Regarding Manson - We won.

[annabanana]

By not executing him, we left open the possibility, (however remote), that he would have a moral recovery and truly suffer.

[Marengo]

1. Did he have a moral recovery as you phrase it?

[annabanana]

4. He did not. But we continued to hold out the possibility.. . .n/t

[Igel]

7. So the reason for his moral recovery would be the pain we wanted to inflict.

I view incarceration as primarily a large, extended time out.

At points the US has aimed for rehabilitation, which is a more important goal than pain and suffering. If somebody wrong's me, I'd want them to (1) make it good through compensation, if that's possible; (2) stop doing wrong and start doing what's right, in a more general sense. The only "suffering" I'd want them to experience is the suffering that comes from realizing that what they did was wrong and turn to doing what's right, and I'd regret any more than is necessary for that goal.

[annabanana]

8. that would have been the pain of remorse I was referring jto. . .n/t

[MoonRiver]

9. I didn't.

[gratuitous]

12. He also had regular parole hearings

I can't imagine those hearings were much fun for the board, but I'd bet that Manson probably didn't relish them, either. Every seven years or so, he had to check in with a skeptical audience and try to demonstrate some moral progress.

[Fullduplexxx]

2. No we didnt . He didnt change and he didnt suffer . We were a babysitter to a monster

Who should have been destroyed in the 70's

[annabanana]

5. We didn't know he wouldn't.

We retain the moral high ground. To me that's worth the cost of incarceration.

[MoonRiver]

10. The reasons I'm against the dp are: innocent people can be executed;

the cost of execution is higher than life in prison; and, I want us to be better than cold-blooded murderers. If that's what you meant by moral high ground I agree. But, no way did I think Manson would have a "come to jesus" moment, at least not sincerely. I'm glad he's dead.

[annabanana]

11. (me too). . . .n/t

[Dave Starsky]

13. That's the ONLY reason I'm against it.

I have a problem with the state being able to kill people at will when they constantly fuck it up and even cold-bloodedly murder people they just don't like.

But I have no illusions that every person is "fixable". Some people are just plain wired wrong and are a terrible danger to others as long as they are free. I don't see the point in paying for these people's room, board, etc., for many decades before they finally kick off.

[MichMary]

3. On principle,

I oppose the death penalty.

However, I think it's a shame that he has been allowed to get three hots, a cot, and free healthcare for the last 50 years, and to this day still has groupies.

[stopbush]

6. Yeah, because being in prison for almost 50 years is like a day at the beach.

Justice was served in this case.