Got wife help. We have a friend here who is really helping both of us thru today--yesterday

[diabeticman]

in response to this--
http://www.democraticunderground.com/10026224743


Just thought it would be easier to respond and everyone can see better. I did get her help. Actually it was me and a friend of ours.

I want to thank you and I know my wife would thank you as well for your concern and support.


My wife did say something that I guess I didn't see or understand. She wanted this vote to pass pets living in the condos because she didn't want to feel like a freak or getting away with something when a doctor's note would allow her to have something while others who may have wanted a pet (one a renter one a owner--so I don't know how the vote of 6 to 1 came about when the owner said she voted for pets.) If the rule was for everyone she could feel more relaxed because she isn't label as nuts to our neighbors.

If anyone understands that.

She wants to demand another vote for next month and let the two hags downstairs know now she suffers from depression. something she didn't want to do.

[elleng]

1. Thanks for writing.

I can understand how she feels about not wanting to stand out as 'nuts,' but then letting the hags know she suffers from depression and seeking another vote sounds promising to me. (I may be too optimistic.)

Take care.

[stage left]

2. Glad you did.

Depression is a serious thing.

[herding cats]

3. There are battles you fight on the front line and battles you fight from afar.

If your wife is in a stage of depression as she's trying to do harm to herself, there is no shame in that, it's just something you need to be realistic about and address, and you, as her caregiver, need to get her out of the situation. This is non-negotiable.

Vote until you gain resolution if that suits you, but don't keep your wife in the midst of this emotional upheaval at this time. It's wrong to risk her health for the sake of a stance on an issue such as this. No one is going to come out the better for such a fight. Be realistic.

Get an attorney, document your wife's plight and sue the pants off them. You'd have one hell of a case based on what you've said to date.

I wish you and your wife the best of luck and outcomes in this situation, know that. Her mental health, anyone who is involved mental health is what should be first priority, and you need to address that and deal with the situation accordingly. I'm sure your healthcare professionals are telling you the similar things. It's their jobs, listen to them and do as they say.

Depression kills. Know the illness you're dealing with and the statistics involved. There is no honor to be gained by ignoring the potential life threatening consequences of an illness. All that road leads to is loss, heartache and self loathing.

[KMOD]

4. I can not think of anything more loving for Valentines Day than

to get your dear wife the help she needs.

Where is she right now? I hope she is getting the care she needs.

[KMOD]

5. Did you actually get you wife help?

or did you and your friend talk to her about the pet vote?

Re-reading this it sound like you all had a talk, which is fine.

And there is concern about her feeling like a "freak". Understandable again.

But again, your wife needs help. Waiting for another vote is not feasible.

This goes much deeper than cats.

Please, please, please, take her to a doctor.

[diabeticman]

7. We were not able to have kids. She transpose the mothering need to the cats. They had always

been her mothering outlet. She is also starting the change in life and still has that mothering urge...(if not it getting stronger) Not to mention she has always had issues with depression ( since her rape as a teen and the fact she had the overbearing mother from hell and a sister wished for a long time she was an only child....)

When we had the cats her depression was in check for the most part. Sometimes she'd sink but this is a depression I had not seen since before the cats.

[KMOD]

9. Please take your wife to see a doctor.

Please.

Maybe she has been fine in the past with cats, and you see a correlation there, but if love her, please get her to a doctor and get her some help.

[diabeticman]

11. She has seen doctors and psychologist who have said what I told you. Now that her insurance cards

are actually here so we can get her in to see a doctor. When all this first started to develop in late December I did call a couple of doctors whose offices said they would not take any new patients without insurance. We now have the cards I will get her to one she feels comfortable with. The last Doctor she saw missed the hernia blamed her issues on her weight and sent her home. two months later she is in the ER with a hernia that is about to explode.

She distrust doctors since the hernia and fungal pneumonia

If I can get a doctor to see her Monday I am getting her there .

[Lars39]

12. Her trying to harm or kill herself should have resulted in an ER visit

and admissission to a psych ward to get her evaluated and helped by professionals.
It was and is an emergency.

[CTyankee]

37. I have a friend who is a brilliantly creative thinker who told me she was admited to

Yale New Haven Hospital because she went to tell them she was hearing voices to kill her baby. You do that and you are locked up in the psych floor.

All is well now. Her son is thriving and she is a writer being very productive...but I treasure her as a terrifically creative voice and who helped me in my struggles finishing my Master's in Liberal Studies...

[Lars39]

38. Being admitted to a psych ward can be for your own safety while diagnosis and dosages are determined

To do otherwise in many circumstances can end in tragedy.

[CTyankee]

39. She knew that and was OK with her treatment. I feel bad for her...

she has actually helped me here at DU with my art essays and I am eternally grateful for her support...

[Lars39]

42. I'm glad that all turned out well for her.

I immensely enjoy your art essays.

[CTyankee]

44. thank you so much! She has helped me with my early renaissance paintings of saints

and other Biblican scenes. She got her Masters from Yale Divinity School and she's a fabulous writer....

I couldn't do what I do with art essays here without my friends/experts on art. She is one. Another is my neighbor who is a retired architect. I get so much help for the architecture stuff I try to post here, too.

[Lars39]

49. Such good friends!

I really appreciate them sharing their knowledge.

[cwydro]

6. Hang in there.

I can't really understand why you stay in that place.

It sounds horrid.

[diabeticman]

8. The inhertiance was limited. We sank every penny into the place. We would lose money and probably

not be able to buy another house. NOT to mention we would have a had time. The woman who owned before us listed it twice before we bought.

plus with it being a condo we found out it is harder for people to get loans for a condo (at least according to the realtor)

[cwydro]

10. Yeah, I do understand that.

I hope things get better.

I understand your wife's love for critters. I have many, and I adore them all.

[vlyons]

13. while you wait for the cats ...

think about getting a parakeet. They can be trained to sit on your shoulder or hand, and of course to mimic words. A parakeet cage is small, and the neighbors never need know.

[Fla Dem]

14. Or a hamsters, guinea pigs, gerbils, chinchillas, ferrets. These are all small lovable pets. nt

[diabeticman]

15. No animals are allowed now... No fish birds NOTHING

[cwydro]

24. Well, a bird might make noise, but

I cannot possibly see how they would know if you had a fish.

I think your wife is a cat lover though anyway...fish really are not the same!

I love my fur friends.

[CreekDog]

54. They can't ban every other anymore animal in the space of a month

Last edited Tue Feb 17, 2015, 01:18 PM - Edit history (1)

Not even time enough for notice and a vote.

Second, if it was done through a change in the bylaws, the owners would need to vote on that.

[CreekDog]

58. This isn't making sense, am I to believe the following?

first, the idea that one board meeting vote could do that is ridiculous.

second, that a board would support 6-1 the outright ban of even fish.

third, even if a simple board meeting vote could ban fish and hamsters, etc., that there was enough notice to even set up a rule to ban it and vote on that in the amount of time you're describing.

[Violet_Crumble]

62. Maybe you could start by not calling women you disagree with bitches?

Just an idea...

[boston bean]

65. You are asking for a change in the contract

that others have agreed when they purchased their property and probably for good reasons. Maybe they moved there because they were assured no pets were to be allowed. So this isn't about two "bi*ches" getting their way. It's about you wanting yours.

This isn't some apartment building, it's people homes that they individually own.

So, again, why did you buy a place where there were clearly no pets allowed if they were that important to your wifes mental health?

[diabeticman]

66. NO!! when we moved in Pets where allowed to visit for up to 48 hours. my wife and mother

would basically share the cats. My wife would have them for the 48 hour visits when she was really starting feeling blue. I went to schedule the visit the old hags heard it was cats and not dogs then they started with the 48 hour visit meant Dogs only. then they had then they change he rule to no pets


The same thing when we wanted to install direct TV -- EVEN THOUGH OTHERS HAVE DIRECT TV THEY STOPPED OUR INSTALL

[boston bean]

67. If the contract you have includes language

Where cats are allowed to visit. Then what is the issue?

[CreekDog]

69. why is he calling women "old h---"?

he does that in the OP also.

and the b- words in his reply to me...

what's going on here, any idea?

[Gormy Cuss]

68. "Old hags?"

Is that supposed to be an improvement over your previous sexist language?

Take your "bitches" and "hags" talk elsewhere.

[CreekDog]

70. It doesn't make sense if there was a ballot for homeowners

then that means the homeowners are deciding, not the board members at the board meeting.

there seems to be a contradiction in all this.

[LeftyMom]

16. I thought you were leaving DU?

[BuddhaGirl]

22. Why the rudeness

Please...have a little compassion...seems like you're trying to carry over from your rude reply in the other thread.

People go through things...that's life and sometimes people need a little support...sheesh

[cwydro]

23. Odd, isn't it?

This poster seems to have a real hate on for DM.

There are peeps I don't care too much for here. I simply try to avoid crapping on their threads.

[appalachiablue]

43. I also experienced this gem recently, from out of the blue, whoa. Real strange.

Takes all kinds, just have to ignore it.

[cwydro]

45. Dang

from the same poster?

Ignore it hon.

Lots of nice peeps here.

[appalachiablue]

46. The very one. Am over it & yep there are many great folks here!

[cwydro]

47. Just ignore it.

Lots of sad people in this world.

[CreekDog]

71. what did he call women in the reply to me just a few posts upthread?

the b-word, multiple times.

and what other terms did he use in the OP and another post just a few posts upthread?

called women "ha--" and "old ha---".

just curious who is actually being rude.

[renate]

17. I thought service/therapy animals were required by law to be allowed

I don't know how many cats your wife needs to help with her depression since I missed the beginning of the story, but I think there's a certification process for both her and the animal (it'd have to be a specially trained animal, so unfortunately not the cats she already has/had) and then there'd be a legal reason for allowing her to have at least one pet.

[diabeticman]

18. We can get the paperwork. We never needed it at ANY of the places we lived before. We moved to my

hometown about 8 months My wife needed to get health insurance and now and we have to go through the process of getting the paperwork.

Christmas and the overdrive to buy for everyone not to mention the Joy cooking and then after new years she just start spiraling FAST

She was hoping to change the rule without having to admit or let our neighbors know she has an illness. Also how can she feel good if everyone else has to follow the stupid no pet rule but she gets the exception.

They only allowed dogs to visit for 48 hours and wouldn't allow the cats that what started all this.

[meow2u3]

19. I'd threaten an ADA lawsuit as a last resort

The ADA not only requires landlords to allow service dogs for disabled people, but also support animals. AFAIK, emotional support animals don't have to be dogs; they can be cats, birds, or any animal who alleviates the mental anguish of someone suffering from depression (example).

If the condo complex still refuses to budge on their no-cats policy, a lawsuit is your only recourse, I'm afraid.

[renate]

20. I know it's easier for me to say than for her to do, but--

-- telling people she has depression might make a lot of this go away. Unless the people in your building are genuinely horrible, they might be kinder about this issue if they knew the reason why, and might treat her a little more gently if they knew the reason this matters so much. From their point of view, her need for cats may just seem like stubbornness. Plus they might just give up and let it go if they knew this could escalate into a legal issue that she would win.

Depression (and anxiety, the two big ones) is so so so common these days; everybody knows someone who's got depression or have been diagnosed with it themselves. It certainly isn't anything to be ashamed or embarrassed about.

[Texasgal]

21. DB-

I am not sure you are taking this as seriously as you should. I know that can be easy to do for some because it's hard to understand mental illness in others.

You need to get your wife help right now. You do not wait. You do not worry about insurance cards. You do not wait for votes at the condo assc. You get your wife help NOW. If she has already tried to harm herself she will try again. Not tomorrow. Not next week. NOW.

Imagine coming home to you wife after she has harmed herself for good knowing that YOU could have helped prevent it?

Now, I urge you to get her to a hospital ER. Tell them that she has already tried to harm herself and is in need of emergency mental health services.

I hope I am not coming off rude or condescending because that is not how I mean it. I just feel this need to be FIRM so that you understand.

Keep us updated.

[ScreamingMeemie]

25. +1

[tammywammy]

26. No, you didn't really get her help.

Having a friend talk to her or stay over is not appropriate help. Your wife tried to hurt herself, she needs medical help. Anything that doesn't involve a medically trained physician is not "help".

[diabeticman]

27. THE FRIEND'S FUCKING RELATIVE IS A PSYCHIATRIST!

JESUS FUCK I CANT ANYONE HAPPY CAN I

She spoke to the psychiatrist yesterday and today! I am taking her to a doctor tomorrow! Had the psychiatrist said to take her up to the hospital she would have been there.

[cwydro]

28. Hey DM

don't let people get to you here.

Difficult to see what people mean online when we don't have the non-verbal cues.

Most folks seem to be supporting you...ignore anyone that causes you worry.

I think most posters mean well. You already know who doesn't. Only one or two that I've seen.

[tammywammy]

29. Did your wife see the friend's relative?

Because having a friend of a friend of a friend that went to medical school still isn't getting your wife help.

Sorry that it makes you all CAPS angry, but you're the one posting on DU that your wife is horribly depressed and tried to hurt herself and your immediate response wasn't to take her to a fucking hospital.

Edited since you've edited: No where in the OP did you mention her talking to a professional or taking her to a doctor. I just hope she gets the help she clearly needs. I've seen enough people that don't take depression seriously that a friend coming over would be enough.

[KMOD]

31. I am so very happy to hear that you are

taking her to a doctor tomorrow.

I know you've said she has trust issues there, but encourage her to be open and honest about how she's feeling.

Make sure the doctor checks her thyroid as well.

I hope she can find some relief to her suffering. Good Luck and keep us updated.

[android fan]

32. You are indeed getting her the help she needs....

Under ADA law, your wife's need for an service animal usurps the homeowner's association rules as long as it is a reasonable accomodation for all.

You also should start looking into a service cat if needed to be.... if that's what your wife wants.

I know a lot on ADA law - I'm disabled myself, and have used the ADA law to force business to accomodate us reasonably. Recently, I made an appointment to my son's doctor, and asked for reasonable accommodation for me and my wife, but initially the refused. I said that under ADA law, you must acommodate us reasonably, and gave her a number of an agency she could contact to set it up. 30 minutes later, it was set up. No problems. They wanted me to bring my mom to help us, but she isn't a certified interpreter.

My own doctor always gives us reasonable accommodations. So you shouldn't have any trouble trying to get your wife reasonable accommodations. Your wife needs an animal for emotional support, and that's what is reasonable accommodation.

Documentations from the doctors to confirm the need for an animal to help with her depression would light a fire on the HOA's asses to approve animal accommodations under the ADA.

[appalachiablue]

40. Great that you have this experience & knowledge to give good input- excellent. I worked with

the visually impaired & blind at a United Way agency. Also am an animal lover & know first hand how attached people are to their pets. Separation from them can be very stressful, anxiety producing for many.

[diabeticman]

50. We need to get her established down around this area. At our old town her doctor coverage was

spotty.. ( either no insurance or limited visits-- Doctor Doctor type person you know MD.) She has already seen a concelor down here and we are getting her a doctor now. I don't know if the MD will give us the papers for the ADA the first time they see her.

I am concerned this process will take months.

[boston bean]

55. Why did you folks buy a place that said no pets,

if you didn't have the necessary paperwork and knew it may take months, knowing how important an issue this is for your wifes mental health?

[REP]

57. I'm not understanding this either

By law, the CC&R has to be provided to the buyers long before closing and the CC&R seems to be pretty clear about no pets.

[boston bean]

64. I have no ideas about CC&R's, never lived in a condo...

but, I definitely would not have bought one where it clearly stated there were not pets allowed, if pets were this important for me to have.

Some places don't allow pets and for good reason. I know we are all pet lovers here, but there is a member of my family that is extremely allergic, so if he bought into a place where he knew no pets were allowed and all of the sudden they were allowed, what about his rights with the property he bought.

I'm just not getting this at all.

[Newest Reality]

30. It may not be what you think it is.

I can only make a suggestion here. A person's reactions to various situations depends on their state of mind, expectations and other variables, of course.

As has been said, some therapy might help her. The reason I say that is you both may be caught-up in the symbolic aspects of the situation. While it is easy to understand wanting to have pets and trying to convince other people and the Association to make a change, the reaction you are seeing is troubling.

Consider expanding your view on this and consider if the reactions she is having are representing symptoms of something that is deeper than the circumstances that are acting as a catalyst. You may both be so distracted by the situation that it is not easy to notice what really needs attention there and that could lead to a better outcome and some insight and more happiness for both of you, pet or no pet.

Glad you have a friend for support and who may be able to help you resolve that, but it is not bad or shameful to find a good professional therapist to help you both see into this matter. I don't mean someone who is just going to prescribe drugs, but a good insightful listener who has tools and techniques to help you find resolution to what is presenting itself by way of circumstances acting as a catalyst for what is being avoided or repressed.

Good luck.

[Liberal_in_LA]

33. good

[cwydro]

34. Hang in there!

[HereSince1628]

35. Well good she is getting help, I do understand her anxiety

The important thing is she has a support team and access to help.

[Not a Fan]

36. Something to consider

From Psychology Today:

Vitamin D Deficiency and Depression
Depressed? Relief may be as close as your nearest vitamin D supplement.

https://www.psychologytoday.com/blog/reading-between-the-headlines/201307/vitamin-d-deficiency-and-depression

That article references this research:

Vitamin D and Depression
https://www.vitamindcouncil.org/health-conditions/depression/#

This is also worth a look, though the article has a different focus overall:
6 Conditions that Feel Like Clinical Depression but Aren’t
http://psychcentral.com/blog/archives/2014/08/06/6-conditions-that-feel-like-clinical-depression-but-arent/

I started using VD3 about 5 years ago, my depression just got better and better and better. Even a year ago I felt I was still improving.

It takes about four years to repair chronic substrate Vitamin D3 deficiency. That's probably why.

It is not clear yet if VD3 deficiency is causing depression, or if Depression is causing VD3 deficiency. In either case, the answer is clearly to raise blood serum levels.

I'm not suggesting that this replaces the need to be under a doctor's care. I am saying it's worth considering on its own to help improve the situation as there is no down side to supplementing.

[Terra Alta]

41. I'm glad she is getting help.

I suffer from depression/anxiety issues myself, so I know all too well what she is going through.

[Rex]

48. I am glad you got help and no I don't understand.

I am worried that she is so stressed out over something like a cat in a condo. I'm sorry she has to be exposed like that to the neighbors, I just wish she would not worry so much how other people are going to react to her having a cat. That is such a small deal, but I have suffered from depression over the years and what one person sees as small - is a huge huge issue to another that is depressed.

Take care of both of you and keep a close eye on her, I'm glad you got her professional help.

Good luck to both of you.

[Warpy]

51. I hope she wins this next time

I never had problems in "no pets" apartment. I had enough money to write the big checks for 3 months' rent and just before I signed them, I'd sweetly say "I have a cat. That's not a problem, is it?" When they saw money, it never was. Dogs are different, they bark and piss people off.

Companion animals are extremely important, especially to shut in old folks and depressives. A doctor's prescription presented to the board should work even if the vote goes against her.

[TDale313]

52. My thoughts are with you and your wife.

Don't have much to add in terms of advice, but wish you both the best. Do whatever you need to do to help her get better and improve the situation (as I know you are & have been)

[CreekDog]

53. If the rule is in the cc&r's a board meeting vote can't change that

I really question how a rule that can ban pets without amending the cc&r's can be turned on and off by way of a board meeting.

Something does not sound right here.

[REP]

56. There seems to be a serious lack of understanding about CC&Rs

They bought a place that forbids pets in the CC&R, which by law has to be provided to them before well before closing. The CC&R usually includes the procedures to amend the CC&R.

Perhaps the vote was to bring up the pet rule for revision?

None of this makes much sense, especially buying a place that forbids pets when it seems to be something important to them.

[cwydro]

59. My mom's condo does not allow pets.

I can't imagine any way that would ever change.

[CreekDog]

60. that's beside the point

not sure the board would have the authority to undo a restriction like that in a simple board meeting.

not sure the board has had the time to undo a restriction like that even if all they did was undo it at a board meeting, there doesn't seem to have been enough time to have properly noticed the upcoming vote and rule change, and then to have had it voted on --ESPECIALLY the idea that they could further restrict pets with almost no advanced notice, no change in bylaws and seemingly as a retaliatory measure.

this seems implausible.

[betsuni]

63. It's all alarums and excursions

Exit, pursued by a bear.