I am warming up to a civil split in our country.

[Old and In the Way]

Lets put it to referndum. I am thiking a geogrsphic divide, based on confederate lines would be reasonable....but maybe we should just split on red/blue results over the last 4 elections. Think of the benefits.

1 -less tax dollars to the red states.
2- no one will care about your sexuality (in the blue states)
3 -we can get our kids educated properly without idiots in small population southern states telling us what God thinks.
4-we wont freak out in the Northern Stztes if you look different than us.
5- we will be allowed to let our visions happen, both North and South. Let social evolution dictate.

Sounds good to me. Give this country 6 months to relocate (Craigs List) and we are good to go. Lets do this bloodless, social experiment Begin!

[Xipe Totec]

1. Who gets to keep the nukes? nt

[Old and In the Way]

2. Hmmmm, hadn't though about that.

I guess we have t o split 5hem 50/50. Will need to operate under a MAD construct, I guess.

[Xipe Totec]

3. And military bases, Panama Canal, Who gets to stay in NATO.

Who keeps the dollar as currency? Who keeps the Federal Reserve?

It gets messy really quick.

[truebluegreen]

5. fyi Panama gets to keep the Panama Canal

as per 1977 treaty and 1999 final handover.

[Xipe Totec]

6. True that. I forgot. Thank you Jimmy Carter

And I say that sincerely.

One less thing.

[RKP5637]

4. I'm always concerned the throwbacks in this country are seriously impeading the future of the

US. Far too many damn fools have too much to say and offer little value to the future of the US. Their primary objective is to sow discontent and trash from the past. And, I am totally fed up with the god stuff. They really need to get over the fact that magic, superstitions and god beings belong in history. If they want to believe in that stuff, fine, but get out of the way of the future of the US and mankind.

[villager]

7. The Empire will start falling apart by mid-century anyway, due to the pressures of climate change,

the inability to keep funding global overreach, etc.

It will be interesting, to say the least, to see what smaller polities develop....

[PatrickforO]

8. I hate to say this because it feels like a cop-out, but

I'll be dead by then. I am, however, sick with worry about the shitty world my kids and grandkids will inherit.

Yep. Capitalism at its best - like a GIANT tapeworm tearing at our guts.

[Old and In the Way]

9. ft good point...didn not even consider that.

Florida and every di density coast line will suffer, but climate change is not an acceptable topic in the South, so enjoy the new coastline south usa friends!

[Cal33]

48. There are no high areas in Florida. Oh, boy!

[RobertEarl]

10. Fix the voting machines

I mean fix them so they count our votes as cast and make elections publicly financed by taking all campaign donations and put that cash in one account that all candidates share equally.

[marlakay]

46. Lol i couldnt see a lot donating

But thats the point, keep cash out of it!

[jtuck004]

11. Why? They don't have to give a thing, just keep taking. You and everyone on your side

can just die. And it can keep going until you do, or until they all do.

Frankly, they see either victory for them or death for everyone as a very workable solution.

That is your opponent. They don't really want a split - they want a place to gather and then attack. See "Hitler" and/or "Mussolini" in the wiki pages for material which might be relevant.

[appalachiablue]

12. This I began to consider two years ago for the first time, matters are that serious. But it's

dangerous to be on the same land mass, continent with them. They will try to export evils like slavery and reactionary religion. Where to go is one of the issues, like dividing above mentioned resources and assets. Nothing is easy, better to expend energy working toward a better existence and future than to stay in a quagmire. The place is declining fast it seems, short of a miracle sorry to say. Relocation for survival has happened throughout history and still does. (Splitting up, separation and divorce are hard but far better than wasting time and effort trying or hoping things will improve in a clearly hopeless case. Not a quitter but it's bad).

[stage left]

13. So...

What do we do with Oklahoma, for instance? It's not a small southern state.

[Old and In the Way]

20. Border states will have to decide. Seems like a geograhic split might work,

But it depends on the States, I guess. Do you want the Republican uptopia Imhofe and Ted Cruz want? Head South. If enough Okies want alignment with the new North...great. If the majority wants to join the climate, denying anti-science South, enjoy. They can always ask for reinstatement if things don't turn out like they thought they would.

[Art_from_Ark]

14. Blue states aren't always blue

Red states aren't always red.

Many states that voted for Obama also voted for Nixon and Reagan.

Some states that voted for Obama have also elected red or purple state governments. like Wisconsin, Michigan, Ohio, Pennsylvania, Massachusetts and New Jersey.

It's a lot more complex than just waving good-bye to "red" states.

[tridim]

15. Missouri is blue and progressive on the borders and a racist hellhole in the entire center. nt

[napi21]

27. Same with Pennsylvania. nt

[appalachiablue]

22. Some people would need to relocate over time to get what they want probably.

Unpleasant but for a better life worth it, it certainly has happened many times before. I would do it.

A year or so ago an article, NYT I think covered blue state people moving to red states ie- NE folks to FL, VA, some upper Midwesterners to TX and people from CA to Nevada. Most of it was for employment. Not an in depth article but the implication was that this would bring Dem. voters into those areas. I've also heard a few media insiders mention this.

Yet as messed up as the US is lately, and as matters are becoming more extreme I wonder how much of an impact this trend will have on changing voting patterns. The pols stats mgrs. know what's going on for sure.

[Scruffy Rumbler]

16. Please let it wait until I am back in Cascadia.

It will be bad enough driving across country with all the hate out there!

[Aristus]

38. Long live the Republic of Cascadia!

(But what the hell is Idaho doing in there?)

[Scruffy Rumbler]

39. Potatos?

[Arthur_Frain]

17. I don't think Alaska is going to be giving away Kodiak Island anytime soon.

[kairos12]

19. Who keeps the Thousand Points of Light?

[brooklynite]

21. Are you aware that marriage equality doesn't exist in several Blue (Presidential) States?

Ohio and Michigan come to mind.

[Old and In the Way]

23. C'mon.....you are smarter than this.

When the great divide happens, IMHO, and is announced, there will be a great exodus. The dumb, stupid morons living in the North will gravitate to the South. We will see an Influx of minorities and white liberals to the North. A grand realignment, maybe Let us be governed by science and common sense. Let the South be governed by G o d and the Koch brothers. Let us see who survives into tne 22nd century.

[Paladin]

24. Enjoying your regional bigotry, are you?

Give it a rest.

[Old and In the Way]

28. Regional bigotry? Really?

When a distinct majority of the population is governed at the Federal Level by the minority, it is time to call bullshit. Republicans win because they openly gerrymander voting...when they aren't subverting the Democratic vote. You are naive or in support of Republican efforts to make themselves a 1 Party rule. OK, for the South, not OK for Democracy.

[Paladin]

31. And me and the 3million+ Texans who voted for Obama get to fuck ourselves, right?

You propose to give us 6 months to abandon everything and migrate to an uncertain future? Call me naïve (I see you already have), but I'll have to pass on this one. If that means I have to put up with insults from you about supporting Republicans, so be it.

Regional bigotry. Really.

[Old and In the Way]

34. You can move.

Unless you like Republicanism. Sucks if you do.

[GGJohn]

35. You can move?

Not very progressive of you. I live in the very red state of AZ, I love living her in Flagstaff and I don't plan to move anytime soon, so take your regional bias and ................., figure it out.

[QuestionAlways]

32. Remember Wall Street is in the north.

[Special Prosciuto]

25. 1865 and subsequent constitutional amendments established absolute federal control over the states,

and their counties, and their towns.

North, South, Blue, Red, Dem, Rep means jackshit anymore today. If a state secedes, it would have to seize or render useless federal property including interstate highways, military bases, nuclear ICBMs.

Charleston tried that at their Fort. Good luck with that.

[Springslips]

45. True. . .

But we break it up at the federal level; we only use State borders to delineate where the national break up is. ( This is all a dream of course; it would take a masses percentage of the population to agree. But it is doable.)

[napi21]

26. NO! NO! NO!

I'm a Yankee (from Pa.) transplant living now in Ga. I DETEST the righties who live here, and they hate me too, and I sure DON'T want to LIVE in a confederacy! Yes, I know I could move, but we're retired now and our son & grandkids lkive here in Ga, so we don't want to leave them. Plus, our house is paid off and we qualify for low real estate taxes. If we moved back to the north, we wouldn't be able to afford to buy a house because the market is much higher there, and the taxes are a lot higher too.

I understand why you want to just let them go back to their own "southern ways", but I can't let you do that to ME!

[DFW]

29. I prefer Howard's 50 State strategy

Even poor taker states eventually will have a majority of people who want more inspiring lives.

[Blue_In_AK]

30. This doesn't exactly work

because some of us red states are suprisingly liberal in some areas - see, for example, Alaska's socialist permanent fund and our recent vote to legalize marijuana. We have no death penalty, and have been at the bottom of "religiosity" lists forever. We still have legal and accessible abortion and no death penalty.

It really isn't as simple as red and blue.

[WhoWoodaKnew]

33. It might work until parents have kids. Then you're back to the same time in a few generations.

[Chan790]

36. If you agree to expel the Clintons back to Arkansas...you've got my vote.

You also have to bar them entry to Blue America for life.

[Hosnon]

37. This shit AGAIN? Why is it so hard to understand the following:

The divide is rural/urban, not North/South.

Why is this hard to understand? Honest question.

[Manifestor_of_Light]

42. The divide is rural/urban, not North/South.

I will repeat that because it is TRUE.

That's the way Texas is. Urban is pretty liberal, and real liberal in some places (Houston and Austin); rural is conservative, right-wing Christian and highly religious, conformist, disapproving of people that are different from themselves. Hell, I painted my house BLUE and heard about shit talk about it down at the hardware store.

Everyone else in this town has a house that is a neutral color. No imagination whatever.

[Telcontar]

40. Any such.movement falls under the heading "Domestic Enemy"

Things don't for well for that sort

[lunatica]

41. Except for those pesky devil in the details thing I think you have a great idea

Lately I've wished this could be a possible solution.

[Amishman]

43. this won't work, its not region vs region, its city vs rural.

Just look at any recent presidential election map, in almost every state the metro areas are blue islands in a sea of red.

[Dan]

47. think

population/area density.... to explain the red.

[RJMacReady]

44. I Disagree, It is Oligarchs vs. Other 99%

Hey DUers, Let us face it, it is not red vs. blue, conservative vs. liberal, sectarian,racial or other make or break divisions. It is the power of the 1%, under Citizen's United, that has robbed us of any real political progress. We are being marginalized and trod upon by the richest 1%, and guess whose fault it is? OURS, that's who. I donate to my fave liberals/media outlets, write for progressive local candidates, but I have no real power. I vote in every election, but when the turn out for last year's mid terms was about 34%, we have allowed ourselves to be subjugated. Until elections are publicly funded, the lobbyists are kicked out, term limits imposed, we will continue on our slide to total oligarchic rule. The stolen elections of 2000 and 2004 would have sent our fathers and grandfathers into the streets with torches and pitchforks. Now 1/2 of the moronic public turns on the Faux News, and is told how Obama hates Christians, by two nauseating, hate filled, pathological liars and sociopathic miscreants like Kelly and Perkins. That organization, along with 'One America", should have their licenses to broadcast revoked until they change their titles to "Right Wing Opinions", and not be allowed to label themselves as news outlets. If you want the truth, watch AlJazeera and NPR. 60 minutes of AlJazeeraAmerica will give you the latest news from all the hot spots on the globe, like the disintegration of Yemen, the Iran nuclear deal, etc... Splitting the country after Lincoln and his generation sacrificed so much to keep it together would be giving Nixon's "Southern Strategy" its' ultimate vindication. Fuck Nixon, and fuck these hate filled gas bags on Fox/OAN, and let's band together and fight to get our country back. RJM

[musicblind]

49. Since NC is a purple state, I think we should get to hold a separate vote to divide the state.

I would hate to see places like Asheville, Chapel Hill, Charlotte, Raleigh, and Greensboro with all of their colleges get cut off from the real world because of places like Bakersville, NC, and Randolph County.......