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HerbChestnut

(3,649 posts)
Fri Apr 8, 2016, 06:19 PM Apr 2016

There have been some bizarre criticisms here, but going after the Vatican meeting is callous...

At best. It shows a complete unwillingness to see the other candidate in a positive light, which goes beyond just supporting your candidate. No rational human being could twist Bernie's meeting with the Vatican into something negative.

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There have been some bizarre criticisms here, but going after the Vatican meeting is callous... (Original Post) HerbChestnut Apr 2016 OP
"No rational human being" Lizzie Poppet Apr 2016 #1
They can try but it might not work out like they planned... beam me up scottie Apr 2016 #2
It reminds me of MItt trying to get Statesmanship cred by going to England itsrobert Apr 2016 #3
Since you went there nadinbrzezinski Apr 2016 #4
Talk about a blunder! NWCorona Apr 2016 #5
They are counting on us not remembering beyond two days ago nadinbrzezinski Apr 2016 #13
They ripped him a huge one! NWCorona Apr 2016 #15
No it is not nonesense nadinbrzezinski Apr 2016 #37
Yup NWCorona Apr 2016 #38
Well DU is truly a teacup nadinbrzezinski Apr 2016 #44
No worse than Hillary trying to pretend she had ever taken the subway nichomachus Apr 2016 #7
Except telling national TV you are meeting with the Pope. You think? seabeyond Apr 2016 #6
What if he does meet the Pope NWCorona Apr 2016 #16
He isn't. The Pope said no. No intentions of giving Sanders an audience. Let alone a "meeting". seabeyond Apr 2016 #23
That's not what I asked NWCorona Apr 2016 #27
So? Sanders supporters do this a lot. Not what is, but but but, what if. He is not seeing the Pope. seabeyond Apr 2016 #30
I don't see it that way NWCorona Apr 2016 #40
Of course you don't. seabeyond Apr 2016 #42
Yup! NWCorona Apr 2016 #46
This is not a place of worship, and candidates are not deities. geek tragedy Apr 2016 #8
Which is being held at Vatical City, a... stay with me, a sovereign state. nadinbrzezinski Apr 2016 #14
a meeting at the Vatican is not the same thing as a meeting WITH the Vatican. geek tragedy Apr 2016 #17
Again, stay with me, this is being held in VATICAN CITY nadinbrzezinski Apr 2016 #21
where on their programme does it indicate he's speaking at this event? geek tragedy Apr 2016 #24
Don't tell me nadinbrzezinski Apr 2016 #25
Reuters jumped the gun. geek tragedy Apr 2016 #26
Once again nadinbrzezinski Apr 2016 #29
Tedious, nt geek tragedy Apr 2016 #31
Correct Reuters nadinbrzezinski Apr 2016 #33
And you missed this nadinbrzezinski Apr 2016 #32
is he submitting an academic paper? geek tragedy Apr 2016 #34
Once again nadinbrzezinski Apr 2016 #36
A chance to directly dialogue with 30 of the worlds top scholars on this? riderinthestorm Apr 2016 #47
And two south american Presidents who led populist revolutions of their own nadinbrzezinski Apr 2016 #48
Its just win win for him. I can't see any downside. riderinthestorm Apr 2016 #52
This is an optics problem why they are trying to mudd the water nadinbrzezinski Apr 2016 #55
I believe she's at Clooney's $350k/person fundraiser instead that night riderinthestorm Apr 2016 #56
Hmm, maybe an actual shelter nadinbrzezinski Apr 2016 #58
Wow, nice. vintx Apr 2016 #60
They wanted somebody from North America nadinbrzezinski Apr 2016 #61
Callous is the Clintons' middle name nichomachus Apr 2016 #9
The posts cast images of exploding heads, as ids, egos and super-egos collide in a mental vapor! TheBlackAdder Apr 2016 #10
This is such a bad look for team Hillary to be doing this NWCorona Apr 2016 #11
i am not Catholic but i still respect the Pope questionseverything Apr 2016 #39
I'm not either but the Pope has made some important moves NWCorona Apr 2016 #43
He's not "meeting with the Vatican" and he lied about meeting w/Pope Francis. KittyWampus Apr 2016 #12
Slowly where do you suppose this mythical vatican nadinbrzezinski Apr 2016 #18
So typical of some here to parse and ignore the larger picture Armstead Apr 2016 #20
Sorry, but Team Sanders isn't the entity that looks like a bunch of desperate, lying bozos. DisgustipatedinCA Apr 2016 #50
Hey, watch your tone & have some compassion... Mudcat Apr 2016 #19
"It shows a complete unwillingness to see the other candidate in a positive light" quickesst Apr 2016 #22
Their strategy is to attack EVERYTHING Bernie does that's different from Hillary. It's insane. reformist2 Apr 2016 #28
It is almost pavlovian nadinbrzezinski Apr 2016 #35
It's been really pathetic watching certain people go after Bernie harder than they did when Boehner jillan Apr 2016 #41
It's all good. The more they say, the more buffoonish they look. DisgustipatedinCA Apr 2016 #45
Agreed. Great OP nt riderinthestorm Apr 2016 #49
It's just envy. Hillary would never be invited to a conference on economic justice The Velveteen Ocelot Apr 2016 #51
the media wants to destroy and disqualify Bernie Csainvestor Apr 2016 #53
It's just one more step further into destructive stupidity. nt LWolf Apr 2016 #54
As though "callous" is new to this place? nt Jitter65 Apr 2016 #57
almost comical. RazBerryBeret Apr 2016 #59
Thank you. dr60omg Apr 2016 #62
They would be wiser to just ignore it and not say a thing. Kittycat Apr 2016 #63
 

nadinbrzezinski

(154,021 posts)
4. Since you went there
Fri Apr 8, 2016, 06:24 PM
Apr 2016

do you think Sanders will reveal the existence of Her Majesty's Service, MI-6? Really.

Now that was comedic, and that is the major reason it did not go well, I suspect the Swiss Guard will not be part of the conversation, thought the SS team will likely have to figure out, as they always do, how to work with the Swiss Guard.

At this point I am really starting to feel extremely sorry for you guys.

 

nadinbrzezinski

(154,021 posts)
13. They are counting on us not remembering beyond two days ago
Fri Apr 8, 2016, 06:28 PM
Apr 2016

And no the Queen Mother was not pleased.

 

nadinbrzezinski

(154,021 posts)
37. No it is not nonesense
Fri Apr 8, 2016, 06:52 PM
Apr 2016

I know why they are doing this. There is real worry that they are about to get trounced in NY, and how this might help Sanders with the voters.

Also, we stopped talking of Bill's pretty racist statement.

 

nadinbrzezinski

(154,021 posts)
44. Well DU is truly a teacup
Fri Apr 8, 2016, 06:58 PM
Apr 2016

it used to matter a lot more. Realistically it no longer does. So it's become a testing ground for talking points. Those who are swatted this fiercely will not make it though.

nichomachus

(12,754 posts)
7. No worse than Hillary trying to pretend she had ever taken the subway
Fri Apr 8, 2016, 06:26 PM
Apr 2016

She's a phony and a fraud in just about everything she does.

 

seabeyond

(110,159 posts)
23. He isn't. The Pope said no. No intentions of giving Sanders an audience. Let alone a "meeting".
Fri Apr 8, 2016, 06:42 PM
Apr 2016
 

seabeyond

(110,159 posts)
30. So? Sanders supporters do this a lot. Not what is, but but but, what if. He is not seeing the Pope.
Fri Apr 8, 2016, 06:48 PM
Apr 2016

He lied. He knew he was lying. On national tv.

 

geek tragedy

(68,868 posts)
8. This is not a place of worship, and candidates are not deities.
Fri Apr 8, 2016, 06:26 PM
Apr 2016

It is perfectly reasonable to criticize decisions politicians make during an election.

This isn't a "meeting with the Vatican" btw. He's attending a conference.

 

nadinbrzezinski

(154,021 posts)
14. Which is being held at Vatical City, a... stay with me, a sovereign state.
Fri Apr 8, 2016, 06:30 PM
Apr 2016
Democrat Sanders, 'big fan of pope,' to attend Vatican conference


http://www.reuters.com/article/us-usa-election-sanders-vatican-idUSKCN0X516C

This really got under your skin.
 

geek tragedy

(68,868 posts)
17. a meeting at the Vatican is not the same thing as a meeting WITH the Vatican.
Fri Apr 8, 2016, 06:31 PM
Apr 2016

A meeting in New York is not the same thing as a meeting with Bill D's administration or Andy Cuomo's for that matter.



 

nadinbrzezinski

(154,021 posts)
21. Again, stay with me, this is being held in VATICAN CITY
Fri Apr 8, 2016, 06:39 PM
Apr 2016

with one of their top research institutions, You might be more familiar with the Observatorio Romano, but for some silly reason, going to back to Jesus actually, (or more specifically the first popes), the idea of social justice has been part of at least the ideology of teh church.

They have failed to do this at times... see that whole thing called the Middle Ages, but they do. This is very close to Pope Francis's ideology, to serve the poor. This really got under your skin. It really did, and I am beyond feeling sorry for you at this point.

And this is my read as well,

U.S. Democratic presidential candidate Bernie Sanders will speak at an event in the Vatican next week, likely broadening his appeal to Catholic voters ahead of crucial nominating contests in a series of Northeastern states.

Like Pope Francis, Sanders has made economic inequality and the plight of the working class a central tenet of his message. Sanders' April 15 visit to Vatican City, where he will give an economic address at a conference, will come just days before Democrats in New York vote in their state primary.

The trip may help the U.S. senator amplify the anti-corporate line of attack he has employed against Democratic rival Hillary Clinton as he tries to keep his insurgent campaign for the Nov. 8 presidential election alive.


http://www.reuters.com/article/us-usa-election-idUSKCN0X51Q6

And please do correct Reuters as well.
 

geek tragedy

(68,868 posts)
24. where on their programme does it indicate he's speaking at this event?
Fri Apr 8, 2016, 06:45 PM
Apr 2016

You will be surprised to learn that journalists sometimes make mistakes.

There have been about 7 different versions of this story released today by the press.

Here's the Catholic news agency's account:

http://ncronline.org/news/politics/bernie-sanders-set-attend-vatican-conference-john-paul-ii-encyclical

The Vatican conference on Centesimus annus will be a small gathering of roughly 30 scholars. It is not open to the public. Pope Francis is not expected to attend, though Cardinal Oscar Rodriguez Maradiaga, head of the pope's Council of Cardinals, will open speak at the conference's opening.

The remainder of the conference will situate around the presentation of five papers. Presenters include Sachs and each of the Latin American presidents, in addition to Fr. Bryan Hehir, of the Harvard University John F. Kennedy School of Government, and José Casanova, senior fellow at the Berkley Center for Religion, Peace and World Affairs, in Washington, D.C.

Asked if Sanders might address the conference as well, Sanchez said, "I think that he needs to have the same possibility as the other political leaders." He clarified that it would have to be within the context of Centesimus annus.



According to the conference booklet, the symposium will explore two major issues: What changes have occurred in the world -- economically, politically and culturally -- in the last 25 years? And how has Catholic social teaching engaged the world during the time, and how might it best do so in coming decades?

"How ought we to think about the cultural situation today and what realities call for further reflection within Catholic social thought today to better understand the situation of ordinary people, especially the poor and marginalized?" it asked.

At least one conference attendee who spoke on background said they anticipated a "generic academic conference" but are now "queasy" how Sanders' presence, and the political overtones accompanying him, might distort a more academic reflection on the interrelationships between markets and morality.

"It's just tricky to navigate those issues, and I don't know that a politician -- any politician, not Sanders in particular -- is well equipped to navigate them in a subtle and nuanced way," the attendee said.

 

geek tragedy

(68,868 posts)
26. Reuters jumped the gun.
Fri Apr 8, 2016, 06:46 PM
Apr 2016
The Vatican conference on Centesimus annus will be a small gathering of roughly 30 scholars. It is not open to the public. Pope Francis is not expected to attend, though Cardinal Oscar Rodriguez Maradiaga, head of the pope's Council of Cardinals, will open speak at the conference's opening.

The remainder of the conference will situate around the presentation of five papers. Presenters include Sachs and each of the Latin American presidents, in addition to Fr. Bryan Hehir, of the Harvard University John F. Kennedy School of Government, and José Casanova, senior fellow at the Berkley Center for Religion, Peace and World Affairs, in Washington, D.C.

Asked if Sanders might address the conference as well, Sanchez said, "I think that he needs to have the same possibility as the other political leaders." He clarified that it would have to be within the context of Centesimus annus.

According to the conference booklet, the symposium will explore two major issues: What changes have occurred in the world -- economically, politically and culturally -- in the last 25 years? And how has Catholic social teaching engaged the world during the time, and how might it best do so in coming decades?

"How ought we to think about the cultural situation today and what realities call for further reflection within Catholic social thought today to better understand the situation of ordinary people, especially the poor and marginalized?" it asked.

At least one conference attendee who spoke on background said they anticipated a "generic academic conference" but are now "queasy" how Sanders' presence, and the political overtones accompanying him, might distort a more academic reflection on the interrelationships between markets and morality.

"It's just tricky to navigate those issues, and I don't know that a politician -- any politician, not Sanders in particular -- is well equipped to navigate them in a subtle and nuanced way," the attendee said.


http://ncronline.org/news/politics/bernie-sanders-set-attend-vatican-conference-john-paul-ii-encyclical
 

nadinbrzezinski

(154,021 posts)
32. And you missed this
Fri Apr 8, 2016, 06:49 PM
Apr 2016
The chancellor told CNN that Sanders' attendance "does not signify any support for the campaign," and that the academy sought to establish a dialogue between North and South America by inviting a U.S. politician.

"I don't know what is the problem," he told NCR. "We have two presidents from Latin America, and we don't have a problem. And we have a problem because we invited one candidate to the White House of your country? It's a little impossible to understand."
 

riderinthestorm

(23,272 posts)
47. A chance to directly dialogue with 30 of the worlds top scholars on this?
Fri Apr 8, 2016, 06:59 PM
Apr 2016

Bernie the human must be ecstatic and has told Bernie the candidate to sit down.



He truly lives his ideals.

I had no idea it was this intimate of a gathering. Now I know why its a must-go thing for him.

 

riderinthestorm

(23,272 posts)
52. Its just win win for him. I can't see any downside.
Fri Apr 8, 2016, 07:04 PM
Apr 2016

Whatever hours he may lose campaigning in NY, will be more than made up in the positive press he's getting now and then.

 

nadinbrzezinski

(154,021 posts)
55. This is an optics problem why they are trying to mudd the water
Fri Apr 8, 2016, 07:07 PM
Apr 2016

yes, HRC will not be in Hong kong raising 2700 a pop, but her CFO will... same moment in time. The optics suck.... if you are a Clinton supporter

 

riderinthestorm

(23,272 posts)
56. I believe she's at Clooney's $350k/person fundraiser instead that night
Fri Apr 8, 2016, 07:14 PM
Apr 2016

So much better. ..



I predict Hillary will be helping at a soup kitchen that day. Watch for carefully staged "charitable " photo ops...

questionseverything

(9,627 posts)
39. i am not Catholic but i still respect the Pope
Fri Apr 8, 2016, 06:56 PM
Apr 2016

as US citizens i would think we all should be proud bernie is invited to speak on a "moral" economy

look at her supporters on this page...just hating

<shrugs>

 

nadinbrzezinski

(154,021 posts)
18. Slowly where do you suppose this mythical vatican
Fri Apr 8, 2016, 06:33 PM
Apr 2016

mentioned in this Reuters headline actually exists at:

Democrat Sanders, 'big fan of pope,' to attend Vatican conference


http://www.reuters.com/article/us-usa-election-sanders-vatican-idUSKCN0X516C

Perhaps you are not aware of this, but this mythical place is this magical kingdom

https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/d/d6/St_Peter's_Square,_Vatican_City_-_April_2007.jpg
 

Armstead

(47,803 posts)
20. So typical of some here to parse and ignore the larger picture
Fri Apr 8, 2016, 06:36 PM
Apr 2016

Maybe he shuold have stopped and said -- No, it's not determined that I am going to meet with the pope..... But you don't know that's not true or discussions have been going on about that.

But in a larger sense, you totally ignore his obviously heartfelt explanation of what he admires about the Pope, and the need for an economy with a more moral basis.

To some here, political bickering is all that counts. Memes are all that count.

 

DisgustipatedinCA

(12,530 posts)
50. Sorry, but Team Sanders isn't the entity that looks like a bunch of desperate, lying bozos.
Fri Apr 8, 2016, 07:01 PM
Apr 2016

That would be another candidate.

Mudcat

(179 posts)
19. Hey, watch your tone & have some compassion...
Fri Apr 8, 2016, 06:35 PM
Apr 2016

... for those folks whose favorite candidate's poll numbers are going down the tubes almost daily.

quickesst

(6,277 posts)
22. "It shows a complete unwillingness to see the other candidate in a positive light"
Fri Apr 8, 2016, 06:40 PM
Apr 2016

Read the replies in this thread from your fellow Bernie supporters, then say that again with a straight face.

 

nadinbrzezinski

(154,021 posts)
35. It is almost pavlovian
Fri Apr 8, 2016, 06:50 PM
Apr 2016

if Sanders supporters said that Sanders is the devil himself, they would attack that statement.

jillan

(39,451 posts)
41. It's been really pathetic watching certain people go after Bernie harder than they did when Boehner
Fri Apr 8, 2016, 06:57 PM
Apr 2016

invited the Pope to speak to Congress.



 

DisgustipatedinCA

(12,530 posts)
45. It's all good. The more they say, the more buffoonish they look.
Fri Apr 8, 2016, 06:58 PM
Apr 2016

This is one of those Chinese thumbcuff kind of things--the more they work at it, the worse they look. Let's mix our metaphors and give them all the rope they require.

The Velveteen Ocelot

(114,510 posts)
51. It's just envy. Hillary would never be invited to a conference on economic justice
Fri Apr 8, 2016, 07:03 PM
Apr 2016

so they just have to piss on Bernie's campfire.

RazBerryBeret

(3,075 posts)
59. almost comical.
Fri Apr 8, 2016, 07:18 PM
Apr 2016

whether he meets with the pope, regardless of who invited him.. he is speaking about poverty/wealth and morality. Something he has spent his entire career working on; I am very proud he has this opportunity. I can't think of anyone else better versed in speaking about this subject, it's great that an American Politician was invited. let's lighten up a bit. Maybe say congrats?

Kittycat

(10,493 posts)
63. They would be wiser to just ignore it and not say a thing.
Fri Apr 8, 2016, 07:36 PM
Apr 2016

But insulting the Vatican, Catholics, and sander's supporters. Good call. They haven't learned that it's only political if you make it political. Hillary's message doesn't align, Bernie's does - so now they want to piss on Bernie for it, and the Vatican in the process. Way to go!

Keep up the work

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