2024? Really. No wonder this place is almost 'speechless' right now. Not even a poll. Just

[Purveyor]

saying.

eom

[The Velveteen Ocelot]

1. Just saying what?

[Purveyor]

2. Already said. eom

[DCBob]

3. Do you realize we still have troops in Korea, Japan and Germany?

I dont like it but its the American way.

[neverforget]

9. But the Japanese, Germans and Koreans aren't shooting at us.

[DCBob]

12. Well, I suspect at some point the Afghans will stop shooting at us too.

This agreement should help facilitate that.

[Daniel537]

21. You know what's the best way to get them to stop shooting at us?

By leaving the damn country.

[DCBob]

23. Cant argue with that.

but then you have to accept the consequences of leaving.

[morningfog]

34. I think you are probably wrong. They'll stop when we leave.

[SunsetDreams]

4. I wasn't speechless but now I am...well sort of

I just have to ask a question...what is it with this 2024 stuff? I'm seeing a few threads with that and no explanation.

[TheCowsCameHome]

5. Fill us in - What is going on in 2024?

[avaistheone1]

6. We will be in Afghanistan at least until then.

Surprise, surprise. Not

[TheWraith]

11. No. Please try re-reading.

It says that the US will offer support to the Afghans. It says nothing to do with troops, and in fact explicitly says US troops are getting out of the war by 2014.

[hlthe2b]

13. If our role is counter-insurgency, that means troops.

I'm just trying to sort through this as I am confused as well, particularly since most of NATO is, for all intents and purposes, withdrawing.

[kenny blankenship]

18. Well...Special Forces, drones and contractors

But if anyone ever asks them, I'm sure they'll be instructed to deny that they are "troops".

The presence of any militaryish forces -not troops, of course, no one is alleging that!- acts as a trigger, always ready to draw us back in in greater and more obvious involvement.

[Zalatix]

26. No, it doesn't mean troops.

It means drones, special advisors, arms shipments to psychopaths that are on our side, puppet governments, sabotaged elections, and the like.

[avaistheone1]

14. Yeah, right.

I listened to tonight's speech, and all the speeches that came before. Yeah, right.

How many extensions have we had so far? I don't have enough fingers to count.

[kenny blankenship]

20. But this one is good for it - at least thru November!

Man there was nobody more in favor a Public Option for health insurance than Barack Obama. I mean he was FIERCE about it, right through Nov. 2008.

[avaistheone1]

27. Oh yeah. So glad that one about the public option got caught on video.

Otherwise anyone suggesting that was Obama's position then would be probably be tossed from this board.

[steve2470]

8. U.S. pledges financial, support role to Afghans through 2024

http://seattletimes.nwsource.com/html/nationworld/2018048900_afghanistan23.html

*snip*

Afghan President Hamid Karzai's national-security adviser, Rangin Dadfar Spanta, initialed a final draft of the agreement with U.S. Ambassador Ryan Crocker, according to emailed statements from Karzai's office and the U.S. Embassy in Kabul.

The two countries have a month to review and sign the deal by the May 21 NATO summit conference in Chicago, a goal voiced last month by Secretary of State Hillary Rodham Clinton. That gathering is expected to produce a plan for the final phase of the decadelong war in Afghanistan.

The document pledges American financial support for Afghanistan through 2024 and refers to the ongoing U.S. role in bolstering Afghan democracy and civil society.

The specifics of the U.S. commitment have yet to be formally outlined and could be governed by future agreements.

*snip*

[avaistheone1]

22. Nation building.

While things at home go down the tubes.

Hurrah!

[Purveyor]

10. AP:Highlights of US-Afghanistan agreement

Highlights of the strategic partnership agreement signed in Kabul by President Barack Obama and Afghanistan President Hamid Karzai outlining the relationship between their countries after the U.S.-led war ends in 2014:

- U.S. commits to support Afghanistan's social and economic development, security, institutions and regional cooperation for 10 years, through 2024.

- Afghanistan commits to strengthen government accountability, transparency and oversight, and to protect the human rights of all Afghans, both men and women.

- U.S. does not seek permanent military bases in Afghanistan, but Afghanistan will provide U.S. personnel access to and use of Afghan facilities beyond 2014.

- Allows U.S. possibility of keeping forces in Afghanistan after 2014 for purposes of training Afghan forces and targeting al-Qaida.

MORE...

http://seattletimes.nwsource.com/html/nationworld/2018116425_apasafghanistanagreement.html

[avaistheone1]

29. Meanwhile police are attacking Occupy protestors in Oakland tonight.

Ah the hypocrisy of it all is rich.

[Daniel537]

32. Targeting Al-Qaida?

Which guy would that be? Panetta himself says there are only 50-100 left in Afghanistan. There's probably more of them in Boston or Brooklyn than in Afghanistan?

[Rosco T.]

7. Cause people are actually LISTENING and not paying attention misinformation.

[derby378]

15. Yeah, I heard that part about the Taliban loud and clear

The unintended message to Afghan women: grab your ankles - you are not going to enjoy this.

Allowing the Taliban to have any part in rebuilding the nation they just destroyed is not just wrong - it is unthinkable.

[phleshdef]

16. The end of the war was just announced. Our cooperation with the Afghanistan government will continue

...as a means to support them in training and to be in a counter-terrorism positions (ie the Biden plan).

I have absolutely no problem with this. It means that we will not have a huge force there. It means its no longer an occupation as we are not in control. Its no different than what we did with South Korea after the Korean war.

[Rosco T.]

17. US/Afghan agreement does NOT keep US troops in Afghanistan past 2014.

(copied from another thread)

It says that the US will support Afghanistan's "social and economic development" after the US troops troops leave in 2014, including POSSIBLY, although not certainly, continuing to provide training for Afghan troops. However, it does not keep the US in a combat or occupation role after the already scheduled end of the war in 2014. In exchange for US support, Afghanistan makes commitments to strengthen government accountability and protect human rights of all Afghans, including women.

http://seattletimes.nwsource.com/html/nationworld/2018048900_afghanistan23.html

[redqueen]

19. That is encouraging.

However I'm sure many will expect that to change, or worry that it might, due to a change in circumstances there, some technicality (mercenaries vs. troops?), or what have you.

Also, it's an election year, so ... who knows.

[Rosco T.]

33. or we get a Republican in the WH

and a bigger war

[ecstatic]

24. Didn't hear the speech, but Chris Matthews and Joe

Scab made it seem as if the war would continue until 2024. If that's not the case, I guess it's just another case of poor journalism.

[boxman15]

28. Very poor journalism.

Troops will be out in 2014. No bases will be built. Financial and other forms of support will continue until 2024. (Arguing about that point is valid. Saying the war will continue for another 12 years is disingenuous and false.)

[former9thward]

35. Troops will still be there but as "trainers".

That way you can say combat has ended. There is absolutely no sign of any success in Afghanistan. In fact April was the worst of this year with at least 33 dead.

[MineralMan]

25. Here's a poll:

http://www.democraticunderground.com/1002634026

[boxman15]

30. DID ANYBODY ACTUALLY WATCH THE SPEECH?!?

This is maddening. The war will end in 2014. No troops will be in Afghanistan. No bases will be built. Financial aid and other aid will continue until 2024.

You can be upset the war will continue for another 2 years. You can be upset we're going to be aiding the country for another 12. I'd agree with you partially on the latter. But saying we're going to be at war until 2024 is just false.

Debate the facts. Don't use spin or lies.

[panader0]

31. Thank you.

[PufPuf23]

37. Bases are already built. The USA will fund and train the

Afghan military until 2024 at $4 billion per year.

This may involve 20,000 USA military "trainers" and Special Forces (and increased State Department, mercenaries/contractors, etc.).

Are you a Sufi perchance? Bliss through dervish dancing is cool.

[Purveyor]

38. Afghan military until 2024 at $4 billion per year? israel will be pissed~~ eom

[Hell Hath No Fury]

36. I am surprised yet not surprised.

Did I expect us to leave Aghanistan by 2014? No. Did I expect it to be 2024? No, even I couldn't actively allow myself to imagine that. I cannot say how disgusted I am at this point. I feel like I've been punched in the gut a bit too often