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H2O Man

(73,559 posts)
Mon May 21, 2018, 12:34 PM May 2018

Impeachment [View all]

“But in Nixon’s case, the list of actions that together were deemed to constitute impeachable obstruction reads like a forecast of what Trump would do decades later — making misleading statements to, or withholding material evidence from, federal investigators or other federal employees; trying to interfere with FBI or congressional investigations; trying to break through the FBI’s shield surrounding ongoing criminal investigations; dangling carrots in front of people who might otherwise pose trouble for one’s hold on power. “
Laurence Tribe; Washington Post; May 13, 2017

https://www.washingtonpost.com/opinions/trump-must-be-impeached-heres-why/2017/05/13/82ce2ea4-374d-11e7-b4ee-434b6d506b37_story.html?utm_term=.07ad847f90f9


In order to be more fully prepared for campaigning for candidates from the Democratic Party in the upcoming election season, I am trying to review various books on the issues involving impeachment. This includes Laurence Tribe and Joshua Matz's new book, “To End a Presidency: The Power of Impeachment.”

The authors believe that there is a strong case for impeaching Donald Trump, although the book does not focus primarily upon that belief. Rather, because of the divided nature of the nation, discussions about the possibility of impeachment demand that the public be informed about the history and intent of the process.

There are, the authors note, dangers if the process is abused by elected representatives. The obvious example of a politically motivated abuse of the process was the republican impeachment of President Clinton. There are also unanswered questions regarding how things would play out if the Senate convicted a president. These are, of course, important to consider today for two reasons: first, we have a president who has no respect for either the rule of law or the US Constitution, and second, there is a significant, armed minority in this country that would mistake the impeachment of Trump for a coup by the “deep state.”

Yet, the authors recognize that there are times – and this appears to be one – where the failure to impeach and convict poses far greater dangers to our nation, than doing so. I agree with that. More, I believe that a significant and growing number of citizens believes that, too. It is clear that issues regarding impeachment will play a role in the 2018 elections.

Republicans will use impeachment as an issue to energize the alt-right. And there are certainly some congressional districts in which a Democratic Party candidate cannot take an aggressive position on the issue. Yet, all Democrats can advocate for the rule of law, and a willingness to objectively fulfill their duties if elected. Indeed, any candidate that attempts to side-step or avoid these issues will fail to energize a significant portion of voters.

It will be difficult to engage in rational discussions about impeachment, based upon facts, at a time when emotions rooted in ignorance, and inflamed by lies, saturate the thinking and behaviors of so many people. “But all noble things,” Spinoza reminds us, “are as difficult as they are rare.” It was Benjamin Franklin who advocated most forcefully that impeachment be included in the Constitution. And so we would do well to remember his saying that, “When passions drive, let reason hold the reins.”

Peace,
H2O Man

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Impeachment [View all] H2O Man May 2018 OP
I Also Agree That The Danger To The Nation Me. May 2018 #1
The only thing trump was ever RIGHT about; that war being a uuuge mistake. 7962 May 2018 #13
I've Heard He Swung Both Way On That Me. May 2018 #15
Correct. H2O Man May 2018 #22
As always, perfectly articulated: cilla4progress May 2018 #2
To do our duty, our nation would need bipartisan majority Hortensis May 2018 #18
It's true that H2O Man May 2018 #23
Well, we'll know when we can remove Trump just as Hortensis May 2018 #24
I agree 100%. H2O Man May 2018 #34
I got quite angry yesterday at Lawrence Tribe, Hortensis May 2018 #39
I think Dem candidates mercuryblues May 2018 #3
I agree with you, explain about the rule of law but do not push for impeachment yet Perseus May 2018 #12
The Dems mercuryblues May 2018 #20
I want a unicorn...but seriously...Congress can't interfere with pardon powers...it would violate Demsrule86 May 2018 #30
The Constitution H2O Man May 2018 #35
We are not talking about pardoning himself for impeachment...moving the goal posts there...you can Demsrule86 May 2018 #42
Right. H2O Man May 2018 #54
I think that even a right wing court would not allow the president to pardon himself in case of Demsrule86 May 2018 #62
it is a tight rope act, but mopinko May 2018 #4
Clinton wasn't removed from office. And the GOP had a disastrous election in 98 because of Demsrule86 May 2018 #31
In fact, Newt H2O Man May 2018 #36
Of Course it did... Voters don't like a waste of time impeachment without conviction. Demsrule86 May 2018 #41
Really? H2O Man May 2018 #43
It goes against H2O Man May 2018 #44
It was the independents who didn't like it. And there votes matter too. The same will be true for Demsrule86 May 2018 #63
"But all noble things," Spinoza reminds us, "are as difficult as they are rare." kentuck May 2018 #5
Nixon left because he was told the GOP had turned against him. 7962 May 2018 #14
I prefer actually winning in 20...nobility is overrated. Demsrule86 May 2018 #33
Thanks, Buddy! H2O Man May 2018 #37
Demons, real and imagined. kentuck May 2018 #40
Right. H2O Man May 2018 #46
Kicked and recommended. Uncle Joe May 2018 #6
Thank you, Uncle Joe! H2O Man May 2018 #38
Let reason hold the reins! malaise May 2018 #7
Thanks! H2O Man May 2018 #47
You're the voice of reason coeur_de_lion May 2018 #8
Thanks! H2O Man May 2018 #48
What a wonderful birthday! coeur_de_lion May 2018 #61
If the Democrats in Washington think that the pro-Dem "energy" and RandomAccess May 2018 #9
Precisely. Ligyron May 2018 #21
I agree. H2O Man May 2018 #49
And you touch on something else people turn against RandomAccess May 2018 #50
Important point. H2O Man May 2018 #51
Impeachment calculus requires that more than half the independents grantcart May 2018 #10
Impeachment calculus requires H2O Man May 2018 #52
The X factor grantcart May 2018 #60
Love ya H20 Man EricMaundry May 2018 #11
Thanks, Eric! H2O Man May 2018 #53
I worry also that if there isn't some action taken the opportunities will be lost. erronis May 2018 #16
What opportunity? The opportunity to lose 20...if the GOP would join with us in the Senate, I would Demsrule86 May 2018 #27
Well said. H2O Man May 2018 #55
How about instituting a "civil service" test to any federal elected official erronis May 2018 #59
K&R Solly Mack May 2018 #17
Thanks, Buddy! H2O Man May 2018 #56
Franklin was very wise indeed. So is Tribe. BigmanPigman May 2018 #19
Franklin is one H2O Man May 2018 #57
I grew up in Phila and lived in Center City in a house BigmanPigman May 2018 #58
If impeachment drives Democrats to the polls, use it. dalton99a May 2018 #25
The danger is it will drive Republicans to the polls. We are looking to take seats in GOP areas... Demsrule86 May 2018 #28
no democratic candidate should ever say IMPEACHMENT until AFTER the election, why give beachbum bob May 2018 #26
We could have saved this nation a lot of misery and suffering elocs May 2018 #29
K&R... spanone May 2018 #32
There isn't going to be an impeachment. Codeine May 2018 #45
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