Proposed ammo ban update from ATF

[Duckhunter935]

Notice to those Commenting on the Armor Piercing Ammunition Exemption Framework

Thank you for your interest in ATF's proposed framework for determining whether certain projectiles are “primarily intended for sporting purposes” within the meaning of 18 U.S.C. 921(a)(17)(C). The informal comment period will close on Monday, March 16, 2015. ATF has already received more than 80,000 comments, which will be made publicly available as soon as practicable.

Although ATF endeavored to create a proposal that reflected a good faith interpretation of the law and balanced the interests of law enforcement, industry, and sportsmen, the vast majority of the comments received to date are critical of the framework, and include issues that deserve further study. Accordingly, ATF will not at this time seek to issue a final framework. After the close of the comment period, ATF will process the comments received, further evaluate the issues raised therein, and provide additional open and transparent process (for example, through additional proposals and opportunities for comment) before proceeding with any framework.

https://www.atf.gov/press/releases/2015-03-021015-advisory-notice-those-commenting-armor-piercing-ammunition-exemption-framework.html

Sounds like the pro-controller side lost another one to the more motivated firearms owners.

[Electric Monk]

1. dupe thread, fyi

http://www.democraticunderground.com/1172162936

[Duckhunter935]

2. Ok

But there is no rule aganst it. I Will modify or self delete if the host of THIS group asks me to.

[NaturalHigh]

3. Great news!

I'm okay with the dupe thread, by the way. I don't mind reading good news more than once.

[Duckhunter935]

4. Thanks, I think EM

forgets even though this is his favorite group, he is NOT the host here.

[Electric Monk]

6. Stop putting words in my mouth. I said no such thing. I merely thought you were ignorant

of the other thread's existence, despite it still being near the top of the page.

[NaturalHigh]

7. Cool story EM.

[Duckhunter935]

13. sure....

Last edited Wed Mar 11, 2015, 08:37 AM - Edit history (1)

Care to answer my simple question yet, yes or no.

Was it you that posted an insult about me on an alert the other day? If I did that, at least I would take responsibility for my actions.

Hosts aren't responsible for everything posted by other members. This arrogant gun nut needs to be reminded what website they are on, and they are not on ar15.com.

[Duckhunter935]

15. what words would that be?

you have a history of trying to control the dialog in this group and you are not the host. This also IS your favorite group.

[Nuclear Unicorn]

20. You should teach him a lesson by

posting a cartoon showing the guns of the US military pointed at him.

[petronius]

5. That sounds like a good half-step. I just hope this mealy-mouthed statement

is just a CYA way of saying they're going to drop the whole bad idea...

[NaturalHigh]

8. As I posted in GD...

http://www.democraticunderground.com/10026287888

"I wonder if the Rude Pundit will now blog about the defeat of the ammo ban and ponder who is losing whose mind."

Hey, if he's gonna be an asshole, he should at least give it up for both sides.

[friendly_iconoclast]

9. Over at the other group, they're not taking the news well at *all*, as see:

http://www.democraticunderground.com/12628413

Note how the posters with actual technical knowledge about firearms (as opposed to the One
who merely believes he does) are angrily rejected by the OP, even as they propose
various new controls on guns.

Once again, the controllers reject factually accurate information that doesn't jibe with
their preconceptions...

[NaturalHigh]

10. I noticed that.

As soon as they get their asses handed to them, they "have no desire to speak with gunners."

[friendly_iconoclast]

11. One rarely encounters such a willful and sustained embrace of ignorance...

...outside of fundamentalist religious circles.

[NaturalHigh]

12. Sort of a modern-day Flat Earth society.

[jimmy the one]

17. ACLU at odds with iconic member

icon: Once again, the controllers reject factually accurate information that doesn't jibe with their preconceptions...

Like you? mr civil liberties supporter? harping on ACLU's 2ndA position, as it doesn't 'jibe with' your 'preconceptions'?

icon, mar 9, 2015: The ACLU non-support of the Second Amendment is a blot on their record... They're good on all the other ones....
http://www.democraticunderground.com/?com=view_post&forum=1172&pid=162920 #74

1/17/2013 ACLU POSITION Given the reference to "a well regulated Militia" and "the security of a free State," the ACLU has long taken the position that the Second Amendment protects a collective right rather than an individual right.
..... For seven decades, the Supreme Court's 1939 decision in United States v. Miller was widely understood to have endorsed that {collective militia} view. This position is currently under review and is being updated by the ACLU National Board in light of Supreme Court decision in D.C. v. Heller in 2008.
In striking down Washington D.C.'s handgun ban by a 5-4 vote, the Supreme Court's decision in D.C. v. Heller held for the first time that the Second Amendment protects an individual's right to keep and bear arms, whether or not associated with a state militia. The ACLU disagrees with the Supreme Court's conclusion about the nature of the right protected by the Second Amendment.
However, particular federal or state laws on licensing, registration, prohibition, or other regulation of the manufacture, shipment, sale, purchase or possession of guns may raise civil liberties questions.

Although ACLU policy cites the Supreme Court's decision in U.S. v. Miller as support for our position on the Second Amendment, our policy was never dependent on Miller. Rather, like all ACLU policies, it reflects the ACLU's own understanding of the Constitution and civil liberties.
Heller takes a different approach than the ACLU has advocated. At the same time, it leaves many unresolved questions, including what firearms are protected by the Second Amendment, what regulations (short of an outright ban) may be upheld, and how that determination will be made.
https://www.aclu.org/racial-justice_prisoners-rights_drug-law-reform_immigrants-rights/second-amendment

[friendly_iconoclast]

22. So what? "Appeal to authority" is a logical fallacy...

[jimmy the one]

18. icon's lack of technical knowledge

icon: Note how the posters with actual technical knowledge about firearms (as opposed to the One who merely believes he does) are angrily rejected by the OP, even as they propose various new controls on guns.

I indeed have some technical knowledge about firearms, once a marksman in the navy; tho it certainly is limited to certain pistols & rifles, including the m16 & s&w 12 ga pump.

But who are you to cast these stones, icon? On a concurrent rkba board regarding BATF armor piercing ban, I didn't see you playing any reindeer games; why, you made some stupid remarks but didn't engage in any technical discussion whatsoever.

Put your money where your mouth is, icon, or pipe down on it. Your half ***** posts on statistics have been shot down at least a half dozen times by yours truly, without even breaking a sweat (links on request, please do).

Icon's stupid remarks on the armor piercing ban board:

friendly_iconoclast 14. The whine cellar is gonna have a sad about that

45. You should be. I only stea...err, borrow from the best!
http://www.democraticunderground.com/?com=view_post&forum=1172&pid=161113

Then icon makes his cheap shot above mocking my technical knowledge ability.
Is icon gonna 'have a sad' about not posting anything technical? why didn't you join in the reindeer games, icon???? no technical knowledge about the subject, eh?
This is the kind of juvenile BS you frequently post when you decide to come of that cookoo clock.

[Straw Man]

19. Certain pistols and rifles?

I indeed have some technical knowledge about firearms, once a marksman in the navy; tho it certainly is limited to certain pistols & rifles, including the m16 & s&w 12 ga pump

Sounds like one rifle and one shotgun to me. What else would you "include"?

[friendly_iconoclast]

21. The disinterested reader is invited to see his "technical knowledge" in another thread...

http://www.democraticunderground.com/1172161113

[Duckhunter935]

14. Yep, I see that

[ileus]

16. Finally some common sense from those who seek to control...