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Mon Apr 16, 2012, 04:53 AM

Single payer advocate gives up and moves to New Zealand

One of our former chairs of Health Care for All WA is also a psychiatrist who moved to New Zealand. Her reason was that as she aged, her own insurance premiums got too high. She used to be the only MD psychiatrist in the state who would accept Medicaid patients. She hung on for a long time, even giving up her car and moving closer to work, but eventually the financial load got to be just too much.

http://www.commondreams.org/headline/2012/04/07-1

Dr. Carol Paris is a psychiatrist. She’s practiced for 13 years in southern Maryland. And she’s fought hard for a single payer system.

Dr. Carol Paris is arrested for disorderly conduct outside of a U.S. Senate office building Tuesday, May 5, 2009 for speaking out at Sen. Max Baucus' Congressional hearings on health care reform. (Photo/South Maryland News) She’s even been arrested in Congress for speaking out for single payer. But now, she’s had enough.

She’s closing her practice.

And moving it to New Zealand.

“I’m so tired and weary of trying to practice sane, passionate, good medicine in this insane health care system in the United States,” Paris said last month in an interview at Union Station before walking over to protest in front of the Supreme Court against the Obama health care law and for single payer. “It impairs my ability to practice in a way that is ethical and passionate. I have a few years left in me to practice. And I’ve decided see what it is like in another country. I have a couple of friends who are psychiatrists who have done a sabbatical in New Zealand. And they said they are so sad to be back in the United States practicing because it was so much more sane and caring in New Zealand. I’m going to see what it is like for my own mental health.”

“The insanity here is that we have a system of financing health care in this country that is all about profit for corporate America and not about the health care of the people,” Dr. Paris said. “It is opposed to the health care of the people of America. You can’t be about profit and be about a social service.”

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Reply Single payer advocate gives up and moves to New Zealand (Original post)
eridani Apr 2012 OP
elleng Apr 2012 #1
malaise Apr 2012 #5
Fearless Apr 2012 #37
Beartracks Apr 2012 #45
Nay Apr 2012 #2
Ship of Fools Apr 2012 #3
SammyWinstonJack Apr 2012 #6
HughBeaumont Apr 2012 #7
n2doc Apr 2012 #17
obxhead Apr 2012 #18
dogknob Apr 2012 #24
Snake Alchemist Apr 2012 #26
coalition_unwilling Apr 2012 #31
Daniel537 Apr 2012 #42
peacebird Apr 2012 #53
Snake Alchemist Apr 2012 #50
KurtNYC Apr 2012 #4
xchrom Apr 2012 #9
Fearless Apr 2012 #38
southernyankeebelle Apr 2012 #8
LittleGirl Apr 2012 #10
mmonk Apr 2012 #11
Snake Alchemist Apr 2012 #12
certainot Apr 2012 #13
obxhead Apr 2012 #20
certainot Apr 2012 #75
AndyTiedye Apr 2012 #43
certainot Apr 2012 #74
AndyTiedye Apr 2012 #76
shcrane71 Apr 2012 #60
exboyfil Apr 2012 #14
sofa king Apr 2012 #15
Snake Alchemist Apr 2012 #16
harun Apr 2012 #19
SoCalDem Apr 2012 #21
Dragonfli Apr 2012 #23
Ruby the Liberal Apr 2012 #22
Quantess Apr 2012 #27
Ruby the Liberal Apr 2012 #28
Quantess Apr 2012 #30
OnyxCollie Apr 2012 #25
Mr.Turnip Apr 2012 #29
coalition_unwilling Apr 2012 #32
BlueJazz Apr 2012 #48
OnyxCollie Apr 2012 #33
Mr.Turnip Apr 2012 #35
OnyxCollie Apr 2012 #36
white_wolf Apr 2012 #40
Mr.Turnip Apr 2012 #51
coalition_unwilling Apr 2012 #54
OnyxCollie Apr 2012 #62
white_wolf Apr 2012 #56
FedUp_Queer Apr 2012 #47
saras Apr 2012 #52
FedUp_Queer Apr 2012 #73
Daniel537 Apr 2012 #41
got root Apr 2012 #59
sabrina 1 Apr 2012 #63
nwliberalkiwi Apr 2012 #34
SHRED Apr 2012 #39
newfie11 Apr 2012 #44
DeSwiss Apr 2012 #46
SDjack Apr 2012 #49
magic59 Apr 2012 #55
EmeraldCityGrl Apr 2012 #58
Mimosa Apr 2012 #57
shcrane71 Apr 2012 #61
lovuian Apr 2012 #64
shcrane71 Apr 2012 #72
Domingo Tavella Apr 2012 #65
Bigredhunk Apr 2012 #66
Tax Man Apr 2012 #67
suffragette Apr 2012 #68
wickerwoman Apr 2012 #69
eridani Apr 2012 #71
AnnieK401 Apr 2012 #70

Response to eridani (Original post)

Mon Apr 16, 2012, 04:58 AM

1. "You can’t be about profit and be about a social service."

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Response to elleng (Reply #1)

Mon Apr 16, 2012, 06:34 AM

5. That simple

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Response to elleng (Reply #1)

Mon Apr 16, 2012, 05:39 PM

37. +1

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Response to elleng (Reply #1)

Mon Apr 16, 2012, 06:18 PM

45. + another 1 n/t

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Response to eridani (Original post)

Mon Apr 16, 2012, 05:23 AM

2. Good for her. More people should abandon this shithole. nt

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Response to Nay (Reply #2)

Mon Apr 16, 2012, 06:02 AM

3. I'd LOVE to go there! No resources to do it, though...

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Response to Nay (Reply #2)

Mon Apr 16, 2012, 06:37 AM

6. I'd love to blow this pop stand of a country. Not able to financially.

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Response to SammyWinstonJack (Reply #6)

Mon Apr 16, 2012, 06:50 AM

7. Try telling this to the "Love it or leave it" crew . . .

. . . they don't seem to get that the "leave it" part really isn't as easy as it sounds.

Although "leaving it" is pretty much conceding this nation to the fascists, staying around and making things better is becoming a futile quest. Corporate America's talon clutches on government are sinking in deeper by the year.

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Response to HughBeaumont (Reply #7)

Mon Apr 16, 2012, 07:57 AM

17. +1 n/t

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Response to HughBeaumont (Reply #7)

Mon Apr 16, 2012, 02:51 PM

18. My reply to them is always.

 

Buy my property and lend me a few thousand and I'll be on the next boat out.

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Response to HughBeaumont (Reply #7)

Mon Apr 16, 2012, 03:26 PM

24. I would leave if it were possible.

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Response to HughBeaumont (Reply #7)

Mon Apr 16, 2012, 03:42 PM

26. The US is a virtual prison.

 

Most countries have strict laws keeping us out.

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Response to Nay (Reply #2)

Mon Apr 16, 2012, 04:24 PM

31. You realize that those who can do so are predominantly the upper-middle

 

and upper classes, right?

The poor thus are left to inherit the whirlwind while the well-to-do make their escape?

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Response to coalition_unwilling (Reply #31)

Mon Apr 16, 2012, 05:50 PM

42. Some people here seem to not give a shit.

 

Lets just move to Europe or Canada and let the poor fight over the scraps. Gee, that sounds familiar to me. Kind of stuff the Tea Party nuts say. Limousine liberals indeed.

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Response to Daniel537 (Reply #42)

Mon Apr 16, 2012, 09:28 PM

53. Hmm, Daniel537 only joined DU 9 April 2012 and yet feels comfortable deriding people as

Limousine liberals?

Seems odd.....

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Response to coalition_unwilling (Reply #31)

Mon Apr 16, 2012, 07:15 PM

50. "Surely they can sell their summer home if need be" seems to be the reaction. nt

 

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Response to eridani (Original post)

Mon Apr 16, 2012, 06:29 AM

4. She went to NZ and GOT single payer health care. To me that is NOT giving up.

She voted with her body, her skills, her taxes and her residence.

Good for her.

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Response to KurtNYC (Reply #4)

Mon Apr 16, 2012, 06:58 AM

9. +1 nt

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Response to KurtNYC (Reply #4)

Mon Apr 16, 2012, 05:40 PM

38. +2

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Response to eridani (Original post)

Mon Apr 16, 2012, 06:53 AM

8. Good luck to her. Maybe if we keep losing doctors to other countries our own government

 

and the teabaggers will realize we our losing the best.

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Response to eridani (Original post)

Mon Apr 16, 2012, 07:09 AM

10. We're planning to do the same.

We're in the planning stages now. Husband knows that in a year when this project he is working on is complete, he'll be out of a job here in Indy. So since he's a British citizen, we're going to see about opportunities at HQ in Europe or in the UK with another company. We know that in mid-life, we should do this while we're young enough to do it. And I'm the one pushing to do it. The America of 2012 is not the one I recognize.

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Response to eridani (Original post)

Mon Apr 16, 2012, 07:12 AM

11. It's easy to give up.

Powerful forces currently at play are beyond our control to improve our lot. But many do not have the luxury of being able to pick up and leave.

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Response to eridani (Original post)

Mon Apr 16, 2012, 07:14 AM

12. Unfortunately, not everyone has this opportunity. nt

 

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Response to eridani (Original post)

Mon Apr 16, 2012, 07:25 AM

13. this kind of an exodus can be avoided if the left would get more serious about challenging talk radi

radio- it's been the RW's most valuable weapon for 20 years and until recently has been getting NO attention while it kicked the left's ass on ALL issues.

those teabaggers may have gotten bus passes from the kochs but the lines they spouted and their ignorance of facts was because they were /are first and foremost- talk radio dittoheads, who heard for 20 years how millions of canadians had flooded over the border for years to get health care in the US, etc.

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Response to certainot (Reply #13)

Mon Apr 16, 2012, 02:54 PM

20. Rush, arguably the most followed right wing talk radio but has

 

a following of 20 million. While that seems large, it's a very small fragment of the actual Republican voter.

While I agree hate radio has influence, it's not the primary cause of the direction politics has taken over the last 30 years.

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Response to obxhead (Reply #20)

Tue Apr 17, 2012, 10:55 PM

75. he's point man for 1000 coordinated stations, creating made-to-order constituencies and alternate

realities. 50 mil a week, many of them absorbing the lies and passing them to friends and family and co-workers. it's a buzz machine mad avenue would kill for, well coordinated by those think tanks.

it dominates the republican voter and the party, determining who is too moderate to represent them. the party of lincoln became the party of limbaugh.

team limbaugh can dominate messaging through unchallenged repetition. it's a 24/7 ad for the GOP. they decide where the political center is perceived, what is acceptable or not.

it was the small number of dittohead/teabaggers (following a big microphone) and the 20 years of unchallenged and ignored lying that made single payer and public option politically impossible. it was largely limbaugh, with months of blowharding, that convinced those idiots that defaulting on the debt would be good for us, forcing obama to make cuts. it was largely team limbaugh that gave us bush, iraq, bank deregulation, tax breaks for billionaires, and much of this supreme court. one of his earliest successes was swiftboating anita hill to get thomas on the court, and creating the atmosphere that makes a real liberal on the court so hard.

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Response to certainot (Reply #13)

Mon Apr 16, 2012, 05:56 PM

43. Right Wing Talk Radio is a Huge Problem For Us, But What Can We Do About It?

The wingnuts own all the commercial radio networks and nearly all of the stations.
How do we counter something like that?

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Response to AndyTiedye (Reply #43)

Tue Apr 17, 2012, 10:40 PM

74. RW radio monopoly can't survive without university sports, and those unis should be ashamed

dem party and left orgs need to get behind limbaugh boycotts, and get the 76 unis on 170 limbaugh stations to find alts.... here's the list of those unis....

https://sites.google.com/site/universitiesforrushlimbaugh/

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Response to certainot (Reply #74)

Wed Apr 25, 2012, 12:58 AM

76. That is a Good Suggestion

Most of those universities are pretty conservative, at least at the administration level, most being state schools in very red states.
so whoever decides where they broadcast may actually approve of the ˘®ĺ¶ that limpballs spews.

There are some on that list that should be persuadable though.

My alma mater is not on that list, but I never expected it to be. They didn't even have a football team when I was there.

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Response to certainot (Reply #13)

Mon Apr 16, 2012, 10:32 PM

60. +1000... Anyone who questions the power of a broadcast platform to disseminate

propaganda and effect public sentiment hasn't read history.

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Response to eridani (Original post)

Mon Apr 16, 2012, 07:39 AM

14. Funny my two daughters have thought about New Zealand

One is planning on being an Electrical Engineer working on film production/equipment/software (still to be decided). The other wants to be a surgeon. I told them to be on the lookout for nice New Zealand boys in college.

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Response to eridani (Original post)

Mon Apr 16, 2012, 07:49 AM

15. They damned near had to drag me on the plane in NZ.

It's still a nicer place than the U.S. in just about every way, even though the conservatives ruined that country two decades ago by offshoring its industry and lowering the income of most New Zealanders.

Not real easy to emigrate to, however. When I checked--and believe me, I checked hard when GWB came to town--you had to have a lot of money and a unique professional skill to score a work visa and a job. Attaining citizenship was considerably harder.

But yeah, you could walk into a corner pharmacy, speak at length with a trained health professional for free, and walk out with a prescribed solution for a few bucks. Nobody I was with got any sicker than that.

But beer, which the population consumes in vast quantities, is limited to 3.4% alcohol by volume--which I suppose is why many Kiwis drink it by the gallon. Don't you dare tell them you can drink more beer than they can, even though many Americans probably can. It really hurts their feelings.

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Response to sofa king (Reply #15)

Mon Apr 16, 2012, 07:52 AM

16. Most places people want to go to are hard to get into. nt

 

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Response to eridani (Original post)

Mon Apr 16, 2012, 02:53 PM

19. “Give me your tired, your poor, your huddled masses yearning to be free”

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Response to eridani (Original post)

Mon Apr 16, 2012, 02:59 PM

21. She's lucky she has a profession that can "move" easily. If she were a hairdresser or clerk

she would be stuck here forever.

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Response to SoCalDem (Reply #21)

Mon Apr 16, 2012, 03:22 PM

23. I don't know if it has changed, but my wife and I looked into relocating 15 years ago

If I recall correctly you had to prove that you could do a job that no one in the destination country could do (I imagine to protect their jobs).

It sounds worse than it is even tho it is bad if you are not a professional of some sort that is in short supply.

As a carpenter and cabinet maker, I didn't make the cut to become a Canadian citizen, my wife was an art teacher and they didn't even take that seriously for some reason.

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Response to eridani (Original post)

Mon Apr 16, 2012, 03:19 PM

22. Sorry, I am on the fence about this one.

She is going to another country, where she didn't pay into the system over her lifetime. I *get* it, but I also see that if everyone did this as they "aged, (their) own insurance premiums got too high", that is just setting up another country's citizens to pick up the burden of what our country should be managing for our own.

Yes, I am happy for her that she has the means (and type of career) to make this kind of decision, but overall, that isn't the answer.

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Response to Ruby the Liberal (Reply #22)

Mon Apr 16, 2012, 03:46 PM

27. But that was New Zealand's choice to let her in.

I do not know their immigration policies, but I am going to wager that she is a good investment for them. She will be a contributing taxpayer for a while longer, with a good income.

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Response to Quantess (Reply #27)

Mon Apr 16, 2012, 03:52 PM

28. I am not speaking about one individual

I'm talking about this being promoted as a good idea in general.

Trust me when I say I have thought about it myself - to the point of seriously looking at real estate investment and making inquiries.

One thing that niggles at me is I feel like I would be taking advantage of another country's taxpayers by just showing up and asking to be a part of the system from the day I get there, even if I do contribute for another 15-20 years. I will undoubtedly need more medical care in the last 20 years of my career than in the first 20.

Too many years living here in the US and being told that healthcare is a privilege, not a right, I guess.

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Response to Ruby the Liberal (Reply #28)

Mon Apr 16, 2012, 04:18 PM

30. Well, I can see your point about that.

But then, I don't think it's an easy accomplishment anyway, to relocate to another country. One needs to consider whether the other country will want you to stay for more than a vacation. It's just not an option for most Americans.

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Response to eridani (Original post)

Mon Apr 16, 2012, 03:41 PM

25. She wants Romney to win!!!11!

 

But, seriously, if politicians only care about supporting an industry that profits by denying people health care, then fuck this place. One's health is more important than supporting a country governed by douchebags who are only interested in campaign contributions and could give a shit if you died.

I'd move too, if I could.

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Response to eridani (Original post)

Mon Apr 16, 2012, 03:58 PM

29. The sort of attitude displayed in this thread is why the Right is able to label us as Anti-American.

"THE US IS SHITHOLE"
"THE U.S. IS LOST TO FASCISM"
"AMERICANS ARE IDIOTS"
Etc,etc.

Do you guys really think we can win the hearts and minds of the American people like this? You really think it won't push people who might otherwise listen to us away? And nobody likes defeatism.

Seriously a lot of people here seem to have almost no concept of marketing and public outreach, you don't win people over by belittling them and calling them morons, nor do you win them over by insulting a country that they might feel patriotism for.

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Response to Mr.Turnip (Reply #29)

Mon Apr 16, 2012, 04:30 PM

32. The U.S. IS a shithole. 50 million Americans currently receiving food stamps. 44 million

 

Americans living at or beneath the poverty line. 48 million Americans with no health insurance. And 1% of this country's population control 40% of its wealth. That, my friend, is the textbook definition of a shithole.

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Response to coalition_unwilling (Reply #32)

Mon Apr 16, 2012, 06:53 PM

48. Amen. Plus...we're up to our asses in debt...so far, in fact, we're NEVER going to get out. Period.

 

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Response to Mr.Turnip (Reply #29)

Mon Apr 16, 2012, 04:38 PM

33. The way to win hearts and minds

 

is to give people something they can actually use, like, oh, I don't know, maybe healthcare.

Will patriotism pay for your hospital stay?

Democrats would be golden if they had done that, instead of selling us out to a corrupt system. Now it's up to apologists to try and convince us that all we need to do is act in a non-rational manner and things will be better. Clapping for Tinkerbell and all that.

Fuck "hope." That's for suckers. Objective incentives are the only things that matter.

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Response to OnyxCollie (Reply #33)

Mon Apr 16, 2012, 05:08 PM

35. And see that's why someone like you will never win an election in any major capacity.

People like optimism, people like hope, people don't like to be told to be miserable, people don't like being told that they shouldn't have hope for the future.

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Response to Mr.Turnip (Reply #35)

Mon Apr 16, 2012, 05:31 PM

36. Was I trying to win an election?

 

No.

People don't like smoke blown up their ass either, particularly when they need real solutions for their problems.

If optimism is so important to win an election, why doesn't Obama run the "hope" campaign again? It worked so well the first time...

Edit to add: People don't have to be told to be miserable. They already are. Gee, I wonder why?

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Response to Mr.Turnip (Reply #35)

Mon Apr 16, 2012, 05:46 PM

40. That's the problem.

People want false hope and false optimism. They don't want to hear the truth. They don't want to hear that, contrary, to what propaganda says, America is not the greatest place in the world. Until people are ready to face the truth of what America is there is no hope of fixing it.

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Response to white_wolf (Reply #40)

Mon Apr 16, 2012, 08:05 PM

51. America is a fairly highly-developed Western Nation with a currently flawed Economic system.

Despite this it's by no measure the worst place in the world and it retains a standard of living well above most of the world.

There are FAR worse places a person could live. And I can't think of a place that I would rather live, despite all of America's problems it's the country I was born in, have lived in, have my family my friends basically my core social circle, have traveled extensively (and it's a truly beautiful country, few places have the diversity of landscapes it has) within it. And you know what even out there in say Wyoming full of people I agree with on almost nothing I find plenty of decent folk.

So to me the greatest goddamn place in the world is a good pizza places in New York City because I don't believe their really is no greatest or worst place in the world other than what the greatest place in the world is to YOU.

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Response to Mr.Turnip (Reply #51)

Mon Apr 16, 2012, 09:30 PM

54. "It's by no measure the worst place in the world" -- aka damning it with faint praise. I guess you

 

forgot about the estimated 1.5 million homeless children here right now. For them there are probably far better places to live.

But carry on with your Panglossian narrative. Voltaire is groaning in his grave.

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Response to coalition_unwilling (Reply #54)

Mon Apr 16, 2012, 10:35 PM

62. Whoo hoo! We're better than North Korea!

 

USA! USA! USA!

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Response to Mr.Turnip (Reply #51)

Mon Apr 16, 2012, 10:01 PM

56. Of course, there are worse places to live.

There are always worse places, but that doesn't excuse America's faults. My comment about America not being the greatest place in the world was to point out that many Americans do seem to think that the U.S. is God's gift to the world, a shining city as Regan put it. As for better places, many countries in Europe provide a higher stander of living and more upward mobility than the U.S. I'm not saying they are better in every way, but I do think there is a lot America could learn from Europe, if Americans would let go of their pride.

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Response to Mr.Turnip (Reply #35)

Mon Apr 16, 2012, 06:42 PM

47. Ok. Let's do this.

 

Let's look at what the hope and optimism instead of truth and reality have gotten us.

1) Reagan: the decimation of the middle class; higher taxes on poor and middle class people; lower taxes on high income people; Iran Contra, but by golly we felt better;

2) George H.W. Bush: war in Iraq, recession, veto of the FMLA, stagnation, all in all not a disaster;

3) Clinton: the telecommunications act of 1996; the repeal of Glass-Steagall; the end of welfare; NAFTA and the WTO; we got some crumbs, but the Clinton/Rubin/Summers team sowed the seeds of the bank failure;

4) George W. Bush: torture; war; death; destruction; enormous deficits; a broken country; huge curtails on civil liberties; the death of 1 million Iraqis; the displacement of 5 million Iraqis; the worst attack on US Soil since 1812; more and more tax cuts for the rich;

5) Barack H. Obama: extension of tax cuts for rich folks; handed over to the insurance companies (I happened to be shopping for insurance today and received a quote of $1,300 for ONE PERSON...the lowest was $647, so I can't wait for when I MUST buy it); cuts to the community services block grant, cuts to the community development block grant; watered-down financial reform; "looking forward" and no accountability on the Bush/Cheney/Rumsfeld war crimes; indefinite detention; extra-judicial killings; more death in Afghanistan.

So, I, for one, am sick of hope and party streamers. We need cold, hard facts. We need people who are going to have the courage as Johnson did when signed the Civil Rights Act of 1964 knowing he would "lose the south for a generation."

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Response to FedUp_Queer (Reply #47)

Mon Apr 16, 2012, 08:13 PM

52. You need BOTH, and they DON'T get along. That's why politics is hard.

 

To oversimplify to a jaw-droppingly extreme degree:

Believers will believe anything, but/and will keep on going against any odds. Without believers, we'd still have slavery and male-only voting. It takes believers to have a hundred-year plan.

Skeptics don't undertake fanatical long-term crusades, for better or worse. They tend to sell out whenever it's profitable to do so in the short term.

They need to respect each other and keep each other in line. The party is only big enough to win when it includes both groups.

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Response to saras (Reply #52)

Tue Apr 17, 2012, 03:24 PM

73. Fair enough.

 

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Response to Mr.Turnip (Reply #29)

Mon Apr 16, 2012, 05:47 PM

41. +1

 

I want to make this country better, not just abandon ship and condemn it as a "shithole". If that's how some of you feel, why bother even voting?

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Response to Mr.Turnip (Reply #29)

Mon Apr 16, 2012, 10:27 PM

59. brown nosing has gotten us this far

 

-1

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Response to Mr.Turnip (Reply #29)

Mon Apr 16, 2012, 10:43 PM

63. Why do you care what the 'Right thinks'?? Surely if you are a Democrat you know that the Right

doesn't think and we don't care what fantasies they conjure up in their seriously disturbed excuses for 'minds'. It's a big world, they wanted to take over this country and they have destroyed it, and now many people are doing what many Europeans did back in the past, looking for somewhere else to live where people value lives over profit and where Healthcare especially, is considered a right not a privilege.

Do you think all those Europeans who emigrated to the US in the past were 'anti-British, anti-Irish, anti-Italian, anti-wherever they came from or was it because morons like the far right here, had destroyed their countries to the point where they could no longer stay and sought freedom elsewhere?

And what happened in all those countries people left? They got better. Sometimes you have to know when to leave. I would too if I could. Let all the good, decent people leave it to the Limbaugh/Fox mob for a while and watch what happens when only their policies are in place. Somalia comes to mind.

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Response to eridani (Original post)

Mon Apr 16, 2012, 05:00 PM

34. I've Been To Heaven

We lived for two years in New Zealand. If not for a sick family member we'd be back there in a flash. The people are wonderful. My wife worked as a nurse in one of their hospitals. We had a friend with heart trouble that had several surgeries---no cost---no worries about losing all your income. The government came out to his house and remodeled his bathroom for no cost so that it would be easier for him to use. Their taxes are higher, but you get a better health care system than in the United States. Look what we get with the lower tax mantra. I truly can say that I've been to heaven!!!

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Response to eridani (Original post)

Mon Apr 16, 2012, 05:44 PM

39. Good luck getting citizenship


It is nearly impossible for New Zealand and also Canada for that matter if you come from the USA.


--

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Response to eridani (Original post)

Mon Apr 16, 2012, 06:08 PM

44. Glad she could move to NZ

Most of us cannot. Retired folks must be wealthy to be allowed to move there.

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Response to eridani (Original post)

Mon Apr 16, 2012, 07:12 PM

49. Wish we could subcontract our healthcare system to France. n/t

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Response to eridani (Original post)

Mon Apr 16, 2012, 09:52 PM

55. Smart people are leaving this country

 

Its going down hill fast. It turning into a corporate cesspool. Healthcare is just one of many problems that will never be fixed until we have a bloody revolution, no other way.

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Response to magic59 (Reply #55)

Mon Apr 16, 2012, 10:14 PM

58. More expats gave up citizenship

and green card holders turned them in last year than any other time in history.
Many cited the complicated and unfair tax code as the reason why.

http://www.reuters.com/article/2012/04/16/us-usa-citizen-renounce-idUSBRE83F0UF20120416

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Response to eridani (Original post)

Mon Apr 16, 2012, 10:05 PM

57. The awful truth.

I wish I could move. I'm too old now. But if i new then what I know now I would have left in the late 1970s.

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Response to eridani (Original post)

Mon Apr 16, 2012, 10:34 PM

61. I was just thinking that the US will have a brain drain first as the most educated

emigrate to more stable countries. The next wave of emigration will take the young and mobile who will be looking for any sort of economic advantages.

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Response to shcrane71 (Reply #61)

Mon Apr 16, 2012, 10:46 PM

64. it will be massive ....what will be left

is slaves to the system ...
America will deteriorate rapidly

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Response to lovuian (Reply #64)

Tue Apr 17, 2012, 03:07 PM

72. Move over lavish suburbs! Make way for favellas. nt

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Response to eridani (Original post)

Tue Apr 17, 2012, 12:12 AM

65. Lucky her

 

It is not easy to emigrate. You don't just show up at the NZ embassy and declare you want to go and live there. It simply does not work like that. Some of us are lucky enough to have more than one passport, but the vast majority of Americans don't have the luxury of choosing where to spend the last decades of their lives, when health becomes a most important issue. It is indeed a tragedy that with the money wasted in invading Iraq (close to 4 trillion over 10 years) it would have been possible to finance universal health care and then some. But spending on health is not as glamorous as spending on war and it is up to the American voter to wake up and do what is right.

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Response to eridani (Original post)

Tue Apr 17, 2012, 01:45 AM

66. Hmmm

Yeah, I imagine it'd be hard to emigrate anywhere. No idea how it's done/how much it costs. It's beyond me (but very appealing). The UK, Germany, Sweden, Switzerland, etc... I'm in!

My boss at my last job...her family hosted a foreign exchange student from Denmark when she was in high school. Her older brother eventually (10 years later) ended up marrying this gal and moving to her native Denmark. As a citizen, he gets free health care and college. He was studying to be a nurse on Denmark's dime. I would love to live somewhere where everyone chipped in, everyone took out. That's unfathomable to the morons here, who'd all be worried that someone got .10 more then them out of the pot.

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Response to eridani (Original post)

Tue Apr 17, 2012, 02:23 AM

67. can't say i blame her

 

and, if romney wins, this country won't be fit for anyone to live in.

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Response to eridani (Original post)

Tue Apr 17, 2012, 02:43 AM

68. It's all of our loss that such a dedicated professional has chosen to leave

though I understand her reasons for doing so.

Health care should be a right for all, not a profit margin for some.

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Response to eridani (Original post)

Tue Apr 17, 2012, 03:50 AM

69. If she's over 55 she can't get in.

I take her point, but New Zealand won't accept anyone over 55 or anyone with any kind of moderate to serious health problems (which her high premiums suggest she has). They won't even take people who are significantly overweight.

Yes, it's a great system, but they keep costs low by making it really damn hard to get into it.

It seems to me that she hasn't researched her intention very seriously.

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Response to wickerwoman (Reply #69)

Tue Apr 17, 2012, 01:33 PM

71. The former chair of HCFA-WA got in at age 57

Her insurance was costly here solely because of age rating--she had no chronic health problems. If they like your professional qualifications, it looks like they cut you some slack.

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Response to eridani (Original post)

Tue Apr 17, 2012, 04:34 AM

70. Incredibly depressing because it's true

After reading this thread I am even more depressed about the direction our country is headed. I think it's clear that, for many reasons, a mass exodus is not the answer. The fact is that many people in this country still have some type of coverage through their employer and do not consider health care a major concern. Their only thought is keeping a job they may despise. They are not thinking long term and considering what would happen if they lost their job and/or got a catastrophic illness. They believe they will be fine if they just make it until 65 and who cares about the millions who don't have coverage through an employer or Medicare or a parent. I am one of those millions. Lets face it, the real problem is that our politicians are bought and paid for by powerful corporate interests. They seem to have found ways to subvert our electoral process. A revolution? I heard that about one out of every 35 people died during the Civil War. Not pretty. Sorry, it's obvious there is a serious problem here (health care is a symptom) but I don't have any quick and easy answers.

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