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Fri May 20, 2016, 12:35 PM

How many here would like it if Trump won so you could have your revolution faster?

Theory is it would be faster that way, anyway.

I myself have wondered if that would work, but that was before this brain dead asshole ran for the office.

42 replies, 2862 views

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Reply How many here would like it if Trump won so you could have your revolution faster? (Original post)
Actor May 2016 OP
Autumn May 2016 #1
Contrary1 May 2016 #3
casperthegm May 2016 #2
redstateblues May 2016 #8
casperthegm May 2016 #12
Fawke Em May 2016 #15
Yurovsky May 2016 #21
redstateblues May 2016 #28
casperthegm May 2016 #35
redstateblues May 2016 #38
casperthegm May 2016 #41
dchill May 2016 #42
cali May 2016 #31
joshcryer May 2016 #4
Fawke Em May 2016 #18
joshcryer May 2016 #23
redstateblues May 2016 #29
frylock May 2016 #40
BillZBubb May 2016 #5
thucythucy May 2016 #6
nc4bo May 2016 #7
Agschmid May 2016 #9
nc4bo May 2016 #10
workinclasszero May 2016 #11
Actor May 2016 #13
Actor May 2016 #14
nc4bo May 2016 #22
Orsino May 2016 #16
Yurovsky May 2016 #17
Fawke Em May 2016 #20
Yurovsky May 2016 #25
snort May 2016 #19
QC May 2016 #24
Todays_Illusion May 2016 #26
JonathanRackham May 2016 #27
arcane1 May 2016 #30
Aerows May 2016 #32
Tierra_y_Libertad May 2016 #33
redstateblues May 2016 #37
Bluenorthwest May 2016 #34
1StrongBlackMan May 2016 #36
frylock May 2016 #39

Response to Actor (Original post)

Fri May 20, 2016, 12:41 PM

1. Message deleted by DU the Administrators

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Response to Autumn (Reply #1)

Fri May 20, 2016, 12:42 PM

3. x 2 n/t

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Response to Actor (Original post)

Fri May 20, 2016, 12:41 PM

2. The revolution is happening regardless

I see a lot of posts from the HRC supporters that say something along the lines of "Bernie lost, it's over." It's amazing to me how blind those people are to the realities of the political world right now. Nothing is over. It's just beginning. Bernie is just one man. He's a man that many of us respect and appreciate for helping point out the enormous flaws within the Democratic party. But this is much bigger than him. And I don't think Trump will really have that big of an impact, as many people view it as one republican vs another in the GE if Bernie doesn't get the nomination.

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Response to casperthegm (Reply #2)

Fri May 20, 2016, 12:49 PM

8. Bullshit-That old smear-Hillary was one of the most liberal Senators in Congress

Calling Hillary a Republican and lumping her in with Cruz,Trump et al is just plain ignorance. We'll see in the midterms if there is really a movement-I have my doubts

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Response to redstateblues (Reply #8)

Fri May 20, 2016, 01:03 PM

12. Let me help you out

Last edited Fri May 20, 2016, 01:44 PM - Edit history (1)

My bad- I should have cited examples of you, so that you'd see that I have facts to back up my comparison. Hillary Clinton supports fracking, she supports regime change (Iraq war vote, Syria, Libya) and no fly zones, she supports trade agreements that outsource US jobs overseas, she opposes Glass Steagall, she opposes healthcare for all, she opposes college for all, and she says she's opposed to Citizens United but is going to accept the millions of dollar (but just for now, pinkie swear). Now, if you can tell me which of these positions is not widely found on the gop platform, by all means, go ahead and list them here. Otherwise, I stand by my comment.

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Response to casperthegm (Reply #12)

Fri May 20, 2016, 01:19 PM

15. Honestly, she's to Nixon's right.

That's how far the shift has gone.

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Response to casperthegm (Reply #12)

Fri May 20, 2016, 01:37 PM

21. And don't forget...



She didn't really exhibit courage in the fight for LGBT equality. "Cowardice" is actually the word that comes to mind...

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Response to casperthegm (Reply #12)

Fri May 20, 2016, 02:19 PM

28. Opposed to college for all? I don't believe I've seen that anywhere

She is not in favor of getting rid of the ACA, as Bernie is. She is opposed to Citizens United although you have made an insinuation of a connection that doesn't exist. There is still no proof of quid pro quo as you insinuate. When pressed in the debate Bernie could not name one instance of corruption after railing about it for a year. Bernie voted for regime change in Libya. Bernie has been devoted to protecting gun manufacturers. Bernie voted against the Brady bill. Bernie voted for the crime bill. By your standards the case could be made that Bernie is a Republican!

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Response to redstateblues (Reply #28)

Fri May 20, 2016, 02:55 PM

35. Hillary Clinton does not share Bernie's vision for free college

If she does, that's great. Maybe she can copy his stance on the $15 minimum wage. Wait, already did that (sort of, on the state level, kind of) Never mind.

No, there is no proof of quid pro quo regarding Citizens United. But then, if you think about it, why would she want to get rid of Citizens United? Isn't it because the idea the money in campaign finance is akin to legal bribery? But she's above all of that, right?

Regarding the ACA, come on, really? Do you really believe that, or are you repeating talking points from Hillary? Bernie is not doing away with anything, only expanding it so that everyone is covered. Let's avoid this silliness.

Your twist on the protection of gun manufacturers is silly, as I'm sure you are aware. And for such a serious topic, that's a shame. The argument is sound; blaming the manufacturers for a gun that is made legally when someone goes and commits a crime with it just doesn't make any sense. That's like blaming a car manufacturer when someone commits a crime with a car. The crime is horrible, but there's just no logic there.

I disagree with Bernie on the Brady Bill. There's no such thing as the perfect candidate and I'm not going to agree with on every vote.

The crime bill has been discussed repeatedly. The crime bill, supported by Hillary (super predator?) and signed by Bill, was voted for by Bernie with the acknowledgement that it was flawed and he mainly did it because of the part that added protection for women. You know the talking points, so I'm assuming you actually know the truth. If so, then why bring this up when it's so easy to correct the record?

I appreciate the fact that you are trying to discuss the issues It's more than I usually get. But you've only addressed a handful of the many issues that Hillary leans far right on. And those facts remain unchanged, as I've addressed them for you.

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Response to casperthegm (Reply #35)

Fri May 20, 2016, 04:16 PM

38. It's always amazing how BSS casually brush off the bad stuff about Bernie

You excuse him for any bad votes or any of his corporate connections. Stuff that you castigate Hillary for. So you tell me- how is it possible to institute Bernie's single payer without tearing down the ACA- you would have Republicans all on board to eliminate the ACA and then be faced with their intransigence on any new system. The reality is BSS all have this group think going that equivocates Trump and Hillary- Your Hillary hatred has blinded you to the huge differences and I find it appalling that you think a Republican Trump Presidency would be the same as a Democratic Clinton Presidency. It's "not a dimes worth of difference" all over again. A lot of progressives bought that back then. Have you already forgotten what Bush/Cheney was like?

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Response to redstateblues (Reply #38)

Fri May 20, 2016, 05:25 PM

41. Come on, you really want to start comparing corporate connections?

I get that you're a fan and I'm sure you don't like reading negative things about Hillary. But let's try some objectivity for a moment, shall we? I'd left out the speeches for hundreds of thousands to the banks and the transcripts. We've already touched on Citizens United. And you want to compare corporate connections?

Nobody is claiming "hey, let's tear down the ACA and then hope we can replace it with something better." That's not the approach that will be taken. I think, and hope, that you know that.

And now we get to the usual, "better get on board or we'll be faced with evil Trump." There's always going to be an evil republican. This time it's Trump.

If the Democratic party puts forward a candidate that has a multitude of pro-gop views, voting history, and close ties to Wall Street, I do not feel obligated to simply vote for the lesser of two evils. I'm not rewarding the establishment for their poor policy decisions. Like a spoiled child, the DNC will learn that their actions have consequences.

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Response to casperthegm (Reply #35)

Fri May 20, 2016, 11:14 PM

42. "Let's avoid this silliness."

Wouldn't that be nice? Highly unlikely, though. These shamaghast cutthroat brocktoys know they're lying, distorting and ignoring the truth. They think it's justified because it's Her Turn and anyone who disagrees shouldn't be allowed to vote, anyway. The bigger the truth we tell them, the LOL-er it is. Ridicule is their party line. Their candidate has NO position that as she hasn't flip flopped on, and no statement that anyone with any intelligence can trust. So we're supposed to take a leap of faith that we're completely sure would just be a high jump with no net. Not gonna do it.

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Response to redstateblues (Reply #8)

Fri May 20, 2016, 02:26 PM

31. No she wasn't. All those graphs and assessments give equal weight to a vote

 

to fund the NEA and a vote on war.

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Response to Actor (Original post)

Fri May 20, 2016, 12:43 PM

4. "we want to punish the Democrats, we want to hurt them, wound them"

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Response to joshcryer (Reply #4)

Fri May 20, 2016, 01:28 PM

18. And your screed there is wrong.

I was there, too. Hell, I'm a Tennessean. I was REALLY there. Gore lost our home state. Bush got conservative Democratic votes in Florida. And the SCOTUS stopped the recount.

That's what happened.

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Response to Fawke Em (Reply #18)

Fri May 20, 2016, 01:51 PM

23. Nope.

My post is an accurate historical overview of what happened. You can follow the links, you can use Archive.org to find the old internet websites with the articles. It happened.

Those are direct quotes from the players involved.

We saw what happens when we punish the Democrats.

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Response to Fawke Em (Reply #18)

Fri May 20, 2016, 02:21 PM

29. Nader denialism Lives!!

The people in FL that voted for Nader played a part in getting Bush/Cheney elected-to deny that is to deny reality

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Response to redstateblues (Reply #29)

Fri May 20, 2016, 05:18 PM

40. GOLDSTEIN!!!

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Response to Actor (Original post)

Fri May 20, 2016, 12:44 PM

5. trump winning is bad. It is not likely it would help progressives.

Why? Because then the Democratic party goes into opposition and people will rally to it as the only viable counter to trumpism. All the shortcomings of the Democratic party (and there are MANY), would be put aside in order to block trump's actions.

In the 2018 midterms, the Democrats would win a sweeping victory--boosting the current Democratic establishment.

So, no, a trump win being good for progressives is not a valid assumption.

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Response to Actor (Original post)

Fri May 20, 2016, 12:48 PM

6. Horrible thought, horrible way to think.

I heard the same nonsense in 1980: Electing Reagan will swing the country left. Once people see how bankrupt conservatism is, they'll endorse our liberal platform. In 2000: "There's no difference between Gore and Bush. A Bush victory will enable us to build a viable third (Green) party.

A Trump victory will swing this country even further to the right.

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Response to Actor (Original post)

Fri May 20, 2016, 12:49 PM

7. This post is dumb for $500 Alex. nt

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Response to nc4bo (Reply #7)

Fri May 20, 2016, 12:50 PM

9. I'll take "If Susan Saradon said it, it must be true" for $1,000

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Response to Agschmid (Reply #9)

Fri May 20, 2016, 12:51 PM

10. Better Susan than having Henry Kissinger on quick dial. nt

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Response to Actor (Original post)

Fri May 20, 2016, 12:55 PM

11. Susan Sarandon: Trump more likely to bring 'revolution' than Clinton

 

Susan Sarandon: Trump more likely to bring 'revolution' than Clinton
By Tal Kopan, CNN
Updated 8:18 PM ET, Tue March 29, 2016

http://www.cnn.com/2016/03/29/politics/susan-sarandon-donald-trump-hillary-clinton-bernie-sanders/


Susan Sarandon for sure.

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Response to Actor (Original post)


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Response to Actor (Reply #14)

Fri May 20, 2016, 01:41 PM

22. Yall keep flinging poop here. What happened, ran out of room in there? nt

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Response to Actor (Original post)

Fri May 20, 2016, 01:19 PM

16. It would work...

...if by "work" we mean "prevent things from working."

Seems a case of setting one's house on fire in order to encourage the survivors to install a better smoke alarm in the next house.

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Response to Actor (Original post)

Fri May 20, 2016, 01:26 PM

17. I don't want either to win (HRC or Trump), but here's my problem ...

If Bernie were the nominee, the Senate would almost certainly go Democratic, and the House might, or at least shift enough were it could in the 2018 midterms. In 2020, if the growth of the progressive movement continued (which I believe it would, due to demographics as well as effective progressive governance), a Sanders re-election could ensure long-standing Democratic majorities in the House & Senate, and continued support for policies that have worked well in Europe to ease poverty and limit income inequality. Just as importantly, it would re-establish the Democratic Party as the party of the people, and a force that could effectively counter Wall Street/corporate power and influence. Those monied interest might flee to the GOP, but with control over all of the branches of government, effective campaign finance reform could neuter the big money interests that have worked against working-class and poor Americans for generations.

If Hillary were to win, I think we would maintain the social gains won by women, minorities, and LGBT Americans (just as we would under President Sanders), but both the country and the Democratic Party would suffer under the very monied interests that Sen Sanders opposes and HRC embraces (and have bankrolled both her campaign and the Clinton "non-profit" honeypots like the CGI and Presidential library fund). Progressive interests might be purged from the Democratic Party, and the GOP might retain enough support to challenge her and Democrats in both 2018 and 2020. In fact, I think the Senate could remain in GOP hands, and I don't see any scenario under which the GOP loses the House in 2016, 2018, or 2020. Economic justice would be given little more than lip service, and the quality of life for millions of working-class and poor Americans would continue to decline, while the 1% would continue to hoard ever-greater shares of our economic output. She might also spend her Presidency mired in impeachment proceedings, as I doubt the GOP will simply walk away from her email and pay-to-play scandals. And in the face of scandal, she may turn to military adventurism to boost her poll numbers. She's certainly not averse to turning loose the dogs of war.

If Trump were to win, I doubt he would go full-on right wing religious nut on America (it's not who he is). He might toss a few insignificant bones to the mouth-breathers, but nothing that might upset voters enough to endanger Trump politically (think of a modestly more socially conservative Hillary). Economically, he might even be less beholden to Wall Street & corporations than HRC, but I doubt we would see meaningful positive change - he might toss out a bone or two to the working-class populists that support him at present. Militarily I think he's a Fortress America type, so we probably wouldn't be starting any wars intentionally, although his big mouth might start one inadvertently. I have no idea what his election might do WRT party control of Congress, other than if his racist streak takes hold, and a war starts on his watch, it might swing everything back towards Democrats on a timetable that could be months to years in the making. I do think having HRC off the national stage might allow the Democratic Party to continue to embrace progressive policies and candidates. Not that I want to see Trump win, but I have a hard time seeing how much worse a Trump presidency would be compared to Hillary.

Yes, I understand a SCOTUS appointment could go bad on us, but if HRC is one and done or is faced with large GOP majorities, we're not going to see progressive judges nominated or confirmed. In the final analysis I find both a Hillary presidency and a Trump presidency bad for America, but a Hillary Presidency potentially worse for the Democratic Party in the long term. If Goldman Sachs. Walmart, and defense contractors are allowed to run the Denocratic Party, progressives will flee, and without progressives, Democrats are in trouble.

While I know the possibility of a Sanders presidency is the least likely of the 3 scenarios, it far and away offers the best prospects for both America and the Democratic Party. Not to mention the rest of the planet. As long as there is hope, I will fight to keep that hope alive.

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Response to Yurovsky (Reply #17)

Fri May 20, 2016, 01:35 PM

20. You, me and Asher Edelson are on the same page with this.

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Response to Fawke Em (Reply #20)

Fri May 20, 2016, 01:57 PM

25. That's a great piece...

Just not sure Bernie could win as a 3rd party candidate. Bloomberg had the money ($400 BILLION -makes Donald Trump look like a hobo) but Bernie has the right message & policy. Sadly, a 3rd party run requires crazy money due to,the lack of party structure, and even Ross Perot's billions weren't enough - plus he was/is crazy.

I'm really hoping the FBI recommends an indictment against Hillary. That would really be the best thing for everyone, despite Hillary's supporters' assertions to the contrary.

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Response to Actor (Original post)

Fri May 20, 2016, 01:33 PM

19. Correct the Propaganda.

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Response to Actor (Original post)

Fri May 20, 2016, 01:52 PM

24. This is dumb even by the standards of the Mid-April Club.

Welcome to DU, by the way!

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Response to Actor (Original post)

Fri May 20, 2016, 02:01 PM

26. Oh stop worrying, Hillary has declared herself to be the nominee, just ignore us hopeless Bernie

Sanders supporters.

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Response to Actor (Original post)

Fri May 20, 2016, 02:06 PM

27. Trump is another enabler of our police state.

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Response to Actor (Original post)

Fri May 20, 2016, 02:24 PM

30. Another day, same stale propaganda. You need some new material.

 

Call the office!

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Response to Actor (Original post)

Fri May 20, 2016, 02:27 PM

32. Oh boy. This is a Democratic website.

 

And we have "Actor" wondering who here is going to vote for fucking Donald Trump.

I could understand if the name was "Republican Underground" or "We can't tell our ass from a hole in the ground Underground" and even possibly "We like to talk shit all day long and speculate that the earth is really flat Underground" but DU?

It isn't Dumb Underground.

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Response to Actor (Original post)

Fri May 20, 2016, 02:29 PM

33. The revolution is happening. Without Trump.

 

The polls show that most people don't trust the government, don't trust the electoral process, don't trust politicians.

The revolution is now.

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Response to Tierra_y_Libertad (Reply #33)

Fri May 20, 2016, 04:00 PM

37. Bernie's "revolution" is an empty bumper sticker slogan

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Response to Actor (Original post)

Fri May 20, 2016, 02:52 PM

34. You're soaking in it.

 

nt

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Response to Actor (Original post)

Fri May 20, 2016, 02:57 PM

36. Read the title and locked my computer ...

 

I want to have a empty bladder when reading the replies. I didn't want to be interrupted by my having to do the "Pee Pee dance."

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Response to Actor (Original post)

Fri May 20, 2016, 05:16 PM

39. I'm beginning to think 4 years of Trump may not be such a high price to pay..

to finally rid ourselves of the Clintons. Not an endorsement, nor am I voting for him. Just sayin'.

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