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Le Taz Hot

(22,271 posts)
Sat Nov 28, 2015, 08:16 AM Nov 2015

I just can't stop being blood red angry about this.

The guy that made that highly-edited video should be hauled in as an accomplice. The MSM media needs to be called out for never even questioning the authenticity as well as their shilling for right wing crazies and featuring them as "experts."

I remember when I was in college, I didn't make much money (was putting myself through back when you could still do that) and going to PP to get my birth control pills, pap smears, pelvic exams and breast exams. They were on a sliding scale and it was something that I could actually afford. If they hadn't been there I could have never afforded those services otherwise. The VAST MAJORITY of what PP does has nothing to do with abortions but even if it was ALL they did, abortion is a legal medical procedure. Don't like it? Don't get one. And these anti-choice MEN. MEN have NO RIGHT EVER to determine if a woman is going to carry a pregnancy full term or not. NONE! And don't ever think you do!

I also remember a time in this country when abortions were illegal. Do these vile anti-abortion pieces of offal think that just because it's illegal women won't get abortions? No. The rich and upper-middle class fly to other countries that allow abortions. Middle class women always knew doctors who would perform a D & C and the poor women were reduced to various devices and concoctions, risking their lives to end an unwanted pregnancy.

I can't tell you how I truly hate these anti-choice people. I hate the churches they go to, the media that they listen to and the politicians who control but appease them.

161 replies = new reply since forum marked as read
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I just can't stop being blood red angry about this. (Original Post) Le Taz Hot Nov 2015 OP
Every word of this is right on. Thank you. enough Nov 2015 #1
This. beam me up scottie Nov 2015 #2
Kicked and recommended to the Max! Enthusiast Nov 2015 #3
I call them the shitstream media. 47of74 Nov 2015 #16
there's this thing called the first amendment hill2016 Nov 2015 #4
Gee thanks for filling us in. Kingofalldems Nov 2015 #5
1st Amend. does not prevent the media for denouncing the video as fraud. Hoppy Nov 2015 #6
Agree 100% SickOfTheOnePct Nov 2015 #29
And there are ramifications for hate speech Funtatlaguy Nov 2015 #7
There wasn't anything hateful on the videos Calista241 Nov 2015 #58
Whoosh SammyWinstonJack Nov 2015 #10
No shit! n/t Hepburn Nov 2015 #75
Pfft. beam me up scottie Nov 2015 #12
With that protection comes responsibility deutsey Nov 2015 #14
You would of thought Hitler would have taught us about unchecked propaganda . n/t orpupilofnature57 Nov 2015 #24
Just look at what happened in Rwanda deutsey Nov 2015 #39
Actually Hitler, and Joseph Goebbels taught these right wingers how to do it well. PatrickforO Nov 2015 #152
Thanks, some use it, some abuse it, and villains Hide behind it, like the 2nd . orpupilofnature57 Nov 2015 #23
Sure, free speech is protected, but lies should be called out as lies.. mountain grammy Nov 2015 #34
Exactly MG! It is allmost the year 2016 and we asjr Nov 2015 #54
The media call out only democrats especially when the right rainy Nov 2015 #117
Some lies are not protected speech. Neither are "embellishments" Divernan Nov 2015 #35
Nice thread jack. please delete. yardwork Nov 2015 #43
I don't get it, why are we supposed to single out HRC from other politicians? Rex Nov 2015 #112
Get a grip. PeaceNikki Nov 2015 #45
I think you took a wrong turn on your way to GD-P cwydro Nov 2015 #46
you really are a piece of work dsc Nov 2015 #50
When I see posts like this, it indicates the need for someone to detach, losing their myopic view. TheBlackAdder Nov 2015 #51
I appreciate the mansplaining about HRC in this thread about women's rights. nt msanthrope Nov 2015 #56
It really makes me want to take another look at Sanders, right? yardwork Nov 2015 #59
the tone deafness would be funny, if there weren't bodies. nt msanthrope Nov 2015 #73
Thats because she's well practiced in the art. nt 7962 Nov 2015 #71
Congratulations, Even the Benghazi commitee didn't think to bring this up Progressive dog Nov 2015 #100
SO we are going to seperate her out from all the other politicians that exaggerate? Rex Nov 2015 #111
needed to be placed elsewhere FreedomRain Nov 2015 #119
Shameful thread hijacking there. But no shock coming from you. kestrel91316 Nov 2015 #156
The First Amendment applies ONLY to State Action. Hepburn Nov 2015 #74
um no hill2016 Nov 2015 #105
Pretty clear you have no concept of civil liability as it pertains to kestrel91316 Nov 2015 #157
PP might have a case for slander/libel hill2016 Nov 2015 #161
Thank you. This confirms everything I'll ever need to know about you. DisgustipatedinCA Nov 2015 #90
that facts are much more important to me hill2016 Nov 2015 #104
No. DisgustipatedinCA Nov 2015 #106
If that person is against you, you are doing something right. nt stevenleser Nov 2015 #132
How obtuse Fairgo Nov 2015 #110
It is not legal to yell 'fire' in a building if there is no danger. Rex Nov 2015 #113
do you know what campaign ads are? hill2016 Nov 2015 #114
Those videos are NOT speech protected by the First Amendment jmowreader Nov 2015 #118
You might have a point if you were responding to demands for censorship. n/t Martin Eden Nov 2015 #120
... Unknown Beatle Nov 2015 #128
And that cop (and two others) are dead, whether you like it or not. passiveporcupine Nov 2015 #137
Um, PP is a business, probably a corporation and therefore a person. kestrel91316 Nov 2015 #155
KnR SammyWinstonJack Nov 2015 #8
I agree with everything you said, anger included me b zola Nov 2015 #9
I agree, totally... hlthe2b Nov 2015 #11
K&R Mbrow Nov 2015 #13
And now you see how the manipulation works to get us all angry with each other. CJCRANE Nov 2015 #15
And sometimes anger IS righteous. Le Taz Hot Nov 2015 #18
A concealed man throws rocks at two different groups. They accuse and fight each other. CJCRANE Nov 2015 #27
Sweetheart, if you want to go pray with the guy in jail, you're free to do so. Le Taz Hot Nov 2015 #33
I am with you all the way, but while we are justly outraged about specific events, we rhett o rick Nov 2015 #86
Of course it has Le Taz Hot Nov 2015 #88
I agree with that. nm rhett o rick Nov 2015 #91
Yeah, the chicks just need to shut up about abortion, right? jeff47 Nov 2015 #60
No. I'm talking about stirring up animosity between different groups. CJCRANE Nov 2015 #63
And instead of "animosity" over people taking over their bodies, women should do what, exactly? (nt) jeff47 Nov 2015 #65
The PP video was an example of stochastic terrorism designed to rile up christians conservatives CJCRANE Nov 2015 #69
K and R 47of74 Nov 2015 #17
Ronnie Ray-gun freed them of culpability years ago, instead of protecting validity, we invented orpupilofnature57 Nov 2015 #19
Hear, hear k&r Little Star Nov 2015 #20
I want PP & politicians to make stronger statements, something the mouth-breathers might understand. randome Nov 2015 #21
NOT THEM....WE NEED TO MAKE THE STATEMENTS dembotoz Nov 2015 #25
That sentiment is the antithesis of what this country is about. pipoman Nov 2015 #62
I would think that was implied. Maybe not. randome Nov 2015 #78
K & R GoneFishin Nov 2015 #22
I am with you, Sister bread_and_roses Nov 2015 #26
I was in California (still am) Le Taz Hot Nov 2015 #30
I was in college in the mid to late sixties. maddiemom Nov 2015 #55
Unbelivable Kath1 Nov 2015 #142
K&R. nt DLevine Nov 2015 #28
Control get the red out Nov 2015 #31
But they make damn sure that sarge43 Nov 2015 #36
Hell yes.... daleanime Nov 2015 #32
As I watched this unfold, the same thoughts kept going through my head.. mountain grammy Nov 2015 #37
+1,000,000 malaise Nov 2015 #38
I'm angry too. I also went to Planned Parenthood for low-cost care. yardwork Nov 2015 #40
Agree completely LittleGirl Nov 2015 #41
A woman's decision results in the man being held financially responsible pipoman Nov 2015 #66
Sorry, don't mean to come off that way eom LittleGirl Nov 2015 #87
Many on DU seem to be very dedicated to anti-choice activist clergy. Bluenorthwest Nov 2015 #42
K&R! n/t RKP5637 Nov 2015 #44
K&R ck4829 Nov 2015 #47
k&r... spanone Nov 2015 #48
YOU NAILED IT!!! K&R secondwind Nov 2015 #49
Even as a man I have used Planned Parenthood services and am grateful for their existance davidpdx Nov 2015 #52
Kizinger yellowwoodII Nov 2015 #53
They are all loathsome. kairos12 Nov 2015 #57
The headline on Yahoo was "attack on abortion clinic" as if that is all PP does..... Punkingal Nov 2015 #61
Amen Glaisne Nov 2015 #64
This!!! A thousand times this! ! riderinthestorm Nov 2015 #67
100 per cent with you, LTH klook Nov 2015 #68
The rw fundy churches and rw media are the terrorist organizations in this country. When is law Dont call me Shirley Nov 2015 #70
I just read an OP Le Taz Hot Nov 2015 #72
Sounds like a focus on the family diversion. Dont call me Shirley Nov 2015 #147
Yep. People with enough money will always have access to abortions. SusanCalvin Nov 2015 #76
KnR retrowire Nov 2015 #77
Welcome to Reagan's America. Gregorian Nov 2015 #79
Absolutely. SoapBox Nov 2015 #80
And they have the nerve to call themselves "pro-life"'. What a crock. Elmer S. E. Dump Nov 2015 #81
K&R NikolaC Nov 2015 #82
It's about controlling women and hating women. McCamy Taylor Nov 2015 #83
Le Taz Hot Iwillnevergiveup Nov 2015 #84
K & R SunSeeker Nov 2015 #85
DURec leftstreet Nov 2015 #89
I agree. Per Obama's statement, the responsible are not only talking about reasonable gun laws, seabeyond Nov 2015 #92
Planned Parenthood has PREVENTED far, far more abortions LiberalEsto Nov 2015 #93
^Thread Win^ Le Taz Hot Nov 2015 #97
I loathe them. CrispyQ Nov 2015 #94
They only care about life if it's still in the uterus True_Blue Nov 2015 #115
Libel and Slander shadowmayor Nov 2015 #95
+1000 LiberalLovinLug Nov 2015 #144
I wonder about the implications for Carly Fiorina in all this. wheniwasincongress Nov 2015 #96
k and r niyad Nov 2015 #98
Great post! KT2000 Nov 2015 #99
Agree except with what you said about the middle class. lark Nov 2015 #101
I was speaking strictly from a California perspective. Le Taz Hot Nov 2015 #107
In No. FL we had to go to New York prior to Roe v Wade. lark Nov 2015 #146
Wow! Best! Rant! Ever! GitRDun Nov 2015 #102
Exactly. None of my business in any situation what a woman is seeking medical care for. brewens Nov 2015 #103
Thank You for this post! True_Blue Nov 2015 #108
Great post. Tipperary Nov 2015 #109
I'll see your blood red anger and raise you white hot rage Warpy Nov 2015 #116
. . . Le Taz Hot Nov 2015 #123
KICK and REC!! hifiguy Nov 2015 #121
The Womb Police should try policing mstinamotorcity2 Nov 2015 #122
The people who made these fraudulent videos may well have blood on their hands Gothmog Nov 2015 #124
They are now going to be named in the wrongful death lawsuits, mark my words. kestrel91316 Nov 2015 #160
K & R !!! WillyT Nov 2015 #125
K&R sheshe2 Nov 2015 #126
Shooting Suspect Made Comment About 'No More Baby Parts' Jarqui Nov 2015 #127
Kick Liberal_in_LA Nov 2015 #129
If they would only call it birth 'elimination' instead of control nolabels Nov 2015 #130
+1000 smirkymonkey Nov 2015 #131
K and R-- a very concise post panader0 Nov 2015 #133
K&R Lithos Nov 2015 #134
Sounds about right... Thespian2 Nov 2015 #135
When we finally achieve universal single-payer healthcare, free abortions KingCharlemagne Nov 2015 #136
+1. cheapdate Nov 2015 #138
+infinity^infinity LostOne4Ever Nov 2015 #139
I'm sick of the mealy mouthed statements that come out of Gloria Nov 2015 #140
I'm with you, Gloria! Kath1 Nov 2015 #143
Calm legalese does squat when the other side has been carrying verbal blow torches and guns Gloria Nov 2015 #150
Very well-said. Kath1 Nov 2015 #153
Amen. I am angered we are still having to fight this battle. avaistheone1 Nov 2015 #141
I thought I kicked this marym625 Nov 2015 #145
Long time ago when I was active in pro-choice for our state, early 1970's, dixiegrrrrl Nov 2015 #148
Great story! Le Taz Hot Nov 2015 #149
Excellent story! Kath1 Nov 2015 #159
Yes, we need to stop mincing words with these people. PatrickforO Nov 2015 #151
They are all Christianist terrorists. We need to round them all up, kestrel91316 Nov 2015 #154
YES!!!!!!! Angry Dragon Nov 2015 #158

Enthusiast

(50,983 posts)
3. Kicked and recommended to the Max!
Sat Nov 28, 2015, 08:29 AM
Nov 2015

To this day when the media refers to the video they never mention that it is inauthentic. They act as if it is a highly accurate depiction of PPH. I have never even heard Carly Fiorina's crazy assertions challenged. Maybe Carly has been challenged and I missed it. I watch very little MSM.

The US media is downright horrible. It isn't because they are concerned about the bottom line. It is because they have a right wing bias and have a clear agenda.

SickOfTheOnePct

(7,290 posts)
29. Agree 100%
Sat Nov 28, 2015, 09:23 AM
Nov 2015

The First Amendment doesn't do anything to prevent them from telling the truth about the videos.

But it does protect them (or anyone else) from being jailed as accomplices when they don't say what we want them to, or do say what we disagree with.

Calista241

(5,586 posts)
58. There wasn't anything hateful on the videos
Sat Nov 28, 2015, 10:38 AM
Nov 2015

They clipped out various things the PP people were saying, and put them together in such a way as to make it sensational. The real media should have bene all over this farcical series of stories and corrected things from the beginning.

That being said, there are NO threats against offices or people that work at PP in the videos. No violence is implied, either directly or indirectly. I actually think the videos were designed to motivate fundies in congress or judges to take action, not at the masses to perform acts of random violence.

deutsey

(20,166 posts)
14. With that protection comes responsibility
Sat Nov 28, 2015, 09:02 AM
Nov 2015

Airing those videos and the right-wing propaganda around them without researching and reporting on their shady origins and distortions is irresponsible.

deutsey

(20,166 posts)
39. Just look at what happened in Rwanda
Sat Nov 28, 2015, 09:56 AM
Nov 2015

The massacre there was instigated by radio broadcasts.

Imagine what would happen if Limbaugh and his ilk went on the air and said it was time to exterminate liberal cockroaches.

PatrickforO

(14,646 posts)
152. Actually Hitler, and Joseph Goebbels taught these right wingers how to do it well.
Mon Nov 30, 2015, 08:34 PM
Nov 2015

Read some Lee Atwater and Karl Rove quotes.

mountain grammy

(26,799 posts)
34. Sure, free speech is protected, but lies should be called out as lies..
Sat Nov 28, 2015, 09:31 AM
Nov 2015

the media fails every day by not doing just that. They give vocal credibility to the lies because it's good for ratings, and when it's all debunked, they whisper the truth.
Just because we have freedom of speech doesn't mean the liars and demagogues shouldn't be called out loud and clear, and, if they are public figures, even more so. I can still hate the shit out of these liars, that's my protected freedom, whether you like it or not.

asjr

(10,479 posts)
54. Exactly MG! It is allmost the year 2016 and we
Sat Nov 28, 2015, 10:30 AM
Nov 2015

seem to be falling back into the 1800s. The media seem to think they can print anything and show anything they wish. And the ones that always show us the backwoods Republicans who ought to be washed off the T.V.

rainy

(6,112 posts)
117. The media call out only democrats especially when the right
Sat Nov 28, 2015, 05:00 PM
Nov 2015

start screaming and pointing! Dan Rather comes to mind.

Divernan

(15,480 posts)
35. Some lies are not protected speech. Neither are "embellishments"
Sat Nov 28, 2015, 09:34 AM
Nov 2015

Speaking of lies - how about this oldie? Repeated and embellished by HRC for over 12 years. "We landed under sniper fire. There was no greeting ceremony We had to run to our cars. And that is what happened." And in a later embellishment _ "We had to duck sniper fire!"

What I find chilling about watching the video clip of HRC lying about the sniper fire, is the calm, assured and forceful way in which she delivers the lie.


CBS Exposes Hillary Clinton Bosnia Trip.

https://search.yahoo.com/yhs/search?p=Hillary+Bosnia&ei=UTF-8&hspart=mozilla&hsimp=yhs-002

Hillary_Clinton_official_Secretary_of_State_portrait_crop

It was twelve years after the fact when Democratic presidential candidate Hillary Clinton got caught "embellishing" the danger she’d faced on a trip to Bosnia. I happened to have accompanied her on the trip and didn’t remember being shot at, as Clinton described. The videotape of the actual visit proved Clinton’s memory wrong–not just once but twice.

After my first report exposed the truth, Clinton doubled down and dug in, providing a second reason to question her memory of events. Clinton never fully explained how she could have made such a mistake as saying she had ducked sniper fire when there hadn’t been a sniper in sight. Initially, she stated “I was sleep deprived and I misspoke.”

But as my report below (“Clinton Doubles Down”) shows, Clinton told varieties of the embellishment over a long period of time, not just when she was sleep deprived. Had Clinton somehow convinced herself that it had all really happened? Or did she knowingly advance a false story?

https://sharylattkisson.com/hillary-clintons-dodging-sniper-fire-in-bosnia-tale/


Excerpt from “Stonewalled“:
I prefer not to cover political campaigns. They’re no-win assignments. You follow a candidate around the country: if you expose their flaws, you’re viewed as being politically biased against them and it jeopardizes your access. If they have a good day and you report it as such, you risk critics accusing you of being their cheerleader. And if your observations from the front lines aren’t in synch with what the news managers back in New York see on cable news or read on the wire services or hear on the competition, you may find yourself eternally second-guessing and getting second-guessed. Nonetheless, a campaign story occasionally falls into my lap and draws me into the fray. That happened in 2008 when I returned from a trip overseas to be greeted with a strange question from my husband.
“When you went to Bosnia with Hillary Clinton in 1996, were you guys shot at?” he asks.
“No,” I reply. “Why?”
“Are you sure?” he presses.
“Of course. I’d know if we’d been shot at,” I say.

It seems that Democratic presidential candidate Hillary Clinton has been publicly saying that we took sniper fire on that trip to Bosnia twelve years before when she was first lady. Some observers theorize that Clinton is saying this now because she believes that getting shot at in a war zone would help voters view her as being qualified to serve as commander in chief. More so than a young senator from Illinois named Barack Obama with no such experience.
“She must be speaking of a different trip,” I postulate.

Nothing else makes sense. I do a little research and discover Clinton is referring to the trip on which I accompanied her. She’s claiming that, as our military plane landed in Bosnia, we took sniper fire. She even says she had to duck and run for cover to escape the flying bullets.
The idea is ludicrous. Yes, we flew into a recent war zone and were told it could be dangerous. We were prepared for the possibility of hostile fire. But it never materialized. And the fact is, had hostile forces fired upon our aircraft, our military pilot wouldn’t have just flown right into them and landed. Especially considering that accompanying us on the trip were the president’s daughter, Chelsea, and two entertainers who came along to perform for the troops: comedian Sinbad, and singer Sheryl Crow. If there had been any threat of our plane being shot at, we simply would’ve flown to an alternate, safe destination.


I rarely hang on to story materials for very long, but in this case, I go to my office in Washington, dig through some boxes of records, and discover I still have notes, photographs, and videotape from that trip in 1996. The video clearly disproves candidate Clinton’s story. It shows Clinton and Chelsea disembarking from the plane on the tar- mac in Bosnia, leisurely smiling for photographs and greeting a local schoolgirl on the runway. No sniper fire. No ducking and running.


https://sharylattkisson.com/stonewalled-book/
 

Rex

(65,616 posts)
112. I don't get it, why are we supposed to single out HRC from other politicians?
Sat Nov 28, 2015, 04:13 PM
Nov 2015

Not very democratic if you ask me, but that poster knew this would be stirring the shite.

PeaceNikki

(27,985 posts)
45. Get a grip.
Sat Nov 28, 2015, 10:11 AM
Nov 2015

Can we just take one fucking day and focus on the literal war in women and reproductive freedom in this country without turning it into a Clinton bashing thread??

Jesus fuck. I just voted to hide this and I hope 6 others will, too.

dsc

(52,212 posts)
50. you really are a piece of work
Sat Nov 28, 2015, 10:24 AM
Nov 2015

You are literally pissing on the graves of those who died yesterday.

TheBlackAdder

(28,379 posts)
51. When I see posts like this, it indicates the need for someone to detach, losing their myopic view.
Sat Nov 28, 2015, 10:25 AM
Nov 2015

.


There is more to life than a primary, a single point topic. Not everything relates back to an individual candidate.


When I am on other sites, there are people who constantly see a post, no matter what is is, and find some way to blame Obama for it--yes, it's always "Obama's fault!" Seeing posts like this are akin to that very same manner of posts. Many of the progressives, who see posts like "Obama's fault" are annoyed by that type of posturing. This one is no different.






Healthy tip: Detach, find your center, and return refreshed.


.

yardwork

(62,076 posts)
59. It really makes me want to take another look at Sanders, right?
Sat Nov 28, 2015, 10:44 AM
Nov 2015

I don't understand the purpose of posts like that. Nothing positive can possibly come from it.

Progressive dog

(6,947 posts)
100. Congratulations, Even the Benghazi commitee didn't think to bring this up
Sat Nov 28, 2015, 02:55 PM
Nov 2015

They should give you a reward.

 

Rex

(65,616 posts)
111. SO we are going to seperate her out from all the other politicians that exaggerate?
Sat Nov 28, 2015, 04:11 PM
Nov 2015

How is that fair?

FreedomRain

(413 posts)
119. needed to be placed elsewhere
Sat Nov 28, 2015, 05:15 PM
Nov 2015

It was very interesting, never heard the story from that angle.

But yeah... quite inappropriate, even petty, to place it in this thread.

Hepburn

(21,054 posts)
74. The First Amendment applies ONLY to State Action.
Sat Nov 28, 2015, 11:31 AM
Nov 2015

The video, unless it was made by the state or with governmental monies or their is some other connection to the governmental action, is NOT protected by the First Amendment. The First Amendment was created for the protection of the people against the government suppressing their opinions. Free Speech is not an unlimited right. It is not for the protection of those who incite violence with bullshit videos.

JMHO

 

kestrel91316

(51,666 posts)
157. Pretty clear you have no concept of civil liability as it pertains to
Mon Nov 30, 2015, 08:44 PM
Nov 2015

libel and slander?

Your ignorance just marked you in fluorescent colors as something other than a Democrat.

Fairgo

(1,571 posts)
110. How obtuse
Sat Nov 28, 2015, 04:10 PM
Nov 2015

In one deft wave of your tragic wand you misconstrue and conflate a woman's right to her body with a man's right to his words. What's really sad is that beneath this clumsy bit of sophistry is the assumption of words as weapons...an allowance of the accretion of words into action, in this case stochastic terrorism.

 

Rex

(65,616 posts)
113. It is not legal to yell 'fire' in a building if there is no danger.
Sat Nov 28, 2015, 04:15 PM
Nov 2015

Whether you like it or not.

 

hill2016

(1,772 posts)
114. do you know what campaign ads are?
Sat Nov 28, 2015, 04:19 PM
Nov 2015

they are snippets of an opposition candidate's videos, taken wildly out of context.

yet these are perfectly acceptable speech

jmowreader

(50,742 posts)
118. Those videos are NOT speech protected by the First Amendment
Sat Nov 28, 2015, 05:11 PM
Nov 2015

"Corporations are people, my friend." - Willard Romney

Libel: a published false statement that is damaging to a person's reputation.

Slander is a spoken version of libel.

Libel and Slander are not protected by the First Amendment. They are, rather, actionable torts.

 

kestrel91316

(51,666 posts)
155. Um, PP is a business, probably a corporation and therefore a person.
Mon Nov 30, 2015, 08:40 PM
Nov 2015

It can sue for slander or libel or defamation or whatever it's called. Since there is malice involved, the liability is huge.

CJCRANE

(18,184 posts)
15. And now you see how the manipulation works to get us all angry with each other.
Sat Nov 28, 2015, 09:04 AM
Nov 2015

The string-pullers on both sides manipulate us and pit different groups against each other.


CJCRANE

(18,184 posts)
27. A concealed man throws rocks at two different groups. They accuse and fight each other.
Sat Nov 28, 2015, 09:19 AM
Nov 2015

The man walks away and continues his business undisturbed.

This is the role of the MSM and the 1% in American politics.

Le Taz Hot

(22,271 posts)
33. Sweetheart, if you want to go pray with the guy in jail, you're free to do so.
Sat Nov 28, 2015, 09:27 AM
Nov 2015

I'm standing up for women's reproductive rights and I'm going to get loud about it and I'm going to get mean about it and I may not even hold up my fucking pinkie.

 

rhett o rick

(55,981 posts)
86. I am with you all the way, but while we are justly outraged about specific events, we
Sat Nov 28, 2015, 01:02 PM
Nov 2015

need also to focus on the causes. This culture has been fostered by the 1%, Powers That Be, or whatever you want to call them. It favors them to encourage this behavior to keep us in chaos. To change the culture that encourages this behaviors we must return to a government that is responsive to the People. Punishing those that do these crimes is very much necessary, but only a band-aid.

Le Taz Hot

(22,271 posts)
88. Of course it has
Sat Nov 28, 2015, 01:23 PM
Nov 2015

and I've spent 40 years walking the walk. It's one of many reasons I'm working my buns off for Sanders and why I'll continue to fight the good fight. But the tax-exempt fundamentalists churches continue to be cauldrons of hatred and that existed long before Reagan decided he needed their votes to win the election against Carter. Iow, the politicians and the 1% are merely taking advantage of a culture that has existed for over 2000 years.

CJCRANE

(18,184 posts)
63. No. I'm talking about stirring up animosity between different groups.
Sat Nov 28, 2015, 10:55 AM
Nov 2015

It's more of a meta issue.

Look beneath the surface to see who is stirring things up on both sides to get us constantly fighting each other.


jeff47

(26,549 posts)
65. And instead of "animosity" over people taking over their bodies, women should do what, exactly? (nt)
Sat Nov 28, 2015, 10:57 AM
Nov 2015

CJCRANE

(18,184 posts)
69. The PP video was an example of stochastic terrorism designed to rile up christians conservatives
Sat Nov 28, 2015, 11:09 AM
Nov 2015

and make them demonize liberals. The same thing is done with jihadis. They make them watch videos of western atrocities to psyche them up.

So I'm not criticizing our side, we've done nothing wrong, I'm just pointing out how these conflicts are generated.

 

orpupilofnature57

(15,472 posts)
19. Ronnie Ray-gun freed them of culpability years ago, instead of protecting validity, we invented
Sat Nov 28, 2015, 09:07 AM
Nov 2015

Misanthropic Sycophant Monsters .

 

randome

(34,845 posts)
21. I want PP & politicians to make stronger statements, something the mouth-breathers might understand.
Sat Nov 28, 2015, 09:08 AM
Nov 2015

"If you don't like the laws in this country, then leave."
[hr][font color="blue"][center]Everything is a satellite to some other thing.[/center][/font][hr]

dembotoz

(16,917 posts)
25. NOT THEM....WE NEED TO MAKE THE STATEMENTS
Sat Nov 28, 2015, 09:12 AM
Nov 2015

sorry about the all caps but all too damn often we get crazy mad and then wait for rachel maddow or some such to carry it onward


NO caps again....WE HAVE TO DO THIS

 

pipoman

(16,038 posts)
62. That sentiment is the antithesis of what this country is about.
Sat Nov 28, 2015, 10:51 AM
Nov 2015
"If you don't like the laws in this country, then leave." 

This country is about, 'if you don't like the laws in this country, then you can change the laws'.
 

randome

(34,845 posts)
78. I would think that was implied. Maybe not.
Sat Nov 28, 2015, 11:51 AM
Nov 2015

My point is to turn their own arguments against them. To the GOP, you're either 'with' God's laws or you're not. There is no room for interpretation.

Fight fire with fire? Not always the best approach, of course, since everyone ends up getting burned.
[hr][font color="blue"][center]Everything is a satellite to some other thing.[/center][/font][hr]

Le Taz Hot

(22,271 posts)
30. I was in California (still am)
Sat Nov 28, 2015, 09:23 AM
Nov 2015

and we could go across the border to Mexico, which is ironic considering it was (and still is) illegal in Mexico. Sometimes the facilities were clean but there were no guarantees and nowhere to go if things went wrong. Desperate women will take desperate chances.

ETA: And, those of us who lived during those times need to tell younger women what it was like and how important it is to continue to fight for reproductive choice. As we've already seen, you can never rest. Never.

maddiemom

(5,106 posts)
55. I was in college in the mid to late sixties.
Sat Nov 28, 2015, 10:34 AM
Nov 2015

A girl in our dorm came back from an illegal abortion and was bleeding badly in her dorm room, refusing to tell the house mother. Those of us on her floor took it upon ourselves to call an ambulance. She made it. Over the years I've heard similar stories from many others. I especially remember one other detail from that experience. Through chance, the girl's roommate was not a friend of hers and a vocal "Christian," well before it was a more common thing. The roomie was engaged and always spouting off about how she and her fiance were "saving it for marriage." She left to stay with a friend on another floor, disgusted that her roommate came back in dire straits and badly needing help. She later righteously claimed that it was God's way of punishing her roommate for her terrible "sins." (I'm not making this up or embellishing this). Needless to say, some quick reassignments of rooms were made. Sympathies were largely with the the girl who'd had the abortion and nothing more was ever said.

get the red out

(13,468 posts)
31. Control
Sat Nov 28, 2015, 09:24 AM
Nov 2015

They would regard back alley abortion deaths as justice, and hate for women to have access to birth control. Babies are punishment for sex, which they call blessings. They would probably secretly welcome the deaths of poor women to cancer since they regard the poor as always taking from them.

sarge43

(28,960 posts)
36. But they make damn sure that
Sat Nov 28, 2015, 09:42 AM
Nov 2015

their wives, daughters and mistresses get that 'problem' safely taken care of even when she doesn't concur.

Control.

mountain grammy

(26,799 posts)
37. As I watched this unfold, the same thoughts kept going through my head..
Sat Nov 28, 2015, 09:50 AM
Nov 2015

I'm furious about the crude and vicious rhetoric surrounding Planned Parenthood. I remember all too well a time when abortion was illegal for women without connections. Nearly lost a good friend to a back ally butcher.

LittleGirl

(8,299 posts)
41. Agree completely
Sat Nov 28, 2015, 10:05 AM
Nov 2015

but considering that a woman HAS to have sperm in order to get into that unfortunate situation (pregnancy), we need to stop saying men can't make the decision and start saying that they are responsible for the woman's condition!

When are men going to be held up and told that they are the reason woman have to make these decisions?

Damn it, it's their fault.

 

pipoman

(16,038 posts)
66. A woman's decision results in the man being held financially responsible
Sat Nov 28, 2015, 11:03 AM
Nov 2015

For a very long time. The tone of your post is demeaning to women in that it transfers all responsibility to the male which is as ridiculous as what you are railing against.

In the context of your post this is complete irony: Damn it, it's their fault.....ffs

 

Bluenorthwest

(45,319 posts)
42. Many on DU seem to be very dedicated to anti-choice activist clergy.
Sat Nov 28, 2015, 10:05 AM
Nov 2015

DU used to discuss and strongly object to the March For Life each year:

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=217x1040
http://www.democraticunderground.com/1002206221


Then came Pope Francis, and DU shifted into defending his anti choice activism. 2014 March For Life Francis tweets this: "I join the March for Life in Washington with my prayers. May God help us respect all life, especially the most vulnerable."
Here is a thread about that year's March For Life, most of the comments defend Francis and the March:

http://www.democraticunderground.com/10024376469


Any mention of Francis' anti choice activism on DU is met with derision. And the community seems to endorse that derision and the activism of Francis.

davidpdx

(22,000 posts)
52. Even as a man I have used Planned Parenthood services and am grateful for their existance
Sat Nov 28, 2015, 10:26 AM
Nov 2015

I honestly can not understand the way these people justify using violence toward PP.

yellowwoodII

(616 posts)
53. Kizinger
Sat Nov 28, 2015, 10:29 AM
Nov 2015

For God's sake, get rid of this guy if you have a chance to vote for someone else, anybody else! When does he come up for election again?

Glaisne

(520 posts)
64. Amen
Sat Nov 28, 2015, 10:57 AM
Nov 2015

"I can't tell you how I truly hate these anti-choice people. I hate the churches they go to, the media that they listen to and the politicians who control but appease them."

Absolutely! I share your hatred of these theocratic, hypocritical, selfish, stupid, ignorant, hateful, low life, degenerate, pieces of offal.

klook

(12,217 posts)
68. 100 per cent with you, LTH
Sat Nov 28, 2015, 11:05 AM
Nov 2015

Middle-aged male here, who has many female friends and relatives, is capable of empathy, and is dedicated to justice.

The real goal of these moral crusaders is to perpetuate gender inequality. That's what it is all about. The agenda is cloaked in a twisted idea of devout righteousness that is officially sanctioned by many authoritative entities. This reassuring illusion of rectitude suckers many into following along.

But we must never forget that the war over reproductive rights is, bottom line, about whether women should remain in the subservient place designated for them by a patriarchal society.

Dont call me Shirley

(10,998 posts)
70. The rw fundy churches and rw media are the terrorist organizations in this country. When is law
Sat Nov 28, 2015, 11:21 AM
Nov 2015

enforcement going to enforce the laws against these domestic terrorist organizations instead of harassing Peace groups?

Le Taz Hot

(22,271 posts)
72. I just read an OP
Sat Nov 28, 2015, 11:26 AM
Nov 2015

in GD claiming that we don't know this has anything to do with religion. WHAT. THE. FUCK??? On DU!

SusanCalvin

(6,592 posts)
76. Yep. People with enough money will always have access to abortions.
Sat Nov 28, 2015, 11:38 AM
Nov 2015

It's a war on women without money, if you ask me.

retrowire

(10,345 posts)
77. KnR
Sat Nov 28, 2015, 11:46 AM
Nov 2015

abortion is only a small service of what planned parenthood does. and the fact that some media outlets keep calling it a shooting at an abortion clinic really pisses me off.

they are NOT an abortion clinic, it is a women's health center if anything. the agenda is so obviously blatant.

domestic terrorism needs to end now, before we have our own homegrown Isis.

SoapBox

(18,791 posts)
80. Absolutely.
Sat Nov 28, 2015, 11:53 AM
Nov 2015

As a male...I cannot agree more.

You and every woman, have the right to be blood red angry.

 

seabeyond

(110,159 posts)
92. I agree. Per Obama's statement, the responsible are not only talking about reasonable gun laws,
Sat Nov 28, 2015, 01:32 PM
Nov 2015

But, there must also be the discussion on a media that allowed themselves to feed the hate with non truths. And a man that was allowed to edit a lie to the people. And politicians that use it to get hate votes.

CrispyQ

(36,827 posts)
94. I loathe them.
Sat Nov 28, 2015, 01:51 PM
Nov 2015

Pro-life? They're the biggest warmongers on the planet. They are punitive beyond belief & yet claim they are pro-life cuz they care about a clump of cells more than the living, breathing humans already alive. The biggest terrorist origination on the planet is the republican controlled congress. I'm beginning to question the integrity or mental well being of anyone I know who admits to voting for these assholes. What the fuck?

True_Blue

(3,063 posts)
115. They only care about life if it's still in the uterus
Sat Nov 28, 2015, 04:28 PM
Nov 2015

It's a whole different story altogether once it's out.

shadowmayor

(1,325 posts)
95. Libel and Slander
Sat Nov 28, 2015, 01:53 PM
Nov 2015

And it never ends. Our media is incapable of doing their journalistic duties. The propaganda always grows new legs to crawl out of our TV's and newspapers again and again. My "fundie" idiot friends still won't believe that the video was BS and that their tax bucks cannot be used for abortions. The idea that sex education actually reduces the number of abortions doesn't register with these people. What they really want is control; control of vaginas, control of our sexual lives, and control of our morality. And it all seems to hinge on the belief that conception is a celestial event, and not a biological one. It's too much like adults still believing in the Tooth Fairy, and yet it remains a pervasive line of thought in our country. And most of these anti-abortion people heartily cheer when we drop bombs on kids in far away lands or lock up dark people in this country. Pro-life is pro-Bullshit! And that's what I call 'em to their faces. Pro-Bullshit!

wheniwasincongress

(1,307 posts)
96. I wonder about the implications for Carly Fiorina in all this.
Sat Nov 28, 2015, 02:03 PM
Nov 2015

What if we learn that the gunman was motivated by these videos that simply don't exist? What if he explicitly states that he was inspired by Carly Fiorina's insistence of the videos?

KT2000

(20,659 posts)
99. Great post!
Sat Nov 28, 2015, 02:21 PM
Nov 2015

There were times I did not have money much less insurance and they were there for me and all of us no matter what!
I feel the same about the holier-than-thou, judgmental, simple-minded anti-abortion people and their propaganda generators.

lark

(23,395 posts)
101. Agree except with what you said about the middle class.
Sat Nov 28, 2015, 02:56 PM
Nov 2015

A lot of middle class dads/moms back then, especially in the south, were very conservative and would never help their daughter get an abortion. They sent them to "homes for wayward girls" where they were hidden away and punished for their sins of getting pregnant, sometimes beaten severely if they weren't repentant enough. Of course the guys that got them pregnant had no repercussions. The baby was adopted out, regardless of what the teen aged mom wanted, so the grandparents wouldn't be shamed by their out of wedlock babies.

A lot of middle class girls were in the same boat as the poor ones, no money and no one to help them.

That's what my dad had planned for me but I was "lucky" enough to have a miscarriage.

Le Taz Hot

(22,271 posts)
107. I was speaking strictly from a California perspective.
Sat Nov 28, 2015, 03:51 PM
Nov 2015

I had boyfriends that lived in the (then) wealthier Orange County area and knew of several of their female acquaintances who knew the "right" doctors. The poor ones were more likely to cross the border since it was close and cheap (though not necessarily sanitary).

It's all about control of women, whether it's religion or southern culture.

Speaking of guys having no repercussions. There was a girl in my senior year who was OBVIOUSLY pregnant. Back then they used to kick girls out of school for being pregnant and not married (horrendous, but true). I also remember the female gym teachers looking the other way when it came shower time. So did the rest of the teachers, apparently, because she did graduate on time. She had her baby a week later. But, as usual, the fathers were never threated with expulsion. They were usually whisked off to another town or another state if there was any hint of a paternity suit and all of a sudden none of their relatives had any idea where they were.

lark

(23,395 posts)
146. In No. FL we had to go to New York prior to Roe v Wade.
Sun Nov 29, 2015, 12:11 PM
Nov 2015

It's kinda funny in a way, but a number of seniors and young women that had just graduated high school got together and we supported our friends who needed to go to NY to get an abortion. We'd each chip in as much as we could and we collectively sent 5 young women to a clinic in NYC. We really saved each other's lives. All 5 of us ended up going to college,getting married and have good lives because of our decisions. Only 1 did't have any children. The abortion had nothing to do with her inability to have children and was medically necessary to save her life (without her parents finding out).

Thankfully we had a group of awesome friends/relatives. There wasn't even an internet to research back in those days.

brewens

(13,907 posts)
103. Exactly. None of my business in any situation what a woman is seeking medical care for.
Sat Nov 28, 2015, 03:13 PM
Nov 2015

I'm pretty certain I never had any involvement in an abortion situation. As a kid, when I was an irrisponsible party animal, I suppose it could have happened, though I was no womanizer type. If one of the girls did that, she may have done us both a huge favor.

I did develope a pattern of screwing up, or almost, then getting my shit together before I got in serious trouble. It could be that had I gotten one of the girls pregnant, I would have pulled my head out of my ass and done okay. That would have been asking a lot of a girl to trust me to do that at the time though.

True_Blue

(3,063 posts)
108. Thank You for this post!
Sat Nov 28, 2015, 03:59 PM
Nov 2015

I'm mostly a lurker and rarely log in but I had to recommend this post. I remember when abortions were illegal and reading a letter to Dear Abby from a desperate woman that was considering drinking turpentine to terminate a pregancy.

Warpy

(111,869 posts)
116. I'll see your blood red anger and raise you white hot rage
Sat Nov 28, 2015, 04:52 PM
Nov 2015

against all the liars and propagandists and charlatans you mentioned and also against all those swaggering rabbity men with big ugly guns, those pimples on the rectums of humanity who think they prove their manhood by bullying women and children, those asshole cowards who back down quickly to "yes sir, no sir" when confronted by other males to the point that no one believes what monsters they turn into behind closed doors--and in health care clinics that provide care women can't find anywhere else. I loathe the lot of them, whether their weapons are thumping some book at people frightened of death or shooting up unarmed people whose only crime was showing up to work.

mstinamotorcity2

(1,451 posts)
122. The Womb Police should try policing
Sat Nov 28, 2015, 05:43 PM
Nov 2015

their own wombs. If they don't have one, then the conversation it mute for those individuals. Secondly, I myself would rather have an Abortion than bring another child into this awful world. Children are a huge responsibility. And everyone isn't equipped for the Challenge. Personally I see why some decide not to have any. Contrary to the Happy Baby Commercials, parenting isn't always Happy. They have taken their Religious beliefs and are forcing them on a society that believes in choice. See all is good telling a woman to have the baby of a rapist or Uncle Fester, when it's not you. But flip the script. Young woman will be " visiting Aunt suzy for a couple days". We know.

Gothmog

(147,659 posts)
124. The people who made these fraudulent videos may well have blood on their hands
Sat Nov 28, 2015, 06:16 PM
Nov 2015

They are being sued by PP already and have admitted that these videos are fraudulent

Jarqui

(10,150 posts)
127. Shooting Suspect Made Comment About 'No More Baby Parts'
Sat Nov 28, 2015, 07:24 PM
Nov 2015
http://www.nbcnews.com/news/us-news/planned-parenthood-shooting-suspect-made-comment-about-no-more-baby-n470706
"In one statement, made after the suspect was taken in for questioning, Dear said "no more baby parts" in reference to Planned Parenthood, according to two law enforcement sources with knowledge of the case.

But the sources stressed that Dear said many things to law enforcement and the extent to which the "baby parts" remark played into any decision to target the Planned Parenthood office was not yet clear. He also mentioned President Barack Obama in statements."



To me, the fact he even raised 'baby parts' provides even less doubt about who has blood of innocents on their hands

nolabels

(13,133 posts)
130. If they would only call it birth 'elimination' instead of control
Sat Nov 28, 2015, 08:58 PM
Nov 2015

The wacko's who equate the size and quantity of their firearms with their own moral superiority have difficulty differentiating with finality. The sham of needing guns for hunting mostly stupid at best. Like it's a sport and or a challenge to shoot a unwitting animal from a distance?

The other aspect of self-protection from others or the government also appears mostly to have the opposite effect. I guess every moment another fool is born and heaven knows they all like to follow each other

Lithos

(26,410 posts)
134. K&R
Sat Nov 28, 2015, 11:03 PM
Nov 2015

I remember several girl friends who depended on PP for their basic medical needs. I also know they helped my wife and I when we had a pregnancy terminate early. Not an abortion, but a case where the fetus had died and needed to be removed.

Too many stories about how PP identified many major medical issues early for women - in time to help them.

I stand with PP. Good people doing needed services.

L-

 

KingCharlemagne

(7,908 posts)
136. When we finally achieve universal single-payer healthcare, free abortions
Sat Nov 28, 2015, 11:31 PM
Nov 2015

on demand must be a part of covered procedures, backed by the full might of the federal government.

Gloria

(17,663 posts)
140. I'm sick of the mealy mouthed statements that come out of
Sun Nov 29, 2015, 02:47 AM
Nov 2015

NARAL, PP...and where the hell is NOW?

I call out the bullshit..I've written to them countless times...they rely on the courts, but NEVER really kept up the fight to keep the real issues out there about healthcare, privacy, respect, etc.
They got complacent...it's time to get the fight going again...or send out the JANE info so we can do abortions in the house.
I have the info printed out and would be willing to provide a place...

Where is the fight??

Kath1

(4,309 posts)
143. I'm with you, Gloria!
Sun Nov 29, 2015, 03:35 AM
Nov 2015

We need something like a nationwide women's strike or massive civil disobedience.

Than you for calling bullshit.

Gloria

(17,663 posts)
150. Calm legalese does squat when the other side has been carrying verbal blow torches and guns
Mon Nov 30, 2015, 08:19 PM
Nov 2015

They should be labelled CONSISTENTLY according to their varying intensity of obsession...cruel hypocrites, not respecting OTHER religions on the subject, extremists, terrorists, liars, degrading to women, etc.

The language never seems to convey passionate commitment...

This is why I don't donate to the national, but directly to the Rocky Mountain "local"...to the places actually doing the real work...

Kath1

(4,309 posts)
153. Very well-said.
Mon Nov 30, 2015, 08:36 PM
Nov 2015

You make some good points. I donate to the local also - the people who actually in the trenches and providing the care.

marym625

(17,997 posts)
145. I thought I kicked this
Sun Nov 29, 2015, 06:47 AM
Nov 2015

I'm sorry I didn't

Great post. Every single person, in office and running for office, that has contributed to the lies about Planned Parenthood, in any way, has blood on their hands. Every single media outlet that doesn't tell the truth about the videos and the bullshit Carly Fiorina spewed, has blood on their hands.

And every single one of them should be prosecuted

dixiegrrrrl

(60,010 posts)
148. Long time ago when I was active in pro-choice for our state, early 1970's,
Sun Nov 29, 2015, 07:00 PM
Nov 2015

I attended my grandmother's 75th birthday party, all the large family was there, the 6 uncles, the 3 daughters, my cousins, etc.
And I was wearing a pro-choice button.
Big loud mouth Irish family, always arguing with each other, horribly opinionated, and not helped by a couple hours of drinking.
All 6 uncles were BIG guys, 6 foot at least, hefty.
Grandma was a little chunk of a woman, not even 5 foot tall.

So they started in sharing their opinion of women's place in th world, yakking and then talking louder, all around the dinner table, in her rather small house.

Grandma finally had enough. She stood up, slapped her hand on the table, bringing an instant hush to all her "boys" ( several of whom were well over 50,)

"Let me tell you idjits something", she said .
( oh-oh...everyone one knew what THAT phrase meant)

"Back in the Depression when your Dad and I were barely making ends meet and trying to feed and clothe all of you, I had to have THREE abortions."

Dead silence.

Then she pointed her spoon at 2 of the more unpleasant uncles.
" and If I had had my way, that would have included YOU and YOU".

Watching 6 large subdued men suddenly decided to head for the doorway was unforgettable.

Kath1

(4,309 posts)
159. Excellent story!
Mon Nov 30, 2015, 08:51 PM
Nov 2015

I love it.

My pro-choice and anti-war buttons and bumper stickers used to elicit a lot of nasty comments in my own Irish family. They now realize I can counter every argument they throw my way. Not too many comments any more.

This one...



And this one...




I have a collection of them. Usually where them on my shoulder bag and change them up from time to time depending on what is on my mind.

PatrickforO

(14,646 posts)
151. Yes, we need to stop mincing words with these people.
Mon Nov 30, 2015, 08:30 PM
Nov 2015

Women in this nation have the right to abortion services. It is the law of the land, and I'm for that without qualifying it in any way. In addition, I really have, and should have no say - an abortion is the woman's choice, and no child should ever be brought into the world unwanted.

 

kestrel91316

(51,666 posts)
154. They are all Christianist terrorists. We need to round them all up,
Mon Nov 30, 2015, 08:37 PM
Nov 2015

ship them all off to Gitmo, and commence waterboarding to find all their plans and co-conspirators.

What's good for the goose is good for the gander. Or, if you can't take the heat, stay out of the kitchen.

None of them should ever see the light of day again. Let them die decades hence in a third world shithole. It's their plan, their way of doing things. So do it to THEM.

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