Do you realize just how earth-shattering President Obama's DREAM order is for MILLIONS?

[bigtree]

Hundreds of thousands of immigrant families around America are just overjoyed at this executive order protecting their children from deportation, and offering educational opportunity for what activists today are saying will be nearly a MILLION youth who have been living in our country at odds with and in fear of our regressive immigration laws.

There is a wave of hope and anticipation in these immigrant communities that the lives of these families and individuals in America will be forever enhanced and elevated by the President's decision to remove the stigma and threat of arrest, incarceration, and removal from the U.S. from their essentially innocent youth.

NPR had a special report today in which a woman described her reaction at the news of the President's order as, 'like a bird taking flight into the air.' In this well-considered act, President Obama has sparked a new generation of creativity, knowledge, achievement, and accomplishment among our nation's immigrant youth which will translate, in the future, into advances and benefits for our nation as a whole.

Most importantly, the President's DREAM order has uplifted and embraced an entire community and encouraged them to feel more invested in America; likewise, for Americans to regard our own lives as more connected to those of our immigrant neighbors, co-workers, and acquaintances.

We can only hope, ourselves, that this action by our President will be met in the future with a sure resolve to deepen these ties, and to guarantee these privileges in our permanent law. These youth and these families deserve no less in our ever-inclusive democracy.

[Indydem]

1. And when this non-durable presidential order is rescinded?

Then what?

This means nothing.

[spanone]

2. it's obvious you are not affected by his decision. it means nothing to YOU

[Indydem]

6. It shouldn't mean anything to anyone.

All it means that any illegal alien meeting certain requirements arrested within the next 7 months won't be deported.

They still have no rights. They still have no social security numbers or photo IDs. They aren't citizens.

What is there to cheer about in this.

If the President doesn't win a second term, everything goes back to the way it was in January.

[spanone]

8. tell it to the people who it affects....they appear to be in favor of it.

WASHINGTON — President Obama’s decision to extend administrative relief to an estimated 800,000 young illegal immigrants has won favor with Latino voters in key battleground states, according to a new poll.

The Latino Decisions survey found that Obama’s move had wiped out an earlier “enthusiasm deficit” among Hispanic voters over the administration’s deportation policies. By contrast, the poll found that Latino voters were sharply opposed to Republican presidential candidate Mitt Romney’s call for illegal immigrants to “self-deport.”

Voters in five states with significant portions of Latino voters — Florida, Colorado, Nevada, Virginia and Arizona — were asked about Obama’s new policy of halting deportations and offering temporary work permits to some illegal immigrants who came to the U.S. before they were 16, lived here for at least five years and have clean records.

Forty-nine percent of the Latino voters surveyed said Obama’s move made them more enthusiastic about the president, compared with 14% who were less enthusiastic. Thirty-four percent said it would have no effect on their attitude toward Obama.

http://www.latimes.com/news/politics/la-pn-obamas-immigration-move-wins-support-in-battleground-states-20120618,0,215080.story

[ProgressiveEconomist]

14. 'If the President doesn't win ... back to the way it was in January."

But if Romney doesn't get at least 30-40 percent of the Hispanic vote, the President WILL win re-election, according to most political forecasters You are ignoring the likely political impact of the President's bold action. Every voter who wants immigration policy liberalized for undocumented young people brought across the border as children now CANNOT vote for Romney.

[Voice for Peace]

27. don't be such a poop

it's good news, and even if temporary, it's good news.

[Liberal_Stalwart71]

30. Then why not take your claims to the RepubliCONS? They are the ones who blocked

the DREAM Act. They haven't done shit for immigration. The president can't act without Congress, so you get mad. He is then forced to do *something* without Congress, and you STILL get angry!! The guy can't win! He simply can't.

[Indydem]

38. My apologies

I guess I didn't get the memo that we are required to heap a truckload of praise on a non-durable, pandering act.

Did the president go out and advocate, and push, and strive for the DREAM Act? Not that I can remember.

Did the President spend political capital to make sure that young children brought here by no fault of their own were protected? No, he was too concerned about mandating we all buy private bullshit insurance (no public option).

I don't give a fuck what republican shitbags do. I don't vote for them. I vote for Democrats, and while they controlled both houses of congress and the white house they didn't do SHIT on this issue.

So, in an election year, after 3.5 years of doing absofuckinglutely nothing on this issue, we get this worthless bullshit, that, if he doesn't win re-election, means nothing. No warm and fuzzies for 10 year old kids who get their asses arrested and sent on a bus back to fucking Mexico. No happy thoughts for an 18 year old who discovers that he isn't a legal resident, and never was, and he's not going to college because of it.

If the President cared, he'd have FOUGHT for this, the right way. He'd have made republican fuckfaces own it in an election year. But he didn't. He made a pretty little showing by issuing an executive order (remember how much we USED to hate that shit, oh about 4 years ago) and thinks that makes it all OK.

My apologies; I don't cheer for unadulterated bullshit.

[Liberal_Stalwart71]

40. You totally missed the point. It's willful ignorance now. If you don't know how government works

then no one can help you. Please learn basic civics.

Off to IGNORE! Good luck to you!

[bigtree]

43. yes he certainly has pushed and fought for the DREAM Act

. . . so, your premise that he's 'done nothing for years' on this issue is just plain incorrect.

I don't think you realize that the Act has already passed the House once. It just takes a little effort to find out what the President has done to move the Act forward. it takes even less time to just make it up, as you have here. I guess it wasn't worth the effort for you to find out just what the state of the legislation is and what the President and the administration has done to advance it. I just find that incredible, and that lack of knowledge certainly is reflected in all of the animus you're expressing here. Is it possible for you to actually go and read up a bit on this?

[ProgressiveEconomist]

41. IMO you've got it BACKWARDS. The DREAM order was politically IMPOSSIBLE until Romney became

the sole Republican nominee and had to worry about offending advocates of immigration reform. Before then, there was nothing to hold back hysterical Republican xenophobia. You haven't heard any calls for the President's impeachment since Friday, have you? But what would have happened had the President issued his order during the Republican primaries? Or before Republicans finally agreed to raise the debt ceiling? See http://www.democraticunderground.com/1002824916 for more details.

[CakeGrrl]

3. Yes, much better to wait until the GOP/Tea Party-controlled House takes the initiative.

Countdown in...

[JoePhilly]

4. Vote against Republicans at every opportunity and it becomes DURABLE!

[bigtree]

5. I think the political implications of reversing this order are daunting

Republicans may well be able to stall and obstruct a vote on the DREAM Act, but, without the cloture vote in the Senate, the vote in favor of the bill would be overwhelming. Remember, this bill has already passed the House once.

If we're concerned with another President overturning this, we'd better resolve ourselves to do everything we can to re-elect this one and elect Democrats in the future to advantage this policy.

'This means nothing?' I can say without any hesitation that you speak without any substantive knowledge at all about the very real impact of this order.

[pnwmom]

18. It won't be rescinded if Obama is reelected. This means everything.

Obama has done everything he can do. Now it's up to Congress -- but he's given them a good kick in the pants.

[joeglow3]

7. Until it is rescinded and they have already handed over all their info. to the govt.

Then, it is MUCH easier for the govt. to pick them all up. I predict you will see very few people take advantage of this.

And Obama knows this. This is nothing more than an attempt to get the hispanic vote (and VERY smart on Obama's part).

[bigtree]

9. How could anyone who gives a wit about these youth be adverse to this order?

Even as activists and others in the immigrant communities agree that this is only temporary and subject to a change in administrations, to the individual, they herald the move as a huge advantage and opportunity for their communities.

I don't think dismissals like yours should be taken seriously. Real people will benefit from this order. It's not as if they're somehow blinded to the political and other realities which underlie this action. But to dismiss it out of hand is just a blatant distortion of the very real impact this act will have for millions of families across the nation. Take some time out to actually listen to the families and individuals affected.

[joeglow3]

10. It IS a move in the right direction.

However, I will bet that while many people herald the move as a great step, you will see few people take advantage of it.

[bigtree]

12. immigration lawyers reportedly are having their phones ringing off the hook

. . . and they have been very positive in relating that they can help many of these folks get out of jeopardy; even those already in the pipeline for deportation. You've completely missed all of the excitement and determination of these communities to take advantage of this. One of the challenges, expressed by one activist I heard, was that they find a way to organize their efforts to make this change in the law as accessible as possible for those affected and qualifying. I personally know of two folks in lock-up a few miles from where i live who are in the process of organizing their release under the terms of the order. I believe you are completely out of touch with what is transpiring and curiously using fear as a rationale for your theory that folks won't take advantage of the order. I think that's an amazingly myopic view of the impact of this decision.

[The Wielding Truth]

29. Wow. Did your puppy just die? This is not as bad as you think. In-fact it is wonderful for millions.

[Swede Atlanta]

36. Agree this was very smart on the President's part......

While he has been criticized from many directions, myself included, on not acting quickly enough on some issues, he is a deliberate, skilled and cunning politician.

He has solidified his standing with women by taking on the anti-woman campaign being waged by the Republicans. His support for birth control and equal pay will help him, especially among suburban working women.

He has confirmed his standing with the LGBT community by refusing to continue to defend DOMA and forcing the nut cases in the House to do so and by waiting for the right time and using the right approach to end DADT. I only wish he could have gotten ENDA passed which in my view is more fundamental than DOMA in that protection against discrimination in housing, employment, etc. affects every LGBT individual whereas DOMA affects a sub-set, i.e. those that wish to marry. Don't get me wrong, I support reversing DOMA and am in favor of marriage equality BUT freedom from discrimination in housing and employment is a more fundamental need.

He has now strengthened his position in the Latino community with this recent announcement. There will be some a minority of Latinos that are devout Catholics that have an issue with his position on birth control and gay rights. But this is an overwhelmingly positive act both in substance and as political calculation.

[EFerrari]

11. I guess our "ever inclusive" democracy was on a coffee break

when tens of thousands of families were broken up via low priority deportations without anyone noticing in the last few years when Obama was breaking Bush's record.

Tell you what, bigtree. Let some time pass and let's see some follow through, and then let's do the happy dance.

[bigtree]

13. I'll tell you what

I'll celebrate along with the folks who are presently working to advantage themselves of this order to remove themselves from jeopardy.

It's amazing to me how you can deflect your cynicism off of my own enthusiasm and completely ignore the waves and waves of relief and joy being expressed -- even now, days after the announcement -- from folks who have the ultimate stake in this.

[EFerrari]

15. I think that as I work in that community and not for the Obama campaign

you shouldn't be amazed at my take at all.

After all, I was assured here that Obama would only detain and deport criminals. That turned out not to be true. I was also assured that his administration was only working border security. Also, untrue.

So you see, after witnessing the behavior of his administration for now nearly four years, my viewpoint is informed by experience, not cynicism.

Of course there is a big reaction from our families. They have been the objects of hatred, not to mention abuse and worse, for years now. But my evaluation of this situation is not based on that reaction. More, it is based on a wish that they not be let down again.

I think even you should be able to understand that.

[EFerrari]

17. Sinking to personal attacks, instead of arguing the issue, is beneath you. n/t

[EFerrari]

20. I didn't post my reaction to this order. I told you what I thought.

And yes, questioning my activism and calling me cynical is a personal attack. As is calling my thinking "antipathy" when I gave you a clear, reasoned rationale. But, you carry on.

[bigtree]

21. well, I don't question your activism, I'm sorry if it comes off that way

I really really didn't intend to do that.

I don't think that pulling every objection to this administration's immigration policy down in front of this executive order and expressing cynicism about it is 'reasoned rationale,' but I respect your right to regard it as such.

I will remove my comments about your activism, which I do admire and respect. I apologize for the offense.

[EFerrari]

23. bigtree, I'm not unaware of what Obama risked in making this move.

I guess I wanted to point out, his isn't the only risk at play here.

Sincerely, it's my hope that it works out well for both the president and for the families I interact with every day.

[bigtree]

24. I regard the politics for Obama as important, only as it relates to the success of these initiatives

. . .and I join with you in expressing hope that it works out for these families. I'll be doing what I can to direct and help folks to take advantage of this order. We're going to make it work. We don't have any option but to try and remain optimistic and engaged. Best of luck to you and sorry for my own 'antipathy.'

[gordianot]

22. There is one aspect to this I never see discussed with the so called "anchor children".

A child born in the United States who has American Citizenship whose parents are deported to Mexico do not automatically have Mexican Citizenship on return as such they are not entitled to an education in Mexico. Parents can apply to have Mexican citizenship for these children creating in effect dual citizenship in anticipation of deportation. Few dreams in that situation more like a nightmare.

[NNN0LHI]

25. Recommended

[SidDithers]

26. DU rec...nt

Sid

[Motown_Johnny]

28. That is one way to spin it

but in truth it is to narrow in scope. It seems to cut off for people over 30, which is really really strange. What happens if you are 27? Does this mean that in a few years your legal status changes for the worse?


It also does not have the power of law. It is simply a change in enforcement.


Also, people eligible for this need to register for a 2 year stay of execution.... err... umm.. I mean exemption from deportation.

So you are asking people that could be deported to register with the department that deports them so that they won't be deported. How could that possibly be problematic? What happens if Rmoney wins? Or if some other (R) wins in 2016? Now you have a list of hundreds of thousands of young people who have already signed a legal document stating that they are eligible to be deported.


I think it is a good political move but as far as policy goes it is sorely lacking.

[xxqqqzme]

31. Can someone explain the 'green card'

or work permit process? How are taxes deducted if one is working w/ green card? Is there a social security number or something similar issued?

[metalbot]

37. The people affected by this bill aren't given a green card

Green card holders are eligible to apply for a social security card. Aliens who wish to work who are not permanent residents may apply for an ITN (a tax ID) that they use in place of their social security number for tax purposes.

[FarCenter]

32. Although the children would not be deported, wouldn't their parents be deported?

On the other hand, their parents might already have returned to their home country.

At any rate, anyone taking advantage of this should get a passport from their parent's country in order to be safe.

[Spitfire of ATJ]

33. Why don't we just come out and say it!

The Right Wing in this country will settle for nothing less than the total elimination of anyone who is not white.

They want the United States to be a White Only nation. Period.

The ONLY blacks and Hispanics they even tolerate are ones that can be trained to sound just like them so they can have some measure of deniability over their ultimate goal. I swear, if a Republican called for using the FEMA Camps for a roundup they would chant "U.S.A.! U.S.A! U.S.A.!" just like the Nazis shouted, "Sieg Heil! Sieg Heill! Sieg Heil!" and don't kid yourself, after that, they will target anyone who they disagree with regardless of color.

When Hitler rose to power he declared all other political parties other than his to be illegal. Republicans act like they are the only legal power which is part of why they NEVER accepted either Bill Clinton or Obama to have any legitimate authority. Whenever a Democrat is in power they come off like "Real America" is in exile. When they even get a one vote advantage they act like they are standing on the neck of their enemies.

Anyone who's posted to a Right Winger notices they come off like they have you at gunpoint.

You can see why it was necessary to declare the Nazi Party to be illegal. We are getting to the point where the Republican Party may suffer that same fate if they continue to identify with these Right Wing lunatics.

[Tx4obama]

34. It is NOT an Executive Order, it is 'prosecutorial discretion'

See here:

Exercising Prosecutorial Discretion Is Different From Issuing An Executive Order
http://www.democraticunderground.com/101632278

and here: http://www.democraticunderground.com/125146938

[Vanje]

35. Props to the Prez. nt

[Gman]

39. Stop being so happy

You'll ruin the sour grapes for DU'ers who claim he hasn't done enough or it's too little too late.

What's wrong with you!?

After all, you're cool here if you bash Obama. You're being so un-cool!

[TBF]

42. Yes and I applaud his efforts. nt