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Kentonio

(4,377 posts)
Sat Apr 22, 2017, 11:53 AM Apr 2017

People turning on Matt Taibi

Ok, for full disclosure I'm a huge fan of Matt's writing. I keep seeing people talking about him as an 'apologist' or 'stooge' for Putin and Russia. Now it's possible I'm missing something (I've seen several articles he's written on Russia) but from my understanding his point isn't 'this didn't happen' but purely warning that we need to be extremely careful to make sure we can PROVE it happened. He also makes some very good points about the lack of trust in the media by the public, and how false allegations could further damage that weakened relationship.

Now that to me doesn't sound like apologism. That sounds like the adult in the room reminding people not to run before they can walk, and make sure they're damn sure about what they're claiming before they damage themselves by over-reaching. Given what we've seen my personal feeling is that there are almost certainly some huge and shocking revelations set to come out proving collusion, but I don't think its a negative to approach it carefully and make sure we're hitting the right targets and not just throwing around speculation.

There's a famous lawyer rule, that you should never ask a question you don't already know the answer to. I think for the media this probably falls under that rule. We rely on them to investigate and ask the right questions, but if we set up specific accusations and then they are proven false, it will undermine later investigation and reporting of real related wrongdoing. We can't just swing and miss repeatedly and hope we eventually hit one, we need to make sure our aim is true.

22 replies = new reply since forum marked as read
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People turning on Matt Taibi (Original Post) Kentonio Apr 2017 OP
He has played the far left nini Apr 2017 #1
Please explain how you come to this conclusion. Kentonio Apr 2017 #2
I'm wondering how Taibi's lies and distortions about Hillary Hortensis Apr 2017 #12
Never liked him, ever since I caught him red-handed citing words Kahuna7 Apr 2017 #3
Taibbi is a piece of shit onecaliberal Apr 2017 #5
Yes. I haven't trusted him since he made BS accusations against Clark. Crunchy Frog Apr 2017 #8
First time I've seen this so please fill in me if I get anything wrong Kentonio Apr 2017 #9
A good link to the Nation article.. Kahuna7 Apr 2017 #10
Thank you very much! Kentonio Apr 2017 #11
Read his wiki page... SticksnStones Apr 2017 #13
there's skepticism and there's denialism.. JHan Apr 2017 #4
No he's not melman Apr 2017 #14
Yeah, he is JHan Apr 2017 #20
I generally like Matt Taibi's writing too. Zing Zing Zingbah Apr 2017 #6
He's a tough guy, I'm sure he can protect himself. emulatorloo Apr 2017 #7
Great men must be protected against the subversive speech of citizens BainsBane Apr 2017 #17
Ah I see.. Kentonio Apr 2017 #18
I have a right to free speech? BainsBane Apr 2017 #19
No Kentonio Apr 2017 #21
You're not missing anything melman Apr 2017 #15
Big fan of Matt Taibbi. Learn a lot. Nanjeanne Apr 2017 #16
I've liked a lot of things he's written over the years, 6000eliot Apr 2017 #22

Hortensis

(58,785 posts)
12. I'm wondering how Taibi's lies and distortions about Hillary
Sat Apr 22, 2017, 04:04 PM
Apr 2017

somehow went unnoticed for the better part of two years.

No one who looks for honesty in political writing should be surprised now at Taibi's swinging around like an apologist weather vane whenever something embarrassing to him or whose he supports turns up. Trump's Russia connections overblown?! Good grief. Of course, Taibi's part in the creation of Russiagate needs some major spinning and ass-covering, but not by claiming it's really not that big a deal.

Kahuna7

(2,531 posts)
3. Never liked him, ever since I caught him red-handed citing words
Sat Apr 22, 2017, 12:22 PM
Apr 2017

to Wes Clark when he ran that Clark never said. He claimed that Clark endorsed the Military Industrial Complex. I was at the event with a video recorder and posted the video of what Clark said here and elsewhere to expose him as a liar. Clark said the exact opposite of what Taibbi claimed.


On edit:
Below is the DU link to the thread about Taibbi smearing Clark.


https://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=104x787090

Crunchy Frog

(26,753 posts)
8. Yes. I haven't trusted him since he made BS accusations against Clark.
Sat Apr 22, 2017, 01:54 PM
Apr 2017

Not surprised that he's displaying his true colors now.

 

Kentonio

(4,377 posts)
9. First time I've seen this so please fill in me if I get anything wrong
Sat Apr 22, 2017, 03:18 PM
Apr 2017

But while I can understand going from "I know those guys in the Pentagon. I was one of those guys." to "I'm a product of the military industrial complex" is certainly a misquote or hyperbole, it doesn't seem like the worst smear in the world.

I should point out though that the articles linked in those posts are no longer available so it's more than possible I'm missing other information here. Was there more to it?

Zing Zing Zingbah

(6,496 posts)
6. I generally like Matt Taibi's writing too.
Sat Apr 22, 2017, 12:48 PM
Apr 2017

I haven't read any of his stuff recently. What you describe sounds reasonable to me though.

BainsBane

(53,180 posts)
17. Great men must be protected against the subversive speech of citizens
Sat Apr 22, 2017, 04:59 PM
Apr 2017

whose obligation is to defer to authority and privilege. That applies to Taibi, Assange, Sanders, Hartman, and anyone else deemed more important than the rights and lives of lowly citizens.

 

Kentonio

(4,377 posts)
18. Ah I see..
Sat Apr 22, 2017, 05:02 PM
Apr 2017

So free speech gives you the right to criticize, but we don't have the right to question your criticism or we're trampling on your free speech? Nice racket.

BainsBane

(53,180 posts)
19. I have a right to free speech?
Sat Apr 22, 2017, 05:11 PM
Apr 2017

Last I heard I had a right to exactly nothing. My rights paled in comparison to the infallibility of the great man, and my daring to raise them was an outrage.

I don't give even half a shit about Matt Taibi. I care about principles, civil rights and economic justice for ALL, not the careers of a few individuals you have decided are more important than the rest of the human race.


 

Kentonio

(4,377 posts)
21. No
Sat Apr 22, 2017, 05:16 PM
Apr 2017

I just think you're being wildly hyperbolic when you make it sound like these people are anti-rights despite them being firmly in the progressive camp. Frankly its starting to seem like McCarthy-esque groupthink, where unless people say exactly the things that a group of people decide they must, they're thrown to the wolves as enemies and saboteurs.

You don't have a monopoly on right and wrong, and you sure as hell don't get to decide who is and isn't allowed a voice in progressive politics.

 

melman

(7,681 posts)
15. You're not missing anything
Sat Apr 22, 2017, 04:58 PM
Apr 2017

People that call him an apologist are full of shit. It is, like so much else here, 100% made up bullshit.

6000eliot

(5,643 posts)
22. I've liked a lot of things he's written over the years,
Sat Apr 22, 2017, 05:20 PM
Apr 2017

but now I see him as a Putin stooge trying to deflect attention from Russia's involvement in stealing our election. And, no, I don't trust him at all.

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