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ashling

(25,771 posts)
Sun Nov 16, 2014, 06:33 PM Nov 2014

It’s Elizabeth Warren’s party now! How to remake it in the liberal heroine’s image

If they're smart, liberals could use Warren's new power to make the changes to the party that are so badly needed

At this point, it’s not entirely clear what the folks nominally in charge of this infamously disorganized party are trying to do by elevating Warren. Because the former Harvard Law professor has been prominent in liberal circles since the launch of her brainchild, the Consumer Financial Protection Bureau, it can be easy to forget that she’s only been in Congress for a couple of years. And coming as it does after a truly disastrous midterm showing, this seeming vote of confidence from Democratic bigwigs has the risk of being a “glass cliff” situation. My former colleague Brian Beutler, for example, has guessed that Senate Dem leadership may have opted to bring Warren into the fold because they’ll need a popular spokeswoman to deliver the next two years’ worth of bad news to the “professional left.”

...

Still, even if Warren’s promotion isn’t motivated entirely or primarily by idealism and generosity, it could nevertheless be a major turning point for activists looking to push the Democratic Party in a more left-wing direction. After many years of kvetching about their paltry influence — and following decade after decade of enviously watching the conservative movement refashion the GOP in its own image — lefty ideologues and organizers now have the chance to turn Warren into a kind of trojan horse for a resurgent politics of economic populism (or, as it used to be called, liberalism). And if they adapt and adhere to the script used many years ago by visionary right-wingers, who famously responded to an electoral drubbing in 1964 by staying the course and propelling a true believer to the White House less than 20 years later, it just might work

.....

Perhaps more than anything else, though, what lefty activists should learn from their right-wing counterparts is this: In a dysfunctional two-party system such as ours, in which voters are perpetually unhappy and ready for any excuse to throw the bums out and start all over, it’s only a matter of time until the losers of yesterday are once again ascendant. And as the GOP has shown in the years since its back-to-back wipeouts in ’06 and ’08, responding to electoral defeat by moderating is no longer necessary, while moving further away from the center is no longer a death sentence. Now that they have a political superstar and ideological true believer as their behind-the-scenes agent, lefty activists with an eye on the long term have a chance to, in the words of Warren, “frame the issues for the next few elections” and ultimately make the Democratic Party truly progressive.


http://www.salon.com/2014/11/15/its_elizabeth_warrens_party_now_how_to_remake_it_in_the_liberal_heroines_image/?utm_source=facebook&utm_medium=socialflow
94 replies = new reply since forum marked as read
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It’s Elizabeth Warren’s party now! How to remake it in the liberal heroine’s image (Original Post) ashling Nov 2014 OP
Excellent article, with some very good pointers. Thanks! ~nt RiverLover Nov 2014 #1
Be careful. Because of wild claims like this, anything and everything that goes wrong... wyldwolf Nov 2014 #2
"If they're smart,..." BKH70041 Nov 2014 #4
But then Warren will be just another bought-and-paid-for puppet of the RW Third Way baldguy Nov 2014 #5
lol AgingAmerican Nov 2014 #45
Yeah. By you. Union Scribe Nov 2014 #15
People are coming to a determination that meets their biases. MADem Nov 2014 #29
Where's the blame? aspirant Nov 2014 #40
But but but I hear Third Way libertarians on here howling that liberals have no power in the party. Rex Nov 2014 #3
To the contrary, I thought it was us liberals who howled that liberals had no power in the party. pampango Nov 2014 #7
Well if you listen to libertarians, we have none. So when someone liberal runs Rex Nov 2014 #8
Pure, Purity doesn't that just ring of Frank Luntz? aspirant Nov 2014 #41
Yes it does! Rex Nov 2014 #42
Good article! peacebird Nov 2014 #6
Agreed ... 1StrongBlackMan Nov 2014 #53
Elizabeth is too far left for the Hillary voters who more comfortable right of center. bowens43 Nov 2014 #9
And HRC is too far right for voters who are more comfortable middle or left. peacebird Nov 2014 #10
Hillary is left, she is not right, where did you get your information? Thinkingabout Nov 2014 #13
Oh you ARE funny!! Hillary is LEFT!! Riiiight... RiverLover Nov 2014 #16
Site: http://ontheissues.org/hillary_clinton.htm Thinkingabout Nov 2014 #18
What she says running for president doesn't match what she has done. RiverLover Nov 2014 #19
Obliviously you did not go to the site, if you would have you would have found Thinkingabout Nov 2014 #20
She promoted the TPP, and that helps the 90%? Yep, you're funny. RiverLover Nov 2014 #26
I may be funny but I am correct. Thinkingabout Nov 2014 #27
Yeah, she really threw her weight on Walmart's Board of Directors closeupready Nov 2014 #57
Yes she did, thought more females should be promoted. Thinkingabout Nov 2014 #58
LOL, save it for an audience that will not know better. closeupready Nov 2014 #60
Have you ever served on a board of directors? Thinkingabout Nov 2014 #61
Not over a 7-year period of time like Hillary. closeupready Nov 2014 #62
Serving on a board does not make one bad, if Hillary served on a board of directors for seven years Thinkingabout Nov 2014 #63
I realize you are heavily vested in this, but that was then. Hillary promoted offshoring American RiverLover Nov 2014 #64
Your proof of Hillary promoting offshoring of jobs is not in the article you posted. Thinkingabout Nov 2014 #65
Its kind of well known, old news, how embarrassing for you, Here you go~ RiverLover Nov 2014 #66
I do not have anything to be embarrassed on this subject. Thinkingabout Nov 2014 #68
Then how could you not know Hillary was heavily promoting the TPP? ~nt RiverLover Nov 2014 #69
Go back and read the post again, never said I did not know of Hillary promoting TPP. Thinkingabout Nov 2014 #70
If I say the sky is blue, would you expect me to post a link proving it? RiverLover Nov 2014 #72
What? I said while she was on the walmart board she promoted made in America Thinkingabout Nov 2014 #73
That -may- be true, I only know she's not for "Made in America" anymore. TPP proves it. RiverLover Nov 2014 #81
Well, you can distort the facts all you want, doesn't make it true. Thinkingabout Nov 2014 #82
I don't understand what you're arguing. The other poster is correct-- Marr Nov 2014 #84
NAFTA did Recursion Nov 2014 #37
Your own graph shows Median Income declining after the passage of NAFTA. U4ikLefty Nov 2014 #38
Nope. It started in 1994 Recursion Nov 2014 #39
Shhh ... 1StrongBlackMan Nov 2014 #54
You have to pass minimum wage increases, though. joshcryer Nov 2014 #79
Of course we do. And invest in job training and infrastructure Recursion Nov 2014 #83
Yep, but these truths will be shut down soon. TheNutcracker Nov 2014 #22
Are you talking about the sites where politicans stand on the issues? Thinkingabout Nov 2014 #25
Also loves H1-B visas. JDPriestly Nov 2014 #34
And Obama is a communist.... daleanime Nov 2014 #24
Hard core liberals don't support the TPP or H-1B Visa program... cascadiance Nov 2014 #30
I am not a hard core liberal. Thinkingabout Nov 2014 #32
Well, duh. If you were, you wouldn't be promoting Hillary. ~nt RiverLover Nov 2014 #33
Go to the site referred in earlier, and if you venture to the end you will find Thinkingabout Nov 2014 #51
So Chuck Schumer just about always works a deal pushing H-1B program expansion in legislation... cascadiance Nov 2014 #87
Are you serious? Since immigration is on the minds of many Democrats you want to point to this as Thinkingabout Nov 2014 #89
Yes, H-1B programs are indentured servant slave labor programs. cascadiance Nov 2014 #92
Disagree with you, kinda getting sidetracked. Thinkingabout Nov 2014 #93
Why are you doing this? Over & over, "Hillary is Hard Core Liberal" when that is laughbable RiverLover Nov 2014 #90
Disproved, no, why do you continue to reply without proof she is not liberal? Thinkingabout Nov 2014 #91
But you ARE just claiming in so many words that Hillary is in your post here! cascadiance Nov 2014 #44
Where does it state unless one is as hard core as another I can not support them? Thinkingabout Nov 2014 #52
It's Thanksgiving dinner Ink Man Nov 2014 #11
pretty sure they agree on big defense spending JI7 Nov 2014 #14
Elizabeth is 19th most liberal Senator. Clinton was 10th. joshcryer Nov 2014 #43
So is the poll that puts these kind of nonsense numbers too corporatist to post a link to? cascadiance Nov 2014 #46
Uh, look it up. joshcryer Nov 2014 #49
Links: joshcryer Nov 2014 #76
As the comments note at the bottom these "ratings" are a JOKE! cascadiance Nov 2014 #86
+1 I would like to see how they tallied that up. ~nt RiverLover Nov 2014 #88
All data that does not support my pre-conceived judgment ... 1StrongBlackMan Nov 2014 #55
There are several potential reasons for this. joshcryer Nov 2014 #78
I suspect that Warren is DU's uber-liberal ... 1StrongBlackMan Nov 2014 #80
Put that thing away, josh. You'll put someone's eye out around here Number23 Nov 2014 #75
Hey! Thanks for responding! joshcryer Nov 2014 #77
No, not particularly... brooklynite Nov 2014 #50
You are a 1%, so who cares what you think? (Sarcasm) ... 1StrongBlackMan Nov 2014 #56
Correct Iamthetruth Nov 2014 #94
http://www.elizabethwarrenforpresident.com/ ~nt RiverLover Nov 2014 #12
Howard Dean brought back to head DNC would help. Faryn Balyncd Nov 2014 #17
Ding Ding. We have a winner! nt 99th_Monkey Nov 2014 #28
Why? Recursion Nov 2014 #31
It's my impression that both have the capacity to inspire & energize a grass roots movement, and Faryn Balyncd Nov 2014 #36
I would say the opposite Amishman Nov 2014 #48
I don't think its opposite. Faryn Balyncd Nov 2014 #74
She better get Tant Richards out of Florida! TheNutcracker Nov 2014 #21
This message was self-deleted by its author 1000words Nov 2014 #23
It's her party when she becomes a presidential nominee geek tragedy Nov 2014 #35
Unfortunately with the corporatists infecting the party for 20+ years, it is hard to get experience cascadiance Nov 2014 #47
Why, when I read some of the comments to these kind of OPs ... 1StrongBlackMan Nov 2014 #59
Elizabeth Warren's take on the Trans-Pacific Partnership RiverLover Nov 2014 #67
And at a speech this year, on the TPP~ RiverLover Nov 2014 #71
Kick. n/t area51 Nov 2014 #85

wyldwolf

(43,870 posts)
2. Be careful. Because of wild claims like this, anything and everything that goes wrong...
Sun Nov 16, 2014, 06:43 PM
Nov 2014

... can be laid at her feet. And will.

 

baldguy

(36,649 posts)
5. But then Warren will be just another bought-and-paid-for puppet of the RW Third Way
Sun Nov 16, 2014, 06:48 PM
Nov 2014

And the phoney "progressives" will have forgotten about 2014, just as they have 2008.

MADem

(135,425 posts)
29. People are coming to a determination that meets their biases.
Sun Nov 16, 2014, 09:56 PM
Nov 2014
Jon Tester got some love, too. I don't see anyone leaping up to cheer his elevation as some kind of change. Bottom line, though--he is gonna be a PLAYA.

I think the party is just being more RESPONSIVE across the board, and that's great.

aspirant

(3,533 posts)
40. Where's the blame?
Mon Nov 17, 2014, 01:36 AM
Nov 2014

Like the 2014 elections being laid at the feet of the Third Wayers including Hillary and then they immediately send out their shills blaming the voters.

 

Rex

(65,616 posts)
3. But but but I hear Third Way libertarians on here howling that liberals have no power in the party.
Sun Nov 16, 2014, 06:44 PM
Nov 2014

What a shock that they are just lying, I mean who could have guessed all they are really here to do is hate on liberals.

pampango

(24,692 posts)
7. To the contrary, I thought it was us liberals who howled that liberals had no power in the party.
Sun Nov 16, 2014, 07:00 PM
Nov 2014

My impression is that Third Wayers think liberals have little power and are quite happy about it.

 

Rex

(65,616 posts)
8. Well if you listen to libertarians, we have none. So when someone liberal runs
Sun Nov 16, 2014, 07:06 PM
Nov 2014

the libertarians are on here in force saying they have no chance. Once the liberal wins, then it shifts to us not liking the person because they are not pure enough.

Now we have Warren and Bernie as serious contenders and it has the libertarians here scared to death.

 

1StrongBlackMan

(31,849 posts)
53. Agreed ...
Mon Nov 17, 2014, 06:29 PM
Nov 2014

Great OP.

If I were to summarize it into 4 words, it would be: PUT IN THE WORK! ... Which is why the advice will come to naught. It is far more simple to cry in the wilderness.

Thinkingabout

(30,058 posts)
20. Obliviously you did not go to the site, if you would have you would have found
Sun Nov 16, 2014, 08:48 PM
Nov 2014

Information on issues important to her, how she voted, what she has worked on to make a better life for the 90%, and if you would have followed the site to the end there is a chart of where she is rated and would have found she is quiet left. BTW, some of these occurrences happened before she ever ran for any office.

Thinkingabout

(30,058 posts)
27. I may be funny but I am correct.
Sun Nov 16, 2014, 09:11 PM
Nov 2014

Would you like to see the minimum wage increase?
Are you happy with the wage disparity?
These are just a couple issues she stands left, she I a liberal, plain and simple.

 

closeupready

(29,503 posts)
57. Yeah, she really threw her weight on Walmart's Board of Directors
Mon Nov 17, 2014, 06:52 PM
Nov 2014

on behalf of Walmart's women workers, didn't she?

Thinkingabout

(30,058 posts)
58. Yes she did, thought more females should be promoted.
Mon Nov 17, 2014, 06:57 PM
Nov 2014

She also pushed for the Buy America while she was there. Things in the interest of the middle class.

 

closeupready

(29,503 posts)
62. Not over a 7-year period of time like Hillary.
Mon Nov 17, 2014, 10:10 PM
Nov 2014

Now that I think about it, no I haven't ever done that.

Thinkingabout

(30,058 posts)
63. Serving on a board does not make one bad, if Hillary served on a board of directors for seven years
Mon Nov 17, 2014, 10:20 PM
Nov 2014

Then it further qualifies her to serve on another board, as in presidential cabinet. Oh, she served on the presidents cabinet also, her resume has grown a lot in her life. The board makes decisions about things on the Walmart board to "Buy America", she has left the board and Walmart does not have "Buy America", an example of her work to buy products made in America by Americans, helping provide jobs. She pushed for promoting women, another action of helping the American workers. I like a candidate who helps American workers.

RiverLover

(7,830 posts)
64. I realize you are heavily vested in this, but that was then. Hillary promoted offshoring American
Mon Nov 17, 2014, 10:31 PM
Nov 2014

jobs via the TPP. You know this, since you know so much about Hillary.

So then it follows you know this as well~

The TPP Would Take Away “Made in America”
September 15, 2014 Daniel Mills

There could be good news soon in the made in America movement. The shoes American soldiers wear when they train for combat may soon be all American made. The creator of the shoes may be New Balance, a shoe company that has long lobbied for the U.S. to change its policies to only allow American made shoes to be worn by our military. But this small victory will be very short lived if the TPP passes.

The Trans-Pacific Partnership (TPP) is a “free trade” agreement that will bridge together a handful of countries – Australia, The United States, Japan, Brunei, Chile, Malaysia, New Zealand, Peru, Singapore, Vietnam, Mexico and Canada. “Free trade” means unrestricted, uncontrolled access to our economy, tariff- and duty-free, for goods made for $4-per-hour or less. Our manufacturers cannot compete with these wages so they are forced to choose between going bankrupt, outsourcing nearly all of their manufacturing, or simply selling out.

http://economyincrisis.org/content/the-tpp-to-stop-made-in-america


It truly sickens me that she may be our next president. At least the rethugs are honest about being rethugs.

Thinkingabout

(30,058 posts)
65. Your proof of Hillary promoting offshoring of jobs is not in the article you posted.
Mon Nov 17, 2014, 10:47 PM
Nov 2014

Did you know she for pulling tax breaks for companies who offshore? She also wants to pull subsidies to companies who move offshore. Bet you did not know this about her.

In fact you can read and find much more about Hillary on the following site:

http://ontheissues.org/hillary_clinton.htm

Let me add this also, she was on the presidential cabinet through 2012.

RiverLover

(7,830 posts)
66. Its kind of well known, old news, how embarrassing for you, Here you go~
Mon Nov 17, 2014, 11:17 PM
Nov 2014
Ahead of the fall 2011 Asia Pacific Economic Forum (APEC) meeting in Hawaii, then-Secretary of State Hillary Clinton outlined a plan to transfer U.S. military, diplomatic, and economic resources from the Middle East to the Pacific, in what she called “America’s New Pacific Century.” Describing the pivot in militaristic terms as “forward-deployed diplomacy,” Clinton hailed the TPP as a “benchmark for future agreements” leading to “a free trade area of the Asia- Pacific.”

Yet the TPP excludes China, which has become the second largest economy in the world and is poised to outpace the U.S. economy in a matter of years — a fact that is none too pleasing to U.S. elites accustomed to unrivaled hegemony.
http://fpif.org/open-fire-open-markets-asia-pacific-pivot-trans-pacific-partnership/


Promoting TPP to China, because Big Busine$$ wants an even playing field, like mentioned above~~

Clinton, speaking in Singapore a day before President Barack Obama arrives in Southeast Asia, said the US aims to combine the 11-country Trans-Pacific Partnership with other regional trade agreements to transform global commerce. "We welcome the interest of any nation willing to meet the 21st century standards of the TPP - including China."
http://www.scmp.com/news/asia/article/1084966/hillary-clinton-courts-asia-welcomes-china-us-led-trade-talks


Selling TPP to Japan~

Clinton: "We also discussed the Trans-Pacific Partnership and we shared perspectives on Japan’s possible participation, because we think this holds out great economic opportunities to all participating nations."
http://still4hill.com/2013/01/18/video-hillary-clinton-with-japanese-foreign-minister-fumio-kishida/


RiverLover

(7,830 posts)
72. If I say the sky is blue, would you expect me to post a link proving it?
Mon Nov 17, 2014, 11:42 PM
Nov 2014

My point wasn't that she promoted TPP, that's a GIVEN, we know that. Its that she wants to take away "Made in America" because that is what TPP would do. And I posted a link for that.

Thinkingabout

(30,058 posts)
73. What? I said while she was on the walmart board she promoted made in America
Mon Nov 17, 2014, 11:58 PM
Nov 2014

You made another post about TPP and I said your post did not show a relationship between Hillary and TPP. You are jumping to conclusions.

RiverLover

(7,830 posts)
81. That -may- be true, I only know she's not for "Made in America" anymore. TPP proves it.
Tue Nov 18, 2014, 08:53 AM
Nov 2014

That was my point. Is it sinking in yet?

 

Marr

(20,317 posts)
84. I don't understand what you're arguing. The other poster is correct--
Tue Nov 18, 2014, 11:41 AM
Nov 2014

she's very publicly for the TPP. That makes any rhetoric about being 'for Made in America' obvious bullshit. There's a big difference between actions and words, and promoting the TPP is an un-spinnable action.

Recursion

(56,582 posts)
37. NAFTA did
Sun Nov 16, 2014, 11:37 PM
Nov 2014

Its passage was followed by the only increase in median income in the past 40 years.

TPP would hopefully be more of the same.

U4ikLefty

(4,012 posts)
38. Your own graph shows Median Income declining after the passage of NAFTA.
Sun Nov 16, 2014, 11:46 PM
Nov 2014

And it was already rising before it's passage (according to your graph).

I hope the TPP doesn't yield the same results as NAFTA.

In fact I won't vote for any politician who votes for the TPP.

Recursion

(56,582 posts)
39. Nope. It started in 1994
Sun Nov 16, 2014, 11:50 PM
Nov 2014

And the median wage was where it was in 1977. It shot up after that. Even after the great recession it hasn't fallen back to the 1980s levels.

Recursion

(56,582 posts)
83. Of course we do. And invest in job training and infrastructure
Tue Nov 18, 2014, 11:32 AM
Nov 2014

There's a lot of components here and they have to fit together.

 

cascadiance

(19,537 posts)
30. Hard core liberals don't support the TPP or H-1B Visa program...
Sun Nov 16, 2014, 10:15 PM
Nov 2014

The latter has had me and many in my profession getting screwed for a decade or so now. Finally just got another job again so that I don't go completely broke. For me it's pretty f'ing personal!

Thinkingabout

(30,058 posts)
51. Go to the site referred in earlier, and if you venture to the end you will find
Mon Nov 17, 2014, 05:08 PM
Nov 2014

A chart which rates the candidates, she is listed as a hard core liberal, in fact about the same position Warren is in the chart. If you do not stand on the issues Hillary stands on then you are not liberal.

 

cascadiance

(19,537 posts)
87. So Chuck Schumer just about always works a deal pushing H-1B program expansion in legislation...
Wed Nov 19, 2014, 02:46 AM
Nov 2014

And he's ranked higher the 93% of congress in being "liberal" on economic issues? WHAT A F'ING JOKE that poll is!

Since when is supporting H-1B program a "liberal" thing to do! Liberals don't like to have their politicians sell out their jobs in that fashion!

That rating system is a joke. WHERE is there a criteria posted on how each of those "economic", "social", or "foreign policy" ratings arrived at?

Note how some point out in Huffington Post say this poll is a joke too.

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2014/02/07/national-journal-rankings_n_4746688.html

Even conservatives in Red State laugh at this poll. It seems to reward how partisan one votes along with the party, "Democrat" vs. "Republican" as opposed to "liberal" vs. "conservative" ideology.

http://www.redstate.com/diary/Erick/2012/02/24/national-journals-self-beclowing-they-should-be-embarrassed-by-their-ideological-rankings-of-candidates/


Thinkingabout

(30,058 posts)
89. Are you serious? Since immigration is on the minds of many Democrats you want to point to this as
Wed Nov 19, 2014, 11:16 AM
Nov 2014

not being liberal. We can be smart and keep people who are specially trained or deport then to other countries to work to improve other countries. You can pick and pick to find a point in a haystack to trash anyone, it is easy to do. We have companies moving jobs off shore and with our sending specialty trained to them to be used in their offshore plans. We have to realize lots of work can be performed without a person being on site, why not keep the tax base here in the US. Why accommodate corporations in locating elsewhere because we sent the workers out of the US.

 

cascadiance

(19,537 posts)
92. Yes, H-1B programs are indentured servant slave labor programs.
Wed Nov 19, 2014, 08:30 PM
Nov 2014

Whether we offshore jobs, or we inshore them with these kind of programs that between both of these strategies DEVALUE the labor force everywhere, I'm sorry, but anyone that calls H-1B a "liberal" program is off their rocker!

We also have to realize that we could keep a lot of jobs here in this country if we would bring back the founders' strategies of leveraging tariffs which most other well doing developed countries still do today except us through various means like VAT taxes. Schumer over and over again being the Democrat that makes H-1B expansion of just about every immigration bill is NOT liberal when he does that! I'm sorry, but that in my book, even if everything else he does is liberal (which it is not) would take him out of the #1 spot of any VALID poll.

As I note with the two links I posted, it is pretty bipartisan the reaction of many out there that this poll is not an accurate assessment of how "liberal" or how "conservative" politicians are.

If instead of all of these laws like the free trade laws and throwing away tariffs to help corporations make more profits and shelter them overseas (along with their manufacturing and headquarters locations) we would have them pay a price for these strategies in forms of tariffs, that would be the way to bring back labor here and pay them fair market wages so that it would be measurable to keep the divide from being too wide here which it is when the wealthy reward themselves too much and inflate our markets beyond what most working class people can afford to have the kind of middle class life style they used to have before Reagan's time.

H-1B programs are about *temporary* work arrangements of foreign nationals here, NOT them "immigrating" here. That is one big reason why it doesn't belong in an *Immigration* bill because it really isn't about immigration issues, other than it serves as a means of companies still being able to use union labor, and have LESS people immigrate here than they might otherwise. H-1B IS accommodating corporations in effect training foreign workers here and in effect sending their earnings out of this country, and them being trained here before going back to companies overseas when they are done with their H-1B "tour of duty" here.

Thinkingabout

(30,058 posts)
93. Disagree with you, kinda getting sidetracked.
Wed Nov 19, 2014, 08:37 PM
Nov 2014

The H-1B is a non-immigrant visa in the United States under the Immigration and Nationality Act, section 101(a)(15)(H). It allows U.S. employers to temporarily employ foreign workers in specialty occupations. If a foreign worker in H-1B status quits or is dismissed from the sponsoring employer, the worker must either apply for and be granted a change of status to another non-immigrant status, find another employer (subject to application for adjustment of status and/or change of visa), or leave the U.S.

The regulations define a "specialty occupation" as requiring theoretical and practical application of a body of highly specialized knowledge in a field of human endeavor[1] including but not limited to biotechnology, chemistry, architecture, engineering, mathematics, physical sciences, social sciences, medicine and health, education, law, accounting, business specialties, theology, and the arts, and requiring the attainment of a bachelor’s degree or its equivalent as a minimum[2] (with the exception of fashion models, who must be "of distinguished merit and ability&quot .[3] Likewise, the foreign worker must possess at least a bachelor’s degree or its equivalent and state licensure, if required to practice in that field. H-1B work-authorization is strictly limited to employment by the sponsoring employer

RiverLover

(7,830 posts)
90. Why are you doing this? Over & over, "Hillary is Hard Core Liberal" when that is laughbable
Wed Nov 19, 2014, 11:20 AM
Nov 2014

& EASILY disproved.

Hmmmm

 

cascadiance

(19,537 posts)
44. But you ARE just claiming in so many words that Hillary is in your post here!
Mon Nov 17, 2014, 02:34 PM
Nov 2014

If you're not a "hard core liberal", then how come you are supporting one by your own words!

Answer? Neither of you are as liberal as you are trying to make her out to be.

Thinkingabout

(30,058 posts)
52. Where does it state unless one is as hard core as another I can not support them?
Mon Nov 17, 2014, 06:01 PM
Nov 2014

Take a few minutes to look at Hillary, Warren and Bernie on the issues, I am not the one who rates the them, I am more to the moderate.

 

Ink Man

(171 posts)
11. It's Thanksgiving dinner
Sun Nov 16, 2014, 07:26 PM
Nov 2014

and Elizabeth has been asked to sit at the adult table because uncle Bob is snowed in and missed the dinner. At the Christmas dinner Elizabeth will back at the kids table.

IMO
The people running the show don't want her there.

 

cascadiance

(19,537 posts)
46. So is the poll that puts these kind of nonsense numbers too corporatist to post a link to?
Mon Nov 17, 2014, 02:38 PM
Nov 2014

I call you out on that one. Numbers that are spewed out with no reference mean NOTHING!

joshcryer

(62,276 posts)
49. Uh, look it up.
Mon Nov 17, 2014, 04:43 PM
Nov 2014

When I get online I'll send a link.

You seem so concerned but this should bother you enough to dig for yourself.

 

cascadiance

(19,537 posts)
86. As the comments note at the bottom these "ratings" are a JOKE!
Wed Nov 19, 2014, 02:18 AM
Nov 2014

Schumer tied for first who absolutely LOVES teaming with Republicans to expand H-1B Visa quotas when they get voted on? Sheesh!

And where are senators like Merkley, Sanders, Warren, Harkin, and others I'd put ahead of these 15. And Sherod Brown near the bottom of this list?

No criteria published in how they arrived at these "ratings". More like corporatist marketing labels to try and push this propaganda.

 

1StrongBlackMan

(31,849 posts)
55. All data that does not support my pre-conceived judgment ...
Mon Nov 17, 2014, 06:38 PM
Nov 2014

shall be immediately discarded as crap ... not refuted, just discarded.

joshcryer

(62,276 posts)
78. There are several potential reasons for this.
Tue Nov 18, 2014, 02:05 AM
Nov 2014

1) Senators have all become more liberal, thus being distinguished by the liberal ratings groups is more difficult. Of course, this would be a good thing overall, so many might not like it.

2) Senators aren't voting on as much liberal legislation as before, because Congress is deadlocked (thus forcing Warren to be in the same ranking as Third Way Mark Udall). This would be the go-to "excuse" but when you look at That's My Congress there are still plenty of pieces of legislation that so called "liberals" aren't co-sponsering.

3) Clinton is more liberal than Warren. This of course is impossible to comprehend for some here, but, you know, given that Warren keeps playing the safe card, I think it's likely.

Pick your poison. Either way the rankings are by liberal organizations and they are simple objective measures (based on policy positions either supported by or voted on by politicians).

In reality? It's probably a mixture of the three in some way or another and Clinton and Warren have similar policy positions and in fact that might explain why Warren wouldn't have a problem with a Clinton presidency. Politicians aren't evil shrill mongrels who want to destroy you. They want to do whatever they can to make things better.

 

1StrongBlackMan

(31,849 posts)
80. I suspect that Warren is DU's uber-liberal ...
Tue Nov 18, 2014, 08:33 AM
Nov 2014

not because she is actually more liberal than Clinton (as the data shows otherwise), but because she says the right words in her singular focus. That is one of the advantages of being a seating Senator that hasn't declared for a "higher" office ... you get to specialize; rather than, be a policy generalist, and the media only goes to you when they want your staked out position.

Folks here are proving to be closer to single-issue voters, no different from the gun-folks or the bible-folks ... that is fine; but it doesn't make them representative of any larger group ... no matter how loudly they type.

Number23

(24,544 posts)
75. Put that thing away, josh. You'll put someone's eye out around here
Tue Nov 18, 2014, 01:47 AM
Nov 2014


A weapon rarely seen around GD these days.

brooklynite

(94,729 posts)
50. No, not particularly...
Mon Nov 17, 2014, 04:51 PM
Nov 2014

As one of the 1%ers who supported Warren's campaign, I don't have an objection to any of her policies that I can think of. I'm adding the perfectly reasonable factor of which of the two can actually get elected. You may be willing to take the risk of a President Cruz to try and get Warren elected, but I'm not when Clinton is available.

FWIW, I think you'll find that Clinton and Warren are pretty close on "real": policies (as opposed to the blogosphere hyperbole that gets thrown around). Otherwise, why would Warren say Clinton would be great as President.

 

1StrongBlackMan

(31,849 posts)
56. You are a 1%, so who cares what you think? (Sarcasm) ...
Mon Nov 17, 2014, 06:44 PM
Nov 2014

Let's ignore for a moment that so is EW and Bernie.

Faryn Balyncd

(5,125 posts)
17. Howard Dean brought back to head DNC would help.
Sun Nov 16, 2014, 07:56 PM
Nov 2014


Elizabeth is perfect to build a 50 state strategy around.








Recursion

(56,582 posts)
31. Why?
Sun Nov 16, 2014, 10:20 PM
Nov 2014
Elizabeth is perfect to build a 50 state strategy around.

In what sense? She's +48 / -39 in MA and less popular in other parts of the country.

Faryn Balyncd

(5,125 posts)
36. It's my impression that both have the capacity to inspire & energize a grass roots movement, and
Sun Nov 16, 2014, 11:34 PM
Nov 2014





...that the transparent honesty of both is a large part of this.


I'm certainly not knocking HRC, or any other Democrat for that matter. (Both Dean & Warren support HRC, and an increased role for Dean and Warren would be good for HRC, the Democratic Party, America, and the world.


An increased role for Warren and Dean will help whoever is the 2016 Democratic candidate, in my view.


Their presence and influence will inspire a demoralized electorate, generate support for Democrats across the board, and make it easier for other candidates to have the courage to do right.






















Amishman

(5,559 posts)
48. I would say the opposite
Mon Nov 17, 2014, 04:12 PM
Nov 2014

She is the type of progressive that we can get into office only in more open minded states. If the aim is to be competitive in all races in all states, a true progressive is more of a bonus.

Warren's positions would not be remotely competitive in my part of PA. Taking someone cut from the same cloth as Warren and running them for a House seat in my district would be a recipe for complete failure. The best that could come from my area (and other less progressive areas) would be a blue dog. The entrenched ideas of the populace won't vote for anything more, and given the mass of closed minds it will take several lifetimes to make a meaningful change around here.

A 50 state strategy is about running the most progressive candidate that can actually win. I think a lot of people here forget this last part. There is a opinion that those who vote against their own interests time and time again are just ignorant and stupid. Judging by the conversations I have with family and neighbors, they know full well they are voting against their own interests. They do so because they feel that the programs which could assist them (and other non-rich) are immoral. I have heard of welfare, subsidized housing, and other support programs as theft. Even though they would be eligible for for assistance, they refuse because they have some convoluted logic that makes them think they would be stealing from someone to accept it. This isn't a matter of simple ignorance, its deep seated belief winning over logic. And that is something that is not quickly changed. These people will never vote for the Warrens of the world, and many districts have enough people like this to control the election. A true 50 state strategy is about not giving up on less progressive districts or states, its realizing that if we can't get a Warren we should try for a Joe Manchin because that is still a huge improvement over a Rand Paul.

Faryn Balyncd

(5,125 posts)
74. I don't think its opposite.
Tue Nov 18, 2014, 12:07 AM
Nov 2014


The full throated patriotism of Warren and Dean will help Democrats across the board, including helping blue dogs win against Republican crazies.

A higher presence of Warren in the Democratic Party, and in the Senate, will be good for America, good for the Senate, and good for the Democratic Party, including blue dogs.

This is not about shutting out blue dogs. That is not Dean's approach, and it is not Warren's.

Elizabeth Warren and Howard Dean both support HRC, and will be immensely helpful to her.

Without the full throated presence and higher profile of Warren & Dean, blue dogs will be weaker against the GOP, not stronger.

Dean's approach is the 50 state strategy, and the abandonment of the 50 state strategy since he was replaced has been a disaster.










Response to ashling (Original post)

 

geek tragedy

(68,868 posts)
35. It's her party when she becomes a presidential nominee
Sun Nov 16, 2014, 11:10 PM
Nov 2014

Right now it's Barack Obama's Democratic Party. In 2016 there will be a successor.

Elizabeth Warren is great. But she is a relatively junior member of the minority party in the Senate.

 

cascadiance

(19,537 posts)
47. Unfortunately with the corporatists infecting the party for 20+ years, it is hard to get experience
Mon Nov 17, 2014, 02:44 PM
Nov 2014

with many younger members of the Democratic Party who aren't compromised to big corporate lobbyist money.

When we have the old guard like Tom Harkin being replaced with the likes of Joni Ernst, we can't just put "years of experience" as a barrier to getting back real Democrats to help lead our party out of the corporatist cancer infected mess it has become over the years.

And if you want someone who has more years of experience understanding the plight of the middle class, I think that Warren has had that experience differential greatly over many of our politicians when you consider the work she'd done before she entered politics. Those who question her experience in this area should look at this video made before Obama got elected and before she was even on the radar for a position in government.

 

1StrongBlackMan

(31,849 posts)
59. Why, when I read some of the comments to these kind of OPs ...
Mon Nov 17, 2014, 06:58 PM
Nov 2014

i.e., OPs that provide prescriptions for moving forward ... that involves, actual work, am I reminded of a football team I played for as a freshman and sophomore?

The coach installed the offense and defensive schemes, and a segment of the team spent most of their time walking through the drills and talking about how the coach only played the upper-classmen (with the exception of a few under-classmen that worked hard during practice), and talking about how hard hitting the other team was.

Unsurprisingly, that was a losing team.

RiverLover

(7,830 posts)
67. Elizabeth Warren's take on the Trans-Pacific Partnership
Mon Nov 17, 2014, 11:26 PM
Nov 2014
Warren on Trans-Pacific Partnership: If people knew what was going on, they would stop it

Senator Elizabeth Warren (D-MA) on Wednesday voiced her opposition to President Barack Obama’s top international trade nominee because of a secretive free trade agreement.

“I am deeply concerned about the transparency record of the U.S. Trade Representative and with one ongoing trade agreement in particular — the Trans-Pacific Partnership,” she said on the Senate floor.

The Trans-Pacific Partnership (TPP) has been negotiated behind closed-doors for years by trade representatives from Australia, Brunei, Chile, Canada, Malaysia, Mexico, New Zealand, Peru, Singapore, the United States, and Vietnam. Though the free trade agreement could have wide ranging consequences on workers and consumers, the public only knows a few details of the treaty thanks to leaked documents.

“I have heard the argument that transparency would undermine the Trade Representative’s policy to complete the trade agreement because public opposition would be significant,” Warren explained. “In other words, if people knew what was going on, they would stop it. This argument is exactly backwards. If transparency would lead to widespread public opposition to a trade agreement, then that trade agreement should not be the policy of the United States.”

http://www.rawstory.com/rs/2013/06/warren-on-trans-pacific-partnership-if-people-knew-what-was-going-on-they-would-stop-it/

Ya gotta love her!

RiverLover

(7,830 posts)
71. And at a speech this year, on the TPP~
Mon Nov 17, 2014, 11:39 PM
Nov 2014
“Think about that. Real people, people whose jobs are at stake, small-business owners who don’t want to compete with overseas companies that dump their waste in rivers and hire workers for a dollar a day—those people, people without an army of lobbyists—they would be opposed. I believe if people across this country would be opposed to a particular trade agreement, then maybe that trade agreement should not happen.”

http://www.thenation.com/blog/179885/elizabeth-warren-reveals-inside-details-trade-talks


She sounds like she's running for president, doesn't she?

(Al Franken would be good too, imo....ABC)
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