easy to calculate with a computer Progressive dog Jul 2013 #52

Yes, it is simple math and could be produced DemocratForJustice Jul 2013 #74

You posted 2 of them, use the one closer to the BLS and Progressive dog Jul 2013 #76

They take the average price of what people are paying for handsets DemocratForJustice Jul 2013 #88

Who does this, the guys with the "revised inflation" Progressive dog Jul 2013 #149

I'm calling bullshit on this piece of link bait Politicub Jul 2013 #37

The OP is talking almost exclusively about the public sector - jobs and consumer income. geckosfeet Jul 2013 #42

Yep DemocratForJustice Jul 2013 #62

+1 Jamaal510 Jul 2013 #194

Kick and R for truth telling. Safetykitten Jul 2013 #39

This message was self-deleted by its author scheming daemons Jul 2013 #44

extreme fail by a known troll scheming daemons Jul 2013 #46

And This Is News To? 1ProudAtheist Jul 2013 #47

Congratulations! You've attracted a veritable who's who of DU's corporate boot-lickers. n/t Egalitarian Thug Jul 2013 #49

Thanks for telling me DemocratForJustice Jul 2013 #55

I'll say! Safetykitten Jul 2013 #56

Are you referring to those who recognize that the OP is pure bullshit? n/t ProSense Jul 2013 #59

And you are once again lock step with any troll spouting crap about how bad we are. great white snark Jul 2013 #81

The problem is systemic and fundamental; the need for GROWTH is the problem. Civilization2 Jul 2013 #51

It's a dangerous proposition - capitalism itself is based on assumptions of growth. reformist2 Jul 2013 #61

Sustainable capitalism is possible,. but not this corporate capitalism of plunder and exploitation. Civilization2 Jul 2013 #69

If it's sustainable, or at least static, it's not capitalism... socialist_n_TN Jul 2013 #173

I am thinking of a balanced "social-market economy" type system,. Civilization2 Jul 2013 #206

Best post in this thread; thank you. truebluegreen Jul 2013 #64

The main problem is one of distribution, not growth. n/t lumberjack_jeff Jul 2013 #106

infinite growth on a finite planet is just not possible. basing our economy on this idea is silly. Civilization2 Jul 2013 #139

The people for whom this economy is supposed to work don't need or demand infinite growth. lumberjack_jeff Jul 2013 #142

Update: Recovery Measures ProSense Jul 2013 #58

All hands on deck...AOOOGA! Safetykitten Jul 2013 #60

2012: State-level data confirm nationwide recovery ProSense Jul 2013 #63

Krugman: Employment recovery from Great Recession better than after most historical recoveries ProSense Jul 2013 #65

Now adjust those charts for REAL inflation DemocratForJustice Jul 2013 #80

Now, watch this drive ProSense Jul 2013 #83

I didn't "spin anything away" DemocratForJustice Jul 2013 #89

There are all sorts of different methods one might use bhikkhu Jul 2013 #223

complete and total ownage of the OP! n/t taught_me_patience Jul 2013 #176

Must be really dark in your world. nt treestar Jul 2013 #67

It's really dark in a lot of our worlds. progressoid Jul 2013 #129

tl;dr :: Someone do the cliff notes. Is the sky falling or not? whttevrr Jul 2013 #68

LOL - It's a dirty job, but someone had to do it (read the OP's gibberish). I HardTimes99 Jul 2013 #70

I like the squiggle lines... whttevrr Jul 2013 #71

Grantcart (mid-thread) pretty effectively demolishes the OP, saving HardTimes99 Jul 2013 #73

How do Grantcart, ProSense and yourself square the booming economy geckosfeet Jul 2013 #78

Detroit's numbers are included in JoePhilly Jul 2013 #82

Oh I see. So we just write it off. They are poor black people so they don't count. geckosfeet Jul 2013 #95

Using Straw men against other DUers does not advance your argument. nt stevenleser Jul 2013 #212

Which straw man? The poor unemployed one in Detroit or the rich one on Wall Street. geckosfeet Jul 2013 #214

Any one where you alter that person's argument instead of addressing it directly. aka, the meaning stevenleser Jul 2013 #215

Ahhh. So you must mean this one too.... geckosfeet Jul 2013 #216

How does your sky is falling square with the 1000's of cities Sheepshank Jul 2013 #90

Yeah. Okay. See my response above. geckosfeet Jul 2013 #96

And continues to imply that Cities taking out bankrupcy is a new thing? Sheepshank Jul 2013 #99

Yes - when was the last time a MAJOR US CITY went bankrupt? Can you say NEVER. geckosfeet Jul 2013 #115

Look at your own fucking link Sheepshank Jul 2013 #119

I did. About half of them are post 2008. And watch the language pal. geckosfeet Jul 2013 #127

no one is asking you to kiss anything Sheepshank Jul 2013 #147

Errrp. National unemployment rate. Oh where is that number. Lets just call geckosfeet Jul 2013 #141

you are changing your point. Sheepshank Jul 2013 #148

As a symptom of propping up Wall Street and letting Main Street scramble for the crumbs. geckosfeet Jul 2013 #150

None of us (AFAIK) said the economy was 'booming.' I have taken HardTimes99 Jul 2013 #131

That's about where I skipped down to the 'reply button' whttevrr Jul 2013 #87

For some reason, your posts are making me giggle uncontrollably. Not sure why :) - nt HardTimes99 Jul 2013 #94

If we don't laugh we cry whttevrr Jul 2013 #122

The article refers to the cpi models in place at different dates to calculate inflation DemocratForJustice Jul 2013 #140

Infinite growth cannot be supported by a world of finite resources Jessy169 Jul 2013 #72

The OP ignores that the rest of the world is getting it's piece of the economic pie. bluestate10 Jul 2013 #168

THIS explains everything Jessy169 Jul 2013 #221

I'm not an economist naturallyselected Jul 2013 #86

Your last bit about the Corporate world cutting their own throats is absolutely correct. DemocratForJustice Jul 2013 #92

BLS: State unemployment rates were "little changed" in June ProSense Jul 2013 #91

The BLS Household survey for June reported DemocratForJustice Jul 2013 #93

U.S. job growth improves, exceeds expectations ProSense Jul 2013 #97

Employment Report: More Hiring, Wages Up, Still Weak Labor Market ProSense Jul 2013 #100

Please tell me where they calculate total gross wages in that report DemocratForJustice Jul 2013 #105

"Please tell me" ProSense Jul 2013 #109

The fundamental fact is that when DemocratForJustice Jul 2013 #118

U-6 was a 4 month high of 14.3% byeya Jul 2013 #103

How ProSense Jul 2013 #107

You are mixing up several concepts stevenleser Jul 2013 #98

Not really DemocratForJustice Jul 2013 #114

You can't change the rules midstream and expect it to mean something. No other recovery has been stevenleser Jul 2013 #117

If someone asks a question or makes a point DemocratForJustice Jul 2013 #128

You can say anything you want to say. If you incorrectly use terms that have definite meanings... stevenleser Jul 2013 #153

No other recovery has happened with a world full of competitors or with unprecedented bluestate10 Jul 2013 #170

It's obvious to me that my clients certainly haven't recovered from the kestrel91316 Jul 2013 #102

I am sorry for that. I can tell you my business and clients have. I understand grantcart Jul 2013 #113

Everyone that I deal with are doing better financially today that they were before President bluestate10 Jul 2013 #172

Headline generally correct, but some of the OP is woo cthulu2016 Jul 2013 #116

To bolster your post, the state of NC recently cut the amount paid to unemployed people byeya Jul 2013 #121

There are now 50Million people classified as "poor"($11,000/yr for an individual and byeya Jul 2013 #120

And more are joining them every year now (nt) DemocratForJustice Jul 2013 #126

It's disheartening that this is happening and no one in power is putting forth a solution. byeya Jul 2013 #130

It is extremely disheartening mainly because it would be fairly simple to turn things completely DemocratForJustice Jul 2013 #136

Census: ProSense Jul 2013 #135

Wait and see what the poverty rate is going to be this time next year DemocratForJustice Jul 2013 #137

You just shattered the illusions of the sycophants, politicoes and front groups Corruption Inc Jul 2013 #138

It's nonsense ala' "Zerohedge.com" Kolesar Jul 2013 #145

Bingo. ucrdem Jul 2013 #198

Don't have graphs or anything, but... whttevrr Jul 2013 #143

Kick for truth. Safetykitten Jul 2013 #208

Welcome to active posting on DU! Hydra Jul 2013 #151

TY for the encouragement DemocratForJustice Jul 2013 #188

Put up as many charts as you want. The argument being proposed is fucking insane. bluestate10 Jul 2013 #158

I am putting together a post with my suggestions as to how to turn the American economy around DemocratForJustice Jul 2013 #191

Wow, there's so much garbage in this OP, it's not even worth it. tritsofme Jul 2013 #162

That's because it was never meant to be a recovery for the people. woo me with science Jul 2013 #164

I absolutely 100% agree with you DemocratForJustice Jul 2013 #192

Here is the cold hard truth. roamer65 Jul 2013 #169

The problem is, do you expect the rest of the world to allow us to make them poorer bluestate10 Jul 2013 #175

We have no say over Chinese economic policy. roamer65 Jul 2013 #179

Yes we do, and yes they have a say over ours. Our economies are too interconnected for it to be stevenleser Jul 2013 #213

I totally agree with you DemocratForJustice Jul 2013 #189

I have not seen it. roamer65 Jul 2013 #210

The only people doing better... awoke_in_2003 Jul 2013 #184

Yep. These charts show exactly what has been going on for the last 30 years DemocratForJustice Jul 2013 #195

The gospel according to Peter G. Peterson: cut debt, eliminate safety net, and lower taxes. ucrdem Jul 2013 #193

A number of other sources say exactly the same things DemocratForJustice Jul 2013 #196

Billionaires have deep pockets ucrdem Jul 2013 #197

But the same data can be found at places like DemocratForJustice Jul 2013 #199

I do agree with you that Foundations and "think tanks" DemocratForJustice Jul 2013 #200

THANK YOU MIRT ucrdem Jul 2013 #217

There hasn't been a recovery at all. NuclearDem Jul 2013 #201

ShadowStats?!?!?!? jazzimov Jul 2013 #204

kick woo me with science Jul 2013 #211

I'm afraid you're kicking a dead horse: ucrdem Jul 2013 #218

How sad. zappaman Jul 2013 #219

Oh he'll be back. ucrdem Jul 2013 #220