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pnwmom

(109,031 posts)
Sat Jan 28, 2017, 03:07 AM Jan 2017

Jill Stein got to keep over $4 million from the funds she scammed for her recounts.

How many people gave money they couldn't really afford in the hope that they'd get fair recounts of all three states -- and possibly overturn the election?

She knew from the beginning that she'd already missed the deadline for an automatic Pennsylvania recount, so that recount court petition was a Hail Mary pass.

So, between the money she never had to spend in Pennsylvania, and the $2 million in funds returned to her from WI and MI, she had quite a sum left over at the end of it all. She went from about $58K cash on hand at the end of the campaign, to more than $4 million cash on hand after the partial recounts of two of the states.

But she kept pleading for more donations till the bitter end.

And now Jill Stein, the only candidate who had dinner with Putin in Russia last winter, has a big pile of cash to use to disrupt the next Presidential election. And desperate Democrats helped her get it.

http://www.fec.gov/fecviewer/CandidateCommitteeDetail.do?candidateCommitteeId=P20003984&tabIndex=1


POST-GENERAL(receipts) $5,957,251 (disbursements) $1,845,255 (cash-on-hand) $4,170,298


PRE-GENERAL (receipts) $310,069 (dispursements) $325,447 (cash-on-hand) $58,303


______________________

And the votes going to Jill Stein could have flipped the election, if these people hadn't been deluded into voting against Hillary.

Stein votes/Trump margin:

MI: 51,463/10,704
PA: 49,678/46,765
WI: 31,006/22,177

http://www.salon.com/2016/12/02/jill-stein-spoiled-the-2016-election-for-hillary-clinton/

143 replies = new reply since forum marked as read
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Jill Stein got to keep over $4 million from the funds she scammed for her recounts. (Original Post) pnwmom Jan 2017 OP
No Surprise here larry budwell Jan 2017 #1
Unfortunate HassleCat Jan 2017 #2
PA had too big a margin to qualify in the normal way, no matter who filed it. pnwmom Jan 2017 #3
Sorry keeping the money shows what she is...and never forget she helped elect Trump and is way to Demsrule86 Jan 2017 #131
Hey folks.. FarPoint Jan 2017 #58
Screwed and used HRC, then made her getaway with the loot. democratisphere Jan 2017 #4
The Democrats could run the second coming of Paul Wellstone with Maru Kitteh Jan 2017 #5
Yep. Stein is a tool of the right wing. nt SunSeeker Jan 2017 #6
Russians using far left parties to divide moderates in Europe Chevy Jan 2017 #7
That is a really interesting article -- and quite prescient. Thanks. n/t pnwmom Jan 2017 #11
This is exactly what is happening here in the US. yardwork Jan 2017 #34
They have been doing that here in Europe for 50 years DFW Jan 2017 #127
Wouldn't that mean that Al Gore and John Kerry had "ties to Russian interests" too? PotatoChip Jan 2017 #130
+1 betsuni Jan 2017 #10
remember that Nader held off supporting Wellstone for a long time in 2002 JI7 Jan 2017 #17
she is dumb AlexSFCA Jan 2017 #8
She isn't dumb if she LET herself get played. pnwmom Jan 2017 #9
Nope. She's dumb like a fox, and she is playing American voters hoping for better. Hekate Jan 2017 #13
she is a fraud and opportunist AlexSFCA Jan 2017 #111
This just makes me sick. The Green Party is not worth diddly squat. I can remember .... Hekate Jan 2017 #12
No, I don't think so. When she was collecting her millions, she always said pnwmom Jan 2017 #14
Jill Stein is a hero. So is Ralph Nader. Your arguments are specious. diva77 Jan 2017 #15
We've known repugs game electronic voting for at least since Bush and the Diebold non-paper... brush Jan 2017 #16
stein lied to the America People.. she is a Liar. Cha Jan 2017 #18
She's an anti-hero. If she'd been serious, she wouldn't have waited till after the PA deadline pnwmom Jan 2017 #19
Excellent post!!! Docreed2003 Jan 2017 #59
In addition, she would spend non voting years Blue_true Jan 2017 #109
Jill Stein stepped in to help computer scientists & election lawyers who couldn't get Hillary to ask diva77 Jan 2017 #115
Hillary knew they couldn't qualify for the PA recount because the margin was too big. pnwmom Jan 2017 #116
Great...more "proof of voter fraud" based on exit polls, along with jmg257 Jan 2017 #32
That article is based on an incredibly stupid premise mythology Jan 2017 #60
No, they are grifters. hunter Jan 2017 #96
Did you forget a sarcasm smiley? Hekate Jan 2017 #114
She is the only candidate that fought for a recount HoneyBadger Jan 2017 #20
She had enough for her recounts with the first $2.5 million she raised, pnwmom Jan 2017 #23
No. Wisconsin alone had a filing fee of $3.5 million. scipan Jan 2017 #100
She could have spent the money she had designated for PA pnwmom Jan 2017 #106
How could $2 million cover the WI $3.5 million filing fee, even if she pulled out of PA? scipan Jan 2017 #107
Her original website request was for $2.5, which would have covered almost all of that. pnwmom Jan 2017 #108
Plenty of us were calling this a shameless cash grab while it was taking place. EL34x4 Jan 2017 #21
Yes indeed oberliner Jan 2017 #25
And yet no one has proven this WAS a "cash grab" and fact she did get recounts going in multiple KittyWampus Jan 2017 #77
I'd rather she has money left than no attempt at recounts and left wondering what could have been. uncle ray Jan 2017 #22
Not me. Desperate Dems just helped to bankroll her 2020 campaign. n/t pnwmom Jan 2017 #26
Her recount was a scam from the begining. NCTraveler Jan 2017 #30
+1 uponit7771 Jan 2017 #36
She is a liar and a con artist, just like Trump oberliner Jan 2017 #24
Just like Palin atreides1 Jan 2017 #27
I understand why people wanted to believe. Starry Messenger Jan 2017 #28
She flat out scammed people. NCTraveler Jan 2017 #29
I hadn't heard about that. But it sounds like something she'd do. n/t pnwmom Jan 2017 #31
Her second plea on her website, on day two, she linked directly to two other groups. NCTraveler Jan 2017 #33
Wow. I wonder if those donations had to be reported anywhere. n/t pnwmom Jan 2017 #37
I took screen grabs of them from her website. NCTraveler Jan 2017 #39
Okay, so I get the anger at the green party. Glamrock Jan 2017 #35
We can't. But maybe we can get purist-leaning Dems to think twice. pnwmom Jan 2017 #38
And, don't get me wrong I agree, but how? Glamrock Jan 2017 #41
I have enough vitriol left in me to include her, too. Maybe I'd feel differently pnwmom Jan 2017 #42
Yeah I get it Glamrock Jan 2017 #48
And yet the OP is about smearing Stein regarding donations for the recount. KittyWampus Jan 2017 #75
At what point do we hold them responsible for their own vote. NCTraveler Jan 2017 #40
Yes -- that's exactly what she did. Because those recounts didn't turn up anything, pnwmom Jan 2017 #43
+1 nt NCTraveler Jan 2017 #46
Again, not saying you're wrong.... Glamrock Jan 2017 #45
Please show me my "furious anger at the GP". NCTraveler Jan 2017 #47
Okay, you didn't personally say that Glamrock Jan 2017 #49
I don't speak for the community. Only myself. NCTraveler Jan 2017 #67
Damn, I wish I could keep it all straight: truebluegreen Jan 2017 #44
My brother and his wife... orwell Jan 2017 #52
Well, at least they learned their lesson. Glamrock Jan 2017 #54
They are assuming they can ever vote again. LisaL Jan 2017 #64
Just out of curiosity, where do they live? truebluegreen Jan 2017 #65
9/11 taught me the same lesson sweetloukillbot Jan 2017 #91
If they live in a swing state, they were really stupid MrPurple Jan 2017 #104
That why it is said of Third Party Candidates: CajunBlazer Jan 2017 #123
Democrats gave her a lot of money under false pretenses oberliner Jan 2017 #53
Hillary endorsed the effort iirc. truebluegreen Jan 2017 #61
Hillary didn't endorse the effort. LisaL Jan 2017 #63
Oh sorry--it was only her campaign team. truebluegreen Jan 2017 #69
Big deal. After Stein started the effort, Hillary's team was going to participate LisaL Jan 2017 #76
Yeah, words mean nothing. As ever. truebluegreen Jan 2017 #94
People here we claiming they were happy to do it, even though some of us tried to warn them. LisaL Jan 2017 #62
Many of our Sensible Pragmatic Centrists here really, really, really QC Jan 2017 #74
Hillary is not a centrist and neither were her supporters here. pnwmom Jan 2017 #83
Post removed Post removed Jan 2017 #128
That graph is a crock, but I'm not surprised that a Green advocate would pnwmom Jan 2017 #139
I am shocked truebluegreen Jan 2017 #137
I'm not going to take the test of this nutty site. See post 139. n/t pnwmom Jan 2017 #140
You are using the well worn argument that Blue_true Jan 2017 #110
Well-worn argument vs zombie lie truebluegreen Jan 2017 #129
The caliber of Jill Stein's character will be sealed as we watch how the money is spent. SticksnStones Jan 2017 #50
Of course she does ismnotwasm Jan 2017 #51
The date of the end of the period in the report is 11/28/2016 Hokie Jan 2017 #55
Same here. LisaL Jan 2017 #68
Hucksters gotta huck La Lioness Priyanka Jan 2017 #56
Wow, she's right up there with that "I am not a witch" scammer. WTF is her name? catbyte Jan 2017 #57
There is a danger Uponthegears Jan 2017 #66
Why are you repeating Trump's talking points? truebluegreen Jan 2017 #70
He stole my talking point. I recognized this as a scam before he said that. pnwmom Jan 2017 #73
I guess the point is the two of you agree, truebluegreen Jan 2017 #132
If DT said today was Monday, apparently you would feel obligated to disagree. pnwmom Jan 2017 #134
Nope, I wouldn't. truebluegreen Jan 2017 #135
Just demonstrating your logic. And maybe you should look up pnwmom Jan 2017 #136
stein voters really didn't mind a trump victory and stein is more than happy to keep the money beachbum bob Jan 2017 #71
Why do you twist the issue by including Stein's votes? That has NOTHING to do with the recount. KittyWampus Jan 2017 #72
This message was self-deleted by its author LisaL Jan 2017 #79
No, she didn't. No recount occurred in PA, so she kept the $2 mil she had raised pnwmom Jan 2017 #81
What's really sad is that Democrats were so desperate for SOMEONE to fight this stolen election Tatiana Jan 2017 #78
Gore lost by less than a 1,000 (if he lost at all). LisaL Jan 2017 #80
I appreciate your response. Al Gore didn't lose. Jeb rigged the Florida results for his brother. Tatiana Jan 2017 #87
There was so many issues with FL vote. Hanging chads, butterfly ballots. LisaL Jan 2017 #90
Hillary has always been a realist, and she doesn't take advantage of desperate people. n/t pnwmom Jan 2017 #82
How are all these people eating with Putin? Qanisqineq Jan 2017 #84
This was a gala for RT, the Russian propaganda network. n/t pnwmom Jan 2017 #85
Not knowing much about her, BlancheSplanchnik Jan 2017 #86
Aloha, Blanche.. this is stein in a nut shell... Cha Jan 2017 #120
If you donated to Stein for the recount, call your credit card company for a charge back refund. lapucelle Jan 2017 #88
Charge backs would be an excellent way to get some recourse NWCorona Jan 2017 #93
I am SHOCKED SHOCKED to find gambling going on here. nycbos Jan 2017 #89
I lost all respect for Jill when she pulled this stunt. NWCorona Jan 2017 #92
Stein helped get trump elected and then scammed donors with recounts Gothmog Jan 2017 #95
She's a great con artist BainsBane Jan 2017 #97
Makes me wish even more that Dems had been willing to lead the charge. Barack_America Jan 2017 #98
And found no difference in results BainsBane Jan 2017 #99
Considering how evenly divided this country is liquid diamond Jan 2017 #101
Does the Green party have any part in this? braddy Jan 2017 #102
she was the green party candidate, so yes, the entire party is about defeating democrats JI7 Jan 2017 #117
Well, so far everyone talks only about Jill Stein, rather than the Green party itself, as though braddy Jan 2017 #121
My friend supports Jill Stein, and if Jill had not been on the ballot, Equinox Moon Jan 2017 #103
Sorry, but I hope Trump trashes the causes Blue_true Jan 2017 #112
She is very extreme. I was trying to understand her just last night. Equinox Moon Jan 2017 #113
Oh, I get it... CajunBlazer Jan 2017 #124
Yes it is.. too bad about your friend enabling a Climate Change Denier in the WH Cha Jan 2017 #119
Her stance is confusing to me. Equinox Moon Jan 2017 #122
The staunchest BOBs dislike feminists because they assume they are for HRC and voting "with bettyellen Jan 2017 #138
All leftover monies donated to voter reforms or. returned...?? pbmus Jan 2017 #105
the money will go towards helping defeat democrats in future elections JI7 Jan 2017 #118
Exactly. Dems just helped fund her next campaign against a Dem. n/t pnwmom Jan 2017 #126
Tried to tell folks... Blue_Tires Jan 2017 #125
The money should be donated to the ACLU and it should be done immediately!!! FreeStateDemocrat Jan 2017 #133
Jill Stein's Recount Cash Pays for Her Russia Legal Defense oberliner Jul 2018 #141
Oh. Wow. Thanks, oberliner. n/t pnwmom Jul 2018 #142
A lot of us could see this coming oberliner Jul 2018 #143

pnwmom

(109,031 posts)
3. PA had too big a margin to qualify in the normal way, no matter who filed it.
Sat Jan 28, 2017, 03:33 AM
Jan 2017

And the other two states wouldn't have been enough votes by themselves.

Demsrule86

(68,959 posts)
131. Sorry keeping the money shows what she is...and never forget she helped elect Trump and is way to
Mon Jan 30, 2017, 10:43 AM
Jan 2017

cozy with Putin.

Maru Kitteh

(28,353 posts)
5. The Democrats could run the second coming of Paul Wellstone with
Sat Jan 28, 2017, 04:09 AM
Jan 2017

David Kucinich as the veep and Stein or whatever doofus the Greens put up would STILL claim the same shit they did this go around and EVERY SINGLE OTHER election they've darkened. Not perfect enough. Just like the Republicans. Corporate. Tweedle-Dee and Tweedle-Duh, either way, just as bad.

Fuck. Jill. Stein.


 

Chevy

(1,063 posts)
7. Russians using far left parties to divide moderates in Europe
Sat Jan 28, 2017, 04:52 AM
Jan 2017

Jill Stein has received support from Russia(online trolls) possible links of dark money. Sanders campaign has ties to Russian interests in Tad Devine(Worked with Manafort in the Ukraine)

http://www.jehsmith.com/1/2016/08/jill-stein-is-an-agent-of-putin-too.html|

DFW

(54,608 posts)
127. They have been doing that here in Europe for 50 years
Mon Jan 30, 2017, 03:23 AM
Jan 2017

The French and the West German left were both "shocked" (except for the ones who knew all along) to find, after the dissolution of East Germany and then the Soviet Union, to see Stasi and KGB files laying out how they financed and supported various movements of the western European left to do their bidding.

French Communist Party boss Georges Marchais, an orthodox Stalinist who was rich and lived in a fancy mansion, was whining about "betrayal" after the successors to the CPUSSR opened a trove of KGB files on him and the PCF.

More than a few members of the Greens in West Germany were not pleased to find that they had been infiltrated and manipulated by the Stasi, although they did manage to survive, even credibly after several of their more extreme members moved on. Years before, their founders, the idealistic Petra Kelly and her boyfriend, were found murdered in a double shooting that some wanted to be a relationship-driven suicide, but forensics was not able to confirm to any KTU (German CSI) satisfaction.

PotatoChip

(3,186 posts)
130. Wouldn't that mean that Al Gore and John Kerry had "ties to Russian interests" too?
Mon Jan 30, 2017, 10:32 AM
Jan 2017

Tad Devine worked as a senior adviser on their campaigns as well.

Or did Devine suddenly become enamored with Russia only after Putin came along?

JI7

(89,312 posts)
17. remember that Nader held off supporting Wellstone for a long time in 2002
Sat Jan 28, 2017, 06:31 AM
Jan 2017

and when he did it was some lame shit .

but after wellstone died he used wellstone to attack other democrats.

really showed the sleazyness of these people.

AlexSFCA

(6,139 posts)
8. she is dumb
Sat Jan 28, 2017, 04:57 AM
Jan 2017

She is so clueless, got played by putin. She has no understanding of the world, propaganda, disinformation, gaslighting, etc. She even helped get trump elected by posting a few days before election that Hillary would be more dangerous for the world. This is no doubt because putin told her that. She thinks Russia is more to the left (socialism leftover) whereas it is truly far right nationalist oligarchy.

pnwmom

(109,031 posts)
9. She isn't dumb if she LET herself get played.
Sat Jan 28, 2017, 05:00 AM
Jan 2017

I'd say it's pretty clever to go, in one month, from $58K cash-in-hand to $4 million.

More clever than many of the people who donated to her cause.

Hekate

(91,228 posts)
13. Nope. She's dumb like a fox, and she is playing American voters hoping for better.
Sat Jan 28, 2017, 05:20 AM
Jan 2017

She should be ashamed -- but I doubt that is in her nature.

Hekate

(91,228 posts)
12. This just makes me sick. The Green Party is not worth diddly squat. I can remember ....
Sat Jan 28, 2017, 05:19 AM
Jan 2017

...when they used to have such promise, but between Nader and Stein, afaic they exist only to throw national elections to the REPUBLICANS.

Is there any possibility that Jill Stein can be forced to return this money?

pnwmom

(109,031 posts)
14. No, I don't think so. When she was collecting her millions, she always said
Sat Jan 28, 2017, 05:31 AM
Jan 2017

that if she had some left over it would go toward her party, i.e., her "voter integrity" work.

diva77

(7,704 posts)
15. Jill Stein is a hero. So is Ralph Nader. Your arguments are specious.
Sat Jan 28, 2017, 05:55 AM
Jan 2017

I applaud Jill Stein for her noble attempt to expose the election fraud that runs rampant in the US now that computerized voting is ubiquitous. The resistance to recounts by declared winners (Bush, Trump for example), and the trouble in conducting recounts when you're dealing with computerized voting (how can you witness what goes on in a proprietary computer program?) are giant red flags where voting integrity is concerned.

Don't you wonder how we ended up with so many republican governors, a republican House of Reps, Senate, President when poll after poll shows that our values are not aligned with those who represent us?

I'll bet Hillary won by a landslide, but unfortunately the combination of hackable computerized voting, and purging voters from the rolls, suppression with too few machines at precincts, precincts being discontinued and placed where people could not get to them, etc, etc, caused the election to go to the wrong candidate.

Check out this forensic analysis of the 2014 elections:

E2014: A Basic (Chilling) Forensic Analysis

2014 Election CODE RED Computerized Election Theft Computerized Vote Counting Election Forensics elections red shift

by Jonathan Simon

December 16, 2014

Read more: http://electiondefensealliance.org/#ixzz4X344NRfr


http://electiondefensealliance.org/

brush

(54,046 posts)
16. We've known repugs game electronic voting for at least since Bush and the Diebold non-paper...
Sat Jan 28, 2017, 06:26 AM
Jan 2017

trail machines.

So how does that make Stein a hero, or Nader for that matter?

Is it because we got Bush and Trump because of them?

Cha

(298,354 posts)
18. stein lied to the America People.. she is a Liar.
Sat Jan 28, 2017, 06:44 AM
Jan 2017

"US Green Party presidential candidate Jill Stein has said that her supporters should "absolutely not" vote for Hillary Clinton to stop a Donald Trump presidency, even in a swing state.

In an interview with Mehdi Hasan, host of Al Jazeera's Upfront, Stein said that Clinton "is not different enough" from the New York real estate businessman, to enable her or the Democratic Party "to save your job, save your life, or save the planet."

http://www.aljazeera.com/news/2016/09/jill-stein-hillary-trump-presidency-160928210338543.html

She is part ownership of this shitload dictator with a WAR on REALITY that we have now.

pnwmom

(109,031 posts)
19. She's an anti-hero. If she'd been serious, she wouldn't have waited till after the PA deadline
Sat Jan 28, 2017, 06:47 AM
Jan 2017

to apply, and she'd have been much more honest with her supporters about the odds of winning her court case.

Instead, she collected $2.5 million earmarked for the PA audit she knew wasn't going to happen in PA and then just kept it -- and kept plugging for more millions toward the other audits.

I realize that there are problems with voter suppression, hackable machines, etc., but Jill Stein was never going to overturn the election with those three states -- because the PA audit was never going to happen -- and she should have been more honest with the people who were donating to her.

For example, she first said she needed a few million to do the three audits -- and then as soon as she got the requested amount, she immediately announced that that would only cover one audit (the one in PA that never ended up taking place), and now she needed another two million. Every time she reached a goal she'd suddenly discover a need for even more, till she'd collected $6 million dollars.

That's what this was all about. And so she not only lured progressives into voting for her and helping DT, she earned a big pile of money from her audit scheme. And she was lucky, because she might not have been able to pay all her campaign bills otherwise. If you look at the post-election disbursements, many of those were for expenses incurred before the election. But she only had $58K cash in hand at that point. I wonder how she'd have paid all her bills if she hadn't thought up the audit money-maker?

Blue_true

(31,261 posts)
109. In addition, she would spend non voting years
Sat Jan 28, 2017, 09:31 PM
Jan 2017

Working on vote integrity issues. Attacking republicans in states that are tipping the scales in their favor. Yet, Stein doesn't do that, she comes back every four years to attack Democrats.

diva77

(7,704 posts)
115. Jill Stein stepped in to help computer scientists & election lawyers who couldn't get Hillary to ask
Sun Jan 29, 2017, 05:52 AM
Jan 2017

for recount.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jill_Stein#2016

In November 2016, a group of computer scientists and election lawyers including J. Alex Halderman and John Bonifaz (founder of the National Voting Rights Institute) claimed[sic] about the integrity of the presidential election results. They wanted a full audit or recount of the presidential election votes in three states key to Trump's electoral college win—Michigan, Wisconsin, and Pennsylvania—but needed a candidate on the presidential ballot to file the petition to state authorities. After unsuccessfully lobbying Hillary Clinton and her team, the group approached Stein and she agreed to spearhead the recount effort.[120]

pnwmom

(109,031 posts)
116. Hillary knew they couldn't qualify for the PA recount because the margin was too big.
Sun Jan 29, 2017, 06:06 AM
Jan 2017

Stein threw a Hail Mary pass at a judge and he laughed her lawsuit out of court.

Neither of the other two states did hand counting of any ballots -- the only thing that could show whether there was vote tampering -- so they were worthless. All they did was run the ballots through the same optical scanners, and even more firmly establish the impression on the public that the initial count had been accurate.

And with PA and its many machines with no paper trails, there's no way to know whether those votes were counted properly -- even if they did do an audit/recount.

jmg257

(11,996 posts)
32. Great...more "proof of voter fraud" based on exit polls, along with
Sat Jan 28, 2017, 09:12 AM
Jan 2017

A study that "800,000 non-citizens voted for HRC".
http://www.washingtontimes.com/topics/jesse-richman/

Jill Stein did great in gathering cash by getting upset people to donate for recounts so they could all feel better about the results...how did that work out?

 

mythology

(9,527 posts)
60. That article is based on an incredibly stupid premise
Sat Jan 28, 2017, 10:27 AM
Jan 2017

Unadjusted exit polls are utterly worthless.

https://www.thenation.com/article/reminder-exit-poll-conspiracy-theories-are-totally-baseless/

https://fivethirtyeight.com/features/ten-reasons-why-you-should-ignore-exit/

It's embarrassing seeing people still tout these obviously false "studies".

Also we do have evidence on the difference between hand and machine recounts from Wisconsin and there was no statistical difference between those votes recounted by hand and those by machine.

http://host.madison.com/wsj/news/local/govt-and-politics/recount-found-thousands-of-errors-but-no-major-flaws-in/article_4ad0fe2a-40d8-5cce-8d84-f3e33469c8f1.html

Democratic county election official's article on the subject:

http://host.madison.com/wsj/opinion/column/scott-mcdonell-large-scale-election-changing-voter-fraud-is-fantasy/article_1da4a089-c6f8-5887-a3f9-31652911833c.html

Please stop posting nonsense that has long since been debunked.

hunter

(38,367 posts)
96. No, they are grifters.
Sat Jan 28, 2017, 12:16 PM
Jan 2017

They have much in common with the right wing grifters they vilify.

Beneath the political posturing, with all the green flag waving, in front of their gullible supporters, it's really all about them.

These kind of "heroes" do not make the U.S.A. a better place.

I'm a radical leftist and an environmental extremist. Hell, if I was Emperor of the Planet Earth, I would ban fossil fuels on a ten year timetable and tax the uber-wealthy out of existence. Fuck Nader's safe cars, I'd get rid of personal automobiles as we now know them entirely. A universal 50 kph speed limit would work. (Nader saved the automobile industry from itself. They should give him a medal... But even much improved, with crash cages, seat belts, and airbags, automobiles are still stinky, dangerous, environmentally destructive machines.)

Nevertheless, my politics are utterly practical. I don't let my utopian thinking get in the way. Obama was one of this nation's great Presidents. Trump will be one of the worst. I proudly voted for Obama, I proudly voted for Clinton.

I don't even think the aphorism "The Perfect is the enemy of the Good" applies to Stein. She's merely a disruptor. Noise. I won't even give her credit as any kind of "conscience" in U.S. politics. The platform Hillary Clinton ran on was realistic and represented progressive U.S.A. values well.

 

HoneyBadger

(2,297 posts)
20. She is the only candidate that fought for a recount
Sat Jan 28, 2017, 07:50 AM
Jan 2017

Just the idea of a recount is worth pursuing, because as Americans, it is our right, regardless of who is behind it.

pnwmom

(109,031 posts)
23. She had enough for her recounts with the first $2.5 million she raised,
Sat Jan 28, 2017, 08:09 AM
Jan 2017

with a half million to spare.

Interestingly, that was the original amount she asked for, that was supposed to pay for the three recounts. However, when she raised that much very quickly, she immediately saw the chance to raise a lot more money -- for her party. So then she asked for another couple million. And another.

pnwmom

(109,031 posts)
106. She could have spent the money she had designated for PA
Sat Jan 28, 2017, 06:51 PM
Jan 2017

that she knew she'd never have to spend. When her lawsuit got to the PA judge, he laughed her out of court. That was predictable since she filed after the original deadline and was outside the necessary margin; that's why she had to go to court.

What she did was bait and switch. She got people to donate millions of dollars to her under the pretense that the money would cover all three audits. Then, after that sum came in unexpectedly quickly, she said, thanks, but that only covers 1 audit. That's when it was clear this was a scam.

scipan

(2,368 posts)
107. How could $2 million cover the WI $3.5 million filing fee, even if she pulled out of PA?
Sat Jan 28, 2017, 07:08 PM
Jan 2017

You said she only needed $2 mil for all three.

pnwmom

(109,031 posts)
108. Her original website request was for $2.5, which would have covered almost all of that.
Sat Jan 28, 2017, 07:22 PM
Jan 2017

And she knew when she made that original request that she only intended it to cover PA -- but that's not how she pitched it to the desperate people who sent her checks. It was only after she got that amount that she admitted it would only cover PA.

And she also didn't make clear that the PA recount, even in the extremely unlikely event the PA judge approved it, couldn't prove anything -- because votes on machines with no paper trails cannot be recounted.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/post-politics/wp/2016/11/24/why-are-people-giving-jill-stein-millions-of-dollars-for-an-election-recount/?utm_term=.a94a15053578

If the election were hacked, a recount couldn't prove it. Most of Pennsylvania voters use DRE (direct record electronic) machines, with no paper ballot whatsoever. In other races where those machines have been probed — like Virginia's 2005 attorney general contest — the recount has consisted of the machine results simply being scanned again. The lost/spoiled votes Palast has talked about are not part of that system. (Meanwhile, nearly every Michigan vote has a paper record.)

 

EL34x4

(2,003 posts)
21. Plenty of us were calling this a shameless cash grab while it was taking place.
Sat Jan 28, 2017, 07:55 AM
Jan 2017

She gets to keep the money? Of course she does!

To be fair, she never had any intention of giving any of it back and made this perfectly clear while she was asking for donations.

People need to read the fine print.

 

KittyWampus

(55,894 posts)
77. And yet no one has proven this WAS a "cash grab" and fact she did get recounts going in multiple
Sat Jan 28, 2017, 10:57 AM
Jan 2017

states disproves this attempt to smear that effort.

 

NCTraveler

(30,481 posts)
30. Her recount was a scam from the begining.
Sat Jan 28, 2017, 09:09 AM
Jan 2017

The manner in which she went about it has cemented in the minds of Americans that it was a fair election. What she did was horrid in every way.

 

oberliner

(58,724 posts)
24. She is a liar and a con artist, just like Trump
Sat Jan 28, 2017, 08:09 AM
Jan 2017

It is sad that so many Democrats gave her money, in spite of her active and aggressive campaign against Hillary Clinton.

atreides1

(16,136 posts)
27. Just like Palin
Sat Jan 28, 2017, 08:20 AM
Jan 2017

Stein is a grifter , the only difference is that Stein is better educated and more eloquent!

 

NCTraveler

(30,481 posts)
29. She flat out scammed people.
Sat Jan 28, 2017, 09:08 AM
Jan 2017

And we have no idea of the countless millions she was directing toward other groups. People keep forgetting that. She was directing larger donors to other groups under the guise of the recount. As far as I can see, not one penny of those other funds were used for the recount. Not a f'ing penny.

 

NCTraveler

(30,481 posts)
33. Her second plea on her website, on day two, she linked directly to two other groups.
Sat Jan 28, 2017, 09:14 AM
Jan 2017

She instructed people that the funds going to those groups would be used for the recount efforts and that larger donations could be given to them. The links stayed on her website for days.

 

NCTraveler

(30,481 posts)
39. I took screen grabs of them from her website.
Sat Jan 28, 2017, 09:22 AM
Jan 2017

They can also be found online. I will try to remember to post them here when I'm done working.

Glamrock

(11,803 posts)
35. Okay, so I get the anger at the green party.
Sat Jan 28, 2017, 09:19 AM
Jan 2017

What's the take away here? How do we get the green party peeps to vote Dem?

pnwmom

(109,031 posts)
38. We can't. But maybe we can get purist-leaning Dems to think twice.
Sat Jan 28, 2017, 09:22 AM
Jan 2017

The Greens always do a lot of recruiting on this site in election years, and we need to be ready for them.

Glamrock

(11,803 posts)
41. And, don't get me wrong I agree, but how?
Sat Jan 28, 2017, 09:32 AM
Jan 2017

I mean post after post of teeth gnashing about Stein getting 50,000 here and 35,000 there seems like a waste of time. Personally, I'm more concerned about a million not voting here and a couple million not voting there. Again, don't get me wrong, I'm not saying you are wrong. I just have more vitriol directed against those who didn't participate in their democracy than those who did....

pnwmom

(109,031 posts)
42. I have enough vitriol left in me to include her, too. Maybe I'd feel differently
Sat Jan 28, 2017, 09:35 AM
Jan 2017

if she'd give the $4 million back to the desperate people who sent it to her, instead of using it to fund her next campaign against a Democrat.

Glamrock

(11,803 posts)
48. Yeah I get it
Sat Jan 28, 2017, 09:52 AM
Jan 2017

I'm using allof my vitriol against those who are, in the parlance of our times (sorry, watched The Big Lebowski last nite), fucking me. I'll direct what's left at the enablers after we crush those who want to actively hurt us. My opinion is we need to be focused on the threat at hand, which isthe GOP.

 

KittyWampus

(55,894 posts)
75. And yet the OP is about smearing Stein regarding donations for the recount.
Sat Jan 28, 2017, 10:56 AM
Jan 2017

And twists the issue.

It this thread about voting 3rd party or is it about the TITLE which uses Stein getting money for the recounts as a way to smear that effort.

It's totally dishonest.

Stein didn't stop the multiple recounts. That's a fact.

And donators can almost certainly get their donation back.

 

NCTraveler

(30,481 posts)
40. At what point do we hold them responsible for their own vote.
Sat Jan 28, 2017, 09:25 AM
Jan 2017

They helped to secure a Trump Presidency. Additionally, a lot of it is not anger at the GP. It's anger at the grafter Stein who has taken over and destroyed the GP. Her shady recount effort helped to cement in the minds of the American people that this election was on the up and up. That is what she has done. How do you get people who voted for such a transparent scam artist to vote another way. I sure as hell don't want anyone in our party to start acting like Stein, their choice.

pnwmom

(109,031 posts)
43. Yes -- that's exactly what she did. Because those recounts didn't turn up anything,
Sat Jan 28, 2017, 09:37 AM
Jan 2017

she distracted from the real problems -- all the states that have machines with no paper trails, and all the states that engaged in active voter suppression.

Glamrock

(11,803 posts)
45. Again, not saying you're wrong....
Sat Jan 28, 2017, 09:43 AM
Jan 2017

But, "How do you get people who voted for such a transparent scam artist to vote another way." This applies to million upon millions of people who voted for Trump as opposed to thousands who voted for Stein. Not trying to be insulting here, but it seems this furious anger at the green party is counterproductive. I've never voted green. I'm really not defending them. But, these posts might be more valuable if they discussed how to get the green party voters over to the Democratic party as opposed to, you know, "goddamned greens cost us the election." We need to be focusing on the majority, IMO, as opposed to the fringe left.

 

NCTraveler

(30,481 posts)
47. Please show me my "furious anger at the GP".
Sat Jan 28, 2017, 09:46 AM
Jan 2017

I also don't recall saying they lost us the election.

Calling willful idiots, willful idiots, is not "furious anger."

You just went head to head with the meaning of a fallacy.

Glamrock

(11,803 posts)
49. Okay, you didn't personally say that
Sat Jan 28, 2017, 09:56 AM
Jan 2017

Never said you did. Plenty of posts here that have. I'm here every day. But, I appreciate the insult for asking a question....

 

truebluegreen

(9,033 posts)
44. Damn, I wish I could keep it all straight:
Sat Jan 28, 2017, 09:43 AM
Jan 2017

Jill Stein, Comey, the Russians, BernieBros, the media, voter suppression, racists, misogynists, bigoted yahoos...I'm sure there are more people to blame although somehow one name gets mentioned.

And it seems always always the greatest hatred is reserved for the left. Just like it was the fault of Nader's 97,000 voters in Florida, not the 200,000+ Democrats who crossed over and voted for Bush.

Tell me, pnwmom, what makes you think any of Jill Stein's voters would have chosen Hillary Clinton if Stein hadn't been in the race? They were disaffected enough to vote for Stein even in the face of Trump: what makes you think Hillary would have gotten their votes? Turnout was down in this election because people didn't like the choices. But still, somehow, it is Stein's Fault. It's very comforting I'm sure.

orwell

(7,784 posts)
52. My brother and his wife...
Sat Jan 28, 2017, 10:00 AM
Jan 2017

...would have voted for Hillary but they voted for Stein instead because they liked her better than Clinton but hated Drumpf.

They told me this before the election. They also told me that if she wasn't running they would vote for Hillary.

They now regret their decision to vote her but it's "too late."

They will never vote Green again because of this.

Glamrock

(11,803 posts)
54. Well, at least they learned their lesson.
Sat Jan 28, 2017, 10:08 AM
Jan 2017

There's two more we can count on in 2020 (or 2018. I don't know how politically active they are...) Hopefully, they aren't the only two. Just wish we hadn't nominated someone who was so unpopular.

LisaL

(44,995 posts)
64. They are assuming they can ever vote again.
Sat Jan 28, 2017, 10:30 AM
Jan 2017

They got nothing out of voting for green party except Trump for president. And now they can watch the environment being destroyed.

MrPurple

(985 posts)
104. If they live in a swing state, they were really stupid
Sat Jan 28, 2017, 06:09 PM
Jan 2017

It doesn't really matter if they live in Cali or Mass, but if they live in a swing state and don't know what happened with Nader in 2000, then that was a really uneducated thing to do.

CajunBlazer

(5,648 posts)
123. That why it is said of Third Party Candidates:
Mon Jan 30, 2017, 01:29 AM
Jan 2017

Third Parties are like bees, when they sting, they die.

 

oberliner

(58,724 posts)
53. Democrats gave her a lot of money under false pretenses
Sat Jan 28, 2017, 10:03 AM
Jan 2017

That is the part that is really annoying. She conned Democrats into giving her money that she is going to use to run against Democrats.

 

truebluegreen

(9,033 posts)
61. Hillary endorsed the effort iirc.
Sat Jan 28, 2017, 10:27 AM
Jan 2017

And Democrats did a lot of things in this election, including voting for Trump and not voting. I get annoyed at the hippie--or Green--punching.

LisaL

(44,995 posts)
76. Big deal. After Stein started the effort, Hillary's team was going to participate
Sat Jan 28, 2017, 10:56 AM
Jan 2017

to ensure the recount is accurate. As far as I can tell, they didn't actually do much if anything about the recount.
It was obvious the recount was completely futile (as I pointed out at the time) yet people were donating a lot of money because they were desperate.

QC

(26,371 posts)
74. Many of our Sensible Pragmatic Centrists here really, really, really
Sat Jan 28, 2017, 10:55 AM
Jan 2017

do not like progressives.

Interestingly, some of them spend far more time heaping scorn and indignation on progressives than on Republicans.

pnwmom

(109,031 posts)
83. Hillary is not a centrist and neither were her supporters here.
Sat Jan 28, 2017, 11:05 AM
Jan 2017

And Jill Stein is a progressive in words only. Her actions, like those of Ralph Nader, only help the Rethugs.

Response to pnwmom (Reply #83)

pnwmom

(109,031 posts)
139. That graph is a crock, but I'm not surprised that a Green advocate would
Mon Jan 30, 2017, 09:09 PM
Jan 2017

be pushing it here, trueblueGREEN.

I guess you didn't include a link because you didn't want anyone here to see that that site actually prefers TRUMP over Hillary. Way to go, trueblueGREEN!

https://www.politicalcompass.org/counterpoint-20161110

In Political Compass terms, the US has finished up with a socially reactionary anti-establishment president. It might well have had a socially progressive anti-establishment one. The inescapable conclusion is that the Democratic Party hierarchy preferred Clinton to lose than Sanders to win.

SNIP

Trump is an old-fashioned isolationist and protectionist. As alarming as the thought of his impulsive finger on the nuclear button may be, he will diffuse the escalating tensions with Russia, and the attempts to portray Putin as the new Saddam. he will also hopefully fulfil his promise to tear up the planned Trans-Pacific Partnership Agreement, which many nations are being dragged into. Far from being merely about free trade, the TPPA gives corporations unprecedented and dangerous engagement in many aspects of governance.

Most importantly, Trump’s every move will be analysed and criticised not only by the Democrats, but also by large chunks of his own party. This is a healthier situation than during the previous eight years, when a Democratic president delivered a largely Republican programme while his party remained shamefully silent. A socially reactionary and highly unpredictable new president gratefully inherits the Obama administration’s provisions for illegal detentions without charges, domestic spying of citizens and extrajudicial assassinations — precedents that would be damned as quasi-fascist if Trump had initiated them.

___________________________________

By contrast with your fav site, ontheissues.org not only rates Hillary as a "hard core liberal" -- but includes detailed information on the issues that they reviewed in giving her that rating.

http://www.ontheissues.org/Hillary_Clinton.htm

International Issues Domestic Issues Economic Issues Social Issues


Foreign Policy Gun Control Budget & Economy Education
Homeland Security Crime Government Reform Civil Rights
War & Peace Drugs Tax Reform Abortion
Free Trade Health Care Social Security Families & Children
Immigration Technology Corporations Welfare & Poverty
Energy & Oil Environment Jobs Principles & Values

Signature sponsorships (key bills introduced by Hillary Clinton)

 

truebluegreen

(9,033 posts)
137. I am shocked
Mon Jan 30, 2017, 06:12 PM
Jan 2017

that you didn't reply to my above post in this thread.

But, in pursuit of further knowledge, for both of us: go to this website and take the test (10 minutes iirc). I would be very interested to know your result. Maybe you would be too.

https://www.politicalcompass.org/test

Blue_true

(31,261 posts)
110. You are using the well worn argument that
Sat Jan 28, 2017, 09:44 PM
Jan 2017

Nader apologists use about the Nader votes in Florida. We will always have conservative Democrats that vote for republicans, we have had that since FDR. But when people claim they are acute environmentalists and supremely anti war and they chose to allow the most anti environment and war favoring candidate to win.

SticksnStones

(2,108 posts)
50. The caliber of Jill Stein's character will be sealed as we watch how the money is spent.
Sat Jan 28, 2017, 09:58 AM
Jan 2017

Follow the money. It's always about the money.

Hokie

(4,288 posts)
55. The date of the end of the period in the report is 11/28/2016
Sat Jan 28, 2017, 10:14 AM
Jan 2017

Therefore, there might be some recount expenses incurred after that date not included. That said I did not give money for the recount because I never trusted Stein and I knew the recount was a futile effort.

 

Uponthegears

(1,499 posts)
66. There is a danger
Sat Jan 28, 2017, 10:32 AM
Jan 2017

in comparing 3rd party vote totals with margin of victory/defeat and declaring the former to be the cause of the latter.

When the margins of defeat/victory are as small as they were in the last election (particularly in Michigan and Wisconsin), and much more so when they are as small as they were in the GE-determinative outcome in in Florida in 2000 (less than 1000), any factor which suppressed Democratic turnout in an amount greater than these (small) margins is an INDEPENDENT (i.e., would have changed the outcome even if everything else would have stayed the same) cause of our defeat and accordingly is EQUALLY RESPONSIBLE for that defeat.

I mention this because it has become almost as de rigueur among a certain faction of the Democratic Party to "blame the left" for the outcome in 2016 as it was in 2000, when, in both instances, actions by the "middle" of the party deprived our candidate of the support of identifiable voters in a number sufficient to overcome these (small) margins.

Prior to the 2000 election, Florida used ChoicePoint to purge thousands and thousands of mostly black convicted felons from Florida voter rolls, even though their voting rights had been automatically restored upon their release from prison and/or when their parole ended under the laws of the states where they were convicted. I was among a number of attorneys who were contacted by these men to try to get them back on the rolls before the election. Because they were poor, because they were powerless, and because they were, after all, felons, it became clear that this effort was going to require both financial help and mainstream support from the national party. They were turned away. We were told by told by party officials that there was no way that, after the "Willie Horton" ads in 1988, the Democratic Party was going to make it possible for Republicans to make a black convicted felon the image of the party. Even the most cautious estimates place the number of Democratic votes lost in Florida close to 10,000.

A similar thing happened this election. CrossCheck (which is ChoicePoint on steroids) purged thousands upon thousands of convicted felons from the voter rolls in key states. Aside from one or two passing comments about the handful of "non-Willie Horton" voters who got swept up in this deliberate assault on the voting rights of a group of primarily young black men (who had already been targeted by the war on drugs) the party kept silent. In fact, when Governor Terry McAuliffe (D.Va.) took the extraordinary step of using his pardon power to restore the voting rights of convicted felons in Virginia, the national party kept him at arms length even as he was being eviscerated by the right.

People who regularly claim we should support moderate party leadership because "the left cost us the last election" should remember that the same "comparison of lost voters v. margin of victory/defeat" analysis which is being used to place the "blame" for the last election (and the election of 2000) on the left could easily be used to shift that blame back on moderates.

That being said, there are still MORE than enough reasons to despise Stein voters. The Green Party is, and always has been, a complete fraud. People who fall for their BS are either painfully naïve or painfully lacking in the very concern for their fellow citizens of the world whom they claim to care so much about. Socialism and social justice SHOULD be inextricably intertwined (Quick example, how, other than socialism, does the $60 trillion of wealth stolen from people of color during the 400 years of North American slavery and the 150+ years of institutional racism that has followed ever get returned to the people who created it?). Unfortunately, in "the Greens'" deceitful and/or feeble hands, socialism has become nothing but a tool to achieve further benefits for an already-privileged class.

I completely agree that "the Greens" are not our friends. I agree that the millions they collected for recount efforts were not donated to help their overall cause and should be distributed to folks fighting Trump. AND I add that they are traitors to the cause of socialism who think that alliance to Russia and beasts like Putin somehow substitutes for standing with the oppressed. It's just that they aren't the reason we lost any more than was our failure to stand up for the most oppressed individuals among the most oppressed demographic group in our party.

 

truebluegreen

(9,033 posts)
70. Why are you repeating Trump's talking points?
Sat Jan 28, 2017, 10:43 AM
Jan 2017
http://www.newsweek.com/hillary-clinton-team-backs-recount-effort-wisconsin-525474

“This is a scam by the Green Party for an election that has already been conceded, and the results of this election should be respected instead of being challenged and abused, which is exactly what Jill Stein is doing," Trump said.

pnwmom

(109,031 posts)
73. He stole my talking point. I recognized this as a scam before he said that.
Sat Jan 28, 2017, 10:53 AM
Jan 2017

First she put up her web page saying that she needed $2.5 million to do the three recounts. (Without mentioning that she'd already missed the deadline for PA.)

That money came in very quickly, and suddenly it was bait and switch -- she said she really needed another couple million so she could do the second recount. And then she wanted more for the third.

And it turns out that she was able to keep the $2 million for PA -- because there had never been more than a tiny chance that a judge would agree to extend the deadline for her. And then she got refunds on the other partial recounts. But she was raising money up till the bitter end, as if she was going to be spending it all on the recounts.

pnwmom

(109,031 posts)
134. If DT said today was Monday, apparently you would feel obligated to disagree.
Mon Jan 30, 2017, 12:19 PM
Jan 2017

Twice a day even a broken clock is correct.

pnwmom

(109,031 posts)
136. Just demonstrating your logic. And maybe you should look up
Mon Jan 30, 2017, 06:08 PM
Jan 2017

the term "straw man" so you'll use it correctly next time.

You sought to disparage me because I agreed with something correct that DT had said. By that reasoning, no one should agree with anything DT said, even if it was correct -- like saying today is Monday.

That is not a straw man argument. It is basic logic.

(But I'm not surprised that a self-proclaimed "green" would be objecting to any criticism of Jill Stein.)

https://www.logicallyfallacious.com/tools/lp/Bo/LogicalFallacies/169/Strawman-Fallacy

 

beachbum bob

(10,437 posts)
71. stein voters really didn't mind a trump victory and stein is more than happy to keep the money
Sat Jan 28, 2017, 10:46 AM
Jan 2017

we all we be paying the price of those who didn;t vote and 3rd party voters would could care less in placing REAL EVIL in the whitehouse....


and they HAVE THE MOST TO LOSE

 

KittyWampus

(55,894 posts)
72. Why do you twist the issue by including Stein's votes? That has NOTHING to do with the recount.
Sat Jan 28, 2017, 10:52 AM
Jan 2017

#1. People can demand their money back
#2. She actually DID the recount. She actually HAS contacts with people fighting against BBV while Clinton doesn't. It's not Stein's

Response to KittyWampus (Reply #72)

pnwmom

(109,031 posts)
81. No, she didn't. No recount occurred in PA, so she kept the $2 mil she had raised
Sat Jan 28, 2017, 11:01 AM
Jan 2017

for PA. And she only got partial recounts in the other two states, so they refunded her another two million.

So she went from having $58K left at the end of the election to having $4 million. All because of the recounts that partially happened.

Stein's votes don't "twist" the issue; they just provide context. Thanks to the donations of progressives, she now has $4 million in the bank to use to attack the next Dem in 2010 -- helping the next Rethug, as the Green party seems to want to do.

Tatiana

(14,167 posts)
78. What's really sad is that Democrats were so desperate for SOMEONE to fight this stolen election
Sat Jan 28, 2017, 10:58 AM
Jan 2017

that they gave $$$ to someone who wasn't to be trusted with anything.

Hillary Clinton had the standing and Hillary Clinton's campaign should have been mounting the direct challenge to question the election results. At least Al Gore took it all the way to the Supreme Court.

Very disappointed in the leadership surrounding Clinton's campaign. If I didn't know better, I'd say some of them directly sabotaged her. That being said, she should have exercised better leadership and asked for recounts herself.

If Stein scammed people, it was because Democrats conceded the space for her to fill a void. Democrats were desperate for someone, to stand up to the Republican thugs.

LisaL

(44,995 posts)
80. Gore lost by less than a 1,000 (if he lost at all).
Sat Jan 28, 2017, 11:00 AM
Jan 2017

Across three states, the margin was too large and there was no hope. Or reason for Hillary to challenge the outcome.

Tatiana

(14,167 posts)
87. I appreciate your response. Al Gore didn't lose. Jeb rigged the Florida results for his brother.
Sat Jan 28, 2017, 11:11 AM
Jan 2017

There were several voting irregularities in the 2016 election. I don't think the Michigan results were at all close to being accurate.

I think this election was stolen in more ways than one.

Qanisqineq

(4,826 posts)
84. How are all these people eating with Putin?
Sat Jan 28, 2017, 11:07 AM
Jan 2017

Does he often throw grand dinners and invite people from all over the world? Somehow I imagined he would be a little less accessible.

BlancheSplanchnik

(20,219 posts)
86. Not knowing much about her,
Sat Jan 28, 2017, 11:10 AM
Jan 2017

I was as happy as a drowning woman thrown a life raft.

Apparently it wasn't a life raft, it was a piggy bank.

Cha

(298,354 posts)
120. Aloha, Blanche.. this is stein in a nut shell...
Sun Jan 29, 2017, 06:27 AM
Jan 2017

"US Green Party presidential candidate Jill Stein has said that her supporters should "absolutely not" vote for Hillary Clinton to stop a Donald Trump presidency, even in a swing state.

In an interview with Mehdi Hasan, host of Al Jazeera's Upfront, Stein said that Clinton "is not different enough" from the New York real estate businessman, to enable her or the Democratic Party "to save your job, save your life, or save the planet."

http://www.aljazeera.com/news/2016/09/jill-stein-hillary-trump-presidency-160928210338543.html

she's part owner of this shit storm.

lapucelle

(18,423 posts)
88. If you donated to Stein for the recount, call your credit card company for a charge back refund.
Sat Jan 28, 2017, 11:17 AM
Jan 2017

My daughter did just that when she realized she had been scammed out of her money by Stein. Tell your credit card company that the charge was a donation solicited under false pretenses.

NWCorona

(8,541 posts)
93. Charge backs would be an excellent way to get some recourse
Sat Jan 28, 2017, 11:28 AM
Jan 2017

I donated with a prepaid visa. There's no way I'd give out my real CC info!

NWCorona

(8,541 posts)
92. I lost all respect for Jill when she pulled this stunt.
Sat Jan 28, 2017, 11:24 AM
Jan 2017


That said, I did donate to the recount because I didn't want to look back and wish that we did do something as I don't think the vote was fair. I did go in with open eyes and had my doubts.

BainsBane

(53,137 posts)
97. She's a great con artist
Sat Jan 28, 2017, 12:24 PM
Jan 2017

Not only did she net millions of dollars, many of them continue up to defend her, despite being bilked out if money they doubtless need that money more more than she.

She's not the first and won't be the last.

Barack_America

(28,876 posts)
98. Makes me wish even more that Dems had been willing to lead the charge.
Sat Jan 28, 2017, 12:24 PM
Jan 2017

But they were weak and another party took advantage...again.

BainsBane

(53,137 posts)
99. And found no difference in results
Sat Jan 28, 2017, 12:27 PM
Jan 2017

Which is why the Democrats didn't challenge the elections.

Are you suggesting the Dem party should have donned ordinary Americans out of millions like Stein did?

 

liquid diamond

(1,917 posts)
101. Considering how evenly divided this country is
Sat Jan 28, 2017, 05:59 PM
Jan 2017

all it takes is one asshole like her to fuck up an election. That must be one hell of an ego boost to wield that kind of power. Fuck Stein and anybody who cast a ballot for her. I hope you suffer the most under Trump's reign of terror.

 

braddy

(3,585 posts)
121. Well, so far everyone talks only about Jill Stein, rather than the Green party itself, as though
Sun Jan 29, 2017, 10:50 AM
Jan 2017

this is all about an individual person, a single named individual.

Equinox Moon

(6,344 posts)
103. My friend supports Jill Stein, and if Jill had not been on the ballot,
Sat Jan 28, 2017, 06:06 PM
Jan 2017

she would not have voted for Hillary. To assume that the Stein voters would have voted for Hillary is not correct thinking.

Blue_true

(31,261 posts)
112. Sorry, but I hope Trump trashes the causes
Sat Jan 28, 2017, 10:04 PM
Jan 2017

That you friend value. That is the only way the no difference voters will learn. Until they learn, good people will be fighting desperately to limit the damage that Trump does.

Equinox Moon

(6,344 posts)
113. She is very extreme. I was trying to understand her just last night.
Sat Jan 28, 2017, 10:09 PM
Jan 2017

She was a Bernie or bust person. She is preferring this current chaos, although very difficult. She thinks America needs a re-set explaining that people are more active and motivated politically now then we were during the Obama years. I still love her.

Cha

(298,354 posts)
119. Yes it is.. too bad about your friend enabling a Climate Change Denier in the WH
Sun Jan 29, 2017, 06:25 AM
Jan 2017

Whether she was going to vote for Hillary or not.. stein lied to fans and help enable this planetary shit storm right now.

snip//

"US Green Party presidential candidate Jill Stein has said that her supporters should "absolutely not" vote for Hillary Clinton to stop a Donald Trump presidency, even in a swing state.

In an interview with Mehdi Hasan, host of Al Jazeera's Upfront, Stein said that Clinton "is not different enough" from the New York real estate businessman, to enable her or the Democratic Party "to save your job, save your life, or save the planet."

http://www.aljazeera.com/news/2016/09/jill-stein-hillary-trump-presidency-160928210338543.html

Equinox Moon

(6,344 posts)
122. Her stance is confusing to me.
Sun Jan 29, 2017, 11:35 AM
Jan 2017

I plan on talking with her again today to try to understand. She is a stanch environmentalist and progressive. She was a Dem delegate to the state convention working hard for Bernie.

She refused to go to the Women's March, which shocked me.

I'm just saying in my original comment that I know someone that would not have voted for Hillary if her two choices had been Hillary or Trump. I don't defend it, nor do I don't understand it. But it is very real this is what is happening for some people. She is fed-up with how things are going in this country and this is how she is responding. I just wanted to share her story.

 

bettyellen

(47,209 posts)
138. The staunchest BOBs dislike feminists because they assume they are for HRC and voting "with
Mon Jan 30, 2017, 06:13 PM
Jan 2017

Their vaginas"
Have run into this. They suck.

JI7

(89,312 posts)
118. the money will go towards helping defeat democrats in future elections
Sun Jan 29, 2017, 06:12 AM
Jan 2017

and helping republicans win.

 

oberliner

(58,724 posts)
141. Jill Stein's Recount Cash Pays for Her Russia Legal Defense
Fri Jul 13, 2018, 09:26 AM
Jul 2018
Money that Jill Stein raised to recount votes in 2016 swing states is being used by her campaign to pay for legal bills stemming from the investigation of Russian interference in the last presidential election.

https://www.thedailybeast.com/jill-steins-recount-cash-pays-for-her-russia-legal-defense?ref=home

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As a bonus, making a contribution will allow you to leave kudos for another DU member, and at the end of the week we'll recognize the DUers who you think make this community great.

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