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Praek3

(149 posts)
Tue May 3, 2022, 06:09 AM May 2022

Men's Pregnancy/Abortion Responsibilities

It is passed time that men are held accountable for their responsibility in reproduction issues.

First, if you want to stop unwanted pregnancies REQUIRE men to wear condoms. Financial and criminal penalties applied to lawbreakers. Simple.
Second, no more limp penis medical care. If you are flaccid, too bad.
Third, no more bent penis medical care. Don't use your penis if it is too bent for sex. Tough sh*t.
Fourth, rapists should be castrated.
Fifth, men causing unwanted pregnancies should be chemically castrated for at least nine months.
Six, male health matters to sperm quality just as does maternal health. Stop holding women solely responsible for procreative processes.

WOMEN DESERVE PROTECTIONS from state-forced parenthood. KEEP ABORTION LEGAL, SAFE, AND AVAILABLE.

Think this isn't fair? Try carrying an unwanted pregnancy to term.

Try telling your raped eleven-year-old daughter that she needs to stay pregnant because power-hungry Christo/facist conservative MAGAt GQP morons are happy to force their thinly held whims on her.

20 replies = new reply since forum marked as read
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Men's Pregnancy/Abortion Responsibilities (Original Post) Praek3 May 2022 OP
K&R!!!!! 2naSalit May 2022 #1
Kick! love_katz May 2022 #2
Those ideas further inject the State into medical care and personal decisions bucolic_frolic May 2022 #3
+1 Martin Eden May 2022 #4
Class action lawsuits for women conscripted by the state to bear children for the state. scarletlib May 2022 #5
how is this not sharia law of a different church? pansypoo53219 May 2022 #6
Right! Delmette2.0 May 2022 #13
To the forced birthers; keithbvadu2 May 2022 #15
Yes, that too! Delmette2.0 May 2022 #16
great ideas! RicROC May 2022 #18
the idea that that the anti-choice agenda stopdiggin May 2022 #14
Kick and Recommend!! Welcome to DU @Praek3. iluvtennis May 2022 #7
Just remember... FalloutShelter May 2022 #8
Again, rownesheck May 2022 #9
This message was self-deleted by its author RevBrotherThomas May 2022 #10
Men belong to society and have legitimate interests in it's laws Model35mech May 2022 #20
Free mandatory vasectomies IronLionZion May 2022 #11
Ya Vent, It's a terrible threat to women's self-determination, and self-defense of their futures Model35mech May 2022 #12
You think SCOTUS listens to logic and public opinion bucolic_frolic May 2022 #17
Well, not exclusively, but many do listen to public opinions from the Federalists Model35mech May 2022 #19

bucolic_frolic

(44,121 posts)
3. Those ideas further inject the State into medical care and personal decisions
Tue May 3, 2022, 07:05 AM
May 2022

Not going down that road. SORRY.

Martin Eden

(12,957 posts)
4. +1
Tue May 3, 2022, 07:14 AM
May 2022

Strengthen laws for fatherhood responsibility, but stay out of personal medical decisions which hurt no one and help many couples enjoy lovemaking well past childbearing age.

scarletlib

(3,430 posts)
5. Class action lawsuits for women conscripted by the state to bear children for the state.
Tue May 3, 2022, 07:28 AM
May 2022

That’s what ablation bans are. The state forcing women to have children against their will. Since the state is essentially conscripting/drafting these women into its service, the state has a responsibility to provide for the needs of these women/babies. Therefore class action lawsuits for women against the states to force support for food, shelter, medical care, housing, financial support etc.

State wants/forces you to bear children state has responsibility for care.

pansypoo53219

(21,107 posts)
6. how is this not sharia law of a different church?
Tue May 3, 2022, 07:28 AM
May 2022

I AM NOT CATHOLIC +I REFUSE TO BE ONE!!! and if they do not enforce FATHERHOOD AS WELL, SCOTUS can fuck off.

Delmette2.0

(4,193 posts)
13. Right!
Tue May 3, 2022, 08:07 AM
May 2022

Financial support for the woman through maternity leave.
Life and health insurance for the child back dated to conception.
Financial support for the woman's education.
Financial support for daycare/after school care as long as it is needed.
If the woman is raped and the rapist cannot be found, the state must provide all of the above.

RicROC

(1,210 posts)
18. great ideas!
Tue May 3, 2022, 10:08 AM
May 2022

I would encourage that specific $ amounts are stated for the father. For example, whatever is written in law in that state for child support, 30% of wages (?), then immediately those wages are confiscated from the payroll check.

No volunteer compliance allowed for the father. No room for slackers.

And NO, claim of parental rights given to the father even if he's paying child support. The only way he can have parental rights is if the mother wants to marry him (Not if the father wants to marry the woman)

stopdiggin

(11,645 posts)
14. the idea that that the anti-choice agenda
Tue May 3, 2022, 08:08 AM
May 2022

is still somehow driven by the Catholic Church ....
(and, yes - we all know about the composition of the current court. doesn't at all change the fact that the vast majority of the assault on reproductive freedom - is coming from parts of the country that are very red, very white, and very Protestant. forget the Supremes - check out the the legislature in your state.)

rownesheck

(2,343 posts)
9. Again,
Tue May 3, 2022, 07:54 AM
May 2022

as Bill Hicks once said, "Drop off all unwanted babies on the steps of the Supreme Court and that'll fix the abortion issue real quick. YOU forced me to have it, then YOU fucking raise it!"

Response to Praek3 (Original post)

Model35mech

(1,789 posts)
20. Men belong to society and have legitimate interests in it's laws
Tue May 3, 2022, 03:46 PM
May 2022

Just like pedestrians have interests in traffic law.

Just like borrowers have interest in foreclosure laws pushed by banks.

Just like city dwellers have interests in federal lands, and rural people have interest in urban pollution.

We're all in this. It's true that men don't carry pregnancies, and absolutely the fight IS for HER CHOICE TO SELF-DETERMINATION with respect to pregnancy and abortion. But it's clear that a Constitutional RIGHT to self-determination is a right that would potentially reach beyond just abortion. It would touch transsexual, and homosexual, it would touch the disabled, and the medically and psychologically ill, and surely others.

Laws whose sole purpose is to impose punishment on natural human drives can't be seen as promoting a system of justice that promotes human rights.

Please, while in anger, realize your angry and don't go forward thinking ALL cis-men are the enemy of self-determination and abortion rights.

Look at the obvious...a 6-3 majority opinion coming out of SCOTUS to over-ride Roe will include both sexes. State laws and state constitutional amendments that are needed to enshrine Self-determination as a fundamental right will require the support of ALL genders.

Please recognize that not all women are abortion supporters, belief in choice and belief in anti-abortion really does cross gender barriers.

Preserving abortion rights needs votes and voices, not the silence, turned heads, and zipped purses of the alienated. I think when people get into the hard work that is ahead of this last fight for self-determination including abortion, the absolute need for broad support and best arguments, wherever they come from, will become more and more clear.

Model35mech

(1,789 posts)
12. Ya Vent, It's a terrible threat to women's self-determination, and self-defense of their futures
Tue May 3, 2022, 08:06 AM
May 2022

And part of what SCOTUS may be doing is pushing a trial balloon with public opinion so an immediate strong outcry is needed, especially if it re-invigorates credible durable arguments for protection of women's right to self-determination and self-defense (which I don't see any of the 6 items presented in the OP as actually being).

What is needed is argumentation that holds greater popular support for abortion and better binds abortion to personal rights, whether they are Constitutional or long strong traditional expectations of rights assumed but not included in the constitution.

That's actually the way legislation works, and so that's the path to ultimately amending state constitutions and the federal Constitution to ensure those rights become guaranteed forever. Constitutions constrain courts. Without constitution power behind them, rights are temporary until opposition controls the courts.

The arguments against abortion have mostly boiled down to protection of innocent life, and arguments have floundered in arbitrary definitions of life, and a social climate influenced way more by religion.

IMO, two popular well accepted rights (and there may be more) are self-defense and self-determination. Credible rational legal arguments can be made and must be around these (and/or other) strong traditions of these American values which can (and should) prevail over their competing arguments that are meant to punish or in practice DO punish women for breaking anachronistic religious beliefs and punitive customs.

Tossing out Roe doesn't ban abortions, it moves the issue back to States. The push for constitutional rights to abortion must be re-invigorated. Movements to enshrine that right in state Constitutions need to be forwarded to Legislatures that don't already protect abortion rights. When a clear majority of States have such guaranteed rights, a movement to amend the federal Constitution is more likely to prevail.

Model35mech

(1,789 posts)
19. Well, not exclusively, but many do listen to public opinions from the Federalists
Tue May 3, 2022, 03:34 PM
May 2022

and some of them have an appreciation for logic, though perhaps not for the veracity of the assumptions thiert logic is built upon.

It's important for the States that -can- to move forward and make rights that are assumed but not in States's constitutions truly constitutional.

From that experience much can be gained, certainly access to abortion rights will be preserved in many states. Better, perhaps newer arguments, arguments that pick on conservative beliefs as destructive to personal liberty and punitive to people who do no more than desire permanence of long accepted American beliefs in self-defense and self-determination.

All those anti-mandate, anti-vax, anti-mask arguments are built around self-determination. The political environment may well be situated in a more favorable context for choice arguments than it has been in nearly 45 years. The fight is on, and it needs to be won in as many states as possible.

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