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ehrnst

(32,640 posts)

109. UPDATE: AOC apologizes for trying to discredit WAPO cite for the fact check. Sort of.

Sat Jan 26, 2019, 08:17 AM

Jan 2019

In particular, she and her defenders focused in on Kessler’s link to a 2005 paper by economist Jason Furman which he used to make a point. That paper appeared on a website for the Mackinac Center, which is a free market think tank in Michigan which leans to the right. AOC’s defenders jumped on this arguing it was unfair to cite a paper paid for by a right-leaning think tank which took money from Wal-Mart to defend Wal-Mart. Note, the tweet that AOC was highlighting has been protected as of today, but her tweet reiterating the claim (and mocking Kessler) is still there:

Link to tweet

Kessler argued that the author of the paper had formerly chaired President Obama’s Council of Economic Advisers, i.e. he’s not a right-winger.

Link to tweet

She then argued that Furman’s Obama admin track record didn’t matter because he could be just another revolving-door lobbyist. Kessler replied with a link to his page on Harvard’s website, pointing out he’s not a lobbyist:

Link to tweet

Last night after the very busy day, Furman himself weighed in and pointed out that a) his paper wasn’t funded by anyone and b) it was actually written for an event hosted by the left-leaning Center for American Progress.

Link to tweet

Meanwhile, Kessler added a note to his fact-check and pointed out AOC’s false accusations about the paper he linked.

Link to tweet

https://thehill.com/homenews/media/426961-wapo-fact-checker-fires-back-at-ocasio-cortez-criticism-over-rating-shes-wrong

AOC jumped on a false claim about a paper cited in a fact-check critical of her. Then she doubled-down suggesting the author might be a revolving-door lobbyist. Then she finally apologized for the insinuation when pressed by someone at the Post. But she’s still claiming victory over Kessler as if none of that mattered.

Interesting that she found this to be so important that she devoted much of Wednesday to it.

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WAPO: Fact checks AOC statements on living and minimum wage [View all] ehrnst Jan 2019 OP

That article is shit manor321 Jan 2019 #1

"I'm no professional fact checker, but" - Julia Carrie Wong ehrnst Jan 2019 #6

Since she actually pointed out... tonedevil Jan 2019 #15

You don't seem to understand appeal to authority... ehrnst Jan 2019 #18

If you're going to say someone doesn't understand something melman Jan 2019 #21

I do understand it, and was pointing out what they got wrong. ehrnst Jan 2019 #22

Who is doing the fact checking... tonedevil Jan 2019 #24

Marty Baron's newsroom. ehrnst Jan 2019 #29

Since she's now protected her twitter account, so we can't see the reference any more... ehrnst Jan 2019 #116

Why are you saying.... tonedevil Jan 2019 #154

She has hidden her posts from anyone who isn't a follower ehrnst Jan 2019 #158

Fake news!!! (Screamed the true believers ..) n/t Apollyonus Jan 2019 #28

Here's a professional debunking of the "fact check". AOC is right EndGOPPropaganda Jan 2019 #126

Actually... you may not have seen this rebuttal to her rebuttal ehrnst Jan 2019 #148

But you must not have read the link I posted. EndGOPPropaganda Jan 2019 #160

AOC attacks a cite incorrectly to "prove" she is right and WAPO is wrong. ehrnst Jan 2019 #166

Kessler was wrong. WAPO was wrong. Wrong wrong wrong wrong. EndGOPPropaganda Jan 2019 #172

"Wrong wrong wrong wrong?" Because it makes you unhappy? ehrnst Jan 2019 #173

Still a freshman backbencher exboyfil Jan 2019 #2

This fact check wasn't on DOTUS. It was about AOC's statements. ehrnst Jan 2019 #7

I think my comment is more directed at other media exboyfil Jan 2019 #8

I don't see that there is an issue with the media fact checking DT. ehrnst Jan 2019 #13

Facts are important. It serves no good purpose to exaggerate on these matters. It can be risky. NurseJackie Jan 2019 #3

walmart workers need public assistance Hermit-The-Prog Jan 2019 #4

You may not have been able to read this part of the article: ehrnst Jan 2019 #14

I read it Hermit-The-Prog Jan 2019 #16

This part: ehrnst Jan 2019 #17

focus on wrong part Hermit-The-Prog Jan 2019 #19

No one is disputing that Walmart/Amazon "should pay people more." ehrnst Jan 2019 #20

they are examples Hermit-The-Prog Jan 2019 #27

Why not say she goofed and will do better as she matures? Apollyonus Jan 2019 #32

because she didn't; the author did Hermit-The-Prog Jan 2019 #36

mmmmkay Apollyonus Jan 2019 #37

The author is the WAPO fact check team. ehrnst Jan 2019 #48

no exemption for AOC or the press Hermit-The-Prog Jan 2019 #54

Then I suggest you respond to them. ehrnst Jan 2019 #58

thank you for the discussion Hermit-The-Prog Jan 2019 #59

+1000. ehrnst Jan 2019 #52

Economic theory assumes nothing. GeorgeGist Jan 2019 #23

Every theory makes baseline assumptions and builds on them. n/t Apollyonus Jan 2019 #33

And WalMart's minimum wage is $11 nationwide Recursion Jan 2019 #183

+1000. Dems have to measure up to the standards that we demand of the GOP. ehrnst Jan 2019 #9

+1000. Truth IS the high ground. If she is a good liberal, Hortensis Jan 2019 #43

"...this tactic is typically used extensively by populist movements bent on taking down governments..." NurseJackie Jan 2019 #44

And as you said, accuracy is critically important. Hortensis Jan 2019 #45

One should either fact-check for themselves, or have their staff do things like this for them. NurseJackie Jan 2019 #57

Yes. Note, her staff are NOT inexperienced. Although no doubt Hortensis Jan 2019 #69

Those tactics are ALL of those things. NurseJackie Jan 2019 #70

Unfortunately, Repubs have proven that bypassing intellect to Hortensis Jan 2019 #78

You have totally nailed it here! R B Garr Jan 2019 #118

Attacking fact checkers that don't tow the line is something that she learned ehrnst Jan 2019 #147

Getting defensive about being fact checked ehrnst Jan 2019 #51

Researchers say young people growing up in a world of IT lies Hortensis Jan 2019 #88

Indeed. ehrnst Jan 2019 #94

Amazon warehouses are a high-pressure, mis-managed shitholes with 80-90% turnover rates in 1st month TheBlackAdder Jan 2019 #5

Who are they attack an awesome young Latina congresswoman by checking her facts? Empowerer Jan 2019 #10

.... ehrnst Jan 2019 #12

lol Apollyonus Jan 2019 #35

they could be more honest about it, but that's hard when you're owned by Bezos, I imagine. All JCanete Jan 2019 #73

Yeah, Marty Baron is known for caving to powerful opposition.... ehrnst Jan 2019 #108

that's not my issue at all. I laid out my actual problems with the article. From you on those? JCanete Jan 2019 #131

Actually, it was exactly your issue in the post above... ehrnst Jan 2019 #134

you literally responded to it with "and..." JCanete Jan 2019 #135

Oh that post - I was wondering what that had to do with the fact check. ehrnst Jan 2019 #141

then try harder. Plenty of things literally address issues in the article. But dismiss it if its JCanete Jan 2019 #142

Did you mention where AOC deleted a tweet with a claim that was debunked? ehrnst Jan 2019 #143

and how is that at all relevant to the article's biases and micharacterizations? nt JCanete Jan 2019 #144

OK, which article are we talking about now? ehrnst Jan 2019 #145

I addressed the WAPO article. What other article are we talking about? The OP is the WAPO JCanete Jan 2019 #150

Ah the fact check. Here is new information - there was a back and forth all day on Wednesday ehrnst Jan 2019 #151

ah, so you continue to avoid any point I've made. If my arguments are so bad, I'd prefer you JCanete Jan 2019 #156

Still not getting it, are you? ehrnst Jan 2019 #157

I don't get at all why you won't engage the points I laid out. You made the claim that the WAPO JCanete Jan 2019 #159

I could ask what you believe you are getting out of this exchange ehrnst Jan 2019 #163

The minimum wage in her last statement was a clear error dsc Jan 2019 #11

Yeah, it's pretty obvious she meant "a living wage" in that statement. Hassin Bin Sober Jan 2019 #38

Polticians deal with statements. Words matter. ehrnst Jan 2019 #115

Thou must not fact check Alexandria Ocasio-Cortez NastyRiffraff Jan 2019 #25

The very definition of "appeal to authority." ehrnst Jan 2019 #30

More like melman Jan 2019 #39

I guess you're not familiar with the concept of sarcasm NastyRiffraff Jan 2019 #40

..... ehrnst Jan 2019 #42

This might be true if you're a "FULL TIME WORKER" which most are not... PeeJ52 Jan 2019 #26

When I applied to Amazon last December trev Jan 2019 #41

The part-timeness is why so many workers struggle. nitpicker Jan 2019 #179

Facts are facts. Apollyonus Jan 2019 #31

This message was self-deleted by its author elocs Jan 2019 #34

so basically this is a defense of Amazon and a slam on AOC bigtree Jan 2019 #46

It's a fact check on AOC's statements. ehrnst Jan 2019 #47

it's what I said bigtree Jan 2019 #49

Journalists holding politicians accountable for their statements is "riding herd" on them? ehrnst Jan 2019 #50

what's the relevance here at DU? bigtree Jan 2019 #53

The relevance of a fact check on a Democratic polician on DU? ehrnst Jan 2019 #56

Objectively, this @GlennKesslerWP fact check from yesterday should simply be retracted.' bigtree Jan 2019 #60

Objectively, why should we take the opinion of a reporter from Intercept & YT, which are very biased ehrnst Jan 2019 #67

the subjects at hand have an obvious bias of association bigtree Jan 2019 #68

I'm quite familiar with the Intercept and YT, as well as WAPO ehrnst Jan 2019 #71

objectively, you should take those arguments into account and if you can, refute them. JCanete Jan 2019 #74

Whatevs. ehrnst Jan 2019 #75

? JCanete Jan 2019 #77

!! ehrnst Jan 2019 #79

@# melman Jan 2019 #96

Omegerd!! ehrnst Jan 2019 #99

To be fair, it's really not that many. Mariana Jan 2019 #63

You keep falsely making things personal, I guess as a chosen R B Garr Jan 2019 #167

Breaking news: Kurt V. Jan 2019 #55

My question is: Does Walmart pay the same starting rate across the board or GemDigger Jan 2019 #61

Some states set minimum wage at higher than the federal one. Mariana Jan 2019 #62

Glassdoor.com is a good resource for that info: ehrnst Jan 2019 #64

Thanks for the link. GemDigger Jan 2019 #65

Walmart and Walton family government subsidies UpInArms Jan 2019 #66

what? Of course companies like Amazon and Walmart are essentially stiffing the public. They get JCanete Jan 2019 #72

And? ehrnst Jan 2019 #76

you want more? YOu said this article was a fact check. What is it fact-checking? Why did it JCanete Jan 2019 #90

Fact checking is pretty self explanatory ehrnst Jan 2019 #95

oh you...here I thought you were posting cuz you cared about facts, not what they say they JCanete Jan 2019 #97

I do care about facts. ehrnst Jan 2019 #98

Here's a fact that often gets overlooked - about 30 states already have a minimum wage.... George II Jan 2019 #102

and which among them has a $15 dollar minimum? JCanete Jan 2019 #104

California and New York. betsuni Jan 2019 #105

We will have 15 we certainly do not now in California. its going to be a while still before it gets JCanete Jan 2019 #106

Yeah, but that wasn't the point of the OP. $15 wasn't part of the discussion at first... George II Jan 2019 #123

"raising the Federal minimum wage is moot" melman Jan 2019 #129

My entire sentence: George II Jan 2019 #130

how would that make raising the federal minimum wage to 15 moot? it would only make it moot in like JCanete Jan 2019 #137

You skipped right over post #130. George II Jan 2019 #138

so, on average, raising the minimum wage, you would agree, is nowhere near moot, so why would that JCanete Jan 2019 #139

Read my posts, please. George II Jan 2019 #140

FWIW, half of Walmarts employees are part time TexasBushwhacker Jan 2019 #93

thank you, very informative post, and I totally agree. nt JCanete Jan 2019 #103

Ocasio-Cortez Rattles Pundits Across the Corporate Media Spectrum BeckyDem Jan 2019 #80

Not sure what this has to do with fact checking. ehrnst Jan 2019 #81

I didn't post for you. BeckyDem Jan 2019 #82

It's in response to me. ehrnst Jan 2019 #83

My post was in response to the OP. BeckyDem Jan 2019 #84

That would be my OP. ehrnst Jan 2019 #85

You didn't write the OP. Its not about you. BeckyDem Jan 2019 #86

OK. You responded to me. ehrnst Jan 2019 #87

No, my first post is in response to the OP. BeckyDem Jan 2019 #89

You posted it on a public forum and, thus, should expect comments from others EffieBlack Jan 2019 #91

I posted my response to the OP not the person who listed it. BeckyDem Jan 2019 #92

I don't think that WAPO is on DU... ehrnst Jan 2019 #114

You're not the author of the OP. BeckyDem Jan 2019 #161

WAPO is. (nt) ehrnst Jan 2019 #162

Things that make you go, Hmm. TheBlackAdder Jan 2019 #164

Interesting... see the post above. ehrnst Jan 2019 #165

You finally see the distinction, good. BeckyDem Jan 2019 #168

Again... Since you are responding to WAPO, shouldn't you do it where they can actually ehrnst Jan 2019 #169

You're confused, willingly. BeckyDem Jan 2019 #170

No. Just pointing out the futility of responding to WAPO ehrnst Jan 2019 #171

Trump caved. WeekiWater Jan 2019 #100

So Amazon pays at least $15 per hour to its hourly workers. guillaumeb Jan 2019 #101

Those are not things she made statements about, so they weren't included in a fact check. ehrnst Jan 2019 #107

Understood, but these factors are vital to understanding the larger point. guillaumeb Jan 2019 #127

Again - what does that have to do with the fact check? ehrnst Jan 2019 #152

UPDATE: AOC apologizes for trying to discredit WAPO cite for the fact check. Sort of. ehrnst Jan 2019 #109

Hot Air linked and quoted with approval on Democratic Underground? Denzil_DC Jan 2019 #110

Is it the documentation of the whole back and forth that bothers you? ehrnst Jan 2019 #111

No. Denzil_DC Jan 2019 #112

I acknowledge your claim on the link. ehrnst Jan 2019 #113

Acknowledge my claim on the link?! Denzil_DC Jan 2019 #117

Apparently it was the most pressing political issue preoccupying some reps on the Hill this week ehrnst Jan 2019 #119

The FACTS noted in the original post (with the hot air link) are now exactly the same sans... George II Jan 2019 #124

Speaking of odd allies... ehrnst Jan 2019 #132

Some call this sort of thing "whataboutism" melman Jan 2019 #133

That one left a mark, eh? ehrnst Jan 2019 #136

Of course melman Jan 2019 #146

Actually, whataboutism is when someone defends something by pointing to something else.. ehrnst Jan 2019 #149

"Denzil has yet to reply" because Denzil had other things to do during the course of the day. Denzil_DC Jan 2019 #153

Didn't work, huh? ehrnst Jan 2019 #174

What didn't work was your attempt at deflection with a nonsense comparison. Denzil_DC Jan 2019 #178

I guess you didn't read my response to your critique about RW sources... ehrnst Jan 2019 #180

I did. They're irrelevant to my objection. Read my post above again. I didn't make "numerous posts". Denzil_DC Jan 2019 #181

It's your choice to read or not read, and spend your time or not on DU, yes? ehrnst Jan 2019 #182

Amazing isn't it? melman Jan 2019 #128

Great find. Calling people corrupt lobbyists as a default R B Garr Jan 2019 #120

Tweeting while angry doesn't lend itself to thoughtful, well researched rebuttals. ehrnst Jan 2019 #121

Yes, the Twitter wars do appear to be indiscriminate and R B Garr Jan 2019 #122

Good article Gothmog Jan 2019 #125

This is why hyperbole is so destructive to real dialogue. GulfCoast66 Jan 2019 #155

Usually, experience at the local level in politics allows you to make these kinds of ehrnst Jan 2019 #175

Funny I've only seen her fact checked JackInGreen Jan 2019 #176

I guess you don't see many fact checking sites, or newspapers, or posts on DU... ehrnst Jan 2019 #185

Uh... fact check... my niece worked at a local Amazon distribution center lapfog_1 Jan 2019 #177

Your niece's story would be something that WAPO or NYT would be interested in hearing. ehrnst Jan 2019 #184

I believe the way they get away with this is "employment status" lapfog_1 Jan 2019 #186

That's not what they stated in their press release. ehrnst Jan 2019 #187