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In reply to the discussion: This message was self-deleted by its author [View all]Zebedeo
(2,322 posts)128. You didn't answer the question about women who have had hysterectomies.
Are they disqualified, like men, from expressing opinions concerning abortion, because they are unable to bear children (or to use your terminology, they have no uterus)?
You asked:
Should I have the right to decide what kind of pants I wear tomorrow? Yes. Should I have the right to decide what kind of pants YOU wear tomorrow? ...Do you understand the difference? That's not just a rhetorical question, I'd like to hear the answer.
Answer: Yes. I understand the difference. And in general, I agree with your philosophy that people should have individual autonomy over their own bodies, and the law should proscribe activities, generally speaking, only to the extent that they have the potential to have an adverse effect on OTHER persons. There are some exceptions to this philosophy, but in general I think you and I are on the same page with regard to this principle.
However, people disagree about whether the unborn child is another person. Some say the child is another person. You seem to believe otherwise, or in the alternative, you place the persons who are not yet born into a category that is subject to being killed because they are "wholly dependent upon residing INSIDE the body of another for survival."
If you do not believe that the child who is not born yet is another person, is it because you believe that the child is the SAME person as the mother? Or is it because you believe the child is not a person at all? In either case, I would differ with you, because the child, even from the moment of conception, has a different DNA. The child may in all likelihood have a different blood type than the mother. The child may even be of a different race than the mother. Take our President, for example. Would you say that Barack Obama was the same person as his mother, prior to his birth? Or would you say he was not a person prior to his birth? Was there a point in time at which he became a person (or became a person other than his mother)? What about 5 minutes before his birth? Was he "another person" then?
If you agree that a baby is a person other than his mother prior to his birth, then I think our shared philosophical viewpoint dictates that the issue of whether his mother should have an abortion is an issue in which society as a whole has an interest, and the opinions of members of society are entitled to be expressed - just like the gun control or military action scenarios which you addressed in your post. In other words, it is not just a matter of personal autonomy, because the action of having an abortion does have an adverse effect on another person.
That is not to say that I believe that a woman should not have a choice to obtain an abortion. I have not said that. I am merely saying that I think that persons in this society who do not have uteri should not be disqualified from expressing opinions pertaining to abortion.
By the way, you have been expressing opinions pertaining to abortion. How many uteri do you have?
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166 replies
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Who is saying abortion is a 'wonderful' thing? Access to health care services, including abortion
Fuzz
Feb 2012
#40
Who said that they want the number to increase? And, your quotes from your own post mislead.
yardwork
Feb 2012
#69
Okay, so there are roughly 115,000 kids awaiting adoption in foster care right now
justiceischeap
Feb 2012
#150
What would you consider "a lot", "a lot" being a totally subjective number?
uppityperson
Feb 2012
#35
Well, I guess you should push for more abortions so that they are not so few and far between
Zebedeo
Feb 2012
#41
I imagine that a back alley abortion causes emotional and physical trauma. In fact, sometimes death.
yardwork
Feb 2012
#127
and the adverse effects would be a lot less if they weren't constantly hounded by it.
grantcart
Feb 2012
#147
Where'd you get that information about the experience of the "baby's" mother and father?
yardwork
Feb 2012
#126
Not all abortions involve a live fetus or "healthy birth" - but all abortions involve a live mother.
haele
Feb 2012
#76
No. You said 332,278 per year was "a lot", not 'not "very few"'. If you are going to claim you said
uppityperson
Feb 2012
#122
How many uteruses do you have? I'm betting the number is zero, or maybe one.
Warren DeMontague
Feb 2012
#53
Also, without getting too much into meta territory, this highlights one of the problems with Juries
Warren DeMontague
Feb 2012
#66
That experience was educational; up to now, I thought you were notified if a post was alerted on.
Warren DeMontague
Feb 2012
#78
I did not "advocate an anti-choice agenda." I merely corrected an erroneous claim
Zebedeo
Feb 2012
#87
Out of 1,211,500 total abortions in the US (2008) - Planned Parenthood doesn't perform even half
REP
Feb 2012
#91
I also just contributed $25 to Planned Parenthood. Because of you and you alone.
2ndAmForComputers
Feb 2012
#112
Yeah! Let's contribute, man! For Zebedeo! Hallelujah! Praise the FSM and Dawkins who is His prophet!
2ndAmForComputers
Feb 2012
#120
In old DU, your post would probably have been deleted. This is a much better outcome.
yardwork
Feb 2012
#129
Well, that's rather rude. But I have a thick skin and am willing to forgive and forget.
Zebedeo
Feb 2012
#90
I don't care if you think it's "rude". I'm sick as fuck of fucking anti-choicers.
Warren DeMontague
Feb 2012
#115
The MAJOR thing you are forgetting is that making abortion illegal will NOT prevent abortions.
FarLeftFist
Feb 2012
#132
You're not listening to me. But OK; I'll let you define the terms of the debate and ..wait, what?
Warren DeMontague
Feb 2012
#166
Where did you get that information from? Link please. Thank you for showing it's not just made up
uppityperson
Feb 2012
#124
"This is done for PR purposes in order to make the organization less controversial."
Starry Messenger
Feb 2012
#153
You don't seem to care about preventing pregnancies. Maybe you're against birth control?
yardwork
Feb 2012
#154
Hey Erick Erickson, you are a fucking idiot. NOTE: Erik is the RW quoted in OP, NOT the OP.
uppityperson
Feb 2012
#34
Since that post was hidden due to reading comprehension issues on the part of the jurors
kath
Feb 2012
#141
They started pissing me off when they started suing small charities, to be honest.
MADem
Feb 2012
#148
Planned Parenthood should go after the SGK foundation's core business.
Old and In the Way
Feb 2012
#163