United may have smeared the wrong "Dr. David Dao"

[mainer]

It turns out there are two Dr. David Daos, one with a criminal past, one without.

Questions have inevitably started to be asked: who dug up those details about David Dao’s apparent medical misdemeanour or the gay sex he supposedly had with a younger man, and why? Did they even check that those details related to the David Dao who was dragged off Flight 3411 in Chicago? There is presently confusion about whether the man on the United flight was actually David Thanh Duc Dao, quite possibly another person entirely to David Anh Duy Dao, the man with the criminal records.

http://www.independent.co.uk/voices/united-airlines-doctor-david-dao-drugs-gay-sex-court-documents-oscar-munoz-a7680221.html

[MineralMan]

1. Good catch! It's entirely possible that the victim-shaming

is based on incorrect information. It's irrelevant, either way, though.

[mainer]

4. It's all over Twitter. Two David Daos with different Vietnamese middle names

One David Dao is a poker-playing pill pusher who had a male lover. (and who reportedly also lives near Louisville.)

The other is not him.

[Foamfollower]

25. The other was beat up by United Airlines in order to get him to leave his seat.

Then he was beat up by United Airlines media hatchetmen who claimed he did stuff he did not.

[BlueMTexpat]

43. It is entirely irrelevant to

the overwhelming majority of us - and certainly to anyone with legal training.

But that doesn't seem to make a difference where some - even here on DU - are concerned in their haste to blame the victim, who had paid for his seat, had already boarded the plane and was perfectly within his right to refuse to accommodate the airline's request. Forcing him off the plane and assaulting him were under no circumstances acceptable.

Let's put the blame where it belongs ... NOT on the victim.

I believe that you and I are of one mind on this, but there is at least one insistent poster who seems to appear on every thread about this incident who is determined to blame the victim - no matter what!

[tblue37]

88. Couldn't he sue for libel? nt

[BlueMTexpat]

92. If the information published about him

is not true, yes. Because a LOT of so-called M$M outlets repeated the information, he could also have causes of action against them.

Those who were responsible for this outrageous conduct really need to suffer the consequences. Reuters reports that Dr. Dao has filed suit and that he is still in the hospital recovering from his injuries. http://www.reuters.com/article/us-ual-passenger-idUSKBN17E1GN

There is also this - from the same link:

On Wednesday, U.S. Senator Chris Van Hollen, a Maryland Democrat, announced plans for the Customers Not Cargo Act, which would prohibit the forcible removal of passengers already aboard an aircraft "due to overbooking or airline staff seeking to fly as passengers."

[tavalon]

97. I wholly agree with you

even if every smear were true, he was still beaten and dragged off the plane. That is the only pertinent fact here.

I was planning to be a lawyer before I picked my much better career, but I have a legal mind. I saw this for what it was right from the start and whether it's the right Dr. Dau or not matters not one whit. That shouldn't be a hard thing to grasp, should it? I've been surprised at the number of people willing to rejudge this open and shut case because of the hatchet pieces used by United.

BTW, United, if you wanted to know when I decided to kick your ass, it was when you did this hatchet piece. (extra credit for knowing which series I sort of stole this and vaguely changed it, from. Even more credit if you can name the episode!)

[cab67]

59. Except that it might cross the line into slander.

If they all but accused someone without a criminal past of having one, it gives Dr. Dao (the one tossed from the plane) even more grounds for taking United to court.

(Added on edit: that assumes United is behind the smear. If they're not, Dr. Dao can probably sue whoever is.)

[tavalon]

98. Regardless, the man is going to take them to the cleaners

and he deserves to. And I'm too old to buy that this wasn't from United, via whomever they chose to do it.

[Kittycow]

2. Isn't that a blip !

[dalton99a]

3. Fucking morons.

[Gothmog]

5. Who is surprised by this?

[Tommy_Carcetti]

6. It's entirely irrelevant to the underlying story, but if they actually did smear the wrong David Dao

......Good God, is that some major egg in United's face?

I don't know if Sean Spicer stumbling over himself to explain his Hitler comments would even be that bad.

[calimary]

50. It's more than egg. This guy could sue the pants off them and the airline out from under them.

[Eliot Rosewater]

52. My thoughts exactly, while there may be FAA regs preventing the good Dr. from suing

for the beating he took, he may well be able to sue the ever loving shit out of them for defamation and libel.

I dont have a particular hatred of United vs any other corporation, the problem is the RIGHT to sue and the RIGHT to sue is under major attack by the fascists in the WH and the entire republican party.

[rurallib]

86. hoping he gets the best slander attorney available.

[athena]

7. Wow. I hope Dr. Dao sues them for defamation.

I am speechless and disgusted, utterly disgusted, with all the DUers who jumped at the opportunity to smear this poor gentleman with whatever they could get their hands on.

[NewRedDawn]

18. Yep

We do have some corporate apologists in our midst don't we?

[regnaD kciN]

23. I'm not sure the smears came from United...

It seems like there were some in the Louisville media eager to publish their own "shocking truth" about the doctor. Is that particularly surprising, coming from the land of the "Kentucky colonels?"

[spooky3]

26. Yes, because the Courier Journal once was a highly regarded paper.

[Stonepounder]

46. The good doctor may have a couple of suits going for him.

1. Against United for the forceable removal when the apparently do not have any legal justification for doing so. See: https://www.democraticunderground.com/10028919487

2. A libel suit against the Courier-Journal if they wrote about the wrong person. He is not a 'public person' and the newspaper 'knew or should have known' they were writing about the wrong person and the article would cause him financial harm.

[IronLionZion]

51. I hope some organization like the ACLU gets on it

and helps him with any legal stuff since he's clearly gone through more than enough. Certainly more than many Americans would tolerate.

I'm disappointed in some of my fellow DUers who started victim blaming right from the beginning without knowing anything about it other than the bloody video.

[PoliticAverse]

89. He doesn't need the ACLU, this is a matter for attorneys experienced in negotiating

a good settlement with a party that wants to avoid a trial.

[IronLionZion]

91. Settlement is fine but it has to be large and punitive

and make headlines and cause meaningful changes in the industry.

United needs to be made an example of.

[Hugin]

8. Oh, my!

Please be so... Please be so...

[mountain grammy]

9. Nothing would make me happier.

Whatever outlet broke this, I hope they get burned.. and bad!

[ck4829]

10. Ruh roh

[Denzil_DC]

11. Ugh. What a stupid mess.

If this is true, then add a severe case of libel to the casework.

And all for nothing. It doesn't matter what Dao may or may not have done in the past. What happened on that plane is what matters.

[mainer]

12. from twitter:

"Two different folks. David Anh Duy Dao is the person in Kentucky Board of Medical Licensure letters. The UA victim is David Thanh Duc Dao."

[WinkyDink]

13. Searching for and printing the IRRELEVANT personal details of a VICTIM is extremely disturbing to

me, ESPECIALLY when a victim has only been videotaped but has not entered a formal complaint. This could happen to ANY OF US.

VERY, VERY unsettling.

That this particular story is about the wrong man is beyond chilling.

[athena]

16. It could happen to any of us.

Flying is extremely stressful these days. Suppose you're exhausted after a long and unpleasant work trip and settle into your seat impatient to get home. They show up and demand that you leave the plane, physically assault you, drag you out, and then drag your name through the mud for days because you happen to share the same name as someone who committed a crime. It literally could happen to any of us. We're all in this together. We have to stand up for this man and demand that the corporations and the media treat all human beings with respect and dignity.

[WinkyDink]

31. Absolutely. But boy, do we have the wrong government right now to help in the fight.

[KittyWampus]

32. And it's been proven that in cases with black/brown people the worst photo is used...

while if it's a white person they go for the prom/high school class photo.

[Sunsky]

14. Oh snap

[world wide wally]

15. Dr Dao is going to end up owning UAL

Another lawsuit is brewing with this one
Quick! Call in KellyAnn!

[WinkyDink]

17. Assault, battery, libel, defamation of character, breach of contract, pain and suffering,...$$$$$$$.

[Foamfollower]

19. The first thing an organization under fire for victimizing a person of color does is to "thuggify"

the victim.

Yet another United Airlines screwup.

[JTFrog]

21. An organization and their talking media mouth pieces. nt

[Iggo]

20. Doesn't matter. They did what they did. Doesn't matter who they did it to. (n/t)

[athena]

22. It doesn't. But the fact that they dragged his name through the mud makes the crime even worse.

They could easily have known they were smearing the wrong person. One article published yesterday, which makes all kinds of accusations against the poor doctor, says:

‘There is current speculation that David Thanh Duc Dao has a criminal record under the name ‘David Anh Duy Dao.’

What kind of person has one name, and then has a criminal record under another name? This is reckless and best, and intentionally vile at worst.

[mainer]

24. TMZ claims Dr. Dao is a famous poker player

But the photo they have of the David Dao playing poker doesn't look like the UA victim.

http://www.tmz.com/2017/04/11/united-airlines-doctor-david-dao-poker-player/

[yardwork]

27. Add this to the lawsuit.

[Cirque du So-What]

28. Totally unrelated but relevant in my case

While getting settled into a hotel room, I answered a knock at the door to find two very concerned-looking sheriff's deputies inquiring about my true identity. Seems the local sheriff had been arrested recently on drug-trafficking charges, and we shared the same name. I politely proferred my driver's license and it was settled swiftly, but I saw potential for the situation to head south in a hurry if I had resisted the intrusion.

[Swagman]

29. sickened by some DUers defending corporate thuggery

what part of "volunteer" do people not understand?

[Demsrule86]

30. I am too...you have wonder about such people.

[dalton99a]

33. They sound very much like freepers and RW shills

[Demsrule86]

48. They do sound like freepers...

[neeksgeek]

34. I'm not a lawyer, but this smells like one hell of a defamation lawsuit.

[yardwork]

35. Keep this kicked.

[yardwork]

36. Also, I wonder if this information explains the sudden about-face of the United CEO yesterday.

When they thought that they could smear the victim of their brutal attack, United was unapologetic. Suddenly yesterday the CEO issues the apology that he should have made in the first place.

The timing looks suspicious.

[AgadorSparticus]

108. The timing says everything. Not to mention UA stocks lost atleast $600 million

This CEO is the WORST!!! He needs to be canned.

[kytngirl]

37. Makes me wonder

Last edited Wed Apr 12, 2017, 12:36 PM - Edit history (1)

If the "random" selection of passengers was random after all.

All hell has already broken loose over how UA treated this gentleman. Now imagine if the passenger had been a black man. Twice as bad because he probably would have gotten into a fist fight with the goons, and been arrested. Now imagine them doing that to a black woman. Trice as bad. Now imagine a white man, especially one dressed in a suit. No way, right? How about a white woman? Double no way.

I honestly believe now that this guy was picked because of his ethnicity.

[HoneyBadger]

106. The victim feels that it was racism and misandry

Chinese man

[Grins]

38. Sweet, Holy Ba'al, I want to be his lawyer!

Slam-dunk of a civil lawsuit.

[randome]

39. Um, it was the DailyMail, not United Airlines, that published the original article. Right?

We were warned by some DUers to use caution when referencing a DailyMail story. Aren't all of us as guilty of 'smearing' as anyone else for refusing to listen?
[hr][font color="blue"][center]A 90% chance of rain means the same as a 10% chance:
It might rain and it might not.[/center][/font][hr]

[yardwork]

42. The only "guilty'" parties here are those who rushed to excuse the airline's behavior.

[randome]

44. Trying to understand the whats and whys is not the same as 'excusing'.

It's an exercise of objectivity.
[hr][font color="blue"][center]A 90% chance of rain means the same as a 10% chance:
It might rain and it might not.[/center][/font][hr]

[mainer]

62. Actually I think it was the Courier-Journal that published the original article

But oppo research and smearing is very corporate behavior, with more than a little speculation that United alerted the Courier Journal.

[randome]

65. Oh. Well, one of the original threads had the DailyMail post.

And DUers warned us to beware. Most of us ignored that.
[hr][font color="blue"][center]A 90% chance of rain means the same as a 10% chance:
It might rain and it might not.[/center][/font][hr]

[WinkyDink]

101. Nope--the LESSON is not to automatically believe the INTERNET. I posted below.

[Ms. Toad]

40. Might want to change your caption - the article doesn't assert United is doing the smearing

It asks an ambiguous question in the next to last paragraph that can be interpreted as suggesting the question of whether United was complicit. But even that paragraph doesn't expresesly name United (as opposed to, perhaps, mainstream media outlets) as the entity who should have checked more closely to see if the light technician (the RW media) moved the spotlight.

[treestar]

41. Interesting

Intentional or not?

[Hekate]

45. Christ on a trailer hitch

[Judi Lynn]

47. Kicking. n/t

[Nitram]

49. In any event, such factors are entirely irrelevant.

[ailsagirl]

53. Curiouser and curiouser

[PsychoBabble]

54. United PR formula -

- Beating? What beating? It was vigorous facial massage, a new United service.
- Look, over there, someone else is beating someone.
- He was a member of Fight Club, so it was a consensual beating
- We have evidence that he beat someone else at some point

[still_one]

55. Even though that is irrelevant to how United behaved and what they did, if the press

and United did mistaken his identity, I hope he sues the hell out of all the parties concerned who tried to perpetuated this

[IronLionZion]

56. Looks like the doctor's family has lawyered up

http://fox13now.com/2017/04/11/law-firms-release-statement-for-man-dragged-off-united-airlines-plane/

United Airlines needs to be punished financially enough to change their policies to prevent his behavior in the future. They've already gotten bad publicity from the event and lost some investment capital. It has to be in the millions, not just some small settlement.

And DUers who excuse and encourage this level of corporate abuse should be ashamed of themselves. The smug responses like "no one is entitled to special treatment" is very disgusting and tone deaf. It's no better than the GOPs attitudes towards social programs and civil rights while people are physically abused for simply existing.

[Vinca]

57. I hope he takes them to the cleaners.

[IronLionZion]

60. United claims they will stop using law enforcement officers

http://www.cnn.com/2017/04/12/travel/united-passenger-pulled-off-flight/

"We are not going to put a law enforcement official to ... remove a booked, paid, seated passenger," Munoz told "Good Morning America." "We can't do that."

Chris Christie wants to reform the practice of overbooking. It does need reform. Processes and employee training need to be improved to prevent this. Most airlines do it better.

Disgusted by a man's violent removal from an oversold flight, New Jersey Gov. Chris Christie has called for a suspension to the widespread practice of overbooking.

"To have somebody pay for a ticket, reserve a seat, be seated and then dragged off the plane physically by law enforcement officers at the direction of United (Airlines) -- it's outrageous," Christie told CNN's "New Day" on Wednesday.

"That's why I've asked the Trump administration to stop the overbooking until we set some more, different rules about how the airlines can conduct themselves."

[onetexan]

66. "I've asked the Trump administration to stop the overbooking" -- is this a joke??

Christie's trying to take advantage of the situation to put his sullied name out there in an effort to redeem himself. The president doesn't have the right to dictate to airlines how they conduct business, nevermind that he is a total failure at it (remember Trump airlines?). What a freaking opportunistic moron Christie is.

Many moons ago I worked for a major US airline in the technology division, and my understanding is through complex yield management, an airline can forecast by how much they can overbook a flight. This is a common practice with most, if not all, commercial carriers. The issue here isn't them overbooking, as the gate agents could have easily remedied this by first taking care of the situation PRIOR to allowing passengers to board. They do this all the time. This is why they compensate with free $ and free flights and accommodations, and typically that works.

If the airline was in fact trying to get 4 of their own employees to the destination, they could have just chartered them a flight to move them, and quickly. That would have been much less costly than losing 1+ billion $ in stock price drop overnight.

[IronLionZion]

67. How Delta masters the game of overbooking

http://www.pbs.org/newshour/making-sense/how-delta-masters-the-game-of-overbooking-flights/

How government regulates companies is pretty much the first several planks in both parties platforms in any election.

The FAA or DOT could sign a rule saying every American carrier has to follow the anonymous price bidding model if they felt like it. And they could repeal 2 in its place. I deal with this kind of stuff in my work. Regulations are reformed all the time. Companies update their policies and processes all the time.

[rurallib]

90. Christie knows from experience here - it is sort of like a governor closing a major bridge----

for no fucking reason

[Warren DeMontague]

100. He desperately wants someone to like him. And take him seriously.

[Demit]

68. This was NOT a case of overbooking!

United was bumping passengers, who had already been seated, in favor of their employees.

[IronLionZion]

69. The process still needs reform

United screwed up in several ways here. Offering more money until someone takes it is a better way to handle bumping paid and seated passengers.

[Demit]

71. Fine. Just don't conflate two separate issues.

Overbooking has nothing to do with the circumstances in the case of Dr Dao.

[IronLionZion]

72. Then how do you resolve the bumping in favor of employees issue?

[Demit]

73. What does that issue have to do with overbooking? Nothing.

I've read a lot of suggested solutions to how United could have got their employees to Kentucky. I'm confident United will come up with a way in future that doesn't involve mauling customers.

[IronLionZion]

75. They need to have a process in place

and training for the employees to handle it better. This issue is nothing new. it's going to happen again.

[PoliticAverse]

78. You offer enough money to passenges so enough people offer to give up their seat.

Other airlines do that.

[IronLionZion]

80. Sounds exactly like the process for bumping for overbooking

[PoliticAverse]

82. Not necessarily, once the airline hits the maximum they are required to pay by law...

($1,350 or less depending on specifics) they can just switch to picking people like they did in this case.
Airlines can always just offer more money to prevent the forced picking process though.

[IronLionZion]

85. Passenger Flight Rights

http://money.cnn.com/2017/04/11/news/united-passenger-flight-rights/

[Nevernose]

93. That was why they bumped people

They offered a lot of money, but not enough people took them up on the offer. They couldn't offer more money, because the whole reason for putting their employees on the flight was to avoid paying them overtime for waiting the extra day. Offering more money would have defeated the purpose.

They tried to save a few bucks by "bumping" passengers and instead are probably going to lose millions because of bad publicity. Instant karma.

[PoliticAverse]

94. Sometimes being "penny wise is pound foolish". n/t

[NCjack]

58. When a company is in the customer service

business, it can pay for customer service quality assurance or it can pay for damages. Most often, it is cheaper to pay for the training.

[PoliticAverse]

84. Especially in the age when most everyone is carrying a video recorder. n/t

[Lucky Luciano]

61. All asians look alike. They are the same David Dao.

[Hamlette]

63. How did they pick Dao as one of the ones who had to exit?

I've not seen anything about this but might just be behind.

[PoliticAverse]

79. Apparently they use a computer algorithm that includes things...

line ticket class (coach passengers picked first), frequent flyer status (regular customers picked last), etc.

[rocktivity]

64. Sounds like the good doctor has hit the Litigation Daily Double!

I've forwarded this to TMZ
http://www.tmz.com/2017/04/11/united-airlines-doctor-convicted-drugs-sex


rocktivity

[Lifelong Protester]

70. Dear United: Just because you CAN do something (legally)

doesn't mean you should (bumping a paid, seated passeger).

[PoliticAverse]

81. Don't be penny wise, pound foolish. n/t

[Sen. Walter Sobchak]

74. There is a joke in Orange County about Vietnamese weddings

Hundreds of Guests, ten names on the guest list.

[PoliticAverse]

76. "may", "quite pobbibly" - it would be nice if someone could say for sure. n/t

[Alice11111]

77. I hope so, just to ding United, but his past is still irrelevant

[stevenleser]

83. CNN story on the Louisville Courier-Journal article and backlash to it...

http://money.cnn.com/2017/04/11/media/david-dao-united-passenger-louisville-courier-journal/

On Tuesday, a day after the public reacted in horror to a video of United passenger David Dao being violently removed from a flight, Louisville's Courier-Journal ran a story examining what it called his "troubled past."

And just like that, an internet-wide conversation on air travel protocol and corporate responsibility gave way to one about journalistic ethics, with a chorus of reporters denouncing the unflattering coverage of someone who'd never sought the spotlight in the first place.
.
.
.
The story was written by Morgan Watkins, a state enterprise reporter for the Courier-Journal, who referred requests for comment to Joel Christopher, the executive editor of the Courier-Journal.
.
.
.
In a phone interview on Tuesday, Christopher stood by the story, saying it was a valid subject as Dao's story is known to the paper's local audience. But Christopher also acknowledged that the initial version of the story did not clearly establish Dao's connection to the local audience.
------------------------------------
Still doesnt confirm to me they got the right Dr. David Dao. I am going to post this as an OP

[tblue37]

87. It won't matter if he is proven to be the one who doesn't have a record. The meme that he

is shady has been spread everywhere to poison the well.

[Old Crow]

95. No, there was no mix-up. David Dao was identified correctly.

The story below untangles this whole mess. TLDR version: The doctor who was removed from the United Airlines flight was convicted of illegal prescriptions in 2004. Not that it should matter relative to current events.

http://www.latimes.com/nation/la-na-united-david-dao-20170412-story.html

[janterry]

107. I should have read the thread more carefully before posting

If I did, I would have seen that I didn't need to post at all (I gave out the same link and come back to read more carefully - and see that you (and others) have already corrected this .

[whistler162]

96. Coming soon Dao Airlines!

[Warren DeMontague]

99. They probably lowballed their oppo research goons just like they lowballed the passengers

They wanted to kick off that plane.

You get what you pay for.

[WinkyDink]

102. ONLY to defend the DAILY MAIL, because it is otherwise irrelevant--BUT IT'S THE RIGHT DR. DAO:

HIS OWN WIFE SNITCHED. IT'S ALSO WHY HE JOINED THE PRO POKER CIRCUIT.

SOUTH CHINA MORNING POST-- http://www.scmp.com/news/world/united-states-canada/article/2087014/united-passenger-david-dao-breaks-silence-saying-hes

NY POST-- http://nypost.com/2017/04/11/doctor-dragged-off-flight-convicted-of-trading-drugs-for-sex/

TMZ-- http://www.tmz.com/2017/04/11/united-airlines-doctor-david-dao-poker-player/

DM-- http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-4401980/Dr-dragged-United-swapped-drugs-secret-gay-sex.html

[janterry]

105. Oh

and I posted the same thing. I read that this morning, too .

[Throck]

103. How do these people manage a "no fly list program"?

[janterry]

104. It looks like they identified the correct David Dao

So, I guess that clears up this point. Here's a link:
http://www.latimes.com/nation/la-na-united-david-dao-20170412-story.html

I guess his case will play out around the whole 'deplaning' mess. I hope that it instigates new policies that protect passengers. It's clear that's very needed.