General Discussion
In reply to the discussion: This is a must read - "The coming GOP plot to sabotage a Biden presidency" [View all]LiberalLovinLug
(14,174 posts)Whatever. semantics again.
BTW, one can have an angle of attack and it be based on facts as well. Those two are not mutually exclusive. In fact, facts are more potent of an angle of attack than something that can be proven wrong later.
Which is why I pointed out that yours and others angle that Sanders followers worshipped the man more than the progressive platform, is now proven wrong, with those ardent supporters turning on him for caving in on supporting now someone who does not share the same goals.
Sanders worked very hard for Hillary. 39 rallies wasn't enough? His efforts got more percent of his former supporters to vote for Hillary, than Hillary's efforts to convince her former supporters to vote for Obama. So there's that.
https://www.npr.org/2017/08/24/545812242/1-in-10-sanders-primary-voters-ended-up-supporting-trump-survey-finds
Fully 12 percent of people who voted for Sen. Bernie Sanders, I-Vt., in the 2016 Democratic presidential primaries voted for President Trump in the general election.
........
And according to one 2008 study, around 25 percent of Clinton primary voters in that election ended up voting for Sen. John McCain, R-Ariz., in the general.
So please stop with the Bernie bashing, insinuating he won't help Democrats, when the past evidence proves the opposite
Your second point,
A minority of Clinton supporters were also ugly-mean to both Obama and Sanders. But one difference is that the more insulting, offputting critics of Biden, are not Democrats. Many were Russian and GOP trolls whose purpose was to rile up folks like you, but of the legitimate American voter more extreme critics, misdubbed Bernie Bros, as Sanders had the most diverse base of any candidate,...are independents, young people, new voters, many of who were never going to vote for a Democratic establishment candidate anyways. So there will be a very small percent of actual ex-Sander Democrats voting for Trump.
But, we need the majority of those votes. Whether you like or even understand those folks or not. ( I certainly cannot fathom someone who could be "undecided" at this point) You have to separate logistics from emotion. Someone else made the point that if you, for the sake of argument, divide D and R loyal support traditionally 45% - 45%. Its that 10% we are fighting for. That 10% IMO would have shifted more towards Sanders than will towards Biden. Which is why Sanders not only had the most positive exciting platform IMO, but he also had the best shot at beating Trump.
Not that we cannot win with Biden of course. We can and damn right should. And Sanders and his ex's have to swallow their disappointment and as usual, try and work change from within. We are used to it. It was vote blue no matter who last time, and its the same this time. Be sure great to have a little empathy, for the twice bridesmaids, honey instead of vinegar, but we're not counting on it.
Why does presenting a strong argument back be defined as "baiting"? Where do you see that? I present links to my assertions. But don't worry, I've never alerted on anyone. Because I don't believe in trying to silence a debate partner from an argument that way. I don't "bait" because I don't alert anyways. What would be the point? Alerting because it looks like one is being out debated, or has a thin skin, is not a good look either.
You called my writing "florid"? Gee thanks ehrnst. Honestly, I just enjoy writing and debating. And I gather you do too Its never my intention to do anything other than that. I just enjoy and respect folks like yourself with passion and chops to have it out. Instead of just lurking. Its never personal BTW
cheers.