The Clintons are using 5 shell companies to save on taxes in Delaware

[dana_b]

The Clintons and their family foundation have at least five shell companies registered to the address 1209 North Orange Street in Wilmington, Delaware — which is also home to some 280,000 other companies who use the location to take advantage of the state's low taxes, limited disclosure requirements, and other business incentives. Two of the five are tied to Bill and Hillary Clinton specifically. One, WJC, LLC, is used by the former president to collect his consulting fees. The other, ZFS Holdings, LLC, was used by the former secretary of state to process her $5.5 million book advance from Simon & Schuster. Three additional shell companies belong to the Clinton Foundation.

There is nothing illegal about the Clintons' decision to take advantage of Delaware's tax laws. However, on the campaign trail last week, Hillary Clinton criticized the "super-rich" who use "outrageous tax havens and loopholes" to pay fewer taxes. She pledged that, as president, she would "shut down the so-called private tax system for the mega-wealthy," including legal tax avoidance activities, in order to "make sure that everyone pays their fair share here in America." Bonnie Kristian

http://theweek.com/speedreads/617761/clintons-are-using-5-shell-companies-save-taxes-delaware

I hope this link has enough journalistic integrity for some.

It's so funny that people are obsessed with Jane and Bernie's taxes (for a few hundred thousand) but this is A-ok.

[840high]

1. Thank you - K/R

[dana_b]

2. yep!

hiding it doesn't make it go away

[FreakinDJ]

103. Well now we know what the Goldman speeches are about

[Rosa Luxemburg]

119. shouldn't someone call them out on this?

[FreakinDJ]

120. Hilbots could care less

[7wo7rees]

3. Oh, this can't be good.....speechless! nt

[TheBlackAdder]

55. Earnst & Young helps Disney & Koch Ind. ship money to Luxembourg in a 5-hop process, LT 1% Tax.

.


If someone is going to go through the effort of setting up shell businesses, they might also redirect funds offshore.


http://www.reuters.com/article/luxembourg-tax-disney-idUSL6N0TT4EM20141210


.

[SoLeftIAmRight]

123. Hillary spends more on tax evasion the Sanders get paid

she is not the one

[Politicalboi]

4. This truth was hidden moment ago

Can't imagine why. The truth is coming out and they're trying to stop it. Poor babies. You lay with dogs, you get fleas.

[dana_b]

6. I know

that's why I hope that this one has enough integrity for some.

I won't be surprised if it is hidden though.

[azmom]

5. K&R

[The Velveteen Ocelot]

7. And this tells us that she really doesn't intend to do anything

about "the super-rich who use outrageous tax havens to pay fewer taxes." She's not going to "shut down the so-called private tax system for the mega-wealthy," including legal tax avoidance activities, in order to "make sure that everyone pays their fair share here in America." She and Bill have been using those exact tax avoidance methods for their own benefit for years now. Is she really going to derail her own gravy train?

[FreakinDJ]

124. This tells us the "Substance" of the Goldman speeches

[MrMickeysMom]

8. No, like you said, nothing illegal about this...

Yet, it makes them stink even more on ice.

[northernsouthern]

9. I had read this too.

Sadly when I tried to bring it up I was labeled a privileged sexist and beaten by bags of money.

Kidding, but I was annoyed this has not gotten more traction , maybe it will come up in the debate, that could actually force people to dela with it.

[dana_b]

26. yeah, I hope it will

I mean how much of a hypocrite do you have to be in order to benefit from a process one week and then condemn the next?

[MisterP]

89. DU thinks it's privileged to get enough sleep

if you hang your TP over- or underhand that expresses some internalized prejudice you have to face rather than deny and tearfully apologize in public for

[snowy owl]

10. Clinton supporters...? crickets chirping... Surely you have something to say.

[morningfog]

33. Waiting for marching orders.

[Chasstev365]

11. The mainstream media will ignore this for the most part!

[Gomez163]

12. It's on his tax returns. Not a secret

Maybe Bernie should release his.

[Viva_La_Revolution]

16. now tax havens are ok with you guys?!

[Gomez163]

49. What's Bernie hiding?

[TM99]

51. Obviously nothing that

needs 5 shell corporations to do so with!

But hey let's speculate about his taxes (even though all of his financial disclosures as a Senator are out there) but let's show no worry about the Clinton's FIVE shell corporations in Delaware.

[Bohemianwriter]

53. 1nothing more contriversial than what Hillary is hiding...

...with her Wall Street transcripts.
Why are you going after Bernie on this, and give Hillary a freepass here?


What vast wealth do you suspect Bernie to have hidden away in the same time as you not only ignoren Hillary, but praises her for it, and defends her donors?

Having a bit of double standards?
Or just a bit of cognitive dissonance on behalf of a corrupt politician - also known as a Superpredators without consience or empathy? Because I don't think Hillary has either. When she spoke of black kids as super predators, she really meant white people like herself with too much power and too little consience.

[Viva_La_Revolution]

54. #releasethetranscripts

[noiretextatique]

57. Not a damn thing. In 2014, they made about $215k

Less than one of Hillary's speeches.

[Jitter65]

81. A tax haven??? Not quite. nt

[RiverLover]

88. Tax haven? Exactly.(duh) New York Times 2012 talks about this exact address used as tax haven.

How Delaware Thrives as a Corporate Tax Haven

By LESLIE WAYNEJUNE 30, 2012

NOTHING about 1209 North Orange Street hints at the secrets inside. It’s a humdrum office building, a low-slung affair with a faded awning and a view of a parking garage. Hardly worth a second glance. If a first one.

But behind its doors is one of the most remarkable corporate collections in the world: 1209 North Orange, you see, is the legal address of no fewer than 285,000 separate businesses.

Its occupants, on paper, include giants like American Airlines, Apple, Bank of America, Berkshire Hathaway, Cargill, Coca-Cola, Ford, General Electric, Google, JPMorgan Chase, and Wal-Mart. These companies do business across the nation and around the world. Here at 1209 North Orange, they simply have a dropbox.

What attracts these marquee names to 1209 North Orange and to other Delaware addresses also attracts less-upstanding corporate citizens. For instance, 1209 North Orange was, until recently, a business address of Timothy S. Durham, known as “the Midwest Madoff.” On June 20, Mr. Durham was found guilty of bilking 5,000 mostly middle-class and elderly investors out of $207 million. It was also an address of Stanko Subotic, a Serbian businessman and convicted smuggler — just one of many Eastern Europeans drawn to the state.

Big corporations, small-time businesses, rogues, scoundrels and worse — all have turned up at Delaware addresses in hopes of minimizing taxes, skirting regulations, plying friendly courts or, when needed, covering their tracks....

http://www.nytimes.com/2012/07/01/business/how-delaware-thrives-as-a-corporate-tax-haven.html?_r=0

"rogues, scoundrels and worse"....yep.

The Clintons are playing the con of the century, Democrats In Name Only.

But you knew that.

[MrMickeysMom]

13. Listen to this shit...

There is nothing illegal about the Clintons' decision to take advantage of Delaware's tax laws. However, on the campaign trail last week, Hillary Clinton criticized the "super-rich" who use "outrageous tax havens and loopholes" to pay fewer taxes. She pledged that, as president, she would "shut down the so-called private tax system for the mega-wealthy," including legal tax avoidance activities, in order to "make sure that everyone pays their fair share here in America."

What a double standard we have for some animals. You know, SOME animals are MORE equal than OTHER animals...

[pinebox]

62. #Hillpocricy

[RiverLover]

66. She's a con artist.

ugh

[2cannan]

105. Though not illegal, here's another example of the Clintons' hypocrisy

Wealthy Clintons Use Trusts to Limit Estate Tax They Back
http://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2014-06-17/wealthy-clintons-use-trusts-to-limit-estate-tax-they-back

snip

Bill and Hillary Clinton have long supported an estate tax to prevent the U.S. from being dominated by inherited wealth. That doesn’t mean they want to pay it.

To reduce the tax pinch, the Clintons are using financial planning strategies befitting the top 1 percent of U.S. households in wealth. These moves, common among multimillionaires, will help shield some of their estate from the tax that now tops out at 40 percent of assets upon death.

snip

“The estate tax has been historically part of our very fundamental belief that we should have a meritocracy,” Hillary Clinton said at a December 2007 appearance with billionaire investor Warren Buffett, who supports estate taxes and is using charitable donations to reduce his eventual bill.

snip

According to county property records, the Clintons split their ownership of the house into separate 50 percent shares, and then placed those shares into trusts. That maneuver has multiple potential benefits, starting with the fact that any appreciation in the house’s value will now happen outside the estate.

Additionally, using IRS interest rates, they can assume a discounted value for the house. Splitting the property into 50 percent shares also allows a valuation discount, because a partial interest in an indivisible house isn’t worth as much as a complete interest.

[MrMickeysMom]

110. That's something...

Also, when you can change the law to do something that should not be the law, being legal is a pretty lame excuse for demonstrating some fucking humanity.

[arcane1]

14. That explains the sudden obsession with Bernie's taxes.

Just a week or so ago the obsession was that his net worth was too low. Suddenly it was about his net worth being too high by dodging taxes. The head spins

[closeupready]

15. Wow. This is going to sink their campaign.

K&R

[BillZBubb]

45. There have been so many other things that should have done that.

But didn't. I don't think this will be any different.

[jmg257]

17. "Clinton criticized the "super-rich" who use "outrageous tax havens and loopholes"

Sheesh. What a hypocritical ass.

Put that right up there with:

"Hillary Clinton told supporters that lobbyists should be exposed and publicly called out.
"Maybe use social media? Maybe make a concerted effort to really call these people out all the time, get some social pressure on them, get people to know their names," Clinton suggested"

[SDjack]

28. Only the little people pay taxes. /nt

[nolabels]

93. We know two of their leaders names as 'Bill' and 'Hillary'

My, , what a small world we live in

From Wiki
(snip)
Big lie

The phrase was also used in a report prepared during the war by the United States Office of Strategic Services in describing Hitler's psychological profile:[5][6]

His primary rules were: never allow the public to cool off; never admit a fault or wrong; never concede that there may be some good in your enemy; never leave room for alternatives; never accept blame; concentrate on one enemy at a time and blame him for everything that goes wrong; people will believe a big lie sooner than a little one; and if you repeat it frequently enough people will sooner or later believe it.[7]
(snip)
https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&rct=j&q=&esrc=s&source=web&cd=1&cad=rja&uact=8&ved=0ahUKEwja4Y_EqInMAhXCLmMKHcZIC4cQFggcMAA&url=https%3A%2F%2Fen.wikipedia.org%2Fwiki%2FBig_lie&usg=AFQjCNENt1vjHHimKqbXr4Hq1bAoeY3Kfw&sig2=JW_SO2bU6ZQelq8G6llgNA

[bbgrunt]

18. I see the dam breaking.......

[Cheese Sandwich]

19. Clintons are tax evaders.

[radical noodle]

20. What taxes are they avoiding?

[closeupready]

23. This. It shouldn't be hard to figure out. And also, just ask her.

(I know, lol, like anyone in the media is going to do that, ha.)

[radical noodle]

24. They would still have to pay the taxes in some way

depending on how the LLC is set up.

[closeupready]

29. Right, of course, but they claim to be New York residents.

Why are they dodging New York State taxes, which are higher than in most other states?

[radical noodle]

35. It appears that one of the main reasons for setting up in Delaware

is the minimal paperwork they require. If their residence is in New York, I believe they'd still pay the taxes from it in New York. I'm not a CPA, though. When we were living in Indiana and had rental income in Florida, we had to pay Indiana taxes on it.

[closeupready]

42. This is precisely where the smoke and mirrors helps obfuscate

assets and income. I'm not a CPA either, but in an alternate universe:

If a Delaware corporation is a person, then can that "person"'s income be taxed using Delaware's taxation scheme, and then can those "assets" be used for the benefit of another person perhaps without incurring a higher tax than if that third person had taken in that income directly?

I've also read that one of the games internationally which tax avoiders play is to "lend" to a subsidiary in another country, then have that subsidiary default on the "loan". The parent company then writes off that "default" on their taxes. Something like that, I think that's how I read it was occurring, this global shell game.

[radical noodle]

48. When a business entity is set up in the US

a form must be submitted to the IRS giving the names of the principals (the owners, if you will) and the IRS gives that business or entity a Federal ID number. Any income that goes to that entity then goes through the IRS in (probably a 1099 form) that also goes to the "owners." In that way, the taxes are paid by the people in the LLC. A few LLCs are treated differently in Delaware, but whatever it is, consulting fees, book royalties, whatever.... the person or the entity pays the taxes. Yes, sometimes there are cases where there is a back and forth. I worked for a company that had an LLC for some rental property and the rental property included the real estate the other business was on, so they paid one another. The first business paid rent to the LLC and the LLC paid the business for the real estate they'd purchased. It wasn't particularly advantageous from a tax standpoint, but it allowed us to have an easier record keeping for the rental stuff.

I also once had a boss who had a fictitious company in another state for the sole purpose of buying cheaper license plates for his expensive RV. In the end, he probably spent as much money because he had to pay someone to do all the paperwork in the other state and keep up the pretense of the other business.

I imagine a foreign entity might have more illegitimate reasons for their LCCs, but I have little knowledge in the fraud department.

[noiretextatique]

58. State taxes, if you incorporate in CA, for example

You have to pay a franchise tax. The minimum is $800.00. I know small business owners who pay that minimum.

[bkkyosemite]

21. She lies all the time and her supporters keep giving her kudos

[Stallion]

25. Geez that Address is Simply the Address of CT Corp

which all attorneys or people involved with corporations can tell you serve as a registered office to receive legal papers to be serve on the Corporation within a state. There is nothing nefarious about all those corporations using the same address. Its just a serviced mail address within a state a corporation is incorporated in or authorized to do business to comply with state law. Its very instructive that so many have so little knowledge of routine business practices. More corporations are registered in Delaware than in any other state

[Stallion]

31. Confirmation that Address is Simply CT Corp-a Commercial Registered Agent

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Corporation_Trust_Center_(CT_Corporation)

[Buns_of_Fire]

75. Delaware and Nevada are the easiest states to incorporate in.

You can even do-it-yourself if you've a mind to. Franchise fees are low, and unless you have need of issuing millions of shares of stock, it makes sense.

And every corporation is required to have a Registered Agent to receive legal mail and the like. Many Mom-and-Pop companies just take the suggestion to pay firms like this $50 a year or whatever to accept any legal stuff that comes in. Otherwise, they'd have to notify the state every time they changed their own address.

In and of itself, nothing nefarious there.

[Meteor Man]

27. I wonder if . . .

.. . the former Senator from MBNA passed along any advice or arranged any introductions to a few of his friends.

Not that there's anything illegal about facilitating a money laundering operations. Heck, all of the very finest corporations are doing it.

[ViseGrip]

30. Oh my, I thought it was two!

[jmg257]

32. Companion article 2012 NYT,..

http://www.nytimes.com/2012/07/01/business/how-delaware-thrives-as-a-corporate-tax-haven.html?_r=0

...1209 North Orange, you see, is the legal address of no fewer than 285,000 separate businesses.

Its occupants, on paper, include giants like American Airlines, Apple, Bank of America, Berkshire Hathaway, Cargill, Coca-Cola, Ford, General Electric, Google, JPMorgan Chase, and Wal-Mart. These companies do business across the nation and around the world. Here at 1209 North Orange, they simply have a dropbox.

...

Big corporations, small-time businesses, rogues, scoundrels and worse — all have turned up at Delaware addresses in hopes of minimizing taxes, skirting regulations, plying friendly courts or, when needed, covering their tracks. Federal authorities worry that, in addition to the legitimate businesses flocking here, drug traffickers, embezzlers and money launderers are increasingly heading to Delaware, too. It’s easy to set up shell companies here, no questions asked.

“Shells are the No. 1 vehicle for laundering illicit money and criminal proceeds,” said Lanny A. Breuer, assistant attorney general for the criminal division of the Justice Department. “It’s an enormous criminal justice problem. It’s ridiculously easy for a criminal to set up a shell corporation and use the banking system, and we have to stop it.”

[bvar22]

111. ^THIS^

1209 North Orange was, until recently, a business address of Timothy S. Durham, known as “the Midwest Madoff.” On June 20, Mr. Durham was found guilty of bilking 5,000 mostly middle-class and elderly investors out of $207 million. It was also an address of Stanko Subotic, a Serbian businessman and convicted smuggler — just one of many Eastern Europeans drawn to the state".

Something Stinks.

[Octafish]

115. They operate their frauds with impunity.

What we see is an amazing system for transferring wealth to the financial class, a people rotten to the core and smelling of sulfur.

[imagine2015]

34. K & R

[upaloopa]

36. Why incorporate in Delaware? It is not for tax avoidance. Your OP is not accurate. it's BS innuendo

Talk about selling your state short. I’ll see their four reasons and raise them one. Thus, the following are my top five reasons to incorporate in Delaware:

1. Flexible Laws. Delaware’s General Corporation Law is the most advanced and flexible business formation statute in the United States. It is designed to provide maximum flexibility in the structuring of business entities and the allocation of rights and duties among founders and shareholders.

2. No Wildcard Juries. If you do end up going to court to settle a dispute, Delaware’s Court of Chancery uses judges instead of juries. I don’t know about you, but I’d rather place my startup company’s legal fate in the hands of a well-trained expert than people whose legal experience consists of The People’s Court and Law and Order re-runs.

3. Precedence = Less Litigation. Since judges are used, decisions are issued as written opinions that your startup company can rely on. Thus, most Delaware corporations do not end up litigating disputes because their professional advisers examine these published opinions and construct deals to avoid lawsuits.

4. It’s Free! (Well, almost). Delaware charges $89 to incorporate. A little bit cheaper than California ($100..but they nail you for $800 every year in franchise fees), New York ($125), and a lot cheaper than Texas ($300). [note: Even if you incorporate in a foreign state like Delaware, your startup company may still be subject to registration as a “foreign entity” and compliance with the laws of states you transact business in.]

5. Privacy. In a world where personal privacy is constantly eroding (the Google 3D Mapping truck should be driving by my house anyday now), Delaware does not require director or officer names to be listed in the formation documents. Thus, Delaware provides a level of anonymity from snoopers.

[choie]

40. "Provides a level of anonymity from snoopers"

In other words... Safety from accountability

[Stallion]

43. Registered Agents and Registered Addresses Are Public Information in the Secretary of State Offices

In fact, they provide the method by which attorneys determine where to serve a Defendant with a citation )or notice that they have been sued) and start the time clock on their obligation to file an answer

[cherokeeprogressive]

46. #2's my favorite. Judges instead of juries. No Proles allowed.

There's a BIG upside to this. Why buy 6-9-12 Proles when you can buy 1 Judge? The Proles aren't smart enough to stay bought... too many chances one will turn and not know the consequences for all involved. A Judge though? Once bought they stay bought because they're the ones dealing out the consequences, so they know not to get caught.

Smart.

[bvar22]

117. Why do you think that all the Major Credit Card scamers

incorporate in Delaware?
Coincidence?
They ALL just happen to like the weather?

This is Delaware' entry into the Race-to-the-Bottom that is being played between irresponsible states.
In order to attract business to their states, some states are playing a very nasty game of cut-throat. They are dropping taxes to ZERO or near ZERO,
and in some cases donating land and services. This is like NAFTA, but between the states.
There used to be regulations (Federal Trade Commission?) against this kind of irresponsible behavior.

[hellofromreddit]

37. There is a thread on reddit with some good info

Here's the post: https://www.reddit.com/r/politics/comments/4eb8dr/this_delaware_address_is_home_to_200000_shell/d1yle3w

Basically, this isn't a big deal. When you incorporate you've got to have an address, and there are plenty of legitimate reasons to incorporate without having a physical business. So you basically timeshare an address.

I'm not commenting one way or another on what the Clintons do with their incorporations, just wanted to point out that a charged term like "shell companies" implies a lot more than is known.

[Stallion]

47. Every Attorney in the Country Would Agree With This-Its Humorous this is Causing Such a Hubub

Move on-because there is nothing nefarious to this whatsoever

[noiretextatique]

59. They do it to avoid paying state taxes

Period. That lots of companies do it doesn't change why they do it. But you are right, the address thing is not an issue.

[hack89]

100. No they don't

they still have to pay taxes in the state they reside in.

[Land of Enchantment]

38. The fish rots from the head.....nt

[Stallion]

39. CT Corp is a Commercial Registered Agent Serving Corporations in Every State in the Country

they receive legal documents from government and litigants in order to obtain jurisdiction over the corporate entity within a particular jurisdiction. In the opening paragraphs of all lawsuits there is a section where you plead the parties and how to serve them with legal process. I've done it thousands of times-I've got it memorized

EXAMPLE: Defendant XYZ is a Corporation incorporated under the laws of the State of Delaware and may be served with citation by serving its registered agent CT Corp at its registered address 1209 North Orange Street, Wilmington Delaware

Then when you file your suit you request the Court to issue a citation and have the citation with petition attached to be served upon XYZ Corp by physically serving CT Corp at the registered office

There is nothing unusual to this whatsoever-its simply complying with Delaware law so the corporation will be amenable to service within a particular state or jurisdiction. CT Corp is the biggest commercial registered agent in the country. I bet they have been the registered agent on about 40% of the lawsuits that I have filed during my 30 year legal career

I'm laughing my ass off about this gem

[SHRED]

41. Biden, Delaware, and the Clintons?

Color me shocked I tell ya.

[radical noodle]

44. Their taxes are online

The LLCs you've listed above are plainly shown on their Federal Tax Returns

[RiverLover]

63. Well, yeah, that's how they got the information about the tax-dodging shell companies.

I read their 2014 tax return yesterday because they link it.

...As an aside, 2014 was a very good year for them. Corruption & influence peddling are very lucrative!

[Blue Owl]

50. What fresh shell is this?

n/t

[CentralMass]

52. K&R

[amborin]

56. Wow! unbelievable, NOT!

[Sky Masterson]

60. Nope & (no) Change

She is part of the problem that she claims she wants to fix

[DanTex]

61. "There is nothing illegal about the Clintons' decision to take advantage of Delaware's tax laws."

Delaware LLCs are extremely common. Looks like the Hillary bashers are running out of material.

[hobbit709]

64. Many things that are legal are still of questionable ethics.

Just because the law upholds the principle of caveat emptor doesn't mean the seller should screw the buyer one way or another.

[DanTex]

68. Opening a Delaware LLC is not one of them. It's extremely common, it's not some exotic tax

shelter for Billionaires.

[B Calm]

65. Nothing illegal, just more Hillary hypocrisy!

[DanTex]

67. Delaware LLCs are extremely common, there is nothing hypocritical about it.

The article cited in the OP is a right-wing attack which repeatedly links to Breitbart.

[RiverLover]

69. See post #13. Its the height of hypocrisy. Is she going to fight against herself?

Brings the saying "my bad" to a whole new level.

[DanTex]

70. A Delaware LLC is not an "outrageous tax loophole." This is silly.

[progressoid]

96. Golly, then why didn't they just set up these LLCs in New York or Arkansas?

The same reason hundreds of thousands of other companies do it: $$$$$$$$$

Hillary didn't want to pay New York taxes on her $5500000.00 book deal et.al. Simple as that.

[RiverLover]

97. Yep. They set it up to evade taxes, the very thing she claims to be running AGAINST.

nt

[DanTex]

104. A lot of people incorporate in Delaware. It's not some big secret. You can do it too if you want.

There are websites where you can set up a Delaware LLC. In some cases, due to Delaware's corporate laws, it makes sense, in others it doesn't. I have no idea of the details of why the Clintons decided to do it.

By the way, if you live in New York, you still have to pay New York income taxes, including on money you earn through a Delaware LLC.

[progressoid]

107. Do you really believe that? Just because anyone can do it, it's OK?

C'mon, really. If Trump or Sanders had five shell corps in Delaware, would you be this cavalier about it?

Also, let's not confuse corporate taxes with personal taxes OK?

[DanTex]

108. Of course I do. It's completely standard practice.

This idea that opening a Delaware LLC as a vehicle for consulting revenue is somehow shady is absurd.

[progressoid]

112. Well if everybody is doing it, it must be OK.

Plus its legal. So that's a bonus too!

Just like having a shell corp in Panama. Or moving your company's headquarters to Ireland. It's legal and everyone is doing it so what's the big deal?

[DanTex]

113. How about 401Ks, are you opposed to them too? After all, that's another way that people

reduce their tax liability. How about claiming business expenses as tax write-offs... also evil, I persume? I guess that your moral approval requires that people make intentionally bad decisions, or else are just are just plainly uninformed about their choices.

Maybe that's part of the draw of Bernie's campaign: the policies he proposes are poorly thought out and have a no chance of succeeding.

[progressoid]

114. Oooh, nice deflection.

Back on topic.

She says she wants to stop the super-rich use of "outrageous tax havens and loopholes" to pay fewer taxes and "shut down the so-called private tax system for the mega-wealthy" while she is using that same system for her own gain.

It must be difficult to rationalize this. So, which Hillary do you defend/support? The Hillary using those tax loopholes? Or the one who says she'll close them?

[DanTex]

116. Actually, it's an analogy. One that you don't want to think about, I guess.

A Delaware LLC is not an "outrageous tax haven", it is very common business structure which many people who are not super-rich use. And it is not a "private tax system" because anyone can start a Delaware LLC very easily, it doesn't cost very much and it doesn't require any special political connections or anything. Like I said, there are websites where you can set one up.

It is very much like using a 401K to get a preferable tax treatment on retirement investments. I guess you've never heard of Delaware LLCs so they seem exotic to you. Try googling a little.

[progressoid]

118. Or I could just ask my accountant on Thursday.

I predict a response something like, "you don't belong in that club". Followed by a knowing chuckle.

[RiverLover]

71. LOL!! April 5: "Hillary Clinton Needs a Plan for Tackling Tax Havens"

http://nymag.com/daily/intelligencer/2016/04/hillary-needs-a-plan-for-tackling-tax-havens.html


I'm sure she'd get right on that. First 100 days in office.

[BernieforPres2016]

85. They should have said "embracing" instead of tackling them

And she and Bill are already on it, as her support for the Panama "free trade" agreement showed.

[msanthrope]

72. That's the address for CT corp, for the legally-impaired. nt

[msanthrope]

73. You do realize that a Delaware LLC is not a shell corporation?

This is one of the most appallingly legally ignorant OPs I've ever seen posted here. I don't blame you the poster... I blame the writer of this piece who seems to think that his readers are mind-numbingly stupid.

[DemocracyDirect]

77. Technically it is a shell corporation.

Unless it has some active business model.

They use the corporation mostly to move money to themselves individually or to other corporations.

The legal definition of a shell corporation.

[msanthrope]

82. Um, no. this is a painful thread to read....

And while I appreciate your use of the Wikipedia definition of "shell corporation," a Delaware LLC is not a corporation....either shell or otherwise.

[DemocracyDirect]

84. Oh sorry I thought you were arguing it wasn't a shell.

You were just saying it's not a corporation.

You are right, it's a Limited Liability Company. But that's just jurisdictional jargon for a corporation.

Did I quote the definition of a shell corporation word for word?

I didn't mean to. I just know about these things.

[msanthrope]

92. it is it is neither a shell, nor a corporation. nt

[Katashi_itto]

74. k&R!!!

[Vinca]

76. The big problem is that this kind of thing is perfectly legal.

That's how campaigns financed by fat cats pays off for them. Get the rules tweaked just enough so people with obscene amounts of money only pay the very least they can get away with in taxes, or, even better, figure out a way for the taxpayers to send them a subsidy.

[DemocracyDirect]

78. Starve the beast is their game plan.

Move all the profit overseas.

Governments then start to offer subsidies and lower regulations just to get what little revenue they can...

... mostly through payroll taxes.

[RiverLover]

79. Its robbing US of resources. Tax evading made legal is still tax evading. Its very republican too.

Hillary is republican in many, many ways.

[Vinca]

80. I've always thought of her as half a Republican.

Sadly, when I look at many elected Democrats I feel the same way. They've all moved to the right so many times they are now stuck there and can't see where they used to be.

[RiverLover]

86. Very sadly,

True.

[kristopher]

83. Yes, let's "make sure that everyone pays their fair share here in America" nt

[Freddie Stubbs]

87. I wonder what interesting things we would find on Sanders' tax return

There must be some reason he won't release it.

[Octafish]

90. Nothing close to shell companies. Especially when doing business with Phil Gramm.

After his exit from the US Senate, Phil Gramm found a job at Swiss bank UBS as vice chairman. He later brought in former President Bill Clinton to the Wealth Management team. What a coincidence, they are the two key figures in repealing Glass-Steagal. Since the New Deal it was the financial regulation that protected the US taxpayer from the Wall Street casino. Oh well, what are a few hundred million in speaking fees compared to a $16 trillion bailout among friends?



It's a Buy-Partisan Who's Who:

President William J. Clinton
President George W. Bush Heh heh heh.
Robert J. McCann
James Carville
John V. Miller
Paula D. Polito
Anthony Roth
Mike Ryan
John Savercool

SOURCE: http://financialservicesinc.ubs.com/revitalizingamerica/SenatorPhilGramm.html

One of my attorney chums doesn't like to see his name on any committees, event letterhead or political campaign literature. These folks, it seems to me, are past caring.

Some of why DUers and ALL voters should care about Phil Gramm.

Until the Panama Papers, the fact USA's Notell-6 news media corpse don't bring this up AT ALL should be of great concern to all who care about Democracy.

[Freddie Stubbs]

106. Then why won't he release his tax returns?

[Sheepshank]

91. I work in a Government office in Utah. Almost 10% of all start ups HERE are either NV or DE....

....based corporations. There is nothing unusual about this FACT.

These states are tax shelters....and you'd be surprised how many 10,000's of corporations take advantage of that.

[RiverLover]

95. This article describes how Corp Dems & repubs allowed US to become a World Leader in Tax Avoidance

Tuesday, Apr 5, 2016 05:58 AM EST
This is much worse than the Panama Papers: How America became a world leader in tax avoidance

........While several developed countries are already moving to reduce the anonymity behind shell companies, including a public registry of “beneficial ownership” information in the United Kingdom and a directive to collect similar information throughout the European Union, the United States has resisted such transparency.

According to recent research, the United States is the second-easiest country in the world to obtain an anonymous shell corporation account. (The first is Kenya.) You can create one in Delaware for your cat.

...........While we force foreign financial institutions to give up information on accounts held by U.S. taxpayers through the Foreign Account Tax Compliance Act of 2010, we don’t reciprocate by complying with international disclosure requirements standardized by the Organization for Economic Co-Operation and Development (OECD) and agreed to by 97 other nations. As a result, the U.S. is becoming one of the world’s foremost tax havens.

Several states – Delaware, Nevada, South Dakota, Wyoming – specialize in incorporating anonymous shell corporations. Delaware earns between one-quarter and one-third of their budget from incorporation fees, according to Clark Gascoigne of the FACT Coalition. The appeal of this revenue has emboldened small states, and now Wyoming bank accounts are the new Swiss bank accounts. America has become a lure, not only for foreign elites looking to seal money away from their own governments, but to launder their money through the purchase of U.S. real estate.

In addition, if the United States really wanted to stop Panama or the Cayman Islands or other offshore tax havens from allowing the wealthy to avoid hundreds of billions in payments, they could do so in about 15 minutes. Our recent free trade deal with Panama allegedly prevents Americans from creating offshore tax havens there, but in general, such tax information exchanges are insufferably weak.

And the little America does abroad to police tax evasion dwarfs the next to nothing we do at home.

The intertwining of global and political elites makes tax avoidance, whether legal or illegal, a secondary concern for the country, regardless of how it robs the country of resources and promotes the conception of a two-tiered economic and justice system where the upper class need not follow the same rules as the rest of us.

Our politicians made a consistent choice that this rampant tax avoidance doesn’t bother them.....


http://www.salon.com/2016/04/05/this_is_much_worse_than_the_panama_papers_how_america_became_a_world_leader_in_tax_avoidance/

[KoKo]

98. ...!

[dana_b]

99. and then they complain that we don't have enough money for social programs

but it's all due to their tax avoidance schemes. I don't care if they are "legal", they are still schemes and in my mind, tax cheats and UN American.

[RiverLover]

125. Exactly....& its Money in Politics. Like almost every issue out there, the root of the problem.

And it was a problem BEFORE Citizens United. CU just super-sized it.

And then Hillary super-sized SuperPACs.

(We also need to kick out paid lobbyists, outlaw the revolving door(right Barney Frank???), and end corporate lackeys working within the depts meant to oversee their industry. IE, all the oil men in the EPA . Federal & state level)

[yourpaljoey]

101. Why would you need five?

[TheDormouse]

131. just because

[FreakinDJ]

102. A lot in common with Romney

[Tierra_y_Libertad]

109. The perception of wrongdoing is often as damaging is the reality of wrongdoing. Drip, drip, drip.

[FreakinDJ]

121. This is only important if your policies differ from Mitt Romney's

Of course Romney tried to hide his Shell Companies Tax avoidance scheme as well

[TheDormouse]

122. Hypocrisy, thy name is Hillary.

outrageous tax havens & loopholes

[randome]

126. It's hilarious that so many here haven't bothered to read the thread before posting.

These are not tax havens and they're not shell companies. If someone is going to comment on something as complex as tax law, it would seem that reading up on the subject is paramount.
[hr][font color="blue"][center]You should never stop having childhood dreams.[/center][/font][hr]

[doc03]

127. So it is against some kind of law to invest in a

company chartered in Delaware now? Well we at least know what the Clintons did with their money, what about Bernie?

[RiverLover]

128. They set up a corporation as book authors in a diff state to avoid paying taxes . A TAX CHEAT

is running for president.

And running against....TAX CHEATERS.

She is the epitome of all that is wrong with this country.

[doc03]

129. It isn't cheating to take advantage of legal loopholes to avoid taxes. I

took an energy tax credit last year for insulating my home last year, was that cheating? I have
thousands of dollars in a tax shelter called a traditional IRA and in a Roth IRA, is that cheating?
I get a homestead exemption on my property tax, is that cheating? I get a discount on my fishing
license for being over 65, is that cheating?