Why a Vote for Bernie Sanders Is a Vote for Donald Trump

[SecularMotion]

Dear Bernie Voter,

Unlike many Clinton supporters, I am not writing to you because I think you’re naïve, or misguided, or sexist, or dumb, or any of the other patronizing and condescending crap that Hillary voters often say. In fact, I probably agree with you on most issues. I am writing to you because I am sincerely worried that you will hand this election to the Republicans, and I want to do my best to convince you not to do so.

The point of primary elections is not to select a president; it’s to select a candidate. For that reason, “electability” is not just one among many issues: it is the central issue. Yet despite having absorbed several dozen pro-Bernie articles and videos, I have yet to hear a plausible path to victory for Bernie Sanders.

Let’s tease apart two very different arguments.

First, let’s concede that Bernie is more progressive on just about every substantive issue: the economy, healthcare, foreign policy, the Iraq War, campaign finance, environmentalism, corporatization – even LGBT equality, if you want to hold Hillary’s past against her. I have no idea why the Clinton campaign is pretending she is more progressive than a democratic socialist, but let’s agree that she isn’t. Let’s even concede that she is beholden to Wall Street, a Washington politician (with all the ethical problems that entails), and, basically, part of a broken system.

http://www.thedailybeast.com/articles/2016/02/16/why-a-vote-for-bernie-sanders-is-a-vote-for-donald-trump.html

[beam me up scottie]

1. Why do Bernie supporters hate America?

See the people in this train? That's us if you vote for Bernie:




Don't let that be us, vote Hillary 2016!

[RBInMaine]

7. Bernie supporters don't hate America. Their candidate just can't win the general election.

[Warren DeMontague]

10. Based upon complete speculation and nothing more.

.....from the people who want us to believe that the candidate with crushingly consistent negative numbers, a freight car full of baggage, and the shadow of an FBI investigation hanging over her head, is somehow better positioned.

[monicaangela]

15. This is an old argument..

I believe I heard the same thing about another candidate in 2007. That candidate has completed his 7th year in the White House.

[MrMickeysMom]

16. Where's the music in minor keys with this???

[Katashi_itto]

2. Guess you should have run a better candidate than Hillary.

[PowerToThePeople]

3. Hmm. National polling says the opposite.

[RBInMaine]

8. Those polls don't mean SHIT right now. The R attacks haven't even begun to happen. Bernie is DOOMED.

This country will not elect a socialist, period.

[virtualobserver]

9. This country will not elect someone they mistrust, period.

The R attacks on Hillary haven't even begun to happen.

If she can't beat Bernie, she would have been DOOMED in the GE.

If Bernie can beat Hillary, he can beat any of the buffoon Republicans.

[Warren Stupidity]

13. Ah - so you just know how things are, EVIDENCE be damned!

Your candidate was barking like a dog yesterday. Perhaps that is what you meant by Hillary Derangement Syndrome?

[ejbr]

4. Give me tonight's

winning lottery numbers and I will take this under consideration. Can't trust just anyone with predicting the future you know.

[stonecutter357]

5. K&R!

[7wo7rees]

6. So now it is the Nader/Perot argument......? ?

Beautiful!

[nc4bo]

11. That old mess again. HRC supporter campaign slogan: Keep flingin'.nt

[A Little Weird]

12. He is the better candidate

Even the author admits it - "First, let’s concede that Bernie is more progressive on just about every substantive issue..."

His ideas are better, he talks to people rather than down to people, and he has a history of fighting the good fight.

Those saying that Hillary is more electable than Bernie must not have met any actual, real-life republicans. Unfortunately, I know a lot of them since I live in a red state. It is much more likely to get right-leaning voters to turn to Bernie than to Hillary. There is a deep and visceral hatred of Hillary that doesn't exist for Bernie. It's not fair, but it exists. I agree that there are some who will never vote for Bernie but those folks would never vote for any democrat.

Bernie is inspiring new voters, he is firing up independents, and he has a solid chunk of older voters behind him. Hillary does not inspire the enthusiasm that is seen for Bernie. If she is the nominee, a lot of those new voters and independents just won't show up. They are looking for someone to vote for not just someone to vote against. The only block of voters who will get fired up by a Hillary run is republicans who will show up in force to vote against her. So from where I'm standing, it seems that Hillary is the one unelectable in the GE. A vote for Hillary is a vote for Trump.

[DrDan]

14. spot on - k and r

[shawn703]

17. The establishment must be pissing their collective pants right now

I'm loving this.

[VulgarPoet]

18. The floggings will continue...

I won't vote for someone I wouldn't willingly give my life for. I don't believe she understands what sending people to die for country really means, given her foreign policy record. If we go to war again under her, I don't believe it will be a war in defense of our Constitution. If we go to war again under her, I don't believe it will be for defending our allies. And I certainly don't believe that if we go to war under her again, it won't result in either the end of the world, or the forwarding of the tired tripe about American Exceptionalism.

I raised my hand and swore an oath to protect the United States, and the Constitution. I do not believe she stands for either, and as such, I can't vote for her.

If that means that somehow, a Republican gets in, well, all I have to do is survive half of their first term, and then I'm moving somewhere where the election process isn't already in the moneyed interest's hands.

[Vinca]

19. If it's Hillary vs. The Donald, she might very well lose.

This is the year of the outsider, not the year of business as usual.

[EndElectoral]

20. Completely flawed argument

Starting with the flawed supposition that Americans won't be able to ascertain the difference between Stalinist socialism (more fascism) and Bernie's socialism which focuses on European styles of health care and education approaches. It's a bit of an insult to the intelligence of the voter. I give them more credit than your premise does. Actually, I beleive Americans are currently more suspicious of dirty tricks, trust, corrupt money and Establishment politicians at this point.

But tackling the assertions in the article.

1. Foreign policy. Trump has no more foreign policy experience than Bernie and his basic approach is to bomb. Americans are war weary and would welcome a more cautious approach to foreign entanglements as Washington advocated in his Farewell address. Hillary's foreign policy experience only reveals multiple terrible decisions and a tendency to hawkishness and poor judgments.

2. Voters may complain about tax increaes, but not when measured against overall benefits. The top 10% might rebel against higher taxes, but the bottom 90% are ready to change, and the tax increases ultimately put more in their pockets in recouped benefits.

3. Lastly, people are very supportive of a Medicare for all approach. Old and young like Medicare more than the ACA. The penalties in ACA need to go away, and essentially it is a private insurance approach rather than cutting administrative costs.

Appreciate the civil tone, but just the arguments presented are quite flawed.

[LWolf]

21. Er...no.

Just no.

Jay Michaelson needs some help.

There are toys and games that help with cognitive development. Here's one he might find helpful:



From the manufacturer:

Adults and seniors love these made in America puzzles at least as much as do children, teenagers and college students. These puzzles teach patience, perseverance, fine motor skills and critical thinking skills and help maintain mental agility in older persons, while providing stimulating entertainment as either a solitaire game or a cooperative activity. Each puzzle package includes an interpretive panel of fascinating facts on the subject of the puzzle, as well as a trivia question and hidden answer, all packaged in a unique and handy resealable clear vinyl pouch which can be collected and stored easily in a standard 3-ring binder.

http://www.amazon.com/B-Dazzle-10135-Scramble-Squares-Squirrels/dp/B009G5IJIU/ref=sr_1_10?s=toys-and-games&ie=UTF8&qid=1455630682&sr=1-10&keywords=scramble+squares

[restorefreedom]

22. rotfl!!!! nt

[Orsino]

23. Know who else used to try to frighten us with a Trump presidency?

Hitler.