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In reply to the discussion: Math problems are a problem for job-seekers, employers say [View all]liberal_at_heart
(12,081 posts)59. I don't measure things in my every day life and I am so glad to know that you must know so
much about me without actually knowing me.
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Maybe if schools went back to teaching the material instead of teaching how to take a test.
hobbit709
Apr 2013
#3
They are not looking to hire scientists, just basic manufacturing machine operators
FarCenter
Apr 2013
#4
Yes. It is simply not reasonable to expect people to be able to multiply and divide by 12.
Nye Bevan
Apr 2013
#24
I think you're right. Sixteenths of an inch is far, far beyond my powers of comprehension (nt)
Nye Bevan
Apr 2013
#31
USA lost $1 billion Mars probe because a critical measurement wasn't converted between metric and
Bernardo de La Paz
Apr 2013
#44
It depends. My machinist 6" rule has 16ths and 32nds on one side and 10ths and 50ths on the other.
FarCenter
Apr 2013
#70
People who can't read a tape measure in 96 seconds are not fit to be trained as machinists and
Bernardo de La Paz
Apr 2013
#110
Thank you. You put your finger on the simple basic logic at point and expose the pay straw man. nt
Bernardo de La Paz
Apr 2013
#197
And a super majority of successful professionals who took the HS graduation exam failed it miserably
Fumesucker
Apr 2013
#199
People wanting to succeed in the 21st century need more skills than lawyers educated in the 20th.
Bernardo de La Paz
Apr 2013
#204
Well, it was the person highlighted in the article who seems to want to dilute the test. nt
Bernardo de La Paz
Apr 2013
#213
Modern grade school math education is getting back to that. It is more project based. nt
Bernardo de La Paz
Apr 2013
#212
Nor is it reasonable to gravitate towards the most effective and efficient form of measurement.
LanternWaste
Apr 2013
#209
they're clearly not paying enough to attract people who can pass their test. but HS math performance
HiPointDem
Apr 2013
#74
"formula"? There is no formula necessary. Basic simple understanding of the concepts is all.
Bernardo de La Paz
Apr 2013
#111
there *is* a formula, mass divided by volume. they wanted a specific number for a specific
HiPointDem
Apr 2013
#123
But you forgot the formula, when understanding the concepts is more powerful.
Bernardo de La Paz
Apr 2013
#124
i can't remember the formula because i'm about 40 years out of high school & have never had
HiPointDem
Apr 2013
#125
It's the culture from the bottom up. Cultures that respect learning (Euro, Jpn) have better schools.
Bernardo de La Paz
Apr 2013
#126
oh bullshit. japanese schools are not *better* than american schools (i know from lengthy personal
HiPointDem
Apr 2013
#139
Japanese schools outcompete American schools by all the usual measures.
Bernardo de La Paz
Apr 2013
#143
oh, TIMMS is 'the usual methods', eh? First administered in 1995, less than 20 years ago.
HiPointDem
Apr 2013
#156
Read. I did not write "usual methods". I wrote "usual measures". Fancy straw man you got there.
Bernardo de La Paz
Apr 2013
#160
same difference. not a straw man. surely a genius of logic such as yourself should know better.
HiPointDem
Apr 2013
#173
lol. 'fallacy'. 'straw man'. 'ad hominem'. you're the one tossing around the verbiage.
HiPointDem
Apr 2013
#175
more diversion from the facts i posted, which you ignore because they don't suit your narrative
HiPointDem
Apr 2013
#178
You make more stuff up. Nobody has quoted any Bill Gates press releases.
Bernardo de La Paz
Apr 2013
#162
only because you don't know anything about washington state politics and bill gates' media
HiPointDem
Apr 2013
#168
Thanks for the info. Americans have this mythology that somehow we used to be #1 in everything ...
eppur_se_muova
Apr 2013
#220
Density is dead simple. Understand density and you create the formula.
Bernardo de La Paz
Apr 2013
#127
he was a condescending jerk, and i remember him because he was so awful and *that* is when
HiPointDem
Apr 2013
#136
it's you with the ideologically driven nonsense. you make vapid generalizations about us schools,
HiPointDem
Apr 2013
#145
I haven't stated any ideological positions in this thread. You have already gotten into your
Bernardo de La Paz
Apr 2013
#147
your ideology is clear from your comments and your uncritical stance towards the article.
HiPointDem
Apr 2013
#154
People can't think because we are not teaching them how to think, but what to think.
Sivafae
Apr 2013
#131
Your empty response to a poster's thoughtful writing shows the emptiness of your ideology. nt
Bernardo de La Paz
Apr 2013
#149
'we are still stuck on rote learning' is more parrot-speak from someone who hasn't been
HiPointDem
Apr 2013
#153
why not, if all they're going to be doing is repetitive entry-level manufacturing tasks?
HiPointDem
Apr 2013
#80
Because thinking production workers do "repetitive entry-level manufacturing tasks" misses the boat.
Bernardo de La Paz
Apr 2013
#128
Because I've done entry level production work and know lots of people who have.
HiPointDem
Apr 2013
#134
Again: Fallacy of misdirection: The article is not about entry level production workers.
Bernardo de La Paz
Apr 2013
#150
oooh, "fallacy of misdirection"!!! repeating 'fallacy' over and over is what parrots do.
HiPointDem
Apr 2013
#152
If it's so fucking complex, why do they insist on hiring people with *only* a HS diploma? Oh,
HiPointDem
Apr 2013
#133
You don't know what they pay, but you think you know. It's because you are ruled by an
Bernardo de La Paz
Apr 2013
#137
i know that general plastics gets cheap labor subsidized by the government through a
HiPointDem
Apr 2013
#142
That information has nothing to do with the conclusion you jumped to, nor the facts of the article.
Bernardo de La Paz
Apr 2013
#146
actually, what eric said is that 1) his cheap-labor program is keeping him afloat in the recession
HiPointDem
Apr 2013
#161
Nope. Eric did not say that. You miscomprehend: "poised to come out" does not mean
Bernardo de La Paz
Apr 2013
#164
lol. if you say so. you are the genius who knows all about fallacies and density, after all.
HiPointDem
Apr 2013
#170
First name with "eric"? You kept on referring to him as "eric". Enough of this nonsense.
Bernardo de La Paz
Apr 2013
#172
your agenda is clear to anyone reading. as are your tactics. enough indeed.
HiPointDem
Apr 2013
#167
I've gotta admit, I don't remember calculus anymore, because I don't use it.
winter is coming
Apr 2013
#225
+1. +2. +3. .... Right on. Great post with examples from experience. nt
Bernardo de La Paz
Apr 2013
#48
Yeah. Truth. Right on. Damn straight. The real deal. On point. Should be obvious to all.
Bernardo de La Paz
Apr 2013
#46
Someone's skills would have to be pretty rusty to need several minutes to read a tape measure. (nt)
Posteritatis
Apr 2013
#14
Whether it's a ruler or a tape measure, same diff, used the same way
Bernardo de La Paz
Apr 2013
#51
I don't measure things in my every day life and I am so glad to know that you must know so
liberal_at_heart
Apr 2013
#59
Fine. We all start somewhere. Take charge of your life. Learn something new. You are not stupid.
Bernardo de La Paz
Apr 2013
#77
maybe the poster has other priorities. when s/he feels a strong need to convert recipes, s/he'll
HiPointDem
Apr 2013
#86
you don't know what the problem was. all you know is it involved reading a tape. you could
HiPointDem
Apr 2013
#87
I'd be hard pressed making difficult questions around a standard tape measure..
snooper2
Apr 2013
#94
what you did is pretty much irrelevant to anything. obviously, at some point you *learned* how
HiPointDem
Apr 2013
#98
yet here you are, able to do complex math! i was referring to installing crown moulding, not reading
HiPointDem
Apr 2013
#182
Get real. An adult not knowing how to use a ruler is inexcusable, period. (nt)
Posteritatis
Apr 2013
#185
"several" = 1.6 minutes, and that includes reading the initial instructions and each problem, in
HiPointDem
Apr 2013
#85
Is it time that under most state programs now in HS, 'basic' math isn't taught...
JCMach1
Apr 2013
#16
Count the number of lines between "1" and "2".. if there are 8, it's 8ths, etc
X_Digger
Apr 2013
#75
the question wasn't 'how many inches in a foot'. and how skilled you are at 'reading a tape
HiPointDem
Apr 2013
#91
I've encountered 4 twenty yr olds (give or take a year) lately, 3 male and 1 female, who can barely
Zorra
Apr 2013
#29
actually, it sounds like a job that requires no math skills. it's an entry level production job.
HiPointDem
Apr 2013
#100
it may be. now tell me about the other 17 questions. in fact, show me the problems and i'll
HiPointDem
Apr 2013
#176
i already said i have no problem with such tests; i have a problem with the spin, and i don't
HiPointDem
Apr 2013
#184
you're probably right, as the company has a 'partnership' with tacoma community college.
HiPointDem
Apr 2013
#190
Despite assertions, readers who read the article will see that it actually is not entry level jobs.
Bernardo de La Paz
Apr 2013
#169
I don't know if there's a standard unit for density (and I refuse to google it to look smart, hehe)
X_Digger
Apr 2013
#72
I'd imagine that's a HUGE part of the grunt work.. 'what' was 'where' being as important to the..
X_Digger
Apr 2013
#97
Mathematics, even basic mathematics, needs to be better respected in a culture that
Bernardo de La Paz
Apr 2013
#39
"test is rigged"? Get off. No company looking for employees would have any incentive
Bernardo de La Paz
Apr 2013
#43
If what you say is true, you haven't shown any reason for them to "rig the test".
Bernardo de La Paz
Apr 2013
#49
You are the one asserting that the article lied and the test wasn't straight up dead simple.
Bernardo de La Paz
Apr 2013
#56
I posted to show that your speculation was silly and baseless, without merit. nt
Bernardo de La Paz
Apr 2013
#63
Nope. You can't quote where I asserted that, other than implicitly taking the article on face value
Bernardo de La Paz
Apr 2013
#102
Read. I said "good idea". No policing. You've got nothing on topic. So be it. Enough. nt
Bernardo de La Paz
Apr 2013
#120
the article is bill gates propaganda if you know what you're looking for. touting the common core
HiPointDem
Apr 2013
#103
Nonsense. There is nothing wrong with expecting students to meet basic standards
Bernardo de La Paz
Apr 2013
#107
Nor does your invocation of "gatesian boilerplate" address the bogus claim "the test is rigged". nt
Bernardo de La Paz
Apr 2013
#109
Pretending to have a math block is as bogus as pretending to have a literacy block, but
Bernardo de La Paz
Apr 2013
#41
There's a strong emphasis now on place value. When my kid was first learning
winter is coming
Apr 2013
#64
When I saw the method, I realized it was less prone to error (even though
winter is coming
Apr 2013
#71
Yes. That's how it works and that's the advantage, not to mention also deeper understanding
Bernardo de La Paz
Apr 2013
#95
That's a lot of writing to do if you are calculating with pencil and paper, fine for learning..
Fumesucker
Apr 2013
#108
Exactly. Learn the concepts and fundamentals from all sides and then the shortcuts are a breeze
Bernardo de La Paz
Apr 2013
#113
See anything in this link that rings a bell as to something taught in a strange way?
Bernardo de La Paz
Apr 2013
#66
Longer ago people knew all about baseball, movies, popular music, but would do poorly academically
FarCenter
Apr 2013
#67
Right, also what a culture values & rewards. The beer drinkers applauded the baseball stats recital.
Bernardo de La Paz
Apr 2013
#119
I'm quite good at that kind of math but I totally suck at interviewing, I wouldn't get the job
Fumesucker
Apr 2013
#99
The people who make it to the interview are those with the fanciest looking resume.
lumberjack_jeff
Apr 2013
#122
This isn't breaking news....go to any company and pay attention to *basic* math and writing skills
cbdo2007
Apr 2013
#195
Note the test doesn't concern itself with how to shift earned money into an offshore account,
Trillo
Apr 2013
#201
Huh? You'd expect to be paid for taking a short test given during a job interview?
Silent3
Apr 2013
#210
So when I test prospective employees on their relevant skills in graphics and typesetting...
LanternWaste
Apr 2013
#221
If you don't pay them for your testing of them, you are asking them to work for you for free.
Trillo
Apr 2013
#222
Children are naturally equipped for mathematics and science, but ...
Bernardo de La Paz
Apr 2013
#216
And yet I've seen you on this thread blame those who don't "get it" when it comes to math
Fumesucker
Apr 2013
#227
Nope. It is clear in this thread that I blame the culture much more than individuals.
Bernardo de La Paz
Apr 2013
#234
Yes, around 6th grade is about when the culture hammers the relationship girls have with math. nt
Bernardo de La Paz
Apr 2013
#235