Police Shoot, Kill Man With Pocket Knife Near Hollywood Walk of Fame

[tomm2thumbs]

Source: NBC-LA

A man with a combination pocket knife was shot and killed by police Friday night near the Hollywood Walk of Fame, police said. Police responded to reports of a man with a deadly weapon at Hollywood Boulevard and Highland Avenue just before 7 p.m., police said. Officers fired after seeing the man approach them while armed with a knife, said Meghan Aguilar of the LAPD. The man died in the hospital before 9:30 p.m.

A combination knife, similar to a Swiss Army Knife, was found at the scene. <snip> One woman said a man ran into a McDonald's shouting that police shot his friend, who sometimes "liked to wave a knife to scare tourists."

(pocket knife w/corkscrew from video at link)




Read more: http://www.nbclosangeles.com/news/local/hollywood-highland-shooting-report-284945511.html

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[marym625]

1. Just so sick of it. n/t

[billhicks76]

74. A Pocket Knife???

Every 4th grader had one when I was young and no cop ever had to kill anyone over it. They are killing for sport now. Pathetic. When did some of these guys become such pansies? I thought they were supposed to be tough.

[ManiacJoe]

79. The 4th graders keep the knives in their pockets.

Some folks are not as smart as 4th graders.

[billhicks76]

93. Wow...You're Defending The Indefensible ?

Get some spine.

[ManiacJoe]

94. Even YOUR reading comprehension cannot be THAT bad.

[marym625]

87. Not even a pocket knife

More like a Swiss army knife

[ManiacJoe]

95. How is a Swiss Army knife not a pocket knife?

[marym625]

96. Well I thought a pocket knife

Was only a knife. Just the knife. Swiss army knife has all those other things.

Any pocket knife (one that's just a knife) is much bigger than the knife in a Swiss army knife.

But if they're both referred to as a pocket knife, ok.

[ManiacJoe]

97. Ah, that would do it.

Actually, a pocket knife is any knife that can be folded closed and fits in your pocket.

[marym625]

98. noted.

Thanks.

[Dale Neiburg]

2. Far too little-known fact:

A 2-inch long knife blade is long enough to penetrate the heart.

(And if I "liked to wave a knife to scare people," I think I'd expect them to wave back, with something other than their hands.)

[RKP5637]

3. I don't know all the facts, but if someone starts waving a knife at people they

should know that's probably not going to work out OK for them. ... given his remarks, it seems he knew what he was doing and it was not just a singular irrational act. For awhile, police were using stun guns a lot, seems that would have been more appropriate in this case.

[hexola]

4. Sounds like mental illness...

Multiple irrational acts...suggest he was not in sane frame of mind.

Bizzare - and NOT OK TO SHOOT HIM!

[RKP5637]

6. I've wondered why in cases like this police do not use tranquilizing guns. Today,

the objective by police seems to be to kill rather than restrain. And it seems epidemic. It would appear a tranquilizing pistol could be standard issue.

[Voice for Peace]

18. agree.. it seems like it would be a no brainer.

[EX500rider]

40. "It would appear a tranquilizing pistol could be standard issue."

You have to know the body weight and drug allergies of the subject before you can safely use a tranquilizer on them.

[RKP5637]

42. I hadn't thought of that. n/t

[Chemisse]

44. That would be horrible if it was too much tranquilizer for his body weight.

Better to just shoot and kill him.

[EX500rider]

46. "too much tranquilizer for his body weight" would kill him.

[Chemisse]

47. Perhaps you missed my point.

It would be better to take the RISK of killing someone than to simply kill someone.

If you just take the risk of it, there is a chance that person would survive.

[Beaverhausen]

50. So would bullets

[thesquanderer]

51. as opposed to what you need to know to safely use a bullet on them?

(in response to "You have to know the body weight and drug allergies of the subject before you can safely use a tranquilizer on them.&quot

[Jackpine Radical]

53. Why, yes, of course.

You really should know the metallic lead tolerance of a person before you shoot them in the head.

[EX500rider]

66. People who think a dart will knock you instantly unconscious have been watching too many movies..

Dear Abby,
Why can't the police use a tranquilizer gun in cases where they feel threatened?

Tranquilizing agents don't affect everyone uniformly. Therefore you cannot predict whether you have a sufficient dose to tranquilize the individual.
Second, any tranquilizer will take time to enter the bloodstream and sedate the individual. If someone is advancing on you with a deadly weapon or a threatening object, there's no way a tranquilizer would take effect in the two to three seconds it would take someone to seriously injure you.
Shooting a human with a tranq dart could just as easily result in slight dizziness as in an overdose or brain damage. Only in a few cases would you get the "oh, he'll sleep for a few hours and wake up with a headache" effect you see in movies.

[thesquanderer]

67. Right, I know tranquilizers wouldn't necessarily be practical

I just thought the argument about needing to know a safe amount--when the alternative is a bullet--was a little odd.

[christx30]

72. Some people don't react well to tranqs anyway.

My brother in law has to be strapped down before any surgery, because when he wakes up, he is incredibly violent before he has had time to find his bearings. He punches, kicks, bites.

[leftymon]

55. Like a dart gun,

Old School style?

[RKP5637]

60. Something like that, just enough to subdue them, as least in cases like this, or at

minimal a stun gun.

[leftymon]

64. I've never heard of a tranquilizer gun, except for animals.

[ManiacJoe]

65. There is a reason for that.

See the subthread starting at post #6.

[leftymon]

70. Yeah, using a dart gun would require quite a bit of extra training

[RKP5637]

69. Neither have I, it would need to be developed. To me, it might be better in

some cases than a gun.

[1monster]

56. I thought that was what tazers were for... They seem to use those only to punish, not to defuse

what they appear to believe is a lethal threat.

[ManiacJoe]

57. You thought wrong.

Tasers are not used against lethal force. Tasers are alternatives for spray and batons.

Lethal force gets countered with lethal force.

[1monster]

59. They were touted as an alternative for lethal force not as an alternative to spray and batons.

You are stating how they are used. BTW, unless someone is within two feet of you, a pocket knife is not a lethal weapon.

[ManiacJoe]

63. Tasers have never been touted as an alternative to lethal force.

Tasers have always been advertised as a less-than-lethal option to other non-lethal weapons. That is the way they have always been marketed. That is the way the cops have always been trained.

Any edged weapon is always lethal force. Within 21 feet, they may be more effective than holstered guns.

However, in this case a taser might have worked out OK depending on what the suspect was wearing.

[RKP5637]

61. Same here. It's a total WTF to me as usual. If the guy had an assault weapon that

would be different, but killed for waving a penknife.

[MADem]

76. Someone could die from the tranquilizer and that would create issues right then and there....

It's not realistic for the police to ask people if they are allergic to any of the ingredients in the tranquilizer, but there would be issues with it.

I'd rather see them fire a net at people who are messed up--you know, like they do when they want to catch birds in a thicket to tag them. Get them tangled up in the net, and then haul 'em in. Yes, it's old school, was popular in cartoons, but I'll bet it would work better than shooting every mentally ill person they encounter.

They can't leave knife wavers on the street--they have to do something. I think they should try nets...better than tranquilizers, better than shocking them, better than bullets, too....

[RKP5637]

85. The net idea sounds really good!!! I do wish they explored more alternatives. Some individuals have

mental issues and/or other health problems, they don't deserve to be killed or maimed. And some just get into a fit of rage.

[MADem]

86. Apparently they make the things--I guess there's a few bugs in 'em or something...

I'd love to see them used in law enforcement....

[heaven05]

21. WHY IS IT SO

easy for some people to agree with summary executions? It seems so easy for some people on here.

[RKP5637]

25. I have no idea, also, why don't cops make more use of stun guns and tranquilizing guns.

It seems today their first line of reasoning is to kill the person in question. I think a lot more needs to be done at the federal level. Far too many state and especially local police departments IMO are incompetent to effectively handle a solution to this. To me, there need to be US wide policies on use of lethal force. The way it is today, cops that murder just walk away. Also, I don't think all cops are bad, but the bad ones seem to get a free pass.

[heaven05]

29. Nothing and NO group

is all bad, I agree. But according to some, here and other forums, on one side of the issue, there are too many "hulking demons" threatening the privilege enjoyed by many as a daily way of life. On the other side, there are far too many murders/executions of those alleged 'threats', summarily, without due process. I favor the latter group, that the real threat is the many that are committing summary executions and murders and getting sanction from the state, continually, to continue that form of "business as usual" in eradicating the alleged 'threat'...... on edit: after being reminded, by another thread on DU, I should clarify my remark that "nothing and no group is all bad" I will say the KKK and ALL of it's members are bad, ugly, mean people.

[RKP5637]

32. Sadly, I agree with your last sentence so much. It does seem "business as usual." Each day I feel

more and more uncomfortable in the US, like it's a prison of sorts.

Someone recently was telling me how silly I am, but as I said to them, the only reason it seems OK to them is because they have not yet been affected by it. It seems anymore just a minor traffic occurrence can get one killed. Another of my friends is a diabetic. I was telling them to get a medical id bracelet. They could be having an attack and some of these cops would kill them, same is true with epileptics.

What I see/feel is TPTB are afraid of losing control. The suppression of OWS was not just an occurrence. IMO the suppression was orchestrated by DHS. None want the peasants to get too riled up about being fucked over again and again. So, the "business as usual" message is fall in line or we will kill you. And, there are plenty of people of that ilk more than willing to join the appropriate institutions in the US to bash heads and kill people for the fun of it. NOT all, but enough to make it highly concerning IMO.

[heaven05]

52. +1000

[lonestarnot]

5. So now what the fuck, a shortage of Tasers. Just tase me bro.

[RKP5637]

7. My first thought too. It wasn't like he had an assault weapon or something. More and more

it's cops with lethal toys!

[lonestarnot]

8. Sort of like dudes/women who join military for targeting humans.

Human hunting for sport.

[RKP5637]

12. It really is, we are the game being hunted by cops with newer and newer toys. n/t

[uncle ray]

17. we can hardly go a day without a major news story about someone stabbed in the heart by a 2in blade.

[krispos42]

81. And if the blade doesn't lock, it's very likely to chop of the fingers

of the attacker.

Absent of the man holding somebody at knifepoint, this is something that could have easily been handled with pepper spray or a taser.

[Scairp]

9. Seriously?

They opened fire on someone at Hollywood and Highland, on a Friday night? It's a miracle they didn't kill more than just the guy with the knife.

[Bluenorthwest]

10. I personally witnessed a similar shooting by the police a few blocks from there, drunk woman with

a very tiny knife. Shot her a bunch of time and hit two bystanders, my depositions involved the way the police spoke to the injured bystanders, other neighbors testified or were deposed about the shooting itself. There was no need to shoot the woman at all. None.

[KinMd]

11. "Liked to wave a knife to scare tourists"

and who among us hasn't had some fun doing that.

[blackcrowflies]

20. I have a Swiss army combo

I could certainly kill someone with it if I were so inclined, which I'm not. A razor sharp (the blades never seem to dull) about 3 inch blade, imagine the damage that could do in someone's heart, lungs, guts, or of their face.

Sorry, the police are terrible in many respects, but waving a knife around and threatening people, you take what you get.

[Dyedinthewoolliberal]

28. baloney

and there are other ways to deal with this besides shooting.

[blackcrowflies]

71. always nice to have a reasoned discussion with someone who presents facts

[Dyedinthewoolliberal]

73. You can block me if you don't like my posts

Not a problem........

[heaven05]

22. another one

like the other ones over the last months....

[damnedifIknow]

13. People get arrested all the time with a pocket knife

Key word here is *arrested*. Unless this man was attacking someone with the knife I don't see a reason to shoot to kill.

[SamKnause]

14. 2 or more officers

armed to the teeth and terrified of a combination knife and corkscrew.

The question that needs to be asked, "Are officers instructed to shoot to kill in all confrontations"?

Is there no accounting for deafness ?

Is there no accounting for mental illness ?

Is there no accounting for language barriers ?

Could one of the officers have approached the suspect from behind and taken away the knife ?

Are all police cowards ?

Is this the way police would like to have their loved ones treated ?

I am a 61 year old white female.

I am terrified of the police !!!

To 'Protect and Serve' should be replaced with 'We are here to Harass, Maim, and Kill'.

[lonestarnot]

15. Like arresting a diabetic for being drunk when they are not drunk at all, just having diabetic deal.

[mtngirl47]

16. Thank you! Well said!

I was in a diner yesterday and saw a table in the corner with 4 cops....they were all bulging muscles, armed to the teeth, military haircuts and their pants tucked into their high, lace-up boots.....my first thought was they look like SS....my second thought--Why are these guys afraid of anyone???

It was disheartening to see--I live in a very rural area and we have no crime level to justify cops looking like jackboots.

[SamKnause]

19. You are welcome.

If I saw a group of police decked out in riot gear I would have a panic attack.

I live in a rural area as well.

I only see police on TV and live streams.

I live in Adams county Ohio.

It has the largest DEA task force in the entire state.

I am fortunate not to have had any encounters with them.

Have a great weekend.

Stay safe.

PEACE

[heaven05]

24. they are

the SS. Amerikas SS. And since the RW media has told a lot of fearful, privileged people that they are in danger of losing that privilege to a lot of unwashed masses, people feel they need protection like the modern SS from the threats posed by unarmed black, poor and indigent people. Consequently, a lot of fearful people, here also, turn a blind eye to these state sanctioned executions because they are so damn afraid of these media inspired 'threats' to their privilege, safety and 'way of life'. Even if that 'way of life' is systemically and institutionally racist and has been for 300+ years.

[RKP5637]

27. Sadly, anymore, they don't just look like the SS, they have become the US version of the SS, and

I see/hear little being done to get it under control. I don't even like being near a cop anymore. I just find many to be potentially dangerous, unstable and not in control of their emotions.

[ladjf]

26. "Give a boy a stick and he will find something that needs to be hit." nt

[Trillo]

31. "'We are here to Harass, Maim, and Kill'."

They can't say that! It would be the TRUTH!

[Chemisse]

45. Sometimes it seems they are just cowards.

Like the Ferguson cop who (purportedly) was so afraid of the 'demon' that he riddled him with bullets.

Why is it okay for cops to use fear as an excuse? Can't we expect our police to be brave and take risks to protect the public? That's what firefighters do. And yet they expect the same level of appreciation.

[Chemisse]

49. Great post.

There seems to be a one-size-fits-all approach.

If you are scared, shoot to kill. Period.

[Kablooie]

23. The news says he was stabbing a woman when he was shot.

So it's not the same as the other recent cases.

[pediatricmedic]

30. Tueller drill, also known as 21 foot rule

Police are trained to respond a certain way to an attacker with a knife. Until we as a society want to change the training, this response will remain the norm.


Mythbusters clip:

Another clip that is standard viewing for all new officers and explains the readiness to shoot:

[Historic NY]

43. It actually happened to a friend....

a kid in a shed, family called, he went in the kid had a knife and he was stabbed muliple times He barely made it to the hospital, after numerous transfusions

21 foot rule now rethought could be 35-45 feet. That how the training film was made in 1988.

[tclambert]

83. Here's "Justified's" take on that.

[tclambert]

84. People think so one-dimensionally.

In the Dan Inosanto clip, most of the officers retreated straight backward when he charged. If they had stepped to the side, they would have fared much better.

In any case, an officer confronting Dan Inosanto faces a lot of trouble. He's a martial arts legend.

[magical thyme]

33. per the article, he was observed trying to stab people and refused to drop the knife when ordered

"After observing him apparently trying to stab people inside, they entered the market and confronted the suspect, identified by police as 24-year-old Gabriel Acuna, and ordered him several times to drop the knife.

After allegedly refusing to comply he was shot by an officer."

[muriel_volestrangler]

34. Which article? Not the one in the OP

"Officers fired after seeing the man approach them while armed with a knife, said Meghan Aguilar of the LAPD" is as far as it gets about describing the situation.

[hexola]

35. At the end - but it doesn't really say anyone saw him doing this

One woman said a man ran into a McDonald's shouting that police shot his friend, who sometimes "liked to wave a knife to scare tourists."

[muriel_volestrangler]

36. That's not about him stabbing a woman (nt)

[hexola]

37. Link? That doesnt sound like the same incident.(nt)

[hexola]

38. You are WAY OFF - thats a different incident - and that guy is white and still alive

http://ktla.com/2014/12/05/murrieta-police-shoot-injure-man-attempting-to-stab-gas-station-customers/

Murrieta resident Gabriel Acuna was then spotted allegedly waving a knife and apparently attempting to stab people, according to the news release.

Officers confronted Acuna and ordered him to drop the knife. He was shot after he did not comply, the release stated.

Acuna was hospitalized and listed in stable condition.

[jwirr]

39. A pocket knife used to be in the pocket of every boy in Ameica. Sick.

[Jackpine Radical]

54. And at age 70, I still carry one.

Lifelong habit from growing up rural.

[ManiacJoe]

58. And when it is in your pocket,

you don't get shot by the cops.

[jtuck004]

77. Or, you could just be walking, carving, living your life...

In a press conference the day after the shooting, Seattle Police Department (SPD) Deputy Chief Nick Metz said that Officer Ian Birk, 27, who has been with SPD for two years, was stopped at a downtown Seattle traffic light at 4:15 p.m. when the woodcarver crossed the street in front of his marked police car carrying an open pocketknife and a telephone-book-sized piece of cedar. “And he could see the knife,” Metz told reporters, “the blade of the knife, and he could see he was doing something to the board. The officer thought it was important to find out what was going on and why this person had in public an open-blade knife.” Metz said Birk got out of his car, approached Williams from behind and ordered the woodcarver to drop the knife three times. When Williams failed to do so within four seconds, Officer Birk fired his weapon five times from a distance of 10 feet. Williams was struck by four bullets, including one lethal shot to the chest wall, and died at the scene. In its initial statement to the press, SPD described Williams as having been “advancing towards” Officer Birk, who felt threatened and responded by firing his weapon.

Read more at http://indiancountrytodaymedianetwork.com/2011/02/21/shooting-death-john-t-williams-18538


http://jonathanturley.org/2011/05/28/seattle-pays-1-5m-to-family-of-victim-of-police-shooting/

On edit: If you are unloading your unloaded gun, it might be safer for bystanders if you took your knife out as well...

Two guys doing a firearm purchase before work, in the parking lot. One opens the gun to inspect it, shoots himself in the pocket knife and the ricochet hits the other fella.

http://fox13now.com/2014/08/09/accidental-shooting-injures-2-after-bullet-strikes-pocketknife-shrapnel-ricochets/comment-page-1/

[ManiacJoe]

78. Yes, the cops fucked that up quite well.

However, if you are walking in public, that folding knife should be closed and in your pocket. Walking around in public with an open knife is a good way for bad things to happen.

[jtuck004]

80. But yeah, I do get your point and agree. n/t

[jwirr]

88. Today that is a good rule due to the quality of police we have now. My brothers did all manner of

things in public with those knives and no one even saw it as a problem let alone something to kill them for.

[24601]

75. And a gun used to be openly carried on the hip of anyone who so chose. n/t

[jwirr]

89. Not in modern days. And the wild west was not particularly something we want back. I lived in

rural Iowa and in the 40-50s anyone walking around with a sidearm would have been confronted by a policeman. If it was hunting season many carried shotguns or rifles but not a sidearm.

[24601]

90. You've made my point. It's already the new modern days for any boys (and girls) carrying

around pen knives with mandatory school expulsion at the least and probably a juvenile record.

It's not just knives - pictures of guns or military aircraft, pop tarts that may resemble a gin - and a very menacing finger accompanied by "Bang, bang."

[jwirr]

92. I think I stated that it was yesterday not today that I was talking about. My point is that it is a

shame that this has changed. We are getting worse not better.

[tclambert]

82. Gibbs' Rule Number Nine: Always carry a knife.

Of course, he's a federal agent and gets to carry a gun on an airplane, too.

[hexola]

41. Looks kind of like a knife a cop would carry...

I guess it does!

http://www.lapolicegear.com/wen-w16300-ranger51-knife.html

Kind of!

[geomon666]

48. I no longer believe what any cop says.

So if they say he was approaching them, I have to assume he was running away from them.

[Ino]

68. Cops lie like no tomorrow.

Read this pig's account of why he shot someone, all the loaded words (jumped, stared at me, kept coming towards me). It has absolutely no resemblance to the video. I count six lies in seven sentences. At least this dumb fuck is being charged!

http://www.wltx.com/story/news/local/2014/09/26/sean-groubert-gives-his-account-of-shooting-levar-jones/16295527/

"I pulled him over for a seat belt violation," Groubert can be heard saying on the tape. "Before I could event get out of my car he jumped out, stared at me, and as I jumped out of my car and identified myself, as I approached him, he jumped head-first back into his car."

"I started retracting back towards the rear of his vehicle telling him 'Look, get out of the car, let me see your hands. He jumped out of the car. I saw something black in his hands. I ran to the other side car yelling at him, and he kept coming towards me. Apparently it was his wallet."

Better link:
http://www.islandpacket.com/2014/10/03/3351267/longer-video-has-more-details.html

[Rozlee]

62. They're attracting a sociopathic contingent that's leading the pack.

Seriously, police work is the preferred job for sociopaths because it contains the use of power and authority they crave. The population has a general number of 3% sociopath personalities. Police forces are estimated to have up to 15%. And there's no way to weed them out with psychological testing. They're good at faking normal behavior and impulses when they need to. They beat their wives and girlfriends at twice the national average and there's always a rage in many of them just waiting to take out on someone. I know that there have to be good cops out there. The small town deputies in the little town I grew up in were somewhat Southern stereotypical, but when push came to shove, they treated my minority family with courtesy and one even gave me a kitten once. I don't see that kind of relationship between police and the people they cover on their beats these days.

[muriel_volestrangler]

91. Victim was young, white, seems to have been homeless

Witnesses say the man shot and killed by Los Angeles police Friday night in Hollywood would regularly dress up like the character in the horror movie “Scream,” spooking people to solicit tips for photos.
...
Howe and other street entertainers said sometimes the man would sneak up on people with a plastic knife or gun to surprise them.
...
Sam Seri first met the man three nights ago while he was working at Revolution Books on Hollywood Boulevard at Wilton. Seri said the man was sitting in front of the bookstore entrance and asked him to move over a bit.

“He moved and he just slept there,” Seri said. “He was very nice.”

http://www.scpr.org/news/2014/12/07/48520/hollywood-and-highland-shooting-victim-played-scre/

“When they told him to get down and comply, he did not at all,” said Bruce Cherry, one of hundreds of witnesses.

Cherry said the suspect initially had his hands outside of his pockets.

“When they ran up on him, he went inside of his pockets and stuck both of his hands inside of his pockets and then that’s when they pulled out on him,” Cherry said. “That’s when the shots rang out.”

http://losangeles.cbslocal.com/2014/12/06/cellphone-video-captures-aftermath-of-deadly-police-shooting-at-hollywood-highland/