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Sun Jan 17, 2021, 10:54 AM

I am asking you to be my sounding board

After a career in high tech, I am teaching 9th grade freshman World History (so far for all of a week).

We are doing ancient civilizations.

Is the following question too challenging for kids this age:

The stone that contains the Code of Hammurabi, the Rosetta Stone, as well as mummies and artifacts ended up in European museums. Is it right for those countries to keep these items?

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Arrow 22 replies Author Time Post
Reply I am asking you to be my sounding board (Original post)
melm00se Jan 2021 OP
llashram Jan 2021 #1
FeelingBlue Jan 2021 #2
essaynnc Jan 2021 #3
handmade34 Jan 2021 #4
tblue37 Jan 2021 #5
grumpyduck Jan 2021 #6
KarenS Jan 2021 #7
wcast Jan 2021 #8
Phoenix61 Jan 2021 #9
Simeon Salus Jan 2021 #10
Laelth Jan 2021 #11
happybird Jan 2021 #12
marble falls Jan 2021 #13
OrlandoDem2 Jan 2021 #14
RainCaster Jan 2021 #15
Sneederbunk Jan 2021 #16
3Hotdogs Jan 2021 #17
melm00se Jan 2021 #19
elleng Jan 2021 #18
Tetrachloride Jan 2021 #20
Curbside Jan 2021 #21
Stuart G Feb 2021 #22

Response to melm00se (Original post)

Sun Jan 17, 2021, 10:57 AM

1. No

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Response to melm00se (Original post)

Sun Jan 17, 2021, 11:00 AM

2. Maybe...

a more interesting question would be: ďwho owns the remnants of the first human civilizations?Ē

Truly, beyond the few most significant ones you identified, there ARE remnants in museums all over the world. To whom do these things belong??

I think itís an interesting question.

Thanks!!

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Response to melm00se (Original post)

Sun Jan 17, 2021, 11:00 AM

3. its perfect

it stretched their litle minds with questions that don't have a convenient yes or no answer. let them have an opinion, let them debate, let them think about their positions, let them be persuaded by opposing views, ....let them experience the reality of life. you'll be doing them a great service...

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Response to melm00se (Original post)

Sun Jan 17, 2021, 11:02 AM

4. good question

and appropriate but really more of an ethics/philosophical question that what a factual World History class question

good for general class discussion

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Response to melm00se (Original post)

Sun Jan 17, 2021, 11:03 AM

5. Not at all too challenging. Teens usually like to wrestle with such ethical and

moral questions.

(I taught college for well over 40 years, and I tutor kids in middle school and high school, as well as grade school. I also helped raise 37 younger kids, since I had a home daycare for 18 years, so I know kids pretty well.)

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Response to melm00se (Original post)

Sun Jan 17, 2021, 11:03 AM

6. In today's thinking, no it's not, but

if it were my class, I would explain it in terms of the "colonialistic" mentality at the time and how countries like England wanted to bring back trophies for the "uppah classes." IOW, put it in context and give them a chance to think about the difference, instead of as a black-and-white issue.

There are way too many people nowadays thinking in black and white.

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Response to melm00se (Original post)

Sun Jan 17, 2021, 11:04 AM

7. I think it's great to pose questions that cause thought and debate and do not have a

"right" answer,,,,,, the world needs more thoughtful people.
and 9th grade is the perfect time to ask challenging questions,,,, I'm not a teacher but I'm a Mom & a Granny. jmo


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Response to melm00se (Original post)

Sun Jan 17, 2021, 11:04 AM

8. The question itself is not difficult but whether they can answer depends on several items.

Have you asked this type of question before and have you taught your students the components to answer these types of questions? Do they have the necessary information and background to answer this question? Have you practiced as a group answering questions that call for an opinion and do you require them to back up their answer?

Asking opinions and teaching critical thinking is very important, so kudos to you for doing this. 😄

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Response to melm00se (Original post)

Sun Jan 17, 2021, 11:06 AM

9. I'm a huge follower of Piaget so I'd say yes.

Some may be able to understand the issues involved but I donít think most of them will. Heck, adults struggle with those issues. Iíd definitely discuss we are now questioning where those types of items should be and ultimately who they belong to.

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Response to melm00se (Original post)

Sun Jan 17, 2021, 11:07 AM

10. raises appropriate relevant questions

Is raiding tombs a moral business?

Back in my AD&D days, our entire purpose was to ransack catacombs and tombs.

Indiana Jones and Lara Croft aren't so different.

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Response to melm00se (Original post)

Sun Jan 17, 2021, 11:09 AM

11. I think that's a great question.

Yes, itís advanced ethics with a lot of geopolitical and historical baggage, but if youíre teaching history, thereís nothing wrong with the question.

Elementary ethics says you should give back things that donít belong to you, but the question is far more complicated. I would test empathy too. Why HASNíT France given back to Egypt the obelisk that Napoleon took? Assume that the French are decent, reasonable people who have valid reasons for not following the dictates of elementary ethics. Then ask the students, why not?

-Laelth

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Response to melm00se (Original post)

Sun Jan 17, 2021, 11:09 AM

12. It's a great question for class discussion

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Response to melm00se (Original post)

Sun Jan 17, 2021, 11:12 AM

13. Great question, right age to start this kind of discussion.

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Response to melm00se (Original post)

Sun Jan 17, 2021, 11:28 AM

14. I've taught WH for many years and always asked that question to 9th/10th graders.

Itís perfectly fine. Of course, they need a bit of context, etc.

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Response to melm00se (Original post)

Sun Jan 17, 2021, 11:33 AM

15. I think that's a great topic

I do love British humor. When I took the family to the British Museum, they asked a local if it cost much. He said something to the effect of "no, it's free, because we took so much of that stuff from other countries".

So while it is well known that many of these antiquities belong to other cultures, the BM is an excellent place to display them. They are open to the public, and truly well preserved.

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Response to melm00se (Original post)

Sun Jan 17, 2021, 12:16 PM

16. I would keep the teaching of ancient civilizations ancient.

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Response to melm00se (Original post)

Sun Jan 17, 2021, 12:38 PM

17. Too far adrift at that age.

Hammurabi - focus on its text. Do they agree with that? Has our outlook about law and punishment changed? Then, what do they think?

Rosetta Stone. Maybe give a copy of a text in a foreign language. Ask them to read it. Obviously, most or all won't be able to read it. How could you learn to read it or find out what it says? Connect it to the Rosetta Stone. If you can find how the stone was actually translated, present that.

Mummies -- why were they made? What were the mummy creators believing about the afterlife.

and so forth....

Does your 9th grade curriculum include Asian civilizations? Mine did and it was eye opening for me. What state are you in?

I taught 9th grade Western Civ for only 4 years. U.S. history for most of my career.


Good luck and feel free to p.m. me if you want more suggestions.

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Response to 3Hotdogs (Reply #17)

Sun Jan 17, 2021, 01:39 PM

19. In my district

World History is 9th grade.

I have teed up:

Sumeria, Egypt and Indus Valley Civilization in this section.

I will be then doing Greece, Rome, China, Persia and pre-CE Meso and South America coincidentally.

When it comes to translations, that I do know quite a bit about as one of my personal favorites is cryptology. A language is just an unbroken code.

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Response to melm00se (Original post)

Sun Jan 17, 2021, 12:44 PM

18. Not at all too challenging!

'Is it right for those countries to keep these items?'

Justice and Fairness are ALWAYS suitable education topics.

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Response to melm00se (Original post)

Sun Jan 17, 2021, 05:53 PM

20. 1. the home countries will appreciate them more.

1. Not even counting tourists, Egypt is especially proud of their ancient history. The new national museum, nicknamed GEM, Grand Egyptian Museum, may finally open this year.

2. In my opinion, some items, especially Rosetta Stone, to Egypt would be the right thing (and make headlines throughout the world). On the other hand, I reject returning Chinese artifacts from Taiwan to mainland China.

---------

3. Frankly, there are better questions. I challenge the class to invent better and better questions. If one opens the area outward 500 miles in any direction from the Pyramids, then things get serious.

If there are serious questions on Egypt, modern or ancient, I'm sure I have my friends will have interesting answers. Once in a while, I am able to answer.

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Response to melm00se (Original post)

Fri Jan 22, 2021, 01:41 PM

21. On behalf of all indigenous people in this world

 

ASK THE QUESTION.

The First Amendment gives you the right to ask and it gives your students ( and us here) the right to answer as we see fit.

I once went to school to help my friend's nine year old daughter give a social studies presentation. Somehow I managed to say that the pyramids are in Africa and the class exploded with denials. So we got out a map and look up Egypt. The next day the little girl was bullied because "that person made Egypt African."

Such is my power. Hear me and fear me.
Ask the question.

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Response to melm00se (Original post)

Mon Feb 8, 2021, 03:52 PM

22. Yes, Ask the Question..Good Luck ...9th Grade Ain't Easy..

But it is an experience...Lots and Lots of stories about my teaching 9th grade.

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