Welcome to DU! The truly grassroots left-of-center political community where regular people, not algorithms, drive the discussions and set the standards. Join the community: Create a free account Support DU (and get rid of ads!): Become a Star Member Latest Breaking News General Discussion The DU Lounge All Forums Issue Forums Culture Forums Alliance Forums Region Forums Support Forums Help & Search

FrenchieCat

(68,867 posts)
Thu Feb 25, 2016, 10:52 AM Feb 2016

NO Ashley Williams, you are NOT a Superpredator

Dear Ashley Williams,

I personally thank you for your work and your activism, as it is making a difference.

20+ years ago, this country was experiencing major issues of drug and gang violence. It was in the era of crack cocaine, drug cartels, and gangs selling drugs on the city streets. It created violent havoc in many urban neighborhoods all around America. Children could barely walk to school, or sleep in their own beds without bullets whizzing by their bedroom windows or coming through their walls. The neighborhoods were not safe for those who had no where else to go. Parents residing in the most violent areas were deeply worried and feeling helpless, and young children were traumatized and scared.

I remember clearly how the local and national media sensationalized these crime incidents, and helped promote more fear in the citizenry who did not live in those neighborhoods. The various networks promoted day in, day out, that what was needed were get-tough-on-crime policies. With GOP and Reporters labeling Democrats as "Soft on Crime". Republican politicians, who held both chambers of congress, partnered with the media to mold public opinion into making the entire country believe that it was going to hell in a hand basket, and then some. Yes, and as you know, this country was racist then, as it is still racist now.

Were Superpredators anyone but gang members and drug dealers who were committing crimes such as robberies, car jacking, drive byes and shootings? Well my recollection as a 36 year old wife and mother then, is that, that is who they were. I was raising my own young Black family, living in West Oakland, California. I will add that I was fortunate enough not to live in the areas that most suffered the violence. But I did work in an East Oakland neighborhood on 35th Avenue and East 14th St., now MLK Avenue. I saw the neighborhood people that hung out in the street, as they transformed a little more everyday. I specifically remember one young woman, seemingly healthy and youthful one minute, shockingly turn into an old and damaged addict in just a few short months. Those were the times as they were.

That is why I know that you are not a Superpredator, nor have you ever been.

You are not a gang member nor a drug dealer. you are most likely a student, and a passionate young Black Activist wanting some answers, that is what I believe. Someone sickened and enraged at having to watch racial social injustice unfold, that more can now clearly see. My own daughter was on the ground at Ferguson, MO, from day one. She organized protests of the workhouse jails there. I witnessed her passion grow with each passing day. I even attended a meeting with her of an activist planning session while I was in St. Louis visiting.

I am simply answering the question you asked Hillary Clinton last night, although I'm sure she will answer you herself as well.

Now, let us ask about this crime bill passed into law in 1994.

Was that Crime Bill that President Bill Clinton signed, after two vetoes, a good bill? No it wasn’t.
Did it do far more damage than any good? Yes it certainly did, and time has told that story.

Did Bill Clinton apologize for signing this bill into law? Yes, he did.
Was that enough? Most likely not.

Did numerous legislators on both sides of the aisle vote for it? Yes they did.
Did Presidential Candidate Bernie Sanders vote for it? Yes, he did.
Did he apologize for it? If he hasn't, he should.
Did Presidential Candidate Hillary Clinton promote the bill? Yes, she did.
Did she apologize for that? If she hasn't, she should.

No matter how small or large anyone's role was in it, yes, they should all apologize,
to all of those many negatively affected over these years.

And furthermore, those running for office should have solid and sound criminal justice reforms as part of their platform, done in a way to insure that the wrongs from the past continue to be corrected.

And to be honest, the others that share the blame and need protesting against, is our News Media.
They were chief collaborators in the sensationalizing of various crime events at that time, and were the ones responsible to shape public opinion.

Not only did the local and national media sensationalize crime incidents, but they had the duty and the opportunity
to ask several important questions about the crime wave, that they were frightening people about. But the media never did ask these questions and instead helped promote tough crime policies. They are AS responsible as everyone else, so I pray that the BLM shows up in newsrooms. Because if they are exempted, they will have learned nothing at all for their part.

So in a sense, many more are guilty than are raising their hands, because this was done as a nation, and it was done in our name.


Respectfully,

A Black Hillary Clinton Supporter

65 replies = new reply since forum marked as read
Highlight: NoneDon't highlight anything 5 newestHighlight 5 most recent replies
NO Ashley Williams, you are NOT a Superpredator (Original Post) FrenchieCat Feb 2016 OP
K and R leftofcool Feb 2016 #1
Thank you Frenchie. Lucinda Feb 2016 #2
I just went back and reviewed all of those August post, FrenchieCat Feb 2016 #4
It should be very interesting reading. The young lady lost a very great opportunity Lucinda Feb 2016 #5
Or, on the flip-side, Hillary could have... tex-wyo-dem Feb 2016 #39
Ms Ashley got exactly what she wanted. Her disruption of an event on video. Lucinda Feb 2016 #57
Yeah, that uppity black woman TM99 Feb 2016 #64
Kick. nt. NCTraveler Feb 2016 #3
They all should apologize, I agree and a commitment to unravel the harm. That should be Jefferson23 Feb 2016 #6
You are welcome Jefferson23! FrenchieCat Feb 2016 #7
Absolutely, they made the choice to be public servants, accountability is essential when Jefferson23 Feb 2016 #9
Hillary called KIDS super predators. And that the must be brought to heel. Black kids. morningfog Feb 2016 #8
Bernie referred to them as deeply sick sociopaths. Looks like they both need to apologize. n/t seaglass Feb 2016 #12
NO, you are dead wrong. He did not refer to kids as deeply sick sociopaths. morningfog Feb 2016 #15
After they murdered JustAnotherGen Feb 2016 #31
That is a LIE.... LovingA2andMI Feb 2016 #47
Link? BeanMusical Feb 2016 #65
Ok.... FrenchieCat Feb 2016 #14
This one person happens to be running for president and touts her support for and from the AA morningfog Feb 2016 #16
Well good for you, because many were outraged FrenchieCat Feb 2016 #24
I can't control anyone but myself. morningfog Feb 2016 #26
Black gang bangers JustAnotherGen Feb 2016 #32
Was he a kid? And do you agree he and the other kids should be brought to heel? morningfog Feb 2016 #35
He was 17 JustAnotherGen Feb 2016 #62
I remember so many stories of kids killed because they would not join gangs. Friends got sent bettyellen Feb 2016 #63
My brother was a cop in one of the roughest precincts in NYC then. Children with guns became common bettyellen Feb 2016 #60
We Needed To Make Sure.... LovingA2andMI Feb 2016 #50
k&r n/t JTFrog Feb 2016 #10
Regardless of which candidate one chooses to support, it's clear from this bullwinkle428 Feb 2016 #11
Definitely! FrenchieCat Feb 2016 #21
Of course she is no super predator notadmblnd Feb 2016 #13
I have always cared about people of color... FrenchieCat Feb 2016 #19
I said nothing about your feelings and what you are willing to do or say for your candidate notadmblnd Feb 2016 #23
Glad you have knowledge FrenchieCat Feb 2016 #25
I'm sure you're an intelligent human being. notadmblnd Feb 2016 #29
Thank you. Your post is outstanding. Rec. nt LexVegas Feb 2016 #17
Thank you, Frenchie Cat. oasis Feb 2016 #18
I am very disappointed in the Clintons. Wilms Feb 2016 #20
You should do as you wish...as that is your right, FrenchieCat Feb 2016 #22
indeed, it's almost like the pres/his wife pursuing/promoting it is just like a congressman stupidicus Feb 2016 #44
Could you clarify that last sentence please? ismnotwasm Feb 2016 #58
no stupidicus Feb 2016 #59
Re-posted DemocratSinceBirth Feb 2016 #27
That is true.... FrenchieCat Feb 2016 #36
K&R mcar Feb 2016 #28
Which reminds me, the Willie Horton ad was almost 30 years ago BeyondGeography Feb 2016 #30
Great point about Trump and the "wilding" incident obamanut2012 Feb 2016 #46
Thanks-- JohnnyLib2 Feb 2016 #33
I just remember those times so vividly, FrenchieCat Feb 2016 #37
Greal OP! HRC has had 20 years to apologize for that statement and she hasn't Arazi Feb 2016 #34
She is not the only one.... FrenchieCat Feb 2016 #38
no she's not but I'm sure she appreciates your explanation. retrowire Feb 2016 #40
Fucking nailed it... SidDithers Feb 2016 #41
omg how i missed you SwampG8r Feb 2016 #42
It seems we are in the same position now with heroin as we were with crack then AllyCat Feb 2016 #43
Black Lives Matter... FrenchieCat Feb 2016 #49
It's true that each congressional member who supported that bill should denounce it... and repeal it Bubzer Feb 2016 #45
Back then our environment was recovering from being drenched in lead from car exhausts Fumesucker Feb 2016 #48
I agree with the damage of lead.... FrenchieCat Feb 2016 #52
Bravo, FC! Well told and mirrors my own recollections bigbrother05 Feb 2016 #51
Thank you for this thoughtful clarification, FrenchieCat lunamagica Feb 2016 #53
I don't buy it Rebkeh Feb 2016 #54
K&R ismnotwasm Feb 2016 #55
On the plus side, you're not blaming LGBT people for elections anymore Prism Feb 2016 #56
That you even accept the 'reality' of a super predator myth TM99 Feb 2016 #61

FrenchieCat

(68,867 posts)
4. I just went back and reviewed all of those August post,
Thu Feb 25, 2016, 11:03 AM
Feb 2016

when the BLM were discussed as being on Hillary's payroll,
on the take, simply paid, etc., etc., etc!

I'm going to make sure to read them all...
and there's a lot of them....

as I want to see who the Hypocrites might be!

Lucinda

(31,170 posts)
5. It should be very interesting reading. The young lady lost a very great opportunity
Thu Feb 25, 2016, 11:07 AM
Feb 2016

by not talking with Hillary. The fact that she just shouted her down until she was escorted out, leads me to believe that, and the video they took, were all they really were after. She missed out on a great opportunity to get a one on one with Hillary.

tex-wyo-dem

(3,190 posts)
39. Or, on the flip-side, Hillary could have...
Thu Feb 25, 2016, 12:28 PM
Feb 2016

Completely diffused the situation by handing Ashley the mic and letting her speak her mind and then responding. Instead she engaged in a shouting match and then had her security take her away. Bad bad optics at the very least, especially with this all taking place in what looks like the posh surroundings of a wealthy donors home.

Lucinda

(31,170 posts)
57. Ms Ashley got exactly what she wanted. Her disruption of an event on video.
Thu Feb 25, 2016, 01:46 PM
Feb 2016

If she really wanted to speak to Hillary, she would have stopped when Hillary said she'd talk with her.

 

TM99

(8,352 posts)
64. Yeah, that uppity black woman
Thu Feb 25, 2016, 05:08 PM
Feb 2016

sure got what she wanted.

Did you criticize the Netroots and Seattle Sanders events the same way? Inquiring minds would love to know.

Jefferson23

(30,099 posts)
6. They all should apologize, I agree and a commitment to unravel the harm. That should be
Thu Feb 25, 2016, 11:10 AM
Feb 2016

the next step..what are they proposing to repair this mess that derailed so many lives?

What is the tracking on who this impacted and where are they now? See what I'm
saying?

One thing FrenchieCat I hate about these large bills is they are designed that way
to make it difficult for many to not sign..I am not giving anyone a pass on this who
voted yes, just acknowledging the purpose of the size of the bill.

Very good OP, thank you.

FrenchieCat

(68,867 posts)
7. You are welcome Jefferson23!
Thu Feb 25, 2016, 11:13 AM
Feb 2016

I just wanted us to remember those times....
because sometimes we forget.
Perhaps we do that because it is much more comfortable
and convenient not to remember!

Jefferson23

(30,099 posts)
9. Absolutely, they made the choice to be public servants, accountability is essential when
Thu Feb 25, 2016, 11:15 AM
Feb 2016

egregious wrongs are done.

 

morningfog

(18,115 posts)
8. Hillary called KIDS super predators. And that the must be brought to heel. Black kids.
Thu Feb 25, 2016, 11:13 AM
Feb 2016

We know which kids she was referring to. Black kids in inner city gangs. Kids raised in poverty with little to no resources or support. Kids who needed help, not to be "brought to heel."

 

morningfog

(18,115 posts)
15. NO, you are dead wrong. He did not refer to kids as deeply sick sociopaths.
Thu Feb 25, 2016, 11:23 AM
Feb 2016

He said there are some sociopaths. And he also discussed that poverty leads to the type of violence we have seen. He advocated support and warned that incarceration and decriminalization only worsens the problem.

Hillary said that the KIDS in gangs were super predators who need to be brought to heel.

JustAnotherGen

(31,823 posts)
31. After they murdered
Thu Feb 25, 2016, 11:45 AM
Feb 2016

In the 80's and 90's -

It was too late for help.

At that point they needed to be removed from the black community.

They were a danger to themselves and most important - others.

FrenchieCat

(68,867 posts)
14. Ok....
Thu Feb 25, 2016, 11:23 AM
Feb 2016

But selective outrage doesn't do it for me.

You can point your finger at one person only if you feel the need,

but as mentioned, I have read those threads from when BLM interrupted the Sanders rally,
and at that time the outrage was manifested quite differently.


So it is important that we don't get too huffed up, just cause
as that kind of thing never pays off in the long run....never.

 

morningfog

(18,115 posts)
16. This one person happens to be running for president and touts her support for and from the AA
Thu Feb 25, 2016, 11:25 AM
Feb 2016

community.

I was never outraged by the BLM interruption of Sanders. I think BLM is effective and necessary.

FrenchieCat

(68,867 posts)
24. Well good for you, because many were outraged
Thu Feb 25, 2016, 11:32 AM
Feb 2016

at BLM calling them all kinds of names,
accusations galore!

 

morningfog

(18,115 posts)
26. I can't control anyone but myself.
Thu Feb 25, 2016, 11:34 AM
Feb 2016

I just glad Hillary was FINALLY approached about here racist comment. It took 20 years, but now she has the opportunity to apologize for denigrating black children in that way.

JustAnotherGen

(31,823 posts)
32. Black gang bangers
Thu Feb 25, 2016, 11:47 AM
Feb 2016

She was not talking about my cousin who was murdered in 1991. She was talking about the monster that shot him in the face to get into a gang.

She was not talking about Wendell. She was talking about his murderer who WAS a super predator. And that's that.

JustAnotherGen

(31,823 posts)
62. He was 17
Thu Feb 25, 2016, 02:18 PM
Feb 2016

He got killed for turning on the gang in 1995. Happened about a month after the Oklahoma City bombing.

He killed a young brother on his way to helping black Americans -

He needed to be removed from society - you betcha!

And he was.

There was was a major drug bust in 1995 in downtown Rochester (about a week after the Oklahoma City bombing) and the now 21 year old turned on his peers. Then about a month and a half later the peers brought him to heel for being a snitch.

And I know all of this because I ended up dating an A.D.A. in Rochester in 2004 who was young ATTY in the D.A.'s office working on those drug cases when it happened. And when I told him the story - he told me the kids name, etc. etc.

Still - it goes 'unsolved'.

See - my cousin was only a young black man and the really really dangerous ones are the ones like Obama and Booker - you know. . . guys who can inflict pain by spreading equality and leading the way.


 

bettyellen

(47,209 posts)
63. I remember so many stories of kids killed because they would not join gangs. Friends got sent
Thu Feb 25, 2016, 02:54 PM
Feb 2016

down south to small towns to get them out the fray. People said the NYPD had abandoned the projects because they felt the policy was "fuck it, let the POC kill each other".
Over a twenty year period, huge sections go NYC became incredibly violent, and innocent residents were fighting to get police to come in and clean up the streets they had long ago abandoned.
Reading about it here is bizarre, no one seems to know what it was actually like in big cities.

 

bettyellen

(47,209 posts)
60. My brother was a cop in one of the roughest precincts in NYC then. Children with guns became common
Thu Feb 25, 2016, 01:59 PM
Feb 2016

enough that they had to throw their assumptions about kids out the window. It was heart breaking and dangerous. The late 80s had an incredible uptick in street violence as there were rival cartels fighting it out for the crack trade. And the people actually on crack? Losing their minds all over the streets, the police were literally afraid of them because their unpredictable behavior. People would chase their cars begging to be arrested and then attack them.
It was a very different time. He said he missed the heroin years big time.

LovingA2andMI

(7,006 posts)
50. We Needed To Make Sure....
Thu Feb 25, 2016, 01:21 PM
Feb 2016

Both Sides Would Be Called to the Carpet. Bernie And Hillary. Not just One -- Both if the Message BLM was trying to assert was real.

Now They Have.

Remember This is the SECOND Time Hillary Has Been Dismissive Of BLM Protesters.

Yet, somehow the Hillary Supporters Seem To Forget About That Fact.

The First Time Her "Dismissive Nature" Got A Pass As She "Meet With Some BLM Activists" Afterwards and Still Had Snark -- But Was "Credited" for Meeting With Them.

Now MONTHS LATER -- She Brings the Snark Again and Had "Secret Service" Throw Ashley Williams Out of the $500 Per Plate Fundraiser.

Are you dismissing the fact Ms. Williams PAID to be there and ANSWER her question and expected an ANSWER for her DONATION?

Also, please fact check us. We for sure called out Marissa Alexander and after the Seattle Incident. Yes, we did. BUT...what was different....

1. Bernie Let Them Speak.
2. Bernie Stepped Back From The Mic.
3. Bernie Met With Them Directly After to Address Their Concerns
4. Bernie Has REPEATEDLY Met With BLM Since
5. When Bernie Came to Michigan (Eastern Michigan University to be exact -- with 10K in Attendance on a COLD 28 degree February day with a 3 mile long line that waited upwards of 4 hours to get in) Bernie mentioned the Flint Water Crisis and Said He Met with the Flint Families Impacted (7 of them) BUT Guess What Bernie Did NOT Do....
6. He NEVER POINTED OUT WHO HE MET WITH. Nor did he Parade Them On the Stage. How Do We Know? First -- We Were There. Second - We Know WHO THEY ARE. Third - We Were In The Press Box And Saw The Families Walk Out (Again we know who they are) watch Bernie Speech and NEVER had to be put on Show or Blast -- To "Get Bernie Votes"....
7. Unlike what happened at the Town Hall in South Carolina just days ago WHEN Hillary Clinton had the Mother's of Murdered African-American Men STAND UP -- in fact she told them too -- during the Town Hall for votes. WHY? Was this necessary? NO!!

So, Ashley Williams questions should have been answered and she should have had an opportunity to speak. She was not rude, she WAITED for Hillary to respond -- she did not interrupt - and she PAID to be there.

Marissa Alexander did interrupt the Bernie Event and we called her out for that -- but SHE DID GET HER QUESTION ANSWERED and Bernie has continued to answer BLM questions without any Snark, since.

That is the difference.

Independent Underground News & Talk

bullwinkle428

(20,629 posts)
11. Regardless of which candidate one chooses to support, it's clear from this
Thu Feb 25, 2016, 11:17 AM
Feb 2016

example how important it is to continue to maintain pressure on them to keep such a vital issue as this in the spotlight.

notadmblnd

(23,720 posts)
13. Of course she is no super predator
Thu Feb 25, 2016, 11:22 AM
Feb 2016

As most young people of color are not super predators. That little fact still escapes the establishment today.

That is why HRC comments were so disgusting. Even more so today when you consider the events of the past couple of years where a more and more militarized police force is treating all young people of color(and some old) as super predators. The standard has become shoot first ask questions later when it comes to African American people of all ages. You don't think this attitude is a direct result of the 1994 crime bill?

It's just wrong to pretend that HRC's views have changed especially since she's he's never walked them back. So you go ahead and support someone who is directly responsible for how young people of color are treated today by the establishment. Hopefully none of these injustices ever touch your life because if she is elected, it is not going to get better for POC. If anything, It's going to get worse.

HRC cares about nothing but herself and money and power and if one is not a useful tool for her- she'll have have them shown to the door, just as that young lady was.

FrenchieCat

(68,867 posts)
19. I have always cared about people of color...
Thu Feb 25, 2016, 11:26 AM
Feb 2016

not only when something is done that
might help my candidate.

As for what HRC cares about, I don't know that you know really,
you just want to believe that whatever you believe must be it.

notadmblnd

(23,720 posts)
23. I said nothing about your feelings and what you are willing to do or say for your candidate
Thu Feb 25, 2016, 11:30 AM
Feb 2016

I don't even know why you brought that into the conversation? However, I feel that over the years, I have learned enough about Ms. Clinton to safely talk about what motivates her.

FrenchieCat

(68,867 posts)
25. Glad you have knowledge
Thu Feb 25, 2016, 11:33 AM
Feb 2016

that's a good thing for you!

Of course, you would acknowledge that I may have some too, no?

 

Wilms

(26,795 posts)
20. I am very disappointed in the Clintons.
Thu Feb 25, 2016, 11:27 AM
Feb 2016

And I don't understand the support they have in the AA community.

But that is a big point; I do not understand. I haven't walked completely around the globe and seen it from all angles.

I'm voting for Bernie. But I really do appreciate your post illuminating one among the many angles.

Thank you.

 

stupidicus

(2,570 posts)
44. indeed, it's almost like the pres/his wife pursuing/promoting it is just like a congressman
Thu Feb 25, 2016, 12:45 PM
Feb 2016

voting for what they delivered.

“However, there were too many important provisions within the bill for Sen. Sanders to cast a vote against the entire package. Importantly, the bill contained an assault weapons ban that Sen. Sanders supported — which even turned him into a target for the NRA during his reelection — as well as the crucial Violence Against Women Act.”

Khalil Muhammad, a leading scholar on the political, social and economic links between race and crime, said the 1994 crime bill was “a signature accomplishment for Bill Clinton and not the same as a congressman voting for a bill.” https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/post-politics/wp/2016/02/12/1994-crime-bill-haunts-clinton-and-sanders-as-criminal-justice-reform-rises-to-top-in-democratic-contest/


It's similar to but not to be confused with her Iraq War vote. As the wife to a liar about their wmd, she's not "just like" the rest who cast their vote.

DemocratSinceBirth

(99,710 posts)
27. Re-posted
Thu Feb 25, 2016, 11:36 AM
Feb 2016

Crack is and was an insidious drug because it is relatively cheap and breathtakingly addictive. I actually watched a young woman whom I know smoke it... They call a crack pipe the "glass d---", google it. But she didn't even bother to use a pipe. Like most addicts she would take a soda can, make a hole in the middle, put some silver foil in the hole, and place the rock in it. Then she would go out to sell herself to get the next fix. They used to call them "rock stars" because they were hooked on rock cocaine...

She said she knew guys who would spend money on rocks before they would spend money on deodorant...

Oh, she was white.

Hindsight is better than foresight and at the time folks of all colors wanted something done.

BeyondGeography

(39,374 posts)
30. Which reminds me, the Willie Horton ad was almost 30 years ago
Thu Feb 25, 2016, 11:44 AM
Feb 2016

What an era; maybe the same people demonizing Hillary right now will get around to learning what Donald Trump did to help inflame public opinion against the Central Park Five in 1989.

K&R for a great post.

FrenchieCat

(68,867 posts)
37. I just remember those times so vividly,
Thu Feb 25, 2016, 12:11 PM
Feb 2016

and realized that my kids who are now 28 & 25 were so young....

Arazi

(6,829 posts)
34. Greal OP! HRC has had 20 years to apologize for that statement and she hasn't
Thu Feb 25, 2016, 11:51 AM
Feb 2016

she had another opportunity again last night and she didn't

In fact she was completely condescending as her security hauled Ashley Williams away stating she wanted to return to issues important to her

I'm uncomfortable with anyone letting HRC off the hook for the comment and her actions last night. I'm glad Ashley Williams brought the comment back to the forefront and for her work with BLM

retrowire

(10,345 posts)
40. no she's not but I'm sure she appreciates your explanation.
Thu Feb 25, 2016, 12:31 PM
Feb 2016

your op is a sincere pat on the head for Ashley.

"there there Ashley, you misunderstood Hillary, that's alright."

She knows she's not a super predator, she said so herself. your op means well, but it can be taken as condescending. if you were white, I'd be able to call this "whitesplaining" just so you know.

AllyCat

(16,187 posts)
43. It seems we are in the same position now with heroin as we were with crack then
Thu Feb 25, 2016, 12:41 PM
Feb 2016

It's everywhere. Only now, we don't need a crime bill, we have militarized police that go after black people more than others. And the majority of heroin users I see in my work are white. And still alive. Black Lives Matter!

Bubzer

(4,211 posts)
45. It's true that each congressional member who supported that bill should denounce it... and repeal it
Thu Feb 25, 2016, 12:51 PM
Feb 2016

To my knowledge, however, Hillary is the only presidential candidate to use the term Super Predator. That term, specifically, is powerfully destructive. Especially for one seeking the oval office. I think it would benefit her much to advocate for the bill's real... specifically... not in broad-indirect terms. An apology to PoC would be a good step as well.

Fumesucker

(45,851 posts)
48. Back then our environment was recovering from being drenched in lead from car exhausts
Thu Feb 25, 2016, 01:12 PM
Feb 2016

Lead is a psychoactive substance, it has an effect on how we think and particularly it damages the nervous system in such a way that the poisoned person has less self control and is more likely to lash out violently.

Of course inner city youth were more damaged by lead poisoning, many inner city urban cores were among the most heavily lead polluted areas in the country, lines of cars sitting idling in traffic, emitting lead to be breathed in and to completely pollute the environment.

Bernie had something to say on the passing of the 1994 crime bill.

http://www.dailykos.com/story/2015/8/8/1410122/-Senator-Sanders-remarks-on-1994-Crime-Bill

Mr. Speaker, let me begin with a profound remark: Two plus two equals four.

In other words, there is a logical and rational process called cause and effect. In terms of Newtonian physics, that means that every action causes an equal and opposite reaction. In other words, Mr. Speaker, there are reasons why things happen, as controversial as that statement may be.

A farmer neglects to tend and care for his fields—it is likely that the crop will fail.

A company neglects to invest in research and development—it is likely that the company will not be profitable.

In a similar way, Mr. Speaker, a society which neglects, which oppresses and which disdains a very significant part of its population—which leaves them hungry, impoverished, unemployed, uneducated, and utterly without hope, will, through cause and effect, create a population which is bitter, which is angry, which is violent, and a society which is crime-ridden. This is the case in America, and it is the case in countries throughout the world.

Mr. Speaker, how do we talk about the very serious crime problem in America without mentioning that we have the highest rate of childhood poverty in the industrialized world, by far, with 22 percent of our children in poverty and 5 million who are hungry today? Do the Members think maybe that might have some relationship to crime? How do we talk about crime when this Congress is prepared, this year, to spend 11 times more for the military than for education; when 21 percent of our kids drop out of high school; when a recent study told us that twice as many young workers now earn poverty wages as 10 years ago; when the gap between the rich and the poor is wider, and when the rate of poverty continues to grow? Do the members think that might have some relationship to crime?

Mr. Speaker, it is my firm belief that clearly, there are some people in our society who are horribly violent, who are deeply sick and sociopathic, and clearly these people must be put behind bars in order to protect society from them. But it is also my view that through the neglect of our Government and through a grossly irrational set of priorities, we are dooming tens of millions of young people to a future of bitterness, misery, hopelessness, drugs, crime, and violence. And Mr. Speaker, all the jails in the world, and we already imprison more people per capita than any other country, and all of the executions in the world, will not make that situation right. We can either educate or electrocute. We can create meaningful jobs, rebuilding our society, or we can build more jails. Mr. Speaker, let us create a society of hope and compassion, not one of hate and vengeance.

bigbrother05

(5,995 posts)
51. Bravo, FC! Well told and mirrors my own recollections
Thu Feb 25, 2016, 01:23 PM
Feb 2016

Wasn't anywhere near the kind of situation you saw, but my kids were in middle and high school in NE Texas. Saw the rise of the RW takeover of local and state school boards and the introduction of police and scanners in the schools.

No, Ms. Williams is not a superpredator. There were and are very few of those and are just as likely to come from any neighborhood, class, or race.

Folks in bad situations often make bad choices and those affected usually have bad reactions. It take compassion and internal resolve to fight the group tendency to circle the wagons and seek scapegoats. Our side should always be vigilant in protection of individual rights and the vulnerable among us.

We may be on different sides of the same boat, but I think we are trying to steer it in the right direction for all our futures.

lunamagica

(9,967 posts)
53. Thank you for this thoughtful clarification, FrenchieCat
Thu Feb 25, 2016, 01:32 PM
Feb 2016

And as far as I know, Sanders has never, ever apologized for anything

Rebkeh

(2,450 posts)
54. I don't buy it
Thu Feb 25, 2016, 01:32 PM
Feb 2016

Nope.

She would flip flop on black lives just as she always has.

She showed us who she is, I believe her. I believed her the first time.

Integrity first. Authenticity first. I value people that keep it real.



 

TM99

(8,352 posts)
61. That you even accept the 'reality' of a super predator myth
Thu Feb 25, 2016, 02:08 PM
Feb 2016

Last edited Thu Feb 25, 2016, 03:48 PM - Edit history (4)

is very much the problem. It is the only way you can justify your condescension to this young woman and your support for Hillary Clinton.

During the 1990's, I was a young graduate student in psychology. My first internships and first jobs were working with gang members in a drug and alcohol treatment facility in Tucson. I worked predominantly with minorities - young black and hispanic men and women - lost in a world of inner city poverty, addicted to drugs like cocaine that were being glorified by whites in movies about the wealthy and the elite, and lashing out in violence and in rage due to the trauma, fear, and hurt that they individually and collectively felt.

A small group of criminologists pushed a bogus pseudo-psychological theory on our entire culture that these young 'colored' kids were 'super predators' and worse yet, that any of these young 'colored' kids could become super predators unless we did something drastic to stop them. The Clintons and the Gores not only bought this myth, but they were in positions of leadership to turn this myth into public policy. A fundamentally racist belief was given credence by their actions and support.

Did the Clintons try to help me and my colleague battle this myth and offer real treatment and solutions for these kids? No! And worse, they pushed crime bills that treated these kids as adults. So the young black man in my office wanting to change was moved to an adult prison because he had a gram of cocaine with intent to sell. The young Hispanic woman wanting to change was moved to an adult prison because she had an assault charge for beating up a store clerk during a robbery for drug money.

For 20 years this myth has still lingered. Zimmerman saw Martin not as a kid with some Skittles but rather a potentially dangerous 'super predator'. Cops killing young blacks are also seeing 'super predators' not kids with toy guns. So no it is not outrageous for this young woman to wonder if Clinton still sees & believes that myth given we have video evidence of her belief in that myth. She also wonders if the world around her does see her as a 'super predator' or at least a potential one as well.

And unlike the Clintons who pushed it 100%, Sanders was given a damned if you do, and damned if you don't choice with that omnibus crime bill. He spoke out against it. But does he vote against it which would mean also voting against the Violence Against Women Act or does he vote for it and secure passage of the Violence Against Women Act. And he would not have to make that choice if Bill Clinton was not a triangulator pushing 'hard on drugs and crime' from the right and 'protecting women' from the left. He is to blame for that. She is to blame for pushing it just as hard. They do not get a pass.

Blaming the media and others to try and deflect from the yet again poor leadership of your candidate is cognitive dissonance on a grand and sad scale. Those others that may be 'guilty' as you say are not running for president. They are not asking us to trust them. They are not offering up luke-warm justice reform plans that would not have been necessary if they were not the ones themselves pushing this myth and pushing legislation that created the mass incarceration and excessive violence against minorities that is happening yet again today.

Latest Discussions»Retired Forums»2016 Postmortem»NO Ashley Williams, you a...