General Discussion
Related: Editorials & Other Articles, Issue Forums, Alliance Forums, Region ForumsCraig Stephen Hicks the murderer of three Muslim Students in N.C..
Claims that he is an activist for Gay Rights and Is an Atheist..
Of Course the Right Wing is elated with this info..
Lets not allow them to hi-jack this event of an execution/ murder of 3 Muslim Students by a True Hater..
I am not suggesting that the below article is not written with some sort of bias.
But a good beginning to a discussion of this tragedy..
Five Quick Facts:
http://heavy.com/news/2015/02/craig-stephen-hicks-deah-shaddy-barakat-yusor-mohammad-razan-mohammad-abu-salha-muslim-students-shot-dead-unc-chapel-hill/
Fred Sanders
(23,946 posts)It is a very poor starting place that also glorifies guns.
busterbrown
(8,515 posts)of this story..
I am looking for info..pushing back on a lot of this crap being spewed..by these creeps..
Thats all... So I can strengthen my position in order to attack their lies..
Cooley Hurd
(26,877 posts)busterbrown
(8,515 posts)Perfect.. I never thought a Libertarian could reach that point.. He trained himself well thinking that his life would probably be saved if he could prove that his hate of Muslims was not the reason he executed the students but rather his love of Freedom
Fuck him and thanks so much for the heads up... Almost as though he prepared and posted all his Libertarian views knowing that one day he would need an excuse..
Hoyt
(54,770 posts)Mimosa
(9,131 posts)Hi, D.U. old timers. Because I've been busy, and coping with health issues, I haven't posted here in a while.
As I read reports about Craig Hicks late last week, the 'voice' and personality of his Facebook posts gave me a sense of deja vu. I knew I'd encountered him online, here at Democratic Underground, several years ago. I shan't speculate on his posting name. He may have been one of two or members, and then a happier man.
Hoyt, that Craig Hicks happened to be among a million or more people who hold CCW permits tells us next to nothing about the man or any other concealed weapons permit holders. I know several, among them a physician who happens to be a U.S. Army veteran, another being a 60+ working man who lives in a metro area where he's a minority and might easily be targeted for assault or robbery. IN the greater ATL metro area Female realtors are at risk for carjacking or robbery. Several carry weapons. So don't assume you know everything.
I thought a lot about Craig Hicks last week. Southern states, in particular North Carolina (where my mother lived the last few years of her life) , have been affected by uncontrolled immigration which has drastically affected employment opportunities and lowered wages for most working class men. Let's try to look at the lives of men of Craig Hick's age, class, and location.
When a 40 something year old white man, resident of North Carolina (or South Carolina or GA), attained adulthood, the factories which provided steady jobs were shutting down. North Carolina, along with Pennsylvania and Michigan up North, manufactured most of the furniture bought by Americans. From cheap to the finest levels of craftsmanship. Throughout the states in the South, there were factories which made hardware, tools, clothing and all sorts of textiles. The manufacturing, shipping, and sales of same meant steady employment for millions from the lowest jobs up through higher management positions. College degrees weren't generally required except for those at high management levels.
Outsourcing began in the early 1980s. When internet communications systems went global, the ownership class were able to chase cheap labour no matter where. Bush 41 and Clinton helped expedite policies which solidified the permanent export of most U.S. manufacturing. Both touted the replacement of manufacturing by a 'service economy'. And thus sunk the middle class to serfdom.
We'd always had migrant labour for agriculture. But those working class people who'd lost indoor manufacturing related jobs were not inclined to pick produce in the fields or work in meat processing. The capitalist politicians had pretty much destroyed the unions, so such dangerous grueling jobs paid very little. The border between US and Mexico became open, and INS didn't deport anybody. At least not permanently. Immigrants from all over the globe were welcomed in to America's universities and given preferences at the same time many 20-40 years old American born males were losing job prospects. There were and are no 'affirmative action' programs to help white men obtain higher education. Excepting they join the military.
Hoyt, I don't know where you live, but North Carolina and Georgia are among the states where many men, black and white, have some reasons for nursing grudges about their economic stations in life. I imagine Craig Hicks never 'got it together' to attain the level of employment and income he felt he deserved. He was aging, and opportunities appeared available for the young immigrants next door which were closed to him. The 'foreigners' next door were happy, laughing, perhaps possessed of the arrogance of all youth. (I know I had it.) Maybe they scoffed *just a little* at the 'redneck' next door.
What might have happened if Craig Hicks hadn't been able to buy guns, we can't say. I don't intend to sacrifice my own Second Amendment right to self defense because Craig Hicks slid into an violent breakdown. He might have murdered his neighbours another way if he hadn't owned firearms.
The bigger picture is resentment of 'foreigners' in the South is not actually based on religion or skin pigmentation. When people feel they've hit the 'bottom', they have nothing to lose and strike out in anger. Anger and envy were at the base of Hicks' crime, as at the base of black dysfunction.
The politicians and corporations of America sold out our nation. Computers and other technological advancements have made human beings less necessary. In inflation adjusted dollars workers earn less than half the average wage tah in 1970. Social mobility is nearly non-existent for the majority, yet politicians jump to obey Bill Gates, Mark Zuckerberg, George Soros and other billionaires orders for 'Open Borders'.
Hoyt
(54,770 posts)Without a gun, he'd been just like Zimmerman -- he'd not have accosted/intimidated the people he murdered. Gunz embolden folks like this. There's a lot to be done to stem the anger people have, but letting folks carry a gun -- or compensate for their problems by accumulating/carrying gunz -- ain't the way to address it.
Mimosa
(9,131 posts)Hoyt, the topic isn't about guns available to Craig Hicks or anybody else. So, to discuss that issue takes us away from the larger issue.
For decades I've studied the changes in this America many of us love. I grew up in the South when everybody owned guns yet gun crimes were rare.
I've observed and experienced the economic changes over the decades. I was hoping my contribution might lead to some discussion and understanding about the problems which drive some people to violence. In Britain, those inclined to violence have been using knives and machetes to the degree adults have to show ID on purchasing kitchen knives. I kid you not. And despite illegality, UK criminals have increasingly obtained handguns.
I'm concerned with the larger issues which have made many people, but especially U.S. born males, feel they have no future. We know there were better times for Americans who were willing to learn and work. A time when people could afford to support a small family on a middle class salary and save some money for the future. Now more people are working paycheck to paycheck, many on low-paying part time jobs. I believe the pressure is fueling racial hatreds. The fear that 'they' are taking away opportunities, and ruining a culture which was more shared.
I was in real estate, which was an excellent field from which to observe changes. During the mid 1990s, I observed the shift in the make up of construction and roofing crews from black and white men to Latino crews led by one latino who spoke English, usually employed by a white owner/ contractor.
Many young able bodied males joined the military in order to obtain education benefits . If indeed the wars are winding down, and men (and women) are returning to the civilian work force, I wonder about their employment prospects . If there are few opportunities for intelligent people, they might feel 'left behind'.
Hoyt
(54,770 posts)Just the kind of person who would intimidate Muslims.
As to military, a lot of today's gun fanciers have a military background or wish they had sniper and other military training involving use of lethal weapons.
uponit7771
(90,379 posts)...culture and they should
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