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Related: Editorials & Other Articles, Issue Forums, Alliance Forums, Region ForumsHow Many Civilians are Killed by US Drones?
Even if some have just learned of Americas escalating use of lethal force against suspected terrorists or militants a decade after the program began, any public interest and debate is welcomed. The passage from the New York Times that received the most attention describes that, according to the Obama administrations methodology, there are inherently few civilian casualties as a result of the signature strikes against unnamed people:
It in effect counts all military-age males in a strike zone as combatants, according to several administration officials, unless there is explicit intelligence posthumously proving them innocent. Counterterrorism officials insist this approach is one of simple logic: people in an area of known terrorist activity, or found with a top Qaeda operative, are probably up to no good.
This is not a new story. President Obama simply expanded on a policy initiated by his predecessor, but with more drones at his disposal (there were thirty-four drone combat air patrols [CAPs] when he came into office, now there are fifty-seven) and an even longer list of targets. As a former senior counterterrorism official remarked this weekend regarding signature strikes in Yemen, the elasticity of what the Obama administration considers a direct threat to the United States has grown over time. Another former senior official clarified, There was a little liberalization that went on in the kill lists that allowed us to go after Yemeni militants opposing the regime in Sanaa, rather than specifically the United States.
The use of signature drone strikes was first revealed in a February 22, 2008, New York Times article by Eric Schmitt and David Sanger. The journalists reported President Bushs decision to authorize:
A significant relaxation of the rules under which American forces could aim attacks at suspected Qaeda and Taliban fighters Instead of having to confirm the identity of a suspected militant leader before attacking, this shift allowed American operators to strike convoys of vehicles that bear the characteristics of Qaeda or Taliban leaders on the run, for instance, so long as the risk of civilian casualties is judged to be low.
Read more: http://www.hondurasweekly.com/how-many-civilians-are-killed-by-us-drones?-201206075256/
Scootaloo
(25,699 posts)And will only increase as our "legitimate targets" get scarcer.
Richard D
(8,754 posts)The Northerner
(5,040 posts)Riftaxe
(2,693 posts)to suspected militants, then all is good...
jsmirman
(4,507 posts)you know how "no one ever dies at the happiest place on Earth"?
Which means that they drag the body off of Disney grounds and pronounce the person dead only then...
jsmirman
(4,507 posts)Note that although the verdict is "false," the accompanying text shows far from a clear verdict.
Personally, I know people who have worked at Disney and believe this to be true. Can't claim to have smoking gun proof, though...
hughee99
(16,113 posts)I was just wondering the other day what the hell a "suspected militant" is. Is it US policy to always bomb "confirmed militants"? If not, why is it okay to bomb "suspected" ones.
Comrade Grumpy
(13,184 posts)Like the 18 Afghan civilians killed in the recent NATO air strike.
HopeHoops
(47,675 posts)kelly1mm
(4,733 posts)HopeHoops
(47,675 posts)The drone strikes are disgusting but at least they are INTENDED to hit legitimate targets. The shrub just bombed the shit out of everything in sight and on fabricated pretenses. Neither is "OK", but there is a major difference in scope.
TheKentuckian
(25,026 posts)I'm not as satisfied as you about intent either and is the point of the article in no small part.
More bothersome than the crappy reclassification deal is re-imagining so we can prop up a none to decent regime in Yemen which I see as dangerous and willing mission creep.
HopeHoops
(47,675 posts)It somehow seems to transcend party lines and just "be". Reagan wanted an airport - done deal. BushCo wanted to avenge the attempt on Poppy's life - done. Obama? I just can't figure out what he's after. To his credit, he did mostly get us out of Iraq (mostly). Afghanistan was a clusterfuck he inherited and there isn't a good answer there other than to just say "fuck it" like the USSR did. Whatever is going on, there's one consistent factor now - oil. It has replaced "communism".
Prediction: Israel is going to bomb the fuck out of Iran and we'll have no choice but to back it up. Perhaps Congress will actually pass a declaration of war for the first time since WWII. The "War Powers Act" needs to be repealed. The Constitution clearly allocates the authority to declare war to Congress. Why the hell hasn't the USSC ruled it un-constitutional?
SomethingFishy
(4,876 posts)Just... wow.
This is how you justify this?
The Northerner
(5,040 posts)HopeHoops
(47,675 posts)Igel
(35,300 posts)If lacking manhood before the boom, then certainly unmanned afterwards.
Certainly drones.
It is a question, how to define civilians in an area without an organized military. The Obama method--any military-age male in the area is presumed to be a combatant--is clearly wrong.
The other extreme is no more clearly right. Even the claim of the 18 civilians at the wedding presupposes that one cannot be both a militant and a wedding guest.
And the idea that all such strikes, even if you know a wanted guy is definitely in the room that you're about to blast, must have zero collateral damage is also ludicrous. It says that the guy you're after can forever protect himself just by always going everywhere with an innocent. At some point he takes the responsibility on himself for their lives (which is the basis of the related portions of the Geneva Conventions); at some point, innocent constant companions are no longer innocent because they've seen or heard too much.
Egalitarian Thug
(12,448 posts)and if you don't like, we have a drone for your ass, too!
America! Fuck Yeah!