Welcome to DU! The truly grassroots left-of-center political community where regular people, not algorithms, drive the discussions and set the standards. Join the community: Create a free account Support DU (and get rid of ads!): Become a Star Member Latest Breaking News General Discussion The DU Lounge All Forums Issue Forums Culture Forums Alliance Forums Region Forums Support Forums Help & Search

BumRushDaShow

(128,965 posts)
Fri Dec 16, 2022, 06:29 PM Dec 2022

Child workers found throughout Hyundai-Kia supply chain in Alabama

Source: Reuters

At least four major suppliers of Hyundai Motor Co and sister Kia Corp have employed child labor at Alabama factories in recent years, a Reuters investigation found, and state and federal agencies are probing whether kids have worked at as many as a half dozen additional manufacturers throughout the automakers’ supply chain in the southern U.S. state. At a plant owned by Hwashin America Corp, a supplier to the two car brands in the south Alabama town of Greenville, a 14-year-old Guatemalan girl worked this May assembling auto body components, according to interviews with her father and law enforcement officials.

At plants owned by Korean auto-parts maker Ajin Industrial Co, in the east Alabama town of Cusseta, a former production engineer told Reuters he worked with at least 10 minors. And six other ex-employees of Ajin said they, too, worked alongside multiple underage laborers. In two separate statements sent by the same public relations firm, Hwashin and Ajin said their policies forbid the hiring of any worker not of legally employable age. Using identical language, both companies said they hadn’t, “to the best of our knowledge,” hired underage workers.

The employment of children at Hwashin and Ajin hasn’t been previously reported. The news follows a Reuters report in July that revealed the use of child workers, one as young as 12, by SMART Alabama LLC, a Hyundai subsidiary in the south Alabama town of Luverne. In August, the U.S. Department of Labor said that SL Alabama LLC, another Hyundai supplier and a unit of South Korea’s SL Corp, employed underage workers, including a 13-year-old, at its factory in Alexander City.

Since then, as many as 10 Alabama plants that supply parts to Hyundai or Kia have been investigated for child labor by various state and federal law enforcement or regulatory agencies, according to two people familiar with the probes. The investigations are being conducted across small towns and rural outposts where many of the suppliers and the job recruiters that staff them are located. It isn’t yet clear whether the probes will lead to criminal charges, fines or other penalties, the two people said.

Read more: https://www.reuters.com/investigates/special-report/usa-immigration-hyundai/



I actually heard this reported on the local news radio today.
108 replies = new reply since forum marked as read
Highlight: NoneDon't highlight anything 5 newestHighlight 5 most recent replies
Child workers found throughout Hyundai-Kia supply chain in Alabama (Original Post) BumRushDaShow Dec 2022 OP
Kids work cheap. Chainfire Dec 2022 #1
Beats the pants off of delivering newspapers FredGarvin Dec 2022 #3
Did you deliver papers full-time, unable to go to school, like the kids in the article? SunSeeker Dec 2022 #89
They don't pay them like adults for the same work? KS Toronado Dec 2022 #52
An oldie but goodie Roy Rolling Dec 2022 #69
I would have been in 7th heaven working for Hyndai at 14 FredGarvin Dec 2022 #2
When I was 14, I washed pots and pans in the kitchen at the local hospital. Dysfunctional Dec 2022 #11
I worked at Penney's too! mgardener Dec 2022 #31
But you only worked part-time, and were able to go to school and college, unlike these kids. SunSeeker Dec 2022 #90
Jesus H. Christ. Lucky kids? What is wrong with you? Scrivener7 Dec 2022 #82
Lucky kids? Mysterian Dec 2022 #98
DAFUQ -- how the hell are victims of child labor violations "lucky" obamanut2012 Dec 2022 #106
Imho, these cars should not be allowed to be sold here. SheltieLover Dec 2022 #4
+1 bronxiteforever Dec 2022 #5
Hi Bronxite! SheltieLover Dec 2022 #7
Hi SheltieLover! bronxiteforever Dec 2022 #16
Mice nuts compared to its competitors like Ford FredGarvin Dec 2022 #9
That was a proactive recall (two, really) - aren't those supposed to be a good thing? NullTuples Dec 2022 #39
Exploding Pinto ver. 2.0. This was a design flaw built into the system by cheapening the materials Ford_Prefect Dec 2022 #55
I've had a Santa Fe for 10 years. Very reliable, sturdy, and virtually trouble-free. Gidney N Cloyd Dec 2022 #12
Ford Rebl2 Dec 2022 #21
Fixed Or Repaired Daily or Fucked Over Rebuilt Dodge, Found On Road Dead, For the Ford fans OverBurn Dec 2022 #99
I gave my 2009 Kia Optima to my neighbor when it had 174,000 miles on it. Dysfunctional Dec 2022 #13
Totally agree. hamsterjill Dec 2022 #38
fuck that Kali Dec 2022 #51
We've had a Kia minivan for nearly 20 years mcar Dec 2022 #58
Aren't these the cars that are notorious for being easy to steal? csziggy Dec 2022 #68
Can't they put a club on these cars to prevent an easy steal of the Hyundai and/or Kia models? SWBTATTReg Dec 2022 #100
Yes, but since most cars today have an immobilizer system most don't think of it csziggy Dec 2022 #105
This makes me insanely angry. MontanaMama Dec 2022 #6
Post removed Post removed Dec 2022 #10
Read the article before you spout off SharonClark Dec 2022 #18
I would have loved it! FredGarvin Dec 2022 #22
Except it's against the law, and takes a better paying position from an adult ... marble falls Dec 2022 #27
Hear hear! AllyCat Dec 2022 #60
Um, yeah..Child Labor. whathehell Dec 2022 #64
Working an 8 hour shift with a half hour lunch break wnylib Dec 2022 #30
Child workers also tend to have more injuries, and more severe ones. NullTuples Dec 2022 #40
Really? blue neen Dec 2022 #20
Um, parts suppliers??? FredGarvin Dec 2022 #23
Do you think child labor is a great idea??? What the hell, let's just fire all adults and hire ... marble falls Dec 2022 #28
Thanks. I can't believe the flippant and dismissive attitude toward this. I'd expect on a yahoo LT Barclay Dec 2022 #80
Usually these guys move on or get "included" out the door. I'm willing to believe he had a ... marble falls Dec 2022 #95
So you think that the sweat shops of the robber baron era wnylib Dec 2022 #32
Why are you here? DoBotherMe Dec 2022 #47
That is what I've been wondering. AllyCat Dec 2022 #61
I always check the profile when someone says the darnedest things. LakeArenal Dec 2022 #78
The kids should be required to have work permits and approval by parents and their schools. Those iluvtennis Dec 2022 #8
Here in Philly and this is a PA thing BumRushDaShow Dec 2022 #17
I got a work permit at 14 to bus tables and flip burgers in Ohio ... marble falls Dec 2022 #29
Hundreds of thousands had the same situation BumRushDaShow Dec 2022 #35
Absolutely true. The only sick days I took from school after 13 was to mix "mud", carry ... marble falls Dec 2022 #36
You were fortunate you were paid BumRushDaShow Dec 2022 #37
I did not feel privileged and it was NO compensation for not doing things that kids get to do. marble falls Dec 2022 #44
Oh I agree BumRushDaShow Dec 2022 #46
Wow, thanks for that video on Mother Jones and the Mill Children -I learned something new today. nt iluvtennis Dec 2022 #48
You are welcome! BumRushDaShow Dec 2022 #54
I had to do this for my kid in Wisconsin at 14. AllyCat Dec 2022 #62
And meat factories or farms hiring undocumented migrant workers should be discouraged, too. NullTuples Dec 2022 #41
Child labor in Alabama? Kennah Dec 2022 #14
At 14 I was cutting grass with a scythe for the US military luv2fly Dec 2022 #15
Happy to have the money? SharonClark Dec 2022 #19
I delivered newspapers before school at 12 FredGarvin Dec 2022 #24
Imagine the hit to profits if newspapers had to actually pay W2 delivery people. NullTuples Dec 2022 #42
You have clearly not read the article. Perhaps you should before you make any Scrivener7 Dec 2022 #85
Good for you FredGarvin Dec 2022 #26
There is a difference between a kid doing a little work for extra cash XorXor Dec 2022 #49
It was a 40 hour a week summer job luv2fly Dec 2022 #53
That's a lot of working for a 14 year old. Even if during the summer XorXor Dec 2022 #70
I'm not supporting the violation of child labor laws luv2fly Dec 2022 #75
WTF?? Western folks DO have to like it since its happening in ALABAMA. Did you read Scrivener7 Dec 2022 #86
Yes I read the article luv2fly Dec 2022 #96
"That's a lot of working for a 14 year old" True but the question is why were they doing it? cstanleytech Dec 2022 #92
Well if CEO's walk and there is no prison time only a fine for them, republianmushroom Dec 2022 #25
Why aren't these kids in school? Deep State Witch Dec 2022 #33
To all the posters here who seem to feel nostalgic wnylib Dec 2022 #34
People romanticize being child workers NullTuples Dec 2022 #45
It also seems like comparing apples to oranges XorXor Dec 2022 #50
Exactly. Most teens get some sort of part time or wnylib Dec 2022 #65
I worked in a mall Orange Julius when I was 16 XorXor Dec 2022 #72
Yes it is a very different situation. wnylib Dec 2022 #76
They are probably not comparing similar cultural environments either. There is a difference between LT Barclay Dec 2022 #81
Amazing, isn't it? There is a REASON we do not have child labor AllyCat Dec 2022 #63
Capitalism capitalizing. Odd ain't it. twodogsbarking Dec 2022 #67
It's just creepy. And clearly none of them have read the article. Scrivener7 Dec 2022 #84
Not new. 1905. Upton Sinclair "The Jungle".....Very Sad to see this still going on. Stuart G Dec 2022 #43
It is my handle for a reason. The Jungle 1 Dec 2022 #71
Led directly to the Safe Foods Act, FDA and Dept of Agticulture inspections. That book is just .. marble falls Dec 2022 #101
Thanks for your analysis. Read it and you will see why laws were changed. And laws were changed Stuart G Dec 2022 #102
Read it the first time in the fifties. I lived in the "DP" section of Cleveland. My dad's family ... marble falls Dec 2022 #103
As long as they are attending school still and being paid the same wage as an adult I have cstanleytech Dec 2022 #56
Children should be allowed to be children The Jungle 1 Dec 2022 #74
Children cannot remain children and they do grow and a job is part of growing up. cstanleytech Dec 2022 #77
Yes child labor was very popular years ago. The Jungle 1 Dec 2022 #79
If you read the article, kids they profiled were not attending school. Scrivener7 Dec 2022 #83
I'm guessing nobody who waxxed nostalgic about child labor read the article. SunSeeker Dec 2022 #88
While living without parents in sparsely furnished rooms Scrivener7 Dec 2022 #93
"If you read the article, kids they profiled were not attending school" Did I say they were? No. cstanleytech Dec 2022 #91
You said if they were attending school you were good Scrivener7 Dec 2022 #94
I was speaking in general as if a child is attending it. cstanleytech Dec 2022 #97
In Pa they were called breaker boys The Jungle 1 Dec 2022 #57
Do they think they are Nike? Apple? Amish? twodogsbarking Dec 2022 #59
Neither Nike nor Apple do this obamanut2012 Dec 2022 #107
I see. twodogsbarking Dec 2022 #108
wtf. nt BootinUp Dec 2022 #66
And wtf with the responses in this thread. Scrivener7 Dec 2022 #87
Sweet Home Alabama prismpalette Dec 2022 #73
Post-Roe future right there ck4829 Dec 2022 #104

SunSeeker

(51,553 posts)
89. Did you deliver papers full-time, unable to go to school, like the kids in the article?
Sun Dec 18, 2022, 04:54 AM
Dec 2022

A part-time paper route job beats the pants off the Hell some of these kids lived in, described in the article.

KS Toronado

(17,234 posts)
52. They don't pay them like adults for the same work?
Sat Dec 17, 2022, 03:21 AM
Dec 2022

Should start a class action lawsuit to see how many come out of the woodwork.

mgardener

(1,816 posts)
31. I worked at Penney's too!
Fri Dec 16, 2022, 09:02 PM
Dec 2022

Started at 14 and worked till I graduated from college.
I only work for 2 months as a 14 yo.

SunSeeker

(51,553 posts)
90. But you only worked part-time, and were able to go to school and college, unlike these kids.
Sun Dec 18, 2022, 05:14 AM
Dec 2022

From the article:

Among the children found working at the plant, Reuters learned, were two Guatemalan brothers, aged 13 and 15, who were taken into protective custody by federal authorities. While they worked at SL, the brothers lived without their parents, staying with other factory workers in a sparsely furnished house owned by the president of the staffing agency that hired them, according to property records, family members, and a former coworker interviewed at the home in Alabama.
...
Even as authorities were investigating, a 14-year-old migrant was recruited to the factory floor at Hwashin. The girl’s father said he and his daughter arrived in Alabama four years earlier, after a long trek from Guatemala. The teen looks younger than her age. On a visit to their home, a small house shared with other migrants south of Greenville, Reuters met the girl, who is just over four feet tall, with rosy cheeks and a timid smile.

Early this year, the father had been working poultry jobs. Troubled by the family’s meager income and hoping to send money to family back in Central America, the girl, who wasn’t attending school, asked her father if she too could get a job, he said. He agreed. “I wish I had said no,” he said.

Father and daughter worked long shifts, commuting 90 minutes each way from their home, the cost of van rides deducted from their weekly pay, the father said. Many staffing agencies operate van fleets and provide transportation to companies for which they recruit labor.


https://www.reuters.com/investigates/special-report/usa-immigration-hyundai/

SheltieLover

(57,073 posts)
4. Imho, these cars should not be allowed to be sold here.
Fri Dec 16, 2022, 06:38 PM
Dec 2022

Loads of safety concerns & tons of recalls.

For example: exploding seatbelt tensioners. Just 1 exampke of many I've read about.

Loved the recall for onstrument panels installed up-side-down. Wth?

(No I do not own one, but lots of folks in this region do & they are absolute junk.)



NullTuples

(6,017 posts)
39. That was a proactive recall (two, really) - aren't those supposed to be a good thing?
Fri Dec 16, 2022, 10:07 PM
Dec 2022

54 reports of the problem in 2020-2023 models with a specific engine...out of 540,000 such vehicles, and they are recalling all of them to make sure they're safe.

Especially given the mess that has been the pandemic supply chain, what Ford is doing is a bad thing...how?

Ford_Prefect

(7,897 posts)
55. Exploding Pinto ver. 2.0. This was a design flaw built into the system by cheapening the materials
Sat Dec 17, 2022, 05:55 AM
Dec 2022

in the build to save money. Just like the self-baking ignition modules mounted atop the distributors in many previous Ford products.

Gidney N Cloyd

(19,835 posts)
12. I've had a Santa Fe for 10 years. Very reliable, sturdy, and virtually trouble-free.
Fri Dec 16, 2022, 07:03 PM
Dec 2022

Last edited Fri Dec 16, 2022, 07:39 PM - Edit history (1)

My mom's 2008 Elantra is still on the road, being driven by a friend of mine. No issues. My sister's on her second Tucson. No issues for her, either.

Now, lemme tell ya some stories about the Fords I've owned...

Rebl2

(13,506 posts)
21. Ford
Fri Dec 16, 2022, 07:34 PM
Dec 2022

Fix or repair daily. Had a couple of those myself. My parents had a couple Crown Vic’s that never gave them problems though. I had two Bonneville’s gave us a few problems. Now a Camery. Five years now and still no problems.

OverBurn

(950 posts)
99. Fixed Or Repaired Daily or Fucked Over Rebuilt Dodge, Found On Road Dead, For the Ford fans
Sun Dec 18, 2022, 02:07 PM
Dec 2022

First On Race Day.

MOPAR Mostly Old Parts And Rust or My Old Pig Ain't Running.

 

Dysfunctional

(452 posts)
13. I gave my 2009 Kia Optima to my neighbor when it had 174,000 miles on it.
Fri Dec 16, 2022, 07:07 PM
Dec 2022

That was 2 years ago and he still drives it without a major repair. My 2015 Optima has 87,000 miles on it.

Kali

(55,008 posts)
51. fuck that
Sat Dec 17, 2022, 12:41 AM
Dec 2022

I'm old, driven a LOT of vehicles, many beaters. Love my Kia, it is approaching 10 years old and NEVER had a major repair - or a minor one for that matter. 211 K on it.

mcar

(42,329 posts)
58. We've had a Kia minivan for nearly 20 years
Sat Dec 17, 2022, 10:34 AM
Dec 2022

It's got 200,000 miles on it and is still running decently. Except for this news about child labor, I'd buy a Kia again in a minute.

csziggy

(34,136 posts)
68. Aren't these the cars that are notorious for being easy to steal?
Sat Dec 17, 2022, 01:36 PM
Dec 2022

Yes, they are.

Hyundais, Kias are easy targets amid boom in vehicle thefts

September 22, 2022

When it comes to theft, bargain-priced vehicles manufactured by Kia and Hyundai now rival muscle cars and luxury SUVs as top targets, a Highway Loss Data Institute analysis of 2021 insurance claims shows.

Among newer models, whole vehicle theft claims were highest for the Dodge Charger SRT Hellcat, relative to its numbers on the road over 2018-22. But among 2015-19 model-year vehicles, theft claims were nearly twice as common for Hyundai and Kia vehicles as a group as for all other manufacturers, according to a recent HLDI report.

“Car theft spiked during the pandemic,” said HLDI Senior Vice President Matt Moore. “These numbers tell us that some vehicles may be targeted because they’re fast or worth a lot of money and others because they’re easy to steal.”

Many 2015-19 Hyundai and Kia vehicles lack electronic immobilizers that prevent thieves from simply breaking in and bypassing the ignition. The feature is standard equipment on nearly all vehicles of that vintage made by other manufacturers.

https://www.iihs.org/news/detail/hyundais-kias-are-easy-targets-amid-boom-in-vehicle-thefts


About the source:
The Insurance Institute for Highway Safety (IIHS) is an independent, nonprofit scientific and educational organization dedicated to reducing deaths, injuries and property damage from motor vehicle crashes through research and evaluation and through education of consumers, policymakers and safety professionals.

The Highway Loss Data Institute (HLDI) shares and supports this mission through scientific studies of insurance data representing the human and economic losses resulting from the ownership and operation of different types of vehicles and by publishing insurance loss results by vehicle make and model.

csziggy

(34,136 posts)
105. Yes, but since most cars today have an immobilizer system most don't think of it
Mon Dec 19, 2022, 12:03 PM
Dec 2022

Immobilizer systems - a steering lock if the ignition is bypassed - is standard on most car models today. It's pretty cheap and easy for the car manufacturers to put in when the car is built, but those models are just too cheap to add it.

In addition, it is a Tik Tok craze for young people to steal the cars and go joy riding.

MontanaMama

(23,314 posts)
6. This makes me insanely angry.
Fri Dec 16, 2022, 06:51 PM
Dec 2022

I have a 2020 Kia Telluride. I LOVE this car. I waited seven months for it after I ordered it. Knowing that child labor was involved takes the joy out of it.

Response to MontanaMama (Reply #6)

SharonClark

(10,014 posts)
18. Read the article before you spout off
Fri Dec 16, 2022, 07:15 PM
Dec 2022

that you would have loved working in an auto factory as a child of 12 or 14. We have child labor laws for a reason.

marble falls

(57,081 posts)
27. Except it's against the law, and takes a better paying position from an adult ...
Fri Dec 16, 2022, 08:22 PM
Dec 2022

... I would have enjoyed flying F-4s at 14, too.

wnylib

(21,450 posts)
30. Working an 8 hour shift with a half hour lunch break
Fri Dec 16, 2022, 08:58 PM
Dec 2022

standing in one position for hours at a time, keeping up with production quotas instead of going to school? Instead of socializing with peers?

NullTuples

(6,017 posts)
40. Child workers also tend to have more injuries, and more severe ones.
Fri Dec 16, 2022, 10:10 PM
Dec 2022

The same people who say, "I worked 8 hr days when I was 14" are also often likely to say things like, "I had to stop working at 50 due to back problems" or, "there's just no cartilage left in my joints, my arthritis is awful".

Hard manual labor before puberty damages bodies for life.

blue neen

(12,321 posts)
20. Really?
Fri Dec 16, 2022, 07:26 PM
Dec 2022

How about that employing children at a car factory is against the law. So, if Hyundai and Kia are willing to break this law, what other ones are they blowing off while they're building your automobiles?

It sure makes one wonder.

FredGarvin

(477 posts)
23. Um, parts suppliers???
Fri Dec 16, 2022, 07:54 PM
Dec 2022

You think US automakers dont use components that are not made in childless factories????

marble falls

(57,081 posts)
28. Do you think child labor is a great idea??? What the hell, let's just fire all adults and hire ...
Fri Dec 16, 2022, 08:30 PM
Dec 2022

... kids for peanuts. How about 14 yr old bus drivers? Bar tenders?

Just because someone else does it doesn't make it right. Like your mama once asked you: if Jimmy jumped off a bridge - would you jump, too?


It's not good and there is great pressure to end it.

https://www.forbes.com › sites › forbesbusinesscouncil › 2021 › 08 › 25 › how-businesses-can-stop-child-labor-in-their-supply-chains
How Businesses Can Stop Child Labor In Their Supply Chains - Forbes
Aug 25, 2021In their latest estimates just published in June, the U.N. anticipates another 9 million children will become child laborers by the end of 2022. For most global companies, underaged labor —...

https://www.ilo.org › asia › areas › child-labour › lang--en › index.htm
Child Labour in Asia and the Pacific - International Labour Organization
research by the ilo's international programme for the elimination of child labour (ipec) has found working children in a number of economic sectors, including domestic labour, seafood processing, garment and footwear factories, mining and quarrying, pyrotechnics, rag-picking and scavenging, rubber and sugar-cane plantations, entertainment and …

https://www.nytimes.com › 1998 › 05 › 13 › business › international-business-nike-pledges-to-end-child-labor-and-apply-us-rules-abroad.html
INTERNATIONAL BUSINESS; Nike Pledges to End Child Labor And Apply U.S ...
May 13, 1998Mr. Knight's pledges did not include increased wage, a major complaint of critics who say that Nike and other American companies pay workers in China and Vietnam less than $2 a day and workers in...

https://www.nytimes.com › roomfordebate › 2014 › 07 › 16 › what-standards-of-child-labor-should-apply-in-developing-countries › to-end-child-labor-washington-must-press-companies-to-act
To End Child Labor, Washington Must Press Companies to Act
Jul 16, 2014The United States and other developed countries were able to restrict child labor domestically because they faced no blackmail from global competition. It is these pressures that led to the...

https://share.america.gov › us-stop-forced-labor-xinjiang-china
U.S. expands push to stop forced labor in Xinjiang | ShareAmerica
Jun 30, 2021On June 24, U.S. Customs and Border Protection issued what is known as a "Withhold Release Order" against the Hoshine Silicon Industry Co. Ltd. based on evidence the Xinjiang-based company uses forced labor. The order blocks import of Hoshine's silica-based products, which are used to make solar panels, electronics and other goods.

https://www.change.org › p › nestlé-stop-the-child-labor-in-the-cocoa-plants-in-west-africa-and-the-low-wages
Petition · Stop the child labor in the cocoa plants in west Africa and ...
Petition · Stop the child labor in the cocoa plants in west Africa and the low wages · Change.org Skip to main content Start a petition My petitions Browse Membership Log in Uh oh. The server is misbehaving. You can try refreshing the page, and if you're still having problems, just try again later.

Is this what you want here in the US: a THIRD WORLD labor market???

Are you sure you're a Democrat?

LT Barclay

(2,599 posts)
80. Thanks. I can't believe the flippant and dismissive attitude toward this. I'd expect on a yahoo
Sat Dec 17, 2022, 10:48 PM
Dec 2022

article.
Sometimes I think I need to stick to other news sites. The comments are never like that at rawstory, buzzflash, or consortium news.

marble falls

(57,081 posts)
95. Usually these guys move on or get "included" out the door. I'm willing to believe he had a ...
Sun Dec 18, 2022, 08:59 AM
Dec 2022

... brainfart and for some reason felt compelled to double down on a clinker unthought out post.

wnylib

(21,450 posts)
32. So you think that the sweat shops of the robber baron era
Fri Dec 16, 2022, 09:02 PM
Dec 2022

were a good idea? Where children worked long hours in noisy dirty factories for cheap pay instead of getting fresh air, exercise, and an education?

That's where unchecked child labor leads.

AllyCat

(16,187 posts)
61. That is what I've been wondering.
Sat Dec 17, 2022, 11:04 AM
Dec 2022

Just joined a couple months ago and posts all kinds of things that don’t sound progressive or democratic.

LakeArenal

(28,817 posts)
78. I always check the profile when someone says the darnedest things.
Sat Dec 17, 2022, 06:10 PM
Dec 2022

It’s usually very illuminating.

A poor immigrant non-English speaking child of 13 at the mercy of profit pinching corporations.

What’s not to like about that? Hope one’s child finds a job like that. No college for you. Not even 9th grade.

🙄🥲

iluvtennis

(19,858 posts)
8. The kids should be required to have work permits and approval by parents and their schools. Those
Fri Dec 16, 2022, 06:52 PM
Dec 2022

were the rules when I worked back in the day as a junior high and high school student. School had to approve it as I had to be a student with in good standing with certain GPA.

Of they don't have work permits and parental/school approval, they shouldn't be allowed to work.

BumRushDaShow

(128,965 posts)
17. Here in Philly and this is a PA thing
Fri Dec 16, 2022, 07:14 PM
Dec 2022

teens could get "working papers" at age 16 but no lower. I expect those who were delivering newspapers back in the day were exempt as it was basically part time and nowadays adults are doing the deliveries, probably for obvious reasons.

In fact, I found this for PA -

PA Kids Laws

There are thousands of laws in Pennsylvania, and many of those laws deal directly with issues relating to kids. How many hours are kids allowed to work during the week? When can they get their drivers’ licenses? What is the punishment for graffiti? These and many other questions are answered below. Please take a moment to learn about the laws that affect Pennsylvania kids.

(snip)

Child Labor Laws

Did you know the minors can’t work for more than five continuous hours without a 30 minute lunch break? Or, that no child under the age of 16 can work outside school for more than four hours a day? This area explains the child labor laws in Pennsylvania.

  • Under Pennsylvania law, no child under the age of 16 may be employed. There is an exception for a child between the ages of 12 and 14, who may serve as a golf caddy, but may only carry one golf bag and not for any longer than 18 holes in one day. A child between 14 and 16 may also caddy with the restriction that it cannot interfere with school attendance.
  • No child under the age of 18 can be employed for more than six consecutive days a week or more than 44 hours in one week or more than eight hours a day. If in school, no child under the age of 18 shall be employed for more than 28 hours during a school week.
  • No child under the age of 16 can work outside school for more than four hours a day.

    (snip)


  • https://www.attorneygeneral.gov/protect-yourself/kids/pa-kids-laws/


    I expect in the southern states where there is more farming going on, you will ultimately have family farms with children working - although I don't know how they regulate that - let alone in those states.

    marble falls

    (57,081 posts)
    29. I got a work permit at 14 to bus tables and flip burgers in Ohio ...
    Fri Dec 16, 2022, 08:50 PM
    Dec 2022

    ... I had a physical at the city offices. First time I had a hernia check. Shocked that little 14 year old Lutheran. Just me and a very old doctor alone in a closet sized office.

    The rules were: no more than four days a week, no more than six hours in one day, no later than 10pm on school nights and no grades under a C.

    My summer job was on a truck farm pulling radishes, onions, beets; cutting lettuce, spinach. I made $.30/hr. The next year I got a raise to $.35/hr. this was '63 and '64. In '65 I worked at Bunny Burger and got $1.00/hr.

    The truck farm was dangerous - we were around all sorts of chemicals, machinery, tractors and some of us got hurt badly - falling off loaded trucks, Sun poisoning, radish poisoning (a real thing), insect bites.

    A couple of years later the laws changed and one had to be 18 or older to work a farm.

    I started working construction around 16-17 and used mortar mixers, drove lifts, build scaffolding, carried hods of brick and mortar up scaffling one-handed; all dangerous things. No-one under 18 should have been at it.

    I made the transition to University with no regrets. No child should have done most of the work I did when I was that young.

    BumRushDaShow

    (128,965 posts)
    35. Hundreds of thousands had the same situation
    Fri Dec 16, 2022, 09:20 PM
    Dec 2022

    whether sharecropping on farms or working in a family tailor shop where the family lived above the store.

    It's one of the things that Mother Jones tried to highlight a century and a quarter ago, where she lead children from here in Philly up to Teddy Roosevelt's house.



    marble falls

    (57,081 posts)
    36. Absolutely true. The only sick days I took from school after 13 was to mix "mud", carry ...
    Fri Dec 16, 2022, 09:45 PM
    Dec 2022

    ... buckets of it, tongs of brick, two 8" or 12" concrete block at a time to keep his hired bricklayers working. The summer I worked for him after my junior year was 6 days a week, before sun up till after sundown. When we got home, I'd unload the truck of things we were done with and the next morning reload it for the next phase, and fill a couple of barrels of water to make 'mud' the next day.

    He paid me $40/week. He told me after a month I was a good worker and was giving me a raise to $60/week. When I didn't see the raise, he told me that he figured if I was making $60/week, I could pay $20/week room and board. That was the last summer he beat me (every Thursday night). He came to hit me and I crouched, grabbed him behind his knees, collapsing him; stood up and rolled him over my shoulder to the floor of the kitchen. He realized that it would escalate to the backyard and one of us killing the other. And that stopped that, even though he still drank every Thursday night.

    Within a week of graduating HS, I was out of there and started college at Akron U that September. Back in the day when $1,000 would pay for three semesters (pre quarter days), and some of the text books.

    Kids do all sorts of dangerous, hard work to help keep their families eating. At the same time - we Americans largely treat our kids terribly, or used to.

    The one thing in my life I am very proud of is I was the very best dad to my kids I could be.

    I cannot for the life of me understand how any adult could think child labor is a good thing.

    marble falls

    (57,081 posts)
    44. I did not feel privileged and it was NO compensation for not doing things that kids get to do.
    Fri Dec 16, 2022, 10:17 PM
    Dec 2022

    My senior year, he borrowed $500 from me and NEVER paid me back.

    There was no consolation at all in what I got. Not a fucking iota of compensation at all.

    I came to forgive him, when I was about 40 when he actually asked forgiveness, he had given up drinking cold turkey a few years before, and I suppose he was performing a personal sort of 12-Step.

    The ONLY, positively only good that came from that horseshit of a childhood was: there is no beating I can't get up from, I got in very good physical shape, and I know how to work hard and do a lot of different craft. I know how to treat kids, and how to keep my expectations of other's performance realistic. I know how to keep my temper in check, but I will not be mistreated or have a hand put on me or mine.

    Life is good for me now. Child labor is an abomination. Even labor for family. Children need a childhood. Chores are one thing, adult level labor is another. Adults need to work for at least a living wage so that there is no need to exploit children.

    By the way, the ONLY time the old man paid me was during that one summer, and he borrowed most of it and never paid it back. If you think I was fortunate in any of that, well, that is one opinion.

    BumRushDaShow

    (128,965 posts)
    46. Oh I agree
    Fri Dec 16, 2022, 10:45 PM
    Dec 2022

    but we come from very different backgrounds and cultures where my ancestors were dragged kicking and screaming here against their will and then subjugated to the whims and brutalities of their owners.

    I am grateful that times have changed, although not without a lot of effort and sacrifices by many, to make right that wrong, but we still have a long way to go.

    BumRushDaShow

    (128,965 posts)
    54. You are welcome!
    Sat Dec 17, 2022, 05:44 AM
    Dec 2022

    I know annually on Labor Day on DU, I try to pay tribute to Mother Jones as this is where I first saw someone post an audio book version (Librevox) of Mother Jones' own autobiography and I was completely floored by her life and her contributions to the labor movement here in the U.S. (and particularly her involvement in the mills here in Philly).

    AllyCat

    (16,187 posts)
    62. I had to do this for my kid in Wisconsin at 14.
    Sat Dec 17, 2022, 11:06 AM
    Dec 2022

    Had to apply for a permit signed by school officials. Rules state he CANNOT work during school hours. No more than 18 hours a week.

    Children should be IN SCHOOL not “dang happy they gave a job” as some here seem to be suggesting.

    NullTuples

    (6,017 posts)
    41. And meat factories or farms hiring undocumented migrant workers should be discouraged, too.
    Fri Dec 16, 2022, 10:13 PM
    Dec 2022

    Oh, wait...they do it any way and then all too often abuse them.

    I think the point is that the factory owners don't care. Kids work for cheap.

    luv2fly

    (2,475 posts)
    15. At 14 I was cutting grass with a scythe for the US military
    Fri Dec 16, 2022, 07:08 PM
    Dec 2022

    I made a buck an hour and it was over 95° with probably 70% humidity minimum. I was happy to have the money.

    SharonClark

    (10,014 posts)
    19. Happy to have the money?
    Fri Dec 16, 2022, 07:24 PM
    Dec 2022

    I’m sure you were but the US has labor laws to protect children for working in dangerous situations and for long periods of time. We don’t leave it up to children to decide that the money is worth it.

    FredGarvin

    (477 posts)
    24. I delivered newspapers before school at 12
    Fri Dec 16, 2022, 07:57 PM
    Dec 2022

    Brutal conditions. Dangerous neighborhoods. Bad people.
    I did it though and made a few dollars a week and saved most of it.

    NullTuples

    (6,017 posts)
    42. Imagine the hit to profits if newspapers had to actually pay W2 delivery people.
    Fri Dec 16, 2022, 10:15 PM
    Dec 2022

    I'm talking about back in the day, before all the papers were bought up by private equity companies & the newsrooms fired.

    Scrivener7

    (50,949 posts)
    85. You have clearly not read the article. Perhaps you should before you make any
    Sat Dec 17, 2022, 11:56 PM
    Dec 2022

    more idiotic comparisons between your paper route and the lives these kids are living.

    FredGarvin

    (477 posts)
    26. Good for you
    Fri Dec 16, 2022, 08:01 PM
    Dec 2022

    I worked hard too as a kid.
    Bought a bike, a fishing rod, a watch and banked most of it.

    XorXor

    (621 posts)
    49. There is a difference between a kid doing a little work for extra cash
    Sat Dec 17, 2022, 12:07 AM
    Dec 2022

    Versus a kid who is working full days in a factory. Is it safe to say you were not putting a 40 hour work week cutting grass?

    I always hope that when I read these headlines, that the content of the story says it was one of the employees kids working a few hours a week to earn some extra cash, and that the entire story is just overblown clickbait. Unfortunately that is often not the case. This is legit child labor.

    luv2fly

    (2,475 posts)
    53. It was a 40 hour a week summer job
    Sat Dec 17, 2022, 04:28 AM
    Dec 2022

    Wasn't long-term, I knew there was an end and the cash as a teen was nice to have. It was also my choice.

    XorXor

    (621 posts)
    70. That's a lot of working for a 14 year old. Even if during the summer
    Sat Dec 17, 2022, 03:35 PM
    Dec 2022

    There is still a difference between a kid doing a summer job cutting grass versus a kid being employed in a factory all year long as if they're an adult. I'm going to guess your circumstances were a lot less bleak than these immigrant children who are working these jobs now. It doesn't seem fair to compare them.

    luv2fly

    (2,475 posts)
    75. I'm not supporting the violation of child labor laws
    Sat Dec 17, 2022, 03:56 PM
    Dec 2022

    I'm waiting to see what the results of the investigation show.

    Many people are responding emotionally to this, absent all the facts. Some are also pushing Western values into this scenario, and while that's understandable, in many other countries/cultures work is viewed differently, particularly work by children. Western folks don't have to like it, but they need to be aware of what they're doing and question whether or not that's appropriate. People are all pretty good at rationalizing their own belief systems.

    Scrivener7

    (50,949 posts)
    86. WTF?? Western folks DO have to like it since its happening in ALABAMA. Did you read
    Sat Dec 17, 2022, 11:59 PM
    Dec 2022

    the article? Clearly not.

    cstanleytech

    (26,291 posts)
    92. "That's a lot of working for a 14 year old" True but the question is why were they doing it?
    Sun Dec 18, 2022, 06:10 AM
    Dec 2022

    Was it because they had to do it to help support themselves and or their family then it's wrong and something should be done.
    But what if it was for some other reason such as wanting to buy a new Nvidia 4090 along with a new high end AM5 motherboard, CPU with DDR5 memory? Unless their parents are willing and or able to pay for it they are going to need all the money that they can make if they are only going to work during summer vacation.

    Deep State Witch

    (10,426 posts)
    33. Why aren't these kids in school?
    Fri Dec 16, 2022, 09:10 PM
    Dec 2022

    Are they dropouts? Are they working second shifts? I don't care how much money they're making. Child labor is against the law.

    I own a Hyundai. I like it a lot. I used to like the company a lot. However, this will be the last one I buy unless they clean up their act.

    wnylib

    (21,450 posts)
    34. To all the posters here who seem to feel nostalgic
    Fri Dec 16, 2022, 09:11 PM
    Dec 2022

    about their own experiences as child laborers, is that what you want (or wanted) for your kids? Are you really ok with this?

    NullTuples

    (6,017 posts)
    45. People romanticize being child workers
    Fri Dec 16, 2022, 10:18 PM
    Dec 2022

    The way to a better society is to require kids go to school and provide their families with the means to let them do so. But Capitalists don't very much like that way of doing things.

    XorXor

    (621 posts)
    50. It also seems like comparing apples to oranges
    Sat Dec 17, 2022, 12:10 AM
    Dec 2022

    I don't know of many people who object to anyone under 18 doing some sort of limited work to make extra cash. That's not the same as a kid having a full-time job like an adult.

    wnylib

    (21,450 posts)
    65. Exactly. Most teens get some sort of part time or
    Sat Dec 17, 2022, 12:55 PM
    Dec 2022

    occasional work for spending money, for work experience in something that they like and want to do later, or to save toward college. But not a full time job 40 hours/week or more.

    XorXor

    (621 posts)
    72. I worked in a mall Orange Julius when I was 16
    Sat Dec 17, 2022, 03:43 PM
    Dec 2022

    and then at a Fry's Electronics when I was 17. I only worked part-time, though. Getting a $300 check when I was 16 (late 90's) was the most liberating and awesome things for me at that time. That was a decent amount of money when I didn't have any bills to pay.

    I going to guess that the children in this article are not working part-time so that they can have some extra cash. It's a totally different situation.

    wnylib

    (21,450 posts)
    76. Yes it is a very different situation.
    Sat Dec 17, 2022, 03:57 PM
    Dec 2022

    From the OP, I think that they are the children of immigrants. They might or might not be undocumented. Either way, the kids appear to be helping to support their families. But they still deserve an opportunity to get an education and prepare for a future for themselves instead of working full time when they should be in school.

    The situation raises a lot of immigration questions. Are their employers recruiting undocumented people for this purpose? If undocumented, are the kids and their parents afraid of being turned in and deported if they take the kids off the job? Or ask for more pay? Or better working conditions? Are they being paid minimum wage or less than minimum? This might be a case of human trafficking for a form of enslavement.

    If they left their own country because of drugs, gang violence, extreme poverty, this might even be an improvement in their lives. But if so, there are other immigrants/asylum seekers who are welcomed and don't have to go through this. Immigration reform could end this kind of thing.



    LT Barclay

    (2,599 posts)
    81. They are probably not comparing similar cultural environments either. There is a difference between
    Sat Dec 17, 2022, 10:54 PM
    Dec 2022

    an environment where the kid could continue their education and work their way up, as opposed to those who will start out as a 14 year old factory worker, never learn to read, and be stuck in low paying jobs the rest of their lives.
    We are no longer an upwardly mobile society.

    AllyCat

    (16,187 posts)
    63. Amazing, isn't it? There is a REASON we do not have child labor
    Sat Dec 17, 2022, 11:09 AM
    Dec 2022

    And what we do have is tightly controlled as it should be. These “knee-deep snow” stories are maddening and NOT echoing progressive ideals or even SAFE ones.

    Stuart G

    (38,427 posts)
    43. Not new. 1905. Upton Sinclair "The Jungle".....Very Sad to see this still going on.
    Fri Dec 16, 2022, 10:15 PM
    Dec 2022

    If you haven't read this book, read it. It lead to labor laws in the early 1900s.

     

    The Jungle 1

    (4,552 posts)
    71. It is my handle for a reason.
    Sat Dec 17, 2022, 03:40 PM
    Dec 2022

    The northern industrial worker and miner were worthless. A slave had a value. If the worker was injured or killed the companies just went and got another worker. In a mining company town if you got close to paying off your house you were fired.
    This went on way past the end of slavery. Child labor was common.
    ***I am not trying to minimize the horror of slavery.***
    The right does not want to teach this history. They want to repeat this history! We have a very perverse labor history in this country and it needs to be taught.

    The Jungle is one good history lesson however it does not touch on mining and company towns. That is a whole other story of inhumanity and perversion. The dollar is a sickness.

    marble falls

    (57,081 posts)
    101. Led directly to the Safe Foods Act, FDA and Dept of Agticulture inspections. That book is just ..
    Sun Dec 18, 2022, 11:40 PM
    Dec 2022

    ... heart breaking.

    Stuart G

    (38,427 posts)
    102. Thanks for your analysis. Read it and you will see why laws were changed. And laws were changed
    Sun Dec 18, 2022, 11:55 PM
    Dec 2022

    because of this book. Theadore Roosevelt was President at the time, and he read it and then proposed laws
    to change what was. When you go to the store and buy meat, you know that has been inspected and is safe.

    This book changed the laws of the U.S.A. to include rigorous meat inspection.

    marble falls

    (57,081 posts)
    103. Read it the first time in the fifties. I lived in the "DP" section of Cleveland. My dad's family ...
    Mon Dec 19, 2022, 12:31 AM
    Dec 2022

    ... came from Czechoslovakia and went into the Bethlehem coal mines and the steel mills associated with them in PA. My dad's first job at 14 was relining the insides of smelters with firebrick after every pour.

    One person who worked in the same mine was Charles Bronson, who got drafted from the mine at the start of WWII. Bronson came back and went to school and acting. My grandfather died of black lung in the mid 60s. Thank G*D for the UMW and the Federal Mine Inspectors who came of the unionizing of the mines. It meant Grampa Churley had more years after he left the mines, instead of dying after Bethlehem used him up.

    I identified with those people in the slaughter houses and butcheries. The house we lived in Cleveland was described perfectly in the Chicago of that book. When the violinist ruined his hand with a boning knife, it broke my young heart. I am very familiar with that book. I've read it several times

    I graduated from Upton Sinclair to Sinclair Lewis and got to read about the story arc of my mother's father and her family in "Babbitt".

    cstanleytech

    (26,291 posts)
    56. As long as they are attending school still and being paid the same wage as an adult I have
    Sat Dec 17, 2022, 09:34 AM
    Dec 2022

    few problems with children working.
    Now if it was interfering with their schooling that is a different story as they need to be attending it.

     

    The Jungle 1

    (4,552 posts)
    74. Children should be allowed to be children
    Sat Dec 17, 2022, 03:52 PM
    Dec 2022

    Should children be operating machinery? Should they be dipping food into hot oil? Driving fork trucks or tractors. Loading wood chippers? Operating slicers?
    School is worthless if you are working everyday. I know because I worked in high school. I did no school work. I worked in a forging shop grinding flashings off castings.

    cstanleytech

    (26,291 posts)
    77. Children cannot remain children and they do grow and a job is part of growing up.
    Sat Dec 17, 2022, 04:49 PM
    Dec 2022

    As for what jobs it would have to be ones they can actually physically handle and yes that could be operating some machinery or a tractor as some children actually do drive tractors in the more rural areas on family farms where they help out doing jobs around the farm every day.
    Now the real question you should be asking and what everyone should be for these children is why are they working?
    Is it because they want to or is it because they are being pushed into it to try and support themselves and or their families?
    If its to support themselves and or their families then that should looked into as it should be a choice for them to make freely and not because they are being forced to do it.

     

    The Jungle 1

    (4,552 posts)
    79. Yes child labor was very popular years ago.
    Sat Dec 17, 2022, 10:47 PM
    Dec 2022

    A lot of republicans think we should go back to those days. The days when children operated dangerous equipment. I believe children should not be used and abused in the labor market.
    Child labor law in the US agrees with me.
    https://www.dli.pa.gov/Individuals/Labor-Management-Relations/llc/Documents/child_labor_law_prohbitions.pdf
    I suggest you read some history of child labor in the US. The history is not pleasant. I take issue with anyone suggesting we go back to those days
    You would be OK with 6 year old children volunteering to work in breaker boxes? Five year old children waiting tables. Twelve year old girls waiting tables at Hooters? Child family labor on farms has a very high injury rate!
    Children need to play.

    Scrivener7

    (50,949 posts)
    83. If you read the article, kids they profiled were not attending school.
    Sat Dec 17, 2022, 11:51 PM
    Dec 2022

    Two were living without any parents in a "sparsely furnished" place owned by the "staffing company."

    Most of the kids profiled seem to have been working full time.

    SunSeeker

    (51,553 posts)
    88. I'm guessing nobody who waxxed nostalgic about child labor read the article.
    Sun Dec 18, 2022, 04:46 AM
    Dec 2022

    Comparing a part time paper route or similar work to what these kids were doing full time without being able to go to school is disheartening to see on this board.

    Sounds like Kia was using a "staffing company" that was basically trafficking immigrant minors for their cheap labor.

    Scrivener7

    (50,949 posts)
    93. While living without parents in sparsely furnished rooms
    Sun Dec 18, 2022, 08:51 AM
    Dec 2022

    provided by the "staffing company" which, you are absolutely right, sounds like it's one step below a child trafficking ring.

    And the youngest referenced was 12.

    And multiple people up- thread are comparing it to their after school jobs they got so they could buy a bike.

    I can't believe the things I see here lately.

    Scrivener7

    (50,949 posts)
    94. You said if they were attending school you were good
    Sun Dec 18, 2022, 08:54 AM
    Dec 2022

    with it and if they weren't you weren't OK with it.

    I pointed out that the article indicated they weren't.

    cstanleytech

    (26,291 posts)
    97. I was speaking in general as if a child is attending it.
    Sun Dec 18, 2022, 10:43 AM
    Dec 2022

    In the cases where they are not as according to the article it is not acceptable.

     

    The Jungle 1

    (4,552 posts)
    57. In Pa they were called breaker boys
    Sat Dec 17, 2022, 10:09 AM
    Dec 2022

    Breaker boys often cut their hands on the slate or had fingers amputated. Some would become caught in the conveyor belt and be flung into the grinding gears of the machinery. Those who fell into the flow of coal were crushed or smothered by the mass. Many lost their feet, legs, hands, or arms.
    We have 5000 miles of dead streams in Pa because of coal barons who only loved money.
    Republicans in Pa are giving the gas frackers the same freedom to pollute.

    obamanut2012

    (26,076 posts)
    107. Neither Nike nor Apple do this
    Mon Dec 19, 2022, 12:24 PM
    Dec 2022

    Quit spreading misinformation, unless you can cite one example of this is any of their US factories or offices.

    The Amish leadership just generally suck all over the place with labor laws, incest, puppy and kitten mills, etc.

    prismpalette

    (38 posts)
    73. Sweet Home Alabama
    Sat Dec 17, 2022, 03:50 PM
    Dec 2022

    It is a right to work state and right to work states don't care as long as shareholders are happy!

    Latest Discussions»Latest Breaking News»Child workers found throu...