Hillary Clinton
Related: About this forumBernie supporters could blow this election
Why refusing to vote for Hillary Clinton will only make everything worseBy Gary Legum
The political left has been tearing itself up of late with a rousing game of Who Wants to Be the Most Liberal Liberal Ever To Liberal, much in the same way it seems to each and every election cycle. The current battle, between supporters of Hillary Clinton and Bernie Sanders, would be much more entertaining if the arguments for and against both campaigns werent variations on the same tired leftier-than-thou rhetoric and blind loyalty that were worn out even before Ralph Nader threw his rumpled corduroy blazer over his shoulder and slunk off into the humid Florida night.
Ill get to some of those arguments in a minute, but first Im going to pull on my old-man pants, hike the waist up to my armpits, shake my fist at some clouds, and share a couple of the strongest memories I have of the months leading up to the 2000 election, when I was a 26-year-old, semi-politically-aware liberalish Gen-X voter.
I recall a debate that year about whether true liberals should vote for Nader because, in his formulation, there was not a dimes worth of difference between the two major-party candidates, Al Gore and George W. Bush. I recall email blasts from at least one acquaintance in a toss-up state trying to interest his friends in states that were safely for Gore in a voting trade of sorts, whereby one of us would cast our vote for Nader; in return, our friend would cast his vote for Gore. The thinking was that this would preserve a Democratic victory in both states while also registering liberal protests at the centrist drift of the party.
I recall spending the night before the election drinking in a P.F. Changs in Los Angeles with a group of friends, one of whom had brought along a reporter from the L.A. Daily News who planned on casting her vote the next day for Nader. There had been some vague concern over polls showing the race for Californias 54 electoral votes might be close, but she assured us all that this was not the case. California was safely in Gores column, so liberals might as well cast that protest vote.
http://www.salon.com/2015/12/02/bernie_supports_could_blow_this_election_why_refusing_to_vote_for_hillary_clinton_will_only_make_things_worse/
Yes, this is a couple of weeks old. But it's still true!
Betty Karlson
(7,231 posts)But please, be like Rahm and blame the left.
"Vote for Clinton or else..."
really a winning slogan you've got there. Lots of luck with the last 20th century campaign.
Response to Betty Karlson (Reply #1)
deutsey This message was self-deleted by its author.
stonecutter357
(12,697 posts)Betty Karlson
(7,231 posts)She needs to disown DWS, and soon.
stonecutter357
(12,697 posts)Cha
(297,692 posts)Thinkingabout
(30,058 posts)This is a group, not a forum. Groups often serve as safe havens for members who share similar interests and viewpoints. Individuals who post messages contrary to a particular group's stated purpose can be excluded from posting in that group. For detailed information about this group and its purpose.
Response to Betty Karlson (Reply #1)
ronnykmarshall This message was self-deleted by its author.
ronnykmarshall
(35,356 posts)and I know just where to stick it.
comradebillyboy
(10,175 posts)BlueCaliDem
(15,438 posts)Oh, when they're caught they'll give some stupid excuse, but then they keep posting, so that negates that excuse right off bat.
I swear! Sometimes they act like Tea Partiers.
byronius
(7,401 posts)Fucking sneering young Green at Halloween party: 'Gore is just as bad if not worse than Bush. Let the Republicans have the country and then things will get so bad everyone will wake up and forge a new socialist paradise!'
Hey, it all worked out except for a lot of dead people and animals and trees and things, and, you know, all the things that got so much worse for every life form on the fucking planet.
Was it Camus that judged ideologies by how much death they were okay with?
Well, goddamn that fucking bullshit. This is serious fucking business, shoving human beings over the cliff for 'purity'. I bet that Green has some different opinions these days. I guarantee it. In fact, I read an article about a group of recalcitrant Nader voters that fucking suffered through every day of that fucking hell with ten thousand pounds of 'I was stupid' on their backs.
Sorry, but I had to raise children and run a small business through that fucking awful fucking Mordor hell -- we still have to deal with it every fucking day, my whole generation is fucking dying early of it, and PEOPLE STILL FUCKING PUSH THAT SHIT.
FUCK THAT SHIT.
I don't have a problem with Bernie. I have a problem with purity voters welcoming fucking Donald Trump into their soon to be extinct fucking lives.
BlueMTexpat
(15,373 posts)fleabiscuit
(4,542 posts)ronnykmarshall
(35,356 posts)while waiting in line we were infested by Nader and Bush supporters. I got in the Nader supporter's face and said "How much is Bush paying you?". He shut the up walked away. To this day, I will NEVER forgive Nader or his asshole supporters.
Hekate
(90,827 posts)Because I share those feelings -- in spades. I was there, too.
PFunk1
(185 posts)Yeah it's old. But doing that will only harden bad feelings and make matters worse. Hey how about not trying to force a (to many) and unlikable and divisive candidate down our throats the next time.
stonecutter357
(12,697 posts)this is the Hillary Clinton (Group) .
Thinkingabout
(30,058 posts)This is a group, not a forum. Groups often serve as safe havens for members who share similar interests and viewpoints. Individuals who post messages contrary to a particular group's stated purpose can be excluded from posting in that group. For detailed information about this group and its purpose.
pangaia
(24,324 posts)maybe include quotes when you quote something.. Oh BTW,, there is more to that quote that you missed that might be helpful..
My first comment in this group, as a Bernie supporter, was before I even realized it was a group, way back. I was then told of the rules.
stonecutter357
(12,697 posts)forsaken mortal
(112 posts)Cha
(297,692 posts)ronnykmarshall
(35,356 posts)and shut the fuck up.
the dork knight
(14 posts)If berniebots want to preach, they (it seems to me) have the entire website to sing his praises. (Have I committed blasphemy by not capitalizing the "h" in "him"?)
lobodons
(1,290 posts)Dems need to grow up and put their big boy pants on. Nothing wrong with a strong primary battle, but damn, real Dems need to support whoever comes out of the process. You know the GOP will do that and they are a zillion times more whackadoodle than the Dems!!
PFunk1
(185 posts)That way is madness and could result in putting someone in possibly worse. So ditch the political ticking time bomb meme. It's now lost much of it's impact and is starting to be annoying.
lobodons
(1,290 posts)for giving us 9-11, 2 wars, trillions of $$ wasted, thousands of American Innocent lives, Alito , Roberts and the Tea Party.
Jesus, this is not the time for the Dems to bitch between themselves. We need to go to war against the enemy: The GOP and Tea Party. Yes THEY are the enemy, not either Bernie or Hillary supporters.
FlatBaroque
(3,160 posts)I also consider pimps for the 1% to be bigger enemies than the GOP.
Cha
(297,692 posts)stonecutter357
(12,697 posts)Thinkingabout
(30,058 posts)This is a group, not a forum. Groups often serve as safe havens for members who share similar interests and viewpoints. Individuals who post messages contrary to a particular group's stated purpose can be excluded from posting in that group. For detailed information about this group and its purpose.
Cha
(297,692 posts)fleabiscuit
(4,542 posts)MohRokTah
(15,429 posts)It demonstrates a lack of knowledge about how politics works and smacks of taking your ball and going home from the kindergarten playground.
Hekate
(90,827 posts)...by BushCheney, then I have nothing to say to you.
By the way, this is the Hillary Clinton Group. Bernie's Group is thataway <----
Coolest Ranger
(2,034 posts)because I won't bow to Bernie supporters. I'm so fed up with the division. I'm so fed up with being told Hillary supporters are the problem. I'm burned out and scared to death
Ellen Forradalom
(16,160 posts)amongst my friends because they are all Bernie supporters. And I've heard some pretty bad internalized misogyny from some: "I want a woman president but not THAT WOMAN."
Thinkingabout
(30,058 posts)Republicans in the midterms got us a Republican Congress, not good for Democratic ideas. There is not one Republican running I would like to see as president. The ideas they are saying are terrible. We need to elect Democrats everywhere. They want to kill Social Security and many more programs used and appreciated by Democrats.
wildeyed
(11,243 posts)People have short memories.
And the thing about democracy, if your candidate is more liberal (or conservative) that 98% of the voters, you might have trouble convincing them to vote for your guy (or gal). The deck is not stacked against you, it's how DEMOCRACY works. It does not follow that because your candidate lost due to being far out of the mainstream on views and policy, that ALL the other candidates are the same.
People are salty right now. And I think Bernie Sanders is a better person than Nader, too. He has strong views and is willing to fight for them, but I don't think his ego is so titanic that he is going to take his ball and go home because if he doesn't win it all. Hillary was not at her finest toward the end of her last primary, either. But she did put her big girl pants on eventually, got back in the game for the right side.
yallerdawg
(16,104 posts)Bryce Butler
(338 posts)fleabiscuit
(4,542 posts)ronnykmarshall
(35,356 posts)MohRokTah
(15,429 posts)Cha
(297,692 posts)board to push sanders and the giant graphic.
I don't think the BS supporters who aren't going to vote for Hillary when she wins are going to "blow this election". They aren't enough of them who don't care about Our Planet.
Coolest Ranger
(2,034 posts)we don't go into your group and post Hillary stuff don't come in ours posting this. Delete this please
MohRokTah
(15,429 posts)Sadly, the extreme right has a good understanding and they will still hold their noses and vote for the Republican.
The Extreme Left is all about unicorns and rainbows.
This is why the Democratic Party has no choice but to consider the Extreme LEft an unreliable voting block and must constantly move to the right.
2016 will be no different. Should the Democratic nominee lose the presidential race, there will be no other choice but to jettison the views of the extreme Left and move to the right. Reliable votes are the only way to victory and so long as the Extreme Left proves itself to be childish with no clear understanding of how politics functions, their views will get no traction within our political system.
Godhumor
(6,437 posts)Thankfully, the nomination will be wrapped up so early this cycle that they will have time to get all the poutrage out before working to keep the Republicans out of the White House.
Coolest Ranger
(2,034 posts)Thirty percent of the vote could make the difference in a lot of states especially in republican controlled states. they need to chill out and get with the program
fleabiscuit
(4,542 posts)It's an insignificant percentage of an insignificant percentage, as someone might put it.
William769
(55,148 posts)Coolest Ranger
(2,034 posts)If Bernie doesn't get the nomination a few are urging his supporters to write his name in. This worries me
brooklynite
(94,738 posts)There's a lot of chest-thumping going on, but remember that DU isn't reflective of the real world Democratic voter, and neither are most of the "activists" with a blog page to post on. Clinton will pull more Democrats than Barack Obama did in his first election, as well as a decent share of moderate independents and suburban Republicans.