Fidel Castro celebrates 90th birthday, criticises Obama in public letter
Source: The Guardian (London)
Saturday 13 August 2016 22.53 EDT
Fidel Castro has thanked Cubans for their well-wishes on his 90th birthday and criticised US president, Barack Obama, in a lengthy letter published by state media. He appeared but did not speak at a gala in his honour broadcast on state television Saturday evening.
I want to express my deepest gratitude for the shows of respect, greetings and praise that Ive received in recent days, which give me strength to reciprocate with ideas that I will send to party militants and relevant organisations, he wrote.
Modern medical techniques have allowed me to scrutinise the universe, wrote Castro, who stepped down as Cubas president 10 years ago after suffering a severe gastrointestinal illness.
He sat in what appeared to be a specially equipped wheelchair and watched a musical tribute by a childrens theatre company, accompanied by footage of highlights from his decades in power.
Read more: https://www.theguardian.com/world/2016/aug/14/fidel-castro-celebrates-90th-birthday-criticises-obama-in-public-letter
Fuck you, Fidel, and your puppet brother too! Why don't you do the world a favor by not having a 91st?
![](/emoticons/puke.gif)
![](du4img/smicon-reply-new.gif)
KG
(28,755 posts)![](/emoticons/tongue.gif)
Uh huh.
LenaBaby61
(6,987 posts)It's 2016.
CASTRO=
CASTRO= IRRELEVANT
Democat
(11,617 posts)Trump will love Castro as long as Castro hates a black American president.
Ilsa
(61,731 posts)being a strong leader. That should turn Florida Blue.
IronLionZion
(45,885 posts)ungrateful bastard.
reorg
(3,317 posts)And why shouldn't he criticize Obama?
He was by far not the only one who thought the US president showed 'lack of stature' when he didn't apologize to the Japanese.
Also, from a few months earlier:
But in his letter Castro dismisses Obamas comments as honey-coated and said that Cubans ran the risk of having a heart attack on hearing these words from the president of the United States.
The former president writes that Obama is asking them to forget a ruthless blockade that has now lasted for almost 60 years, as well over half a century of US aggression against Cuba including the decades-long trade embargo against the island; the 1961 Bay of Pigs attack and the 1976 bombing of a Cuban airliner by anti-Castro exiles which killed 73 people.
https://www.theguardian.com/world/2016/mar/28/fidel-castro-obama-cuba-trip
![](http://binaryapi.ap.org/1b6180a75edc4605a7ee0a32052a72c7/460x.jpg)
Mika
(17,751 posts)Many do a cursory googling and become Cuba "experts" in a minute or two.
Most all have never been there to see the island nor met any Cubans in Cuba... yet, they are "experts" on all things Cuban.
EX500rider
(10,951 posts)Judi Lynn
(160,970 posts)many, many times, whose wife was Cuban, whose relatives are Cuban, whose friends are Cuban, who keeps in contact with them continually, who has been from one end of the island, to the other, and the waters around Cuba, and has constant contact with Cubans here.
Why would you attempt to claim he isn't an expert? Are you an expert upon who's an expert or not? Congratulations.
Truly sad how far some people will go to try to discredit others.
EX500rider
(10,951 posts)I just pointed out that would not make anybody a expert either.
Judi Lynn
(160,970 posts)EX500rider
(10,951 posts)Mika
(17,751 posts)At least going there and talking to Cubans IN CUBA would lend itself to a slightly more informed view... but, not even that - and they're experts.
Response to reorg (Reply #9)
Name removed Message auto-removed
tonekat
(1,850 posts)I heard the other day about how Fidel was criticizing Obama for not apologizing to the Japanese. I'm surprised no one is calling the GOP on their accusation (which started the moment the President walked on Japanese soil) that he did in fact apologize. I'm inclined to believe Fidel's version, given each entity's MO.
since I mostly avoid right wing sources, I hadn't been aware of those critics on the other side. But I quickly found an 'article' by that nutjob who once was Bush's ambassador to the UN:
http://nypost.com/2016/05/26/obamas-shameful-apology-tour-lands-in-hiroshima/
I vividly remember watching a public hearing of the US Senate Committee on Foreign Relations, where Biden, Kerry and Obama did their best to prevent or at least delay that appointment ...
What I had in mind were articles with comments like these:
Saying sorry, apparently, is out of the question. But why? Would it really be so terrible to apologize for searing human beings into dust and submitting tens of thousands more to an agonizing death by radiation sickness? Would it be it so terrible to apologize for leaving children with the hideous memories of fire storms that wiped out their entire families?
http://www.counterpunch.org/2016/05/27/obama-in-hiroshima-time-to-say-sorry-and-ban-the-bomb/
And, in fact, the term apology was carefully avoided in Obama's speech, as well as anything that could be interpreted as such except maybe in the general sense of "sorry, we all are beasts of nature, driven by instinct, like you are, too ...):
Their souls speak to us. They ask us to look inward, to take stock of who we are and what we might become. ...
Science allows us to communicate across the seas and fly above the clouds, to cure disease and understand the cosmos, but those same discoveries can be turned into ever more efficient killing machines.
The wars of the modern age teach us this truth. Hiroshima teaches this truth. Technological progress without an equivalent progress in human institutions can doom us. The scientific revolution that led to the splitting of an atom requires a moral revolution as well.
That is why we come to this place. ...
(etc. etc.)
http://www.nytimes.com/2016/05/28/world/asia/text-of-president-obamas-speech-in-hiroshima-japan.html?_r=0
And this is Fidel Castro's comment at the end of his birthday note:
I believe that the speech by the President of the United States when he visited Japan lacked stature, and it lacked an apology for the killing of hundreds of thousands of people in Hiroshima, in spite of the fact that they knew the effects of the bomb. The attack on Nagasaki was equally criminal, a city that the masters of life and death chose at random.
It is for that reason that we must hammer on about the necessity of preserving peace, and that no power has the right to kill millions of human beings.
http://en.granma.cu/reflections-of-fidel/2016-08-15/the-birthday
Response to reorg (Reply #87)
Name removed Message auto-removed
Response to reorg (Reply #9)
Name removed Message auto-removed
Judi Lynn
(160,970 posts)of over 600 assassination attempts.
Can hardly believe my bleeping eyes.
It wouldn't kill you, perhaps, if you tried filling in the blanks with real information you find after conscientious, determined research.
A man or woman doesn't live by propaganda alone, if he or she means to be regarded as sane.
IronLionZion
(45,885 posts)Cuban people haven't been risking their lives to float on homemade rafts to Florida over the last 50 years to visit Disney world.
If the United States is hell bent on killing someone, he'd be dead. It's Cubans who tried to assassinate an unelected dictator.
reorg
(3,317 posts)Perhaps you didn't realize: Cubans are free to travel to wherever they want. They don't need to use 'homemade rafts' any more.
And why did they before? And why would anyone risk their life to get to another country? Perhaps because they received a good education in their country of origin but expected to make a lot more dough once they got to the other place?
Look, I am in Germany and we had the exact same situation. If you grew up in the East, a good education was guaranteed and, of course, free. Then, instead of paying back their country of origin by working their asses off or just doing their job, a small number decided to make it big. They 'risked their lives' crossing the border illegally and then were able to make much more money than those who stayed in the GDR.
Why did they 'risk their lives', you ask? Because in a different social system some people have have more advantages, personally, than in others. A doctor, for instance, earned a lot more in the West than in the East. Were they better? No. Their society, those in power, had decided that you had to pay if you were sick, much more than in the East. That attracted a lot of doctors, those who were primarily interested in making money, from the East to go West. Pretty easy to understand, actually.
IronLionZion
(45,885 posts)Sounds like a perfect place for you. When did you immigrate to East Germany or Cuba? Why not?
And how many people from anywhere immigrated to those places to enjoy the great education that those greedy ungrateful people left behind?
A society that has doctors and educated people leaving is clearly not worthwhile to those doctors and educated people. You judging them as greedy for money doesn't make them want to stay. It's not that great. They obviously want a better life.
My grandparents left a communist/socialist government and immigrated to America for a better life. I thank God every day that they had the wisdom and courage to do so and that I was fortunate to be born in this great country. My life is better off because of it.
Judi Lynn
(160,970 posts)How could you have been unaware of public admissions made over the years the CIA tried many, many times, in many ways to assassinate him? One of the ones they sent to poison him even discussed it in a book well after she failed.
You are desperately uninformed, yet you make your assertions as if you actually believe you know everything about the subject. Tragic!
If the US tries to assassinate, they stay assassinated? Is that true? Not many adults believe that.
As for people trying to "flee" from Castro to the US, why have a lot of news services moved to refer to these people as "economic immigrants" over the later years?
They make the trip from Cuba. Many of them come by airplane, it's easier. Ones coming by boat are often ones who can't get visas from the US Interests Section in Havana, as they have prison records. If they make it to US dry land on their own, through water, the US Cuban Adjustment Act, designed to replace government support from Cuba with US taxpayers-financed opportunities, gives them instant legal status, no need for identification, instant work visa, instant access to social security, welfare, Food Stamps, Section 8 housing, medical treatment, and financial support for education, etc., etc., etc., etc., etc.
These benefits and rewards are NEVER available to immigrants from other countries, only those being used as political pawns from Cuba.
Haitians, who often must travel 900 miles by water, even if they do arrive on dry land, as soon as they are spotted, are sent directly home, even if it means they will be murdered. Consider the multitudes of Central Americans who do flee here, (are you going to propose they are fleeing from their countries' Presidents?) are rounded up, kept in prisons, and deported, same with Mexican people.
Has it never occurred to you it might be a good idea to find out more about the subjects you attempt to discuss with people?
IronLionZion
(45,885 posts)Why not? It sounds perfect for you.
Judi Lynn
(160,970 posts)to them if they are living in Cuba.
As for if it's perfect for me, that's something you really don't know. Pointless speculation on your part.
Being overly familiar with strangers is inappropriate.
IronLionZion
(45,885 posts)you wouldn't need American social security. Fidel just turned 90!
My great uncle lives in a socialist place ruled by a communist party that my grandparents left to immigrate to America. He turned 100 earlier this year. My grandparents passed away years ago. That should prove the benefits of socialism.
Consider immigrating to Cuba. I've heard wonderful things about it...from you!
Judi Lynn
(160,970 posts)Right-wingers all use the same odd terms, don't they?
Festivito
(13,455 posts)Castro did not like Obama's speech to the Japanese that had no apology.
"Looking forward to the future" bothered Castro? Because Cuba needs nothing from US.
Sounds like a lackluster article.
eissa
(4,238 posts)The injustice that this brutal dictator breathes while the many revolutionaries who fought for a free, democratic Cuba were killed off, imprisoned or "disappeared."
ileus
(15,396 posts)I may be a lefty, but I'm no commie supporter.
Judi Lynn
(160,970 posts)FairWinds
(1,717 posts)I always hope for a good, reasoned discussion on Cuba and Fidel's legacy.
But it rarely happens in the US because of propaganda and
brain washing.
A few facts -
1. Cuba has the best education and health care in Latin America.
Children actually play (and not beg) there, get to eat, and have good schools.
2. Cuba is more free than much of Latin America: Honduras, Guatemala,
most of Mexico, most indigenous lands, for openers.
Why does the US empire reserve its violence and hostility to a country
that does a lot of things very well?
The threat of a good example?
Throd
(7,208 posts)LanternWaste
(37,748 posts)I'd pretend that's what was being argued as well if I too, had nothing of substance to offer.
Throd
(7,208 posts)But we can always count on your dismissive passive-aggressive bullshit as sure as the sun will rise.
You're telling me that people aren't willing to risk their lives to leave Castro's utopia?
Judi Lynn
(160,970 posts)the mountains, rivers, canals, or other parts of the ocean who are fleeing from other countries in the Western Hemisphere each year trying to escape?
Are Mexicans fleeing from Pena Nieto? Are Haitians fleeing from Michel Martelly, Hondurans fleeing from Juan Orlando Hernández? Guatemalans fleeing from Jimmy Morales? El Salvadorans fleeing from Salvador Sánchez Cerén?
Why is it when the US under Reagan was fighting leftist leadership in Nicaragua, and using forces in the other Central American states, including death squads, and the people were attempting to run to the US to avoid being butchered while alive, or clubbed to death, or hacked to death with machetes, raped, shot full of holes and thrown down wells, some while still living, surrounded by murdered neighbors, and children, that Cuban right-wing Congresswoman Ileana Ros-Lehtinen and her right-wing allies in the Congress, like Jesse Helms, Tom Delay, etc. pushed for legislation to keep them from getting the same benefits in the United States she and other right-wingers had arranged for Cubans, to lure them here?
Cuban Adjustment Act? Only for Cubans, no one else: instant legal status, protection, instant work visa, complete access to social security, welfare, food stamps, Section 8 taxpayer-financed housing, medical treatment, financial assistance for education, low-cost loans for businesses, etc., etc., etc. This gives back a lot that Cubans lose when they leave their homes in Cuba, as political pawns, in the attempt to drain the Cuban economy of able-bodied young workers. These benefits are not available for immigrants from other countries, even countries where their lives are actually in grave danger.
So what terrifying "dictator" have the hundreds of ones who died in the effort so far this year try to escape? Don't forget, some of those who come from Haiti have a path across water to travel which is nine hundred miles rather than 90.
Throd
(7,208 posts)I've learned long ago that nothing in this world, natural or man-made, can ever kill your boner for the Castro regime.
Judi Lynn
(160,970 posts)Throd
(7,208 posts)In this horrible, horrible USA some speak of.
eissa
(4,238 posts)Last edited Sun Aug 14, 2016, 07:49 PM - Edit history (1)
to have decent health care and education along with a non-oppressive government. I'm not sure why we leftists continue to defend a family-run regime that cracks down on dissidents, does not allow a free press or movement, or the formation of an alternative political movement. The revolutionaries who fought to remove a dictator did so to bring about a pluralistic and free society, not one most of us would never tolerate living under.
Uponthegears
(1,499 posts)Castro's soldiers and the tens of thousands of poor Cubans who supported them as they hid in the mountains were fighting for democracy?
Have you ever heard of Maslow's Hierarchy?
eissa
(4,238 posts)Not replace him with another one. And yes, the majority were fighting to bring Jose Marti's vision of a democratic/socialist society to fruition. There are several videos of Fidel saying exactly that, as well as denying any communist affiliation. While there were some communists among the ranks, most notably Che and Raul, the official communist party didn't join the revolution until mere weeks before victory.
Uponthegears
(1,499 posts)Do you honestly believe that there is a whit of difference between Marti and Castro other than the fatal naivete of believing that the US would let a socialist democracy exist in the Western Hemisphere? Read Marti's writings. His goal was socialism, his ideal democracy. I would be interested in why you believe the former would give way to a flawed version of the latter, even for Marti.
eissa
(4,238 posts)but dear god, did you just compare Fidel to Marti? Yes, I do believe there's a huge gap. Marti wasn't a power-hungry tyrant. He wrote extensively about the fate of Latin American countries falling prey to caudillos, and the need to be rid of them and establishing free and democratic societies. I truly don't believe that Fidel sincerely believed any of that. He speaks like a populist while ruling like a fascist.
Yes, I understand the destructive role the US played in Cuba that led to the revolution. Yes, I know our short-sighted embargo policy and constant interference only fueled the dictator's grip and paranoia. But I believe Fidel's iron grip over the island was always his intention, imperialist neighbor or not.
Uponthegears
(1,499 posts)But, apart from declaring that Marti wasn't a "power-hungry tyrant" and Castro, by contrast, was a tyrant, which is nothing more than a repetition of your original claim in the form of an ad hominem attack, you offer precious little to support your premise, or to answer my simple question.
Perhaps if I ask it again in a different way, we can get a better idea of how you arrived at your original comparison. Let's try.
IF Marti knew (as history has proven beyond a shadow of a doubt) that the US and/or the same multi-nationals that fueled the Banana Republics, would not permit a socialist democracy to exist in the Western Hemisphere, which part of his vision would he have sacrificed, democracy or socialism?
I think you know the answer. Marti wrote extensively about how it was capitalism that fueled the enslavement of the people of Latin America. As did Castro, he understood that tyrannical rule was the byproduct of economic inequality, not the other way around. More importantly, and going back to my original premise, the PEOPLE, those poor people who were forced to worry about simple things like eating and not getting killed instead of engaging in high-minded political discourse over whether they should be ruled by an elected leader or a self-declared one, who stood shoulder to shoulder with Fidel, Raul, and Che, understood it too.
eissa
(4,238 posts)As much as he railed against capitalism and its exploitation, so he did of ruthless military dictatorships. And it was not just the poor who rallied to the revolution. That's what made it so beautiful -- it had the support of almost every aspect of society, including large swaths of the middle and upper classes. That Castro demonized the latter two groups to such an extent as to make himself appear as the ONLY defender of the poor, and transformed the revolution from one that sought a free and pluralistic country, to one in which only he could save the masses not only from the evil, imperialistic gringos, but from other Cubans as well, is a sad twist of history. Cuba and its people deserve better.
Uponthegears
(1,499 posts)Let me say I appreciate your reasoned arguments.
That being said, I agree there is no doubt that wide swaths of Cuban society joined in the fight to overthrow Batista. Indeed, staunchly anti-socialist forces participated in the process. To say, however, that they "joined" Castro, goes a bit too far IMHO.
I suggest it would be more accurate to say that there were factions who strongly opposed such Marti-esque ideas such as land reform and redistribution of wealth, BUT who nonetheless supported the overthrow of Batista because they hoped to dominate the succeeding government (as the wealthy ordinarily do). I don't know that such an alliance qualifies as much "beautiful" event as it does as an opportunistic alliance. Their interests, other than the narrow interest of removing Batista, remained basically antagonistic.
The fact that their hopes of dominating the next government were overborn by the hopes of the poor to escape the oppression of capitalism, while certainly disappointing for them, does not turn Castro into some sort of Machiavelli who led them on with promises of "democracy first." It was well-known among both his supporters and his competitors that Castro's first interest was in socialist wealth redistribution.
eissa
(4,238 posts)We may not agree on everything, but I nevertheless enjoy talking about Cuban politics, particularly the revolutionary years. My personal hero is Camilo Cienfuegos. I'm sure we could have a lively discussion about his views and where he would be today, but I'm sure that's another can of worms
![](/emoticons/hi.gif)
Judi Lynn
(160,970 posts)Mika
(17,751 posts)He and Nelson Mandela wrote an excellent book on their political ideals.
killbotfactory
(13,566 posts)Eisenhower authorized the CIA to carry out Operation PBSUCCESS in August 1953. The CIA armed, funded, and trained a force of 480 men led by Carlos Castillo Armas. The force invaded Guatemala on 18 June 1954, backed by a heavy campaign of psychological warfare, including bombings of Guatemala City and an anti-Árbenz radio station claiming to be genuine news. The invasion force fared poorly militarily, but the psychological warfare and the possibility of a U.S. invasion intimidated the Guatemalan army, which refused to fight. Árbenz resigned on 27 June, and following negotiations in San Salvador, Carlos Castillo Armas became President on 7 July 1954.
The coup was widely criticized internationally, and created lasting anti-U.S. sentiment in Latin America. Castillo Armas quickly took dictatorial powers, banning all political parties, torturing and imprisoning political opponents, and reversing the social reforms of the Guatemalan Revolution. A series of U.S.-backed authoritarian governments ruled Guatemala until 1996. The repression sparked off the Guatemalan Civil War between the government and leftist guerrillas, during which the military committed massive human rights violations against the civilian population, including a genocidal campaign against the Maya peoples.[11] The coup has been described as the definitive deathblow to democracy in Guatemala.[10]
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1954_Guatemalan_coup_d%27%C3%A9tat
There is a reason Cuba became oppressive and authoritarian. It wasn't because their leaders were mad with power, it was to survive the relentless onslaught of US bullshit that was to come: an invasion, terrorism, hundreds of assassination attempts, economic warfare, etc. All governments become authoritarian when faced with those kinds of threats.
geek tragedy
(68,868 posts)Either he's wonderful or pure evil.
Truth is in between-a tyrant who has overseen much progress for the people he rules. But all tyrants become obsolete, quickly.
Uponthegears
(1,499 posts)in the face of true, not manipulated, freedom.
dflprincess
(28,135 posts)(for all his faults) than they did when the U.S. stooge, Batista, was running the show.
As you note, at least with Castro they received education and healthcare - something they did not have before Castro. I doubt that most the people here who criticize Castro have any clue about what Cuba was like with Batista (except what they saw in "Godfather II" .
Throd
(7,208 posts)hack89
(39,171 posts)why was 50 years of Castro in charge necessary to bring about education and healthcare?
dflprincess
(28,135 posts)Castro did come to the U.S. asking for help with the revolution and was turned away.
My frustration comes from those who pretend that everything was just fine in Cuba before Castro and that there were improvements after Batista was thrown out and that we've had nothing to do with any of it.
BTW you might also ask why can't the U.S. have education (beyond secondary), healthcare and multi-party democracy. The answer is the same.
hack89
(39,171 posts)Castro and his inner circle are no different than every other despot in the world. Power and wealth were their motivation.
dflprincess
(28,135 posts)That's why the working and middle classes have done so well over the last 35 years.
hack89
(39,171 posts)That fundamental difference is all the difference in the world. You don't live in a repressive police state.
dflprincess
(28,135 posts)And that if the U.S had been willing to help Castro rather than protect corporate profits they may have had more rights?
hack89
(39,171 posts)Not the same person wrapped in different rhetoric. What stopped Castro from implementing democracy?
dflprincess
(28,135 posts)after the U.S. refused it (not that the U.S. wouldn't back a dictator, after all Batista was our guy at the time).
And Castro was better than Batista in that the population got education and health care and the people in rural areas no longer had to work themselves to death for the pittance United Fruit paid them.
hack89
(39,171 posts)And they will take their place in the global economy with democracy and the right to travel. The pent up demand is too strong for the Cuban government to even dare to resist.
Judi Lynn
(160,970 posts)looking for leftists?
What do you call Batista's death squads, who had leftists dig their own graves, then shot them when they were finished?
What do you call death squads which put leftists in gunny sacks, poured gasoline over them, and set them on fire?
What do you call Batista's killers, some of them called "Tigres," "Masferrer's Tigers" who took young people and quartered them, hanging limbs, etc. from trees, to strike fear into the citizens of their towns, and pressure them to fear Batista too much to rebel, they hoped?
[center]
Mothers of murdered young men who were tortured and murdered, some hung from trees in Santiago de Cuba.
Some mothers trying to reach US ambassador Earl Smith
to beseech him to try to influence to stop murdering their
sons, getting hosed down with fire hoses for their efforts. [/center]
Men hanging from lampposts?
People thrown out of Tigres' cars into the streets after being tortured to death. What would you call that?
Masferrer went and hid in South Florida after the Revolution, but he didn't hide well enough, as someone murdered him back there.
Why has none of this happened after the people's revolution? Not even our dirtiest propagandists have dared accuse the revolutionary government of these formerly US approved tactics under Batista.
Just keep on trying. People learn to recognize the truth when they hear it, and they learn to be able to tell if people are truthful who write it, too. Character counts.
hack89
(39,171 posts)Last edited Wed Aug 17, 2016, 07:57 AM - Edit history (1)
He was supposed to bring freedom to the Cuban people. Turns out he was not really that different. At least Bautista did not use the rhetoric of freedom and democracy - he was honest in his lust for power and wealth.
Judi Lynn
(160,970 posts)hack89
(39,171 posts)the new generation of leaders will not be able to contain the people's desire for political and economic freedom. The more Cuba opens itself to the world, the more the people will see what they do not have.
reorg
(3,317 posts)which they only will be able to get, though, if the GOP knuckleheads stop vilifying the Cuban revolution and lift the embargo.
Judi Lynn
(160,970 posts)cancer diagnostic equipment, dialysis machines, tons and tons of hospital, medical tools, machinery they have been forced to do without due to the fact the US's extra-territorial reach of the embargo forbids them to even purchase these things from other countries if the equipment has components in them which origignated in the US.
Other countries have protested these underhanded tactics for years and years. They do run the real risk of becoming a US enemy if caught trying to sell the life-saving equipment. If Cuba can secure the life-saving items somewhere, it must pay many times its price to buy it on the black market.
Other countries maintain there is actually a blockade in place, rather than an embargo, because the US actually forces other countries to not do business with Cuba, themselves. Grotesque, massive bullying against a helpless nation, brutally impacting the lives of Cubans needing emergency medical care in many cases. That should be illegal, and many countries insist the long reach into their business with Cuba IS illegal in international law.
NuclearDem
(16,184 posts)tclambert
(11,089 posts)Did he blame Obama for a 42% unemployment rate? Did he say Obama allowed millions of illegal immigrants to walk right into our country? Did he say Obama allows terrorists disguised as Syrian refugees into America without any attempt to screen them?
Well, then I guess he likes America better than Trump does.
brooklynite
(95,559 posts)FairWinds
(1,717 posts)I'm impressed.
When I was in Cuba I was also impressed with the degree of democracy
in everyday life: schools, farms, municipalities and churches all had
wide and active participation.
How much democracy is there in everyday US life? Not very damn much.
We were there shortly after the special period, when hunger meant that
the average adult lost at least 15 pounds, and vitamin deficiency was almost
universal.
But at the same time, the Cubans made sure that every single child in the
entire country got their half liter of milk per day. The Cubans are really proud
of that, as well they should be.
When people in the US are hungry, how do we respond?
The above being said, I am no supporter of the communist party upper
echelon in Cuba - although I did meet many lower lever party members who
were very exceptional people.
hack89
(39,171 posts)because that is what real democracy is all about - the routine and peaceful transfer of power between competing groups.
FairWinds
(1,717 posts)Not the ancient Greeks.
And BTW, even under your definition, the US is not doing so
well democracy-wise.
The Koch bros. will be quite surprised to learn that they might have
to give up their power at some point.
I could go on - voter suppression, low info, gerrymandering,
money as speech, inability to properly count votes . . but you get the idea.
I'm a retired political scientist . .
hack89
(39,171 posts)all you just told me is that Castro failed but in a different manner. Certainly not something to be proud about.
I am a retired super hero - at least on DU.
FairWinds
(1,717 posts)You mean the US corporatocracy?
NuclearDem
(16,184 posts)Then you'd know the United States isn't a democracy, but a republican government.
Figured since you were demanding nuance about Cuba, you might show a little bit yourself about American government.
Judi Lynn
(160,970 posts)I never questioned any of it, assuming everything I "knew" was the truth, since I'd heard it all my life.
Did this until Elian Gonzalez was held prisoner, away from his surviving parent, in Miami. Followed the news with growing curiosity until I learned the man, his drunken great-uncle Lazaro Gonzalez, who was his "host," had made previous vacations trips to Cuba and stayed at the little boy's house with Juan Miguel Gonzalez, his father, nephew of the older man.
I heard this repeatedly. It's also mentioned in a book written later, by former NY Times reporter, Ann Louise Bardach. It threw up a flag which didn't fit in with everything else I had heard: why on earth would one of these poor, bedraggled "refugees" ever dream of going back to Cuba, staying for days on end, go fishing, and hang out in bars at night?
He also gave the family a goat, at one point, for the privilege of having taken Juan Miguel Gonzalez' bedroom, as it was offered to him, while the father slept out in his own car, in order to be gracious.
How can this happen?
Once you reach the critical turning point, and admitting to yourself you've met information which doesn't fit into the pattern, and start doing your own homework, researching actual history between the countries, and start trying to arrive at the truth, you will eventually learn you've been had, not just a little, but profoundly.
From that point the door opens upon a whole new world of real information, but you have to do the work, yourself. It will not be given to you. What HAS been given is the opposite of the truth, the entire opposite. Only the most ignorant, and presumptuous people continue to try to perpetrate these whoppers, and you will see you've reached a point in your mental, spiritual, psychological life which is the point of no return, you can't ever go back to the idiotic, embarrassing ignorance they wallow in now. You can't go back once you have dug your way out of ignorance.
Your suspicion you DON'T know everything you thought you did will be your ticket out of stupidity. It's so within your reach. Best wishes.
FairWinds
(1,717 posts)So now, like when the militarists and the MSN go on about, say,
something like WMD's in Iraq, I tend to assume they are lying -
about that, and everything else.
Works most of the time.
Well written description of your conscience-ization, as they
say in Spanish.
Judi Lynn
(160,970 posts)So glad to hear from someone who shared that awakening.
It's a shock, and then disgust, isn't it? Since it's a personal experience you feel no one can understand it who hasn't been through it, too. That's probably still true!
Congratulations to those who make it out! Thank you.
EX500rider
(10,951 posts)That the Cuban government has been accused of numerous human rights abuses including torture, arbitrary imprisonment, unfair trials, and extrajudicial executions (also known as "El Paredón" . Human Rights Watch has stated that the government "represses nearly all forms of political dissent" and that "Cubans are systematically denied basic rights to free expression, association, assembly, privacy, movement, and due process of law."
That Cuba had the second-highest number of imprisoned journalists of any nation in 2008 (China had the highest) according to various sources, including the Committee to Protect Journalists and Human Rights Watch.
That Cuban dissidents face arrest and imprisonment. In the 1990s, Human Rights Watch reported that Cuba's extensive prison system, one of the largest in Latin America, consists of 40 maximum-security prisons, 30 minimum-security prisons, and over 200 work camps. According to Human Rights Watch, Cuba's prison population is confined in "substandard and unhealthy conditions, where prisoners face physical and sexual abuse."
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cuba#Human_rights
Judi Lynn
(160,970 posts)U.S. Aggression & Propaganda Against Cuba
Why the unrelieved U.S. antagonism toward Cuba?
by Michael Parenti
Z magazine, September 2004
. . .
Double Standard "Democracy"
U.S. policymakers have long condemned Cuba for its controlled press. The Cubans, we are told, are subjected to a totalitarian indoctrination and do not enjoy the diverse and open discourse that is said to be found in the "free and independent" U.S. media. In fact, the average Cuban has more access to Western news sources than the average U.S. citizen has to Cuban sources. The same was true of the former Soviet Union. In 1985 Soviet leader Mikhail Gorbachev pointed out that U.S. television programs, movies, books, music, and magazines were in relative abundance in the USSR compared to the almost nonexistent supply of Soviet films and publications in the United States. He offered to stop jamming Voice of America broadcasts to his country if Washington would allow normal frequency transmission of Radio Moscow to the U.S., an offer the U.S. government declined.
Likewise, Cuba is bombarded with U.S. broadcasting, including Voice of America, regular Spanish-language stations from Miami, and a U.S. -sponsored propaganda station called "Radio Marti." Havana has asked that Cuba be allowed a frequency for Cuban use in the United States, something Washington has refused to do. In response to those who attack the lack of dissent in the Cuban media, Fidel Castro has promised to open up the Cuban press to all opponents of the Revolution on the day he saw U.S. Communists enjoying regular access to the U.S. major media. Needless to say, U.S. rulers have never taken up the offer.
Cuba has also been condemned for not allowing its people to flee the island. That so many want to leave Cuba is treated as proof that Cuban socialism is a harshly repressive system, rather than that the U.S. embargo has made life difficult in Cuba. That so many millions more want to leave capitalist countries like Mexico, Nigeria, Poland, El Salvador, Philippines, South Korea, Macedonia, and others too numerous to list is never treated as grounds for questioning the free-market system that inflicts such misery on the Third World.
In accordance with an agreement between Havana and Washington, the Cuban government allowed people to leave for the United States if they had a U. S. visa. Washington had agreed to issue 20,000 visas a year, but granted few, preferring to incite illegal departures and reap the propaganda value. Cubans who fled illegally on small crafts or hijacked vessels and planes were hailed as heroes who had risked their lives to flee Castro's tyranny and were granted asylum in the U.S. When Havana announced it would let anyone leave who wanted to, the Clinton administration reverted to a closed door policy, fearing an immigration tide. Now policymakers voiced concerns that the escape of too many disgruntled refugees would help Castro stay in power by easing tensions within Cuban society. Cuba is condemned for not allowing its citizens to leave and then for allowing them to leave.
More:
http://www.thirdworldtraveler.com/Caribbean/US_Aggression_Cuba.html
FairWinds
(1,717 posts)have you read the HRW report on the US?
It's pretty devastating - but of course does not make the "news" - i.e., propaganda
torture? extrajudicial killings? police abuses?
We got it all.
EX500rider
(10,951 posts)FairWinds
(1,717 posts)of which, BTW, I am a member.
But why depend on them?
I'd suggest you go there yourself and make up your own mind.
That is what I did.
EX500rider
(10,951 posts)....is a one party repressive police state.
FairWinds
(1,717 posts)"Do yourself a favor: take a moment out from telling everyone what you think you know, and actually learn something about Cuba. You'll feel better, in the end, even though it does require effort."
EX500rider
(10,951 posts)WillyBrandt
(3,892 posts)I suppose one upside of his birthday is being taught, my our more learned DUers, that:
- Castro is both a hero and without agency. He was forced to not just seize power but retain it for 50+ years
- Cuba's a nicely run place! You can understand why people from all around Latin America go out of their way to find their way into the island.
- ... say you grant that Castro is maybe sorta a power-seizing, power-holding tyrant, that it is besides the point. True Democracy is a lived experience, and life is lived on the ground, and the cooperation at the block level, and small things like elections are just a way the oligarchs distract you. (Political prisoners? Neighborhood Stasi-minders? Details! Details!)
Judi Lynn
(160,970 posts)Maybe you can get permission from the US government to go there to find out for yourself, or merely start doing your homework, and learning to do research. You'll be much better for it.
As for large groups of people moving to Cuba, US citizens learned they couldn't go there upon retirement because the US government refuses to send anyone's Social Security check he/she has earned to them if they have a Cuban address. You can check that out.
Oh, also, it's still illegal for individuals to travel there, unless they happen to be Cuban "exiles" or their progeny, or if they go there with a sponsored group, as in a tour, for some reason that's OK with Uncle Sam. Not so many chances for bumping into person-to-person situations and having heart to heart conversations, or getting taken around to meet their friends and family, etc., and finding out about life on the island.
There are a few towns in Cuba where Haitian-Cubans live, learn in their own language, even have their own radio station, etc.
Found a quick grab from google regarding a woman's trip, taken during Bill Clinton's Presidency:
Creole Language and Culture: Part of Cuba's Cultural Patrimony
by Susana Hurlich, Havana, 21 May 1998
The first question asked by all Haitians who visit Cuba from outside the country is about Guantanamo, which has been historically the most important region of the country for Haitian residents and descendants - that is, for Creole language and culture. Although no census of Haitians (residents or descendants) in Cuba has been done to date, in the 1980's a group of sociologists from Guantanamo did a study on genealogies of Haitians living in the province. At that time, they estimated that some 45,000 descendants of Haitians and another 4,000 native Haitians were living throughout the province.
Today, there are over 40 groups around the country that promote Creole culture, such as the fabulous choral group, "Desandann", which sings traditional Creole songs with a delicacy, harmony and passion that is gripping. Based in Camaguey and recently returned from a tour in New York, "Desandann" members are all descendants of Haitians.
An annual carnival, begun by Haitians and immigrants from Barbados who arrived in Cuba during the nineteenth century, still takes place. Cuba also participates in international festivals dedicated to Haitian culture - in July '94, such a festival was held in Santiago de Cuba. For years, many Haitians and their descendants in Cuba did not identify themselves as such or speak Creole. In the eastern part of the island, many Haitians suffered discrimination. But since 1959, this discrimination has stopped.
After Spanish, Creole is the second most-spoken language in Cuba. Over 400,000 Cubans either speak it fluently, understand it but speak with difficulty, or have at least some familiarity with the language. It is mainly in those communities where Haitians and their descendant live that Creole is most spoken. In addition to the eastern provinces, there are also communities in Ciego de Avila and Camaguey provinces where the population still maintains Creole, their mother tongue. Classes in Creole are offered in Guantanamo, Matanzas and the City of Havana. There is a Creole-language radio program.
More:
http://slavery.uga.edu/cuba-trip/background.html
I heard about "Desandann" years ago and bought one of their CD's. Wonderful! They are popular all over the world, everywhere except the United States, of course.
Do yourself a favor: take a moment out from telling everyone what you think you know, and actually learn something about Cuba. You'll feel better, in the end, even though it does require effort.
Judi Lynn
(160,970 posts)August 15, 2016
Fidel the Guerrilla in 201516 and Beyond
by Arnold August
Presentation on the panel A Tribute to Fidel Castro on His 90th Birthday,
World Social Forum Montreal 2016, August 12, 2016.
During Obamas historic visit to Cuba on March 2023, 2016, I was commentating on the event with Cuban colleagues for the Caracas-based TeleSUR television network. On the Cuban side, the event was overshadowed by Cuban diplomacy skillfully led, in a complex situation, by President Raúl Castro and the Ministry of Foreign Affairs. From the Obama administrations perspective, the trip also consisted of diplomacy. However, it was tainted by a heavy dose of speeches and talks that promoted U.S. Cuba policy, which is very self-serving. The resistance in Cuba by Cubans and some foreigners, including myself, to this U.S. cultural, political and ideological assault seemed to have taken a backseat. However, on March 27, only a few days after Obamas departure from Cuba, Fidel Castro shared his reflections, ironically titled Brother Obama. It hit Cuba and the world like a bomb. We will soon analyze it.
Allow me for the moment to share with you my immediate reaction. When I read Brother Obama, my first thought was, Fidel Castro remains the guerrilla he always was. A guerrilla such as Fidel leading his Sierra Maestra comrades is mobile and waits for the appropriate moment to go on the offensive. In hiding, the revolutionaries allow the enemy to wonder where the July 26 Movement is camped out. Gathering ammunition and forces among the population, the counteroffensive is mapped out and prepared in detail. No stone is left unturned. Not too early, and not a moment too late. However, all of these preparations are worked out in harmony with the people, taking into account their needs and level of preparation, including their strengths and weaknesses. The key ingredient is also the unwavering courage of the leaders, such as Fidel, who are ready to lay their lives on the line to achieve victory. Fidel the guerrilla leads by example. Taking into account all the above-mentioned ingredients, this is how, among other factors, the July 26 Movement led all the other revolutionary forces in Cuba to the Triumph of the Revolution on January 1, 1959. This watershed in Cuban and Latin American history was carried out against the overwhelmingly superior forces of the U.S.-backed Batista dictatorship.
This is the Fidel, the eternal guerrilla, whom I recognized on March 27, 2016, when he wrote Brother Obama, using his pen as his arm for a surprise counterattack at the moment it was most needed, in order to respond to the needs of the Cuban resistance to the U.S. offensive. He thus contributed to the depth and expansion of the growing intransigence by the majority of Cubans. It took enormous daring to challenge the international imperial tide that was seeking to engulf Cuba with the notion of the U.S. as the saviour of Cuba. The Empire immediately threw up its hands in despair and disappointment. They erroneously thought that the U.S. Cuba policy had wrapped things up in Cuba and internationally. Thus, once again the U.S. and the Western establishment zeroed in on Fidel as they have done without let-up since the 1950s, but this time as a spoiler in the new situation.
In preparing for this panel for today, I decided to re-read all that Fidel had written since the historic joint announcement by Presidents Raúl Castro and Barack Obama on December 17, 2014. I concentrated on those texts that touched on, even as a secondary theme, foreign affairs and especially CubaU.S. relations. There are six such texts. In reading them again, this time with the hindsight of Brother Obama, I saw in them as well the guerillas firmly stamped mark. This perspective was something that I had not detected at the time of their publications, and is thus the reason for my choice of title for this presentation: Fidel the Guerrilla in 201516 and Beyond. How and why beyond? We will see. I would like to begin by sharing with you my experience in reviewing these texts.
More:
http://www.counterpunch.org/2016/08/15/fidel-the-guerrilla-in-2015-16-and-beyond/
Good Reads:
http://www.democraticunderground.com/1016165480
Judi Lynn
(160,970 posts)August 15, 2016
Fidel Castro: 90 Revolutionary Years
by Francisco Dominguez
A great man is great not because his personal qualities give individual features to great historical events, but because he possesses qualities which make him most capable of serving the great social needs of his time, needs which arose as a result of general and particular causes.
GV Plekhanov
London.
In the contemporary world nobody else symbolises the modern revolutionary spirit better than Fidel Castro. From his very first incursions into politics he seemed to have been imbued with an almost insane, verging on the irrational, faith in the victory of his undertakings, many of which were carried out against extraordinary odds.
It was with this spirit that he organised and led the military attack against the Moncada Barracks on the now historic date of of 26 July 1953 when he was not yet 27 years old. The attack was a huge risk, involving 137 badly equipped, poorly trained fighters against one of the largest and best armed military garrisons in the country, housing more than 500 soldiers. Fidels insurgents faced far superior firepower and had a slim chance of success, but only if the surprise factor worked. It did not.
Following his capture after the attack, Fidel took the gamble to defend himself at the trial in a political context dominated by the intensely repressive Batista dictatorship.
In October 1960, Senator John Kennedy said: Fulgencio Batista murdered 20,000 Cubans in 7 years a greater proportion of the Cuban population than the proportion of Americans who died in both World Wars, and he turned democratic Cuba into a complete police state destroying every individual liberty. This gives a measure of Fidels audacity to undertake his own legal and political defence.
More:
http://www.counterpunch.org/2016/08/15/fidel-castro-90-revolutionary-years/
CanSocDem
(3,286 posts)Judi Lynn
(160,970 posts)SammyWinstonJack
(44,130 posts)Dreamer Tatum
(10,926 posts)Judi Lynn
(160,970 posts)EX500rider
(10,951 posts)...as a one-party communist state?
Basically the definition of despot or dictator.
reorg
(3,317 posts)Judi Lynn
(160,970 posts)MrScorpio
(73,631 posts)Being ALWAYS critical of American leadership is what gives him his joy in his life.
It's not like the US is actually harmed by it.
It's just the longest running game he's been playing since he came to power. He's saying, "I'm still here, Yanquis, outliving you and your predecessors."
Let him have his fun.