Lots of other ppl have pointed this out, 3 of the Southern states Hillary has won...

[bigtree]

Raw Story @RawStory
Bernie Sanders dismisses Clinton lead: ‘A lot of that came from the South’ http://ow.ly/10uOTz

Lance Mannion ?@LanceMannion 31m31 minutes ago New Windsor, NY
1 Lots of other ppl have pointed this out, 3 of the (big) Southern states HRC has won are VA, NC, and FL. all went for Obama in 08.

Lance Mannion ?@LanceMannion 38m38 minutes ago New Windsor, NY
2 So her wins are not just in states that won't go blue in 2016. They are in states that have gone blue but *barely*.

Lance Mannion ?@LanceMannion 37m37 minutes ago New Windsor, NY
3 And while there's a chance she could bring NC back into the Dem win column and that would be great, it's more important that...

Lance Mannion ?@LanceMannion 35m35 minutes ago New Windsor, NY
4 that she can hold onto FL and VA.

Lance Mannion ?@LanceMannion 33m33 minutes ago New Windsor, NY
5 Meanwhile, Bernie's many of Bernie's wins have been in deep blue states either one of them should carry easily.

Lance Mannion ?@LanceMannion 31m31 minutes ago New Windsor, NY
6 We'll leave out for now the little matter that *she* won MA, OH, IL. MA and IL are reliably blue, but OH isn't.

Lance Mannion ?@LanceMannion 28m28 minutes ago New Windsor, NY
7 NE, KS, OK, ID, UT, AK, and WY probably aren't going blue this year no matter how many people there are currently feeling the Bern




Stephen Wolf ?@PoliticsWolf 36m36 minutes ago
Sanders won states like Oklahoma in part BECAUSE conservative voters chose him over Clinton. How does he account for that? He doesn't.

[Autumn]

1. Are you saying no POC in the south are conservative?

[bigtree]

2. I think that's a specious argument

...and you should know that.

[Autumn]

5. I know some liberal people in OK who went for Bernie. You brought up OK.

From your OP as you know.

Stephen Wolf ?@PoliticsWolf 36m36 minutes ago
Sanders won states like Oklahoma in part BECAUSE conservative voters chose him over Clinton. How does he account for that? He doesn't.

[bigtree]

12. it's interesting when discussing crossover conservative voters

...how Sanders supporters defend those as important.

All we get is this just this broad-brush dismissal of southern voters, though, portraying them as if they are some conservative bloc. Not a word from Sanders about the conservative voters crossing over in open primaries elsewhere, or the fact that many of the states he's won and is touting are in majority conservative states.

[Autumn]

15. I found it interesting how you spun it as the states that Bernie has won

are conservative. I simply asked for clarification. Are there no conservative POC in the states Hillary won? The point of your OP seems to be liberals vote Hill and conservatives crossed over to vote for Bernie. There are both conservative and liberal POC in OK, also here in CO.

[bigtree]

19. the point went completely over your head

...because it didn't fit your own narrative.

[Autumn]

21. Then perhaps you should make your point instead of whistling your point.

[bigtree]

27. this is the Sanders game

...questioning the South's voting overwhelmingly for Hillary with so many contradictions and so much hypocrisy that it's almost impossible to keep up with the shifting excuses.

I think the tweets make important points about this primary which I'm certain aren't as obtuse to most folks as you're supposing. I'll leave you to your own defenses.

[Autumn]

29. Speaking of games...

[bigtree]

30. you came onto this thread with your own agenda

...and it's not working.

[Autumn]

31. No, I came in to ask you a question on a point in your now edited OP.

That often happens on a discussion board.

[bigtree]

33. and you directed it to your own biased premise

...and got an answer based on my own.

I understand that's never going to be good enough for you. I'll try and get over it.

[Autumn]

34. All I really wanted directed at me was an answer to my question.

[Viva_La_Revolution]

3. Independents like me. more left than the Dem party is currently

For years the polls have been showing us that the American public is far more liberal than ever before. Why is this so hard to comprehend?

[Jitter65]

14. Being liberal does not necessarily equate to being impractical.

I would much rather be a Democrat who works hard within the party to make good changes than an Independent who joins up, shakes up and then leaves the party in chaos after a win or a loss. You know ALL the minimum wage increase will be (that nasty word) GRADUAL. Yet I know several people who believe that next year they will be earning $15/hr. It's wrong to mislead good people that way. And many do not realize that some small businesses can't afford that rate over the next 3-4 years unless our economy changes for the better drastically. And there are going to be some who will use that wage as an excuse to out source. Unless the TPP goes into effect with its requirements for countries like China, Japan and a few others to raise their wages to level the paying field it may well hurt us more. Any way some people are being misled.

[Viva_La_Revolution]

16. sorry, the party left me. they moved right while i stayed left.

Yes, we can put a chicken in every pot!
Yes, we can go to the moon!
Yes, we can eradicate poverty!

Now the party says no we can't but maybe we can get a few crumbs in a couple of years.

[hobbit709]

4. And TX, LA, SC, GA, TN, KY, AL, MS, AR went for who?

[DemocratSinceBirth]

8. I hope you aren't suggesting that's a bad thing.

[hobbit709]

10. In the GE it is, that's what I was referencing too.

Hillary has a less than zero chance of taking TX in the GE, so does Bernie.
Crowing about big primary wins in states that vote R in the GE doesn't mean shit.

[DemocratSinceBirth]

13. That's a fair point...

That's a fair point but winning FL, NC, OH, VA, and to some extent NV is a big deal.

And FL, VA, and to a lesser extent NC are atypical southern states. Lots of folks there are either first or second generation southerners.

[Zynx]

25. Oh, like OK, NE, KS, WY, UT, ID, and AK?

I just invalidated a lot of Bernie delegates there.

[mcar]

6. K&R

[DemocratSinceBirth]

7. She has won five of the most coveted swing states in recent presidential election history

She has won five of the most coveted swing states in recent presidential election history; Nevada, Florida, Ohio, North Carolina, and Virginia, four of them by double digits,.

[Zynx]

11. If Nevada had a primary as opposed to a damnable caucus, I bet she would have won it by a mile.

Caucuses really should be tossed away as they don't reflect the broad view of the party, but rather amplify the most ardent portion of it.

[DemocratSinceBirth]

17. Precisely

In 08 Hillary lost the WA caucus 70-30. She lost the non-binding primary 50-47.

[Zynx]

18. Nebraska was something similar last time, too.

Why we have caucuses in this day and age is beyond me.

[DemocratSinceBirth]

20. It is similar to the Electoral College in that it has the potential of negating the popular vote.

You can have one candidate winning the popular vote and another candidate winning the most pledged delegates. This scenario assumes the caucus popular votes were included.

If it were up to me we would have fifty state and territories primaries, chosen at random. This gives every state and territory an equal chance of going first. Of course the lottery would be well in advance of the primary season.

[Zynx]

9. And a lot of Sanders's total comes from crazy ass Western states like KS, OK, NE, ID, WY, UT, and AK

Sanders should be careful when dismissing whole regions of the country.

[RichVRichV]

22. Both candidates have won in swing states and both candidates have won in red states.

However there is one thing being completely ignored by Hillary supporters. She has only been winning big in states that have had closed primaries. Hillary has shown no ability to win over independent voters anywhere. You cannot win swing states in the general without the independent vote.

Right now her entire claim to winning the general election is independent voters disliking her less than they dislike the Republican nominee (which has yet to be proven). Bernie is the only candidate we have that wins the independent vote on his own merit.

[Zynx]

24. Yes, but he isn't the preference of the party's members.

And we'll see how that appeal to independents holds up under the Republican smear attacks. Republican friends of mine have their eyes light up when they look at Sanders. He's a soft, squishy target.

Of course, it won't come to that because Sanders won't be the nominee.

[bigtree]

28. that's not an indication that independents will abandon Democrats in November

...just that rank-and-file Democrats favor Hillary in greater numbers than her indie/Democrat rival.

We really don't know what general election voters would judge Sanders on, as most of the focus of the republican opposition has been on Hillary, with right-wing orgs. and other republican operatives and operations spending millions alongside of Bernie's campaign against Hillary in every competitive and important state in our primary, often with identical messaging.

The virtually unknown candidacy of Sanders would be a blank slate for the republicans to paint whatever they wanted. It makes sense that most voters will chose the known candidacy of Clinton, in such a crucial race, over a sketchy 'revolution' led a marginal senator.

[geek tragedy]

32. Facts matter, and your post gets them wrong.

Clinton destroyed Sanders in several open primaries, including Virginia, Texas, Ohio, George, Mississippi, Arkansas, and South Carolina.

[TheDormouse]

23. primaries hardly predictive--they're only the most hardcore voters

In Florida in 2012, for example, over 60% of the population turned out to vote in the general election, but only 13% cast ballots in the Democratic and Republican primaries.

Good luck trying to gauge how the general election will go based on the tea leaves from who voted in a primary or, lololol, caucus.

[Lucinda]

26. KNR