Looks like the GOP is in its last throes. Either they are the party of the GOP or the Bannon Party.

[nikibatts]

Everyone is bending over to keep 45 from being connected to the Ryan plan. They will meet, 45 will give his threats, and they will come out of the meeting with an agreement that gives 45 credit from being a great negotiator. No matter what...the rich get richer and poor get sicker.

[TeacherB87]

1. Controlling all 3 branches of government can hardly be described as "its last throws."

It remains to be seen if their efforts to pass this bill will lead to their electoral undoing in 2018. I'd like to believe it will, but peoples' loyalty to Trump might trump their lost healthcare. This is especially true if the right-wingers are successfully able to blame the negative outcomes of their own legislation on the original law, which appears to be their strategy going forward if they manage to pass the bill into law.

[mahatmakanejeeves]

3. Plus governors, plus state legislatures, plus school boards, plus text book boards,... NT

[brush]

4. Now that they control all 3 branches it will become obvious that they don't know...

Last edited Tue Mar 14, 2017, 06:31 PM - Edit history (1)

how to govern, just obstruct.

For God's sake they had seven years to come up with a healthcare plan but they spent that time obstructing Obama's efforts.

Then in weeks they cobble together a piece of shit they call a health care plan.

They've got absolute power now. What's the old saying, absolute power corrupts?

Well, they're already corrupt so we'll now see the other thing that absolute power does.

Absolute power reveals and I suspect it'll reveal that the repugs completely lack empathy for the 99% and have no idea how to govern because of it.

[TeacherB87]

5. I think you're being optimistic.

If you think Trump is looking out for you, you will tolerate quite a bit. We still need to work and find a way to help bring these conversations to Trump voters, we can't just rely on their fucking up to get it done.

[brush]

7. I think you need to re-read my post. No way did I imply that trump or the repugs...

looking out for anyone but themselves.

And fuck anyone stupid enough to vote for trump.

What we need to do is work on stopping their vote suppression through voter ID laws, Interstate Crosscheck, closing polling places in minority districts, cutting early voting days and tricks at the ballot boxes like the tens of thousands of ballots in Detroit, a black city, showing up with no vote for president.

No I not counting on them fucking up, which they will, I want to fight to stop their dirty tricks which cost us the election. And that includes Comey and Putin and Assange.

The stupid majority of whites who voted for trump, I say again, fuck them.

[TeacherB87]

9. You're missing my point.

Any way of thinking that leads to someone dismissing a whole group of people has to be inherently wrong. I don't disagree that we need to deal with all of those things as well. But if you think we don't need to re-examine our strategy vis a vis dismissing most white people then you've lost track of what it even means to be a liberal. And I can only hope that the institutional left doesn't follow your lead, because that strategy will be the best way to ensure Trump and the rest of the Republicans continue to get re-elected.

[brush]

10. You seem to have forgotten Hillary got 3m more votes

If we stop the vote suppression measures and other dirty tricks we don't need racist whites who voted for a racist.

And btw, all whites aren't racists and all whites didn't vote for trump so I'm not advocating dismissing a whole group of people, just the ones stupid enough to vote for trump.

We can work around them.

[TeacherB87]

11. How convenient that this way of thinking doesn't require one iota of self-reflection or criticism.

If we are so right, why are elections like this even close? Clearly the liberal message is not getting across the way it should. I'm interested in exploring that in addition to how we can expand the franchise and make it easier to vote. But again, if our logic involves writing off whole groups of people, it is inherently wrong. I'm not suggesting we lurch to the right or tolerate bigotry, but if our message doesn't get to large swaths of people, for whatever reason, that is not good for the movement.

[brush]

12. You're on the wrong site. The election was clearly stolen. Buh-bye.

[TeacherB87]

13. I've been a member of DU, under different names, for the better part of 16 years.

But thanks for the advice. I think I'll stay put despite the presence of irrationality...there's obviously no way to avoid that in life. But you're totally right, liberals are perfect and can do no wrong. Good luck selling that message to more than 30% of the country. I'd rather think about ideas and positions on a deeper level than someone expressing loyalty to a sports team.

[brush]

14. And you're clearly right about all that you're saying...

. Everyone has opinions. Yours I don't agree with. The election was stolen.

Clinton had it won until Comey did the final dirty deed, despite the months of Russian and Assange hacks and Interstate Crosscheck and ballot manipulations and poll closings in minority districts and all their other dirty tricks, they still needed Comey's letter to steal it.

You can dwell in your "oh we need the WWC to win" yearnings all you want.

I prefer to investing big in negating repug dirty tricks instead of coddling those particular whites who are racist and stupid enough to vote for a misogynist, racist, immigrant and Muslim-hating charlatan masquerading as their savior.

[TeacherB87]

15. Again, if your strategy is to write off a whole group of people, you are clearly wrong.

WWC voters need politicians that will actually give a shit about their issues rather than cater to and augment their fears. You making blanket statements about these people, and their stupidity, when the left has not shown up in their districts in decades is disingenuous and intellectually dishonest.

For the record, I want to fight republican dirty tricks tooth and nail. I just know that we can do both of these things, and more, rather than focusing solely on the strategy that requires no self-critique or introspection.

Also, I never said I was right about all that I'm saying. But that's a nice straw-man. Maybe it will work on someone else.

Liberals used to be able to talk about these things, it's what the 50-state-strategy was all about. Now, most of the time, when I try to discuss it, the response is hating on a whole group of people because of how they voted. That is petty, bitter, and pointless.

[brush]

16. Again, I clearly didn't say write off all whites like you keep insisiting I did

Just the ones stupid enough to fall for trump.

All whites don't fall into that category.

[TeacherB87]

17. I'm clearly talking about white people that voted for Trump

not all white people. Now we can get into a conversation about why they did what they did...but chocking it up to stupidity is an oversimplification that obscures the fact that these people are dying to be well-represented and the left can do that for them.

Writing them off as stupid delegitimizes their, for the most part, real concerns and drives them right into the arms of the right...who are all too happy to race bait etc. to play on the worst versions of the people in order to garner votes for their failed policies.

[brush]

18. Not interested. There were multiple threads on this after the election.

Been there, done that. Not a coddler of trump voters.

[TeacherB87]

19. Good for you.

Thanks for stopping by.

[brush]

20. Enjoy you stay yourself, you with the low post count.

[TeacherB87]

21. More pettiness.

That seems to be your theme.

[brush]

22. How silly. You with the "Thanks for stopping by" reply calling me petty.

[TeacherB87]

23. Justify yourself however you want.

Sarcasm is not the same as pettiness.

[brush]

28. Ahhhh . . . FYI, sarcasm requires wit.

[yeoman6987]

6. They own 34 state governments too

Oh how awful for them. Please. We should have it so bad. Heck they are planning a constituonal convention. Yieks what losers....well that part is true.

[Kingofalldems]

8. How many times will you post that, yeoman6987?

You're taunting DU aren't you?

[Keefer]

2. Last "throes".

[madinmaryland]

24. There's always one grammar nazi in the house...

You beat me to it!!

[0rganism]

25. as others have noted, for a party that's on the ropes they seem unusually healthy

[CrispyQ]

26. This again.

They are like that serpent that keeps coming back. I think it has to do with their appeal to the lowest common denominator in our species. Too bad we can't seem to get past that.

[Trenzalore]

27. I think the correct term is at their peak

The GOP has been effective in the past 8 years at throwing spit balls at anything suggested by the democrats and gerry mandering districts in 2010. Now that they have to govern they have a mess because they are really a coalition (much like the democrats) of varying interest. It is difficult for them to govern and appease republicans in moderate districts at the same time as appeasing libertarian leaning hard core righties in solid right districts.

Democrats ran into similar problems in 2008 when confronted with the health care. I probably don't need to remind you of how the public option died a slow death at the hands of Joe Lieberman, Evan Bayh, and Max Baucus.

Financial reform ran into similar problems with two senators from NY who happen to have Wall Street in their back yard.

I don't think the GOP ends up passing a bill. Repealing the Affordable Care Act is their Kobayashi Maru (just like passing it was ours). If they pass a bill they own the healthcare system...and they really don't want to do that. If they don't pass a bill they have a right wing base that is pretty furious.

Conservative press has largely been negative to the Ryan bill which in my opinion kills it. They simply can't get enough votes with the moderates and hard right defecting. If they pick the hard right they have a bill that can't pass the Senate as Senators have to run state wide campaigns. When hard right conservative Tom Cotton is saying he won't vote for something because he doesn't want to own people being kicked out of the healthcare system in a state wide campaign it is pretty much game over.

No matter what they are screwed and they are screwed the next 2 years because this is the first fight they decided to have....should have started with Tax reform where they had broader agreement.