Censorship resistant markets

[TampaAnimusVortex]

The future is looking strange!

Some of the tech's biggest investors are funding a police-proof marketplace that lets you sell literally anything

http://www.businessinsider.com/openbazaar-gets-1-million-seed-round-from-andreessen-horowitz-union-square-ventures-2015-6

Two of tech's biggest venture capital funds, Andreessen Horowitz and Union Square Ventures, are investing $1 million into OpenBazaar, a wildly ambitious bitcoin startup that aims to create a decentralised, police-proof online marketplace where users can sell literally anything using bitcoin.

Read more: http://www.businessinsider.com/openbazaar-gets-1-million-seed-round-from-andreessen-horowitz-union-square-ventures-2015-6#ixzz3clNdi7Sp

[NuclearDem]

1. Seriously, have we learned nothing about unregulated marketplaces?

[TampaAnimusVortex]

2. This isn't about not having regulations on it, its about it's not even possible to regulate.

A decentralized global marketplace is no more capable of being regulated or shut down than Bittorrent or Bitcoin is.

Decentralization is a powerful force that I don't think a lot of people understand just yet.

[NuclearDem]

3. I think you need to reword that.

I'm having the damndest time trying to parse it.

Sorry, but decentralization goes hand-in-hand with deregulation, and in unregulated markets, workers, the environment, and consumers always get screwed.

[TampaAnimusVortex]

4. I dont know that I always buy that.

Isn't decentralization the fundamental principle between a democracy and a monarchy? Decentralize power over the majority?

[NCTraveler]

9. This is the only part I felt the need to parse.

"This isn't about not having regulations on it, its about it's not even possible to regulate."

Interesting sales tactic they have for this investment vehicle on a non-libertarian site.

[Warren DeMontague]

15. But guess what- there are things that it may not be POSSIBLE to control.

So whether or not it's a good idea or a bad idea, it may just be a "tough shit, there's nothing you can do about it" idea.

Just maybe.

[TampaAnimusVortex]

17. I tend to agree. Data control in the era of the internet is like trying to stop air from flowing.

It's just a matter of time before this genie gets turned up and wont go back into the bottle.

[Warren DeMontague]

18. Which is why it's funny when Rick Santorum promises to "do something" about internet porn.

Like, that's what- half of the zettabyte of information extant on the internet at any given time? Okay, maybe an exaggeration, but only slight.

Good fucking luck. If you've hung all your most precious hopes and dreams on someday stopping people from looking at naked boobs on the web, sorry, you've lost the battle.

[TampaAnimusVortex]

20. And thats only assuming its unencrypted

If they make some data illegal, the first order of business by the powers that be will be to encrypt.

[hifiguy]

24. That sounds FAR more than plausible. nt

[Warren DeMontague]

12. Maybe the lesson here is that we really ought to stop trying to keep consenting adults

from purchasing things from other consenting adults, that they really want.

At the very least, maybe we should ask ourselves whether stopping people from catching an unauthorized buzz is worth the 200 Billion a year or whatever we spend (adding up the DEA budget, local law enforcement costs, incarceration, etc) on the "drug war".

Beyond that, whether "we've learned" or not, the simple fact of the matter is, people are going to get away with doing things other people don't approve of-- they certainly have in the past, and technology is only going to make this sort of thing easier. So how much in terms of public resources do we want to throw at it, to stop it?

[NuclearDem]

19. Drugs aren't the only thing currently illegal people want their hands on.

Where does "virtually anything" end? Weapons being funneled to gangs and other criminal organizations? Conflict diamonds? Kiddie porn? People being sold toxic combinations of pharmaceuticals by likely unlicensed distributors?

I'm all for ending the stupid fucking War on Drugs, but don't act like there aren't legitimate concerns with a laissez-faire marketplace selling "virtually anything" away from any meaningful law enforcement.

[TampaAnimusVortex]

21. Yes - and there isn't going to be anything that anyone can do.

Welcome to the future!

Again, trying to stop data on the internet will be like trying to stop air. Pretty pointless endeavor. Your just going to have to get used to a world where people aren't subject to what you want politicians to prevent.

[NuclearDem]

22. DONE

I've had enough of this bullshit black market apologia for the year.

[Warren DeMontague]

23. I'm NOT acting like there aren't legitimate concerns. But riddle me this:

How much of the silk road do you think was actually devoted to, I don't know, hiring hit men or whatever other unsavory shit was going down there?

I have no idea, but my strong hunch is, if you broke it down, probably 95% of what went on there was people buying dope of one form or another.

So maybe if we actually did end the stupid fucking drug war, we would have the resources to focus on the truly noxious shit. As it is, by lumping this extremely large black market of people obtaining "forbidden" mind-alterants for their own personal use with, say, a black market in stolen organs or whatever-the-fuck, we are wasting the time of law enforcement and fighting a losing battle.

Beyond that, there MAY come a point where- right or wrong- these things do escape the ability of authorities to control them, whether people have legitimate concerns or not.

[KamaAina]

5. Didn't we just go down that Silk Road?

Anyhoo, $1 million is chump change in the VC world.

[TampaAnimusVortex]

6. Except Silk Road was running on a server hosted by a guy.

This would run on thousands of computers around the world, some of them in countries not very friendly with the US. It will be for all practical purposes, impossible to stop.

[NCTraveler]

7. I love the police angle for advertisementing this investment vehicle.

Very smart for the times. I can appreciate the tact all while knowing the rest is shit.

By the way, no one here is calling for no laws or no people to enforce those laws. That is where the police proof thing falls on its face.

[TampaAnimusVortex]

8. Wont be any different than Pirate Bay

Try as they might, they have been trying to kill it for years, but it keeps popping up again. It's there now even... go Google "Pirate Bay"

The technology is perfectly sound and will prevent it from ever being shut down.

[NCTraveler]

10. "The technology is perfectly sound"

Not a good sales strategy when we have the internet at our fingertips.

[TampaAnimusVortex]

16. I simply meant sound from the aspect of it does what they intend it to do.

Torrent technology at this point is years old and very tested. So far no way to stop it on a large scale.

[FSogol]

11. Wow, A huge win for human trafficking, illegal sex trade, and international drug cartels!

Libertarians must be shitting kitties with happiness.

[Warren DeMontague]

13. Yay Drug War!

[phantom power]

14. "Sure it could be used for illegal activity, but I don't want to discuss it!"

What a bunch of dumb-asses.

[haele]

25. Great - a marketplace for organized crime.

Hope all the big wallets who decide to play there enjoys the scamming, extortion, and fraud....

I'd never buy anything off an unregulated market, especially one that is decentralized and sets its own price structure. Where can one go for redress if there's an issue where what you think you've purchased is not as advertised or you've been scammed? What happens when someone doesn't pay the entire amount, or the purchaser counterfeits bit-coins so that you find out whatever you though s/he paid for the product with is nothing but leprechaun money - a willo'whisp?
Where can one go to negotiate any sort of settlement when something you purchase has a legitimate problem?
I don't have an army to back me up in a financial dispute. And if it's a "police-proof" marketplace, unless this is just a private trading site where everyone knows everyone else, I suspect anyone outside the membership that buys or sells there will need a lot of personal muscle to enforce their rights during transactions.

Haele

[TampaAnimusVortex]

26. They mention on their site it will have a reutation system.

Much like Ebay. Vendors who shaft people wont get a lot of customers.

That said, a lot of modern day tech was driven by shady beginnings. The porn industry basically pulled everyone into VHS. Bitcoin started with just drug buying types, but now I can go down the street and buy a cup of coffee and a doughnut with it. I wouldn't be surprised at all to see this in widespread worldwide use in a decade.