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yallerdawg

(16,104 posts)
Sun Jul 5, 2015, 01:06 PM Jul 2015

*HILLARY GROUP* Here's the one number that proves Bernie Sanders isn't a threat to Hillary Clinton

Some more calm reassurance for our Hillary Group.

http://www.msn.com/en-us/news/politics/heres-the-one-number-that-proves-bernie-sanders-isnt-a-threat-to-hillary-clinton/ar-AAcAhUp

But one question in a new CNN poll out Wednesday takes the air out of Sanders' surge, and shows why his momentum likely won't translate to electoral success.

According to CNN, only 2% of Democratic voters think Sanders has the best chance of winning the general election. That number has proven to be a red flag for any candidate.

Studies have long shown that most voters desire to cast their vote for a winning candidate, and they'll often vote for their second choice if they perceive the candidate to have a better chance of winning. As University of Maryland professor Eric Pacuit points out, many voters in 2000 who supported Green Party candidate Ralph Nader ended up voting for Democratic nominee Al Gore.

There are a couple of reasons for this. According to Duke researchers Daniel Kselman and Emerson Noiu, some voters cast their votes strategically, as some Nader supporters did for Gore. Other simply desire to jump on the bandwagon of the winning team.

Voting behavior aside, Sanders's recent gains in New Hampshire shouldn't be projected elsewhere.


CNN Poll


62 replies = new reply since forum marked as read
Highlight: NoneDon't highlight anything 5 newestHighlight 5 most recent replies
*HILLARY GROUP* Here's the one number that proves Bernie Sanders isn't a threat to Hillary Clinton (Original Post) yallerdawg Jul 2015 OP
K&R! hrmjustin Jul 2015 #1
Have you ever seen that movie... yallerdawg Jul 2015 #3
No but it sounds apt. hrmjustin Jul 2015 #4
Calling Hillary supporters piss fucking ignorant to their face!! pocoloco Jul 2015 #17
This message was self-deleted by its author hrmjustin Jul 2015 #18
The fact this comment survived a jury shows how biased the jury system here is now. hrmjustin Jul 2015 #26
I guess studies don't show support of... yallerdawg Jul 2015 #29
This was the results. hrmjustin Jul 2015 #30
Stunning. yallerdawg Jul 2015 #31
This is what DU has become. hrmjustin Jul 2015 #32
I totally agree FloridaBlues Jul 2015 #46
There are some disruptors but i think there is a large green party contingent here. hrmjustin Jul 2015 #47
Disgusting..... CherokeeDem Jul 2015 #35
It was a clear bias and we were never going to get a fair shake from that juror. hrmjustin Jul 2015 #36
Also, Jamaal510 Jul 2015 #48
I wish people would pay more attention on juries and when they come to posy here. hrmjustin Jul 2015 #49
That comment survived a jury??? CherokeeDem Jul 2015 #33
The results. hrmjustin Jul 2015 #34
I'm not ignorant. Not even a little bit. ismnotwasm Jul 2015 #37
Aren't you a big brave poster, pocoloco.. broad-brushing Hillary Supporters with your Cha Jul 2015 #42
Reality intrudes on the unicorn fantasy. okasha Jul 2015 #2
And 75% of that 2% are on DU Sheepshank Jul 2015 #5
I hope Hillary keeps her eye on the prize! yallerdawg Jul 2015 #6
Hey, I am riding that train, some very happy supporters on the train, lots of laughter and joy. Thinkingabout Jul 2015 #7
I've got a feeling it's going to be One Big Party! yallerdawg Jul 2015 #11
Yes, I am preparing for the victory party and inauguration party!!!! Thinkingabout Jul 2015 #12
K & R Iliyah Jul 2015 #8
We need Bernie in the Senate, not as a human trampoline for a GOP presidency. nt SunSeeker Jul 2015 #9
I like those numbers. sheshe2 Jul 2015 #10
I'm glad and on board but I appreciate Bernie and his supporters. nolabear Jul 2015 #13
That includes us. murielm99 Jul 2015 #14
Oh I agree. And I'm glad. I hate the insults lobbed back and forth though. nolabear Jul 2015 #43
98% of Democrats don't think Senator Sanders (I-VT) can win the presidential election. yallerdawg Jul 2015 #16
The way forward. How to achieve goals. Whether Trump's hair can live on its own. nolabear Jul 2015 #44
This is shaping up to be another 1968. jalan48 Jul 2015 #15
The establishment candidate? yallerdawg Jul 2015 #19
Exactly! jalan48 Jul 2015 #22
Your point? hrmjustin Jul 2015 #20
I don't think progressives are going to be lining up in support of Hillary. jalan48 Jul 2015 #21
Thank you for violating our safe haven. hrmjustin Jul 2015 #23
It truly is remarkable. yallerdawg Jul 2015 #24
I banned 5 from this room today and another poster was banned by another host. hrmjustin Jul 2015 #25
Stay strong, Justin!!! yallerdawg Jul 2015 #27
I will and you too. hrmjustin Jul 2015 #28
It's quite amazing that they can come into a "safe haven" and say whatever the hell they like, Tarheel_Dem Jul 2015 #39
You're Wrong.. "In House, liberals side with Clinton over Sanders" Cha Jul 2015 #41
Twitter is on to something! yallerdawg Jul 2015 #50
Politico: "Bernie who? Why the Clinton campaign isn’t sweating the Sanders surge." Tarheel_Dem Jul 2015 #38
"No one's hair is on fire...Not even the nose hairs." yallerdawg Jul 2015 #51
I can identify with your last paragraph - the zealots "out there" (DU home page) are descending... George II Jul 2015 #58
Which is why BS remains mired in the single digits with the most loyal Democratic constituency. Tarheel_Dem Jul 2015 #59
Sanders polling numbers are still very weak Gothmog Jul 2015 #40
The only places where his polling numbers are "strong" are in Iowa (not a truly organized primary).. George II Jul 2015 #60
There is no point arguing within either group. yallerdawg Jul 2015 #61
The groups are a good idea. What I don't think is a good idea is.... George II Jul 2015 #62
Only 2%? I thought the numbers were much higher from what I read at DU. n/t freshwest Jul 2015 #45
True and Good HassleCat Jul 2015 #52
With respect it is inappropriate for you to tell us in our safe haven to calm down. hrmjustin Jul 2015 #53
It's just a little friendly humor HassleCat Jul 2015 #54
That is fine but this a safe haven for us to let off steam. hrmjustin Jul 2015 #55
By all means HassleCat Jul 2015 #56
And you are always appreciated here for your efforts to bring us together. hrmjustin Jul 2015 #57
 

pocoloco

(3,180 posts)
17. Calling Hillary supporters piss fucking ignorant to their face!!
Sun Jul 5, 2015, 03:21 PM
Jul 2015

"voters desire to cast their vote for a winning candidate"

What a fucked up reason to vote for someone, and the reason for
the current conditions in the US!

Wow, just fucking Wow!!

Response to pocoloco (Reply #17)

yallerdawg

(16,104 posts)
29. I guess studies don't show support of...
Sun Jul 5, 2015, 04:07 PM
Jul 2015

a desire to vote for a losing candidate?

Do you like straight pretzels or really twisty ones?

It's fun to support our candidate of choice. Why do people feel they can come in our sandbox and kick sand in our face? I don't do that in their sand box!



 

hrmjustin

(71,265 posts)
30. This was the results.
Sun Jul 5, 2015, 04:12 PM
Jul 2015

On Sun Jul 5, 2015, 03:33 PM you sent an alert on the following post:

Calling Hillary supporters piss fucking ignorant to their face!!
http://www.democraticunderground.com/?com=view_post&forum=1107&pid=11171

REASON FOR ALERT

This post is disruptive, hurtful, rude, insensitive, over-the-top, or otherwise inappropriate.

YOUR COMMENTS

I am bnning this person from this room but this poster has called HRC supporters ignorant in the HRC room. Please hide this.

JURY RESULTS

A randomly-selected Jury of DU members completed their review of this alert at Sun Jul 5, 2015, 03:47 PM, and voted 2-5 to LEAVE IT ALONE.

Juror #1 voted to HIDE IT
Explanation: No explanation given
Juror #2 voted to LEAVE IT ALONE
Explanation: While the vulgarity is improper, until DU makes such words unlawful to the realm, censorship would be errant.

This battle to keep HRC as the only candidate is going to get ugly; but engaging in fascism tactics to suppress all other potentials, is extreme bad form; and - most certainly - not Progressive decorum.
Juror #3 voted to HIDE IT
Explanation: No explanation given
Juror #4 voted to LEAVE IT ALONE
Explanation: No explanation given
Juror #5 voted to LEAVE IT ALONE
Explanation: No explanation given
Juror #6 voted to LEAVE IT ALONE
Explanation: No explanation given
Juror #7 voted to LEAVE IT ALONE
Explanation: No explanation given



I made clear it was our room.

yallerdawg

(16,104 posts)
31. Stunning.
Sun Jul 5, 2015, 04:23 PM
Jul 2015

You would think this means all is tolerable at DU. All's fair...

No, just at Hillary Group...

FloridaBlues

(4,009 posts)
46. I totally agree
Sun Jul 5, 2015, 08:49 PM
Jul 2015

I have been active on DU for years and the negativity has been over the top against HRC. Most days I don't even want to read DU. It's fine to be for sanders but the first ballot is 7 months away.
Keep it in perspective regarding this 'surge'.
Too many republicans coming to site and causing problems perhaps?

CherokeeDem

(3,709 posts)
35. Disgusting.....
Sun Jul 5, 2015, 04:39 PM
Jul 2015

I find this comment from voter #2 disturbing....

While the vulgarity is improper, until DU makes such words unlawful to the realm, censorship would be errant. This battle to keep HRC as the only candidate is going to get ugly; but engaging in fascism tactics to suppress all other potentials, is extreme bad form; and - most certainly - not Progressive decorum.

No one is engaged in keeping Hillary as the only candidate.... how absurd. We live in a democracy, but one couldn't tell it from this comment. To the fact there is no point in hiding something until DU bans the words, who needs the mods to tell us what is improper and hateful?

So ridiculous......

Jamaal510

(10,893 posts)
48. Also,
Mon Jul 6, 2015, 10:23 AM
Jul 2015

the comment that was alerted on was posted in a safe haven. How hard is it for posters to look where they post, and to never trash a candidate or his/her supporters in their room? The rules are posted for anyone to see. Unless some posters don't care and just want to leave stink bombs. They need to grow up.

 

hrmjustin

(71,265 posts)
49. I wish people would pay more attention on juries and when they come to posy here.
Mon Jul 6, 2015, 10:26 AM
Jul 2015

I think the hury system is biased.

CherokeeDem

(3,709 posts)
33. That comment survived a jury???
Sun Jul 5, 2015, 04:29 PM
Jul 2015

My god.... DU is seriously messed up. For someone to get by with this comment is uncalled for. I've seen a lot of vitriol on this board in the past but this is horrible.

They simply can not handle the truth...

ismnotwasm

(42,021 posts)
37. I'm not ignorant. Not even a little bit.
Sun Jul 5, 2015, 05:27 PM
Jul 2015

Go ahead, call me "piss fucking ignorant" I'll laugh and laugh and consider the source.

Cha

(297,818 posts)
42. Aren't you a big brave poster, pocoloco.. broad-brushing Hillary Supporters with your
Sun Jul 5, 2015, 07:01 PM
Jul 2015

ignorance and profanity.

yallerdawg

(16,104 posts)
6. I hope Hillary keeps her eye on the prize!
Sun Jul 5, 2015, 01:28 PM
Jul 2015

We need good Democratic candidates to take on contestable House and Senate seats in 2016.

I want Hillary's "evening gown train" to sweep us in a Democratic Congress!

Enough with the primary side show.

nolabear

(41,999 posts)
13. I'm glad and on board but I appreciate Bernie and his supporters.
Sun Jul 5, 2015, 02:57 PM
Jul 2015

My wish would be for more reasoned debate and less vitriol between the two camps. The further someone is driven back into a corner the less likely they are to be open to change.

murielm99

(30,778 posts)
14. That includes us.
Sun Jul 5, 2015, 03:05 PM
Jul 2015

We are subject to human nature as well.

The more vitriol we see, the more determined we are to work for Hillary and to donate to her campaign. The more the repubbies dump hate and lies on her, the more we will fight for her.

nolabear

(41,999 posts)
43. Oh I agree. And I'm glad. I hate the insults lobbed back and forth though.
Sun Jul 5, 2015, 08:30 PM
Jul 2015

I'm not keeping track of who says what at all so I'm not pointing any fingers, but when the general comes along I'm hoping no one cuts off their nose, so to speak, out of anger about what has been said to or about them in the primary.

yallerdawg

(16,104 posts)
16. 98% of Democrats don't think Senator Sanders (I-VT) can win the presidential election.
Sun Jul 5, 2015, 03:10 PM
Jul 2015

What do we debate?

yallerdawg

(16,104 posts)
24. It truly is remarkable.
Sun Jul 5, 2015, 03:44 PM
Jul 2015

When did electing a substantially credentialed liberal Democratic woman of Hillary Clinton's stature (so reviled by conservative Republicans!) not be considered progressive?

Who are these people?



 

hrmjustin

(71,265 posts)
25. I banned 5 from this room today and another poster was banned by another host.
Sun Jul 5, 2015, 03:45 PM
Jul 2015

I think it is a badge of honor for some and some are trying to bait us so we get hides.

yallerdawg

(16,104 posts)
27. Stay strong, Justin!!!
Sun Jul 5, 2015, 03:58 PM
Jul 2015

It's hard to hold your tongue in a safe haven, isn't it?

Where is William769? - never mind, we know...

Tarheel_Dem

(31,245 posts)
39. It's quite amazing that they can come into a "safe haven" and say whatever the hell they like,
Sun Jul 5, 2015, 06:29 PM
Jul 2015

and if you respond in kind, you're the one who winds up with the hide. Truly amazing.

Cha

(297,818 posts)
41. You're Wrong.. "In House, liberals side with Clinton over Sanders"
Sun Jul 5, 2015, 06:54 PM
Jul 2015
Dozens of House liberals have endorsed Hillary Clinton's White House bid even as Sen. Bernie Sanders (I-Vt.) is gaining steam.

Sanders, a liberal icon, has emerged as a surprisingly strong candidate since launching his campaign two months ago, raising $15 million and making huge gains on Clinton recently among Democratic voters in Iowa, which will host the country's first presidential caucus.

Yet at least 26 Democrats representing the 69-member Congressional Progressive Caucus –– a bastion of liberal thinking that Sanders helped to launch –– have already endorsed Clinton, according to a tally being kept by The Hill.

The list includes liberal stalwarts like Reps. Rosa DeLaura (D-Conn.) and Debbie Dingell (D-Mich.) –– both forceful voices in the recent trade debate that Clinton was reluctant to enter –– and Jerrold Nadler (D-N.Y.), Jan Schakowsky (D-Ill.) and Jim McDermott (D-Wash.), three vociferous critics of an Iraq War that Clinton, as a New York senator, supported.

yallerdawg http://www.democraticunderground.com/110711038

yallerdawg

(16,104 posts)
50. Twitter is on to something!
Mon Jul 6, 2015, 10:35 AM
Jul 2015

Our attention span and fundamentals of reading now ends at 144 characters or less.

The problem is, in 144 characters or less you can still be annoyingly wrong, wrong, wrong!

Right, Cha?

Tarheel_Dem

(31,245 posts)
38. Politico: "Bernie who? Why the Clinton campaign isn’t sweating the Sanders surge."
Sun Jul 5, 2015, 06:26 PM
Jul 2015
By Gabriel Debenedetti 7/3/15 4:19 PM EDT Updated 7/5/15 3:09 PM EDT


Bernie Sanders is winning a third of the vote in Iowa and New Hampshire, according to the latest polls. Nearly 10,000 people showed up at his Wisconsin rally this week. Roughly 250,000 small donors have contributed to his campaign.

At Hillary Clinton’s Brooklyn HQ, it’s as if they’ve never heard of him.

The Clinton campaign is reading straight from the front-runner’s playbook when dealing with the socialist Vermont senator. Her staff insists it’s taking Sanders’ polling bump seriously while showing no signs of changing its long-charted course. There are no new plans to attack Sanders, no alterations of the forthcoming policy rollouts that will dot the summer calendar, and no expected leftward sprints to match him policy-for-policy. She doesn’t even mention his name on the campaign trail.

Instead, the former secretary of state’s political operation is making a show of its organizational muscle and safeguarding its position beyond the early-voting states. Far from sweating over reports of standing-room-only crowds at the Vermonter’s events, the Clinton campaign is breathing a quiet sigh of relief that it’s Sanders — and not a potentially more viable primary opponent like Elizabeth Warren — nipping at its heels this summer. The senator’s name pops up in conversations at Clinton’s Brooklyn headquarters, but he’s not the topic of the day, week or month — not even in the candidate’s chats with donors, who are keeping a close tab on the state of play.

“No one’s hair is on fire about him,” explained Maria Cardona, a national Democratic strategist who remains in close touch with the Clinton camp after working for Hillary’s 2008 campaign. “Not even the nose hairs. Nothing.”


Read more: http://www.politico.com/story/2015/07/bernie-who-119721.html#ixzz3f3dpvq9h


This is why I don't feel the need to combat all the fantastical headlines and accusations of "Fear" by the BS crowd. I don't blame people who want to "set the record straight", but it's like arguing with two year olds, and I figure....what's the point?

This is why I want HRC's media surrogates to just Cool It! BS is no threat. Speak about him in glowing terms if you must, but no need to attack.

If we've learned anything, it's the ugliness of some of his most ardent supporters, and they're not winning anyone over with that. They are, in fact, his greatest liability. The groups they need to buy in feel more alienated than ever from BS, and it has less to do with him, and more to do with his so-called "supporters".

yallerdawg

(16,104 posts)
51. "No one's hair is on fire...Not even the nose hairs."
Mon Jul 6, 2015, 10:50 AM
Jul 2015


How often does a campaign staff actually ignore primary opposition?

Of course the 'anyone buts' will characterize it as "whistling past the graveyard" but I see no good reason for Hillary to promote Senator Sanders (I-VT). Let BS work for it - if he is on the same stage with Hillary, then he must have earned it, right?

George II

(67,782 posts)
58. I can identify with your last paragraph - the zealots "out there" (DU home page) are descending...
Mon Jul 6, 2015, 11:02 PM
Jul 2015

...on this site like they own it, and woe to anyone who doesn't jump on the bandwagon. I'm sure they're turning more people off than turning people on to Sanders.

Tarheel_Dem

(31,245 posts)
59. Which is why BS remains mired in the single digits with the most loyal Democratic constituency.
Tue Jul 7, 2015, 06:19 AM
Jul 2015

I don't see that changing. If the attitude displayed here is any indication, I hope, for BS' sake, that none of his DU "supporters" are working door-to-door.

George II

(67,782 posts)
60. The only places where his polling numbers are "strong" are in Iowa (not a truly organized primary)..
Tue Jul 7, 2015, 10:38 AM
Jul 2015

...and in New Hampshire, the neighboring state of Vermont with almost identical demographics (95% caucasian) and even in those states he's behind by double digits.

I saw a post the other day claiming that Sanders was in a "statistical dead heat" with Clinton because he was trailing by 8% with a margin of error of +/- 4%, assuming that Clinton was the -4% and Sanders was the +4%!

I pointed out that Clinton could be ahead by 16% (taking the opposite 4%s for each) and was "shouted down" by the Sanders bullies.

That's when I decided to come here (BTW, I've been blocked from posting in the Sanders group - reality is too much for "them"!)

yallerdawg

(16,104 posts)
61. There is no point arguing within either group.
Tue Jul 7, 2015, 11:16 AM
Jul 2015

Safe havens are zones of intolerance - I hope. The groups stress unfettered positivity towards the candidate or the subject of choice.

GD and now GD Primaries are for argument, but you have to try to keep it respectful and impersonal, or you can get "swarm hides."

Most liberal activists (people who care and do something! including pointless blog and internet activity) are anti-establishment and idealistic. Iowa caucus participants and a lot of DUers are of course anti-Hillary.

In 2008 Iowa caucus, Hillary came in 3rd. I'm pretty sure, no matter what, Hillary will place higher this time!

George II

(67,782 posts)
62. The groups are a good idea. What I don't think is a good idea is....
Tue Jul 7, 2015, 12:24 PM
Jul 2015

...to allow posts in a group to appear on the left side of the home page.

What they (Sanders supporters) do is get their cadre of like-thinkers (toned that one down) to DU-Rec the crap out of their posts so they show up on that home screen.

Right now, 3 of 5 posts under "Trending Now" are pro-Sanders and 3 of 5 under "Greatest Threads" are pro-Sanders (and some under each also include anti-Hillary comments in the OPs or the responses)

You can't tell me, with all the posts made each day here, that 60% of the TOP posts are pro-Sanders. And I've seen as many as 4 or even 5 of the 5 in each category be pro-Sanders.

It's a bully mentality, and it's only getting worse.

Sorry, but I can't wait for the first few primaries when Sanders gets thrashed so this crap will go away.

 

HassleCat

(6,409 posts)
52. True and Good
Mon Jul 6, 2015, 10:59 AM
Jul 2015

Excellent. Now you can relax and stop arguing with us (Sanders supporters) when we attack your candidate. We're just a bunch of inconsequential, annoying, haranguing, progressive, socialist... Ok, that's enough with the adjectives. Seriously, I'm trying to convince the Sanders supporters to back down a little and be a little more circumspect, as Bernie is himself. You guys could do the same thing, not because you like us, or because we deserve any respect, but simply because Sanders stands no chance. None. Zero. Zilch. See? You can relax now. Would you like a gin & tonic? I make them with just the right lime garnish.

 

HassleCat

(6,409 posts)
54. It's just a little friendly humor
Mon Jul 6, 2015, 11:17 AM
Jul 2015

I'm only partially serious. I realize people get very intense about their candidates, and I do wish both sides would choose their words more carefully.

 

HassleCat

(6,409 posts)
56. By all means
Mon Jul 6, 2015, 11:37 AM
Jul 2015

Steam on! I know we (the Sanders supporters) can be really annoying at times, and there have been some nasty hit pieces on Clinton. I get upset by that stuff, too, even though it's supposed to be in support of my guy.

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