General Discussion
Related: Editorials & Other Articles, Issue Forums, Alliance Forums, Region ForumsIndiana woman charged with feticide for pregnancy outcome
http://www.theguardian.com/world/2014/aug/26/indiana-woman-feticide-chargeA 33-year-old woman from Indiana, has been charged with the feticide and fetal murder of her unborn child after she endured a premature delivery and sought hospital treatment.
Purvi Patel faces between six and 20 years in prison for feticide and up to 50 years imprisonment for neglect of a dependent when she goes to trial, currently scheduled for 29 September. She is the second woman in Indiana to be charged with feticide following the prolonged criminal prosecution of Bei Bei Shuai, who lost her baby when she tried to kill herself.
Women’s rights advocates see the decision by prosecutors of St Joseph County, Indiana, to apply feticide laws against Patel as part of the creeping criminalization of pregnancy in America. At least 38 of the 50 states have introduced fetal homicide laws intended to protect the unborn child and in a growing number of states – including Alabama, Mississippi and South Carolina – those laws have been turned against mothers.
Lynn Paltrow of the group National Advocates for Pregnant Women said that “once again prosecutors in Indiana are using this very sad situation to establish that intentional abortions as well as unintentional pregnancy losses should be punished as crimes. In the US, as a matter of constitutional law and human decency, no woman should be arrested for the outcome of her pregnancy.”
Kathrine Jack, an Indiana attorney and activist who is following the Patel case closely, said that the state’s feticide law had never been intended to apply to pregnant women. It was initially framed to catch illegal abortion providers, and later expanded to include men who domestically abused their pregnant partners.
= new reply since forum marked as read
Highlight:
NoneDon't highlight anything
5 newestHighlight 5 most recent replies
jen63
(813 posts)
Mnemosyne
(21,363 posts)
sakabatou
(42,318 posts)
LeftyMom
(49,212 posts)both are Asian. Maybe Indiana has really changed since I was there last, but I don't recall it being wildly diverse.
Considering that the pro-fetus people have been pushing for sex selective abortion bans largely based on the incorrect assumption that Asian-American women are engaged in the practice, I wouldn't be surprised if Asian women's motivations are subject to greater scrutiny in cases like this.
politicat
(9,808 posts)Since the law went into effect, there have been a couple miscarriages in the extended family and one stillbirth. (Extended is a couple hundred people so not too statistically improbable.) no discussion of any sort of charges. But a) white and b) not in St Joseph County. If the law was being applied equally, at least one of those would have gotten some attention.
Makes me wonder if St Joseph county is selectively prosecuting those whom they perceive as having little social capital and few community advocates. And the sex selective libel is a useful (to the prosecutors) probable cause. I'd like to see what else those prosecutors are pursuing: my bet is that statistically, they'd have a statistically significant racial and classist bent. (Because Howard county certainly does.)
Wella
(1,827 posts)...Legal documents lodged with the St Joseph superior court record that Patel was first charged with endangering the life of a dependent. On 13 July 2013 she turned up at the ER room in St Joseph hospital in Mishawaka, Indiana, bleeding from her vagina.
The court documents allege that she initially denied that she had given birth but later told medical staff that she had delivered a baby at home but believed that it was dead. She said she put the dead body in a bag and placed it in a dumpster behind a local store.
The body of a premature baby was found shortly afterwards in a dumpster at that location.
Police homicide detectives subsequently interrogated Patel and carried out searches under warrant of her home and mobile phone. They allege that they found text messages between the defendant and a friend in which Patel discussed her pregnancy and admitted obtaining drugs from Hong Kong that she took in an attempt to abort the baby.
The two charges that Patel now faces – the initial count of neglect of a dependent, and the new charge of feticide – appear to be legally contradictory. Under Indiana law, a woman can only be convicted of neglecting a dependent if it can be proved that she gave birth to a live baby.
By contrast, feticide requires the baby to have been born dead. Its definition in Indiana law is that the woman “knowingly or intentionally terminates a human pregnancy with an intention other than to produce a live birth or to remove a dead fetus”.
Asked about this apparent contradiction, Patel’s lawyer, Jeffrey Sanford, said: “I don’t think the state can prove a live birth.”
2banon
(7,321 posts)Religious Fanaticism should be condemned in any civilization, that it needs to be said here in the U.S. is beyond disgusting, it's terrorizing. All women should leave these states immediately if they value their lives.
missingthebigdog
(1,233 posts)Read it before you jump to any conclusions here.
This woman delivered a 30 week fetus at home, after taking a drug to induce labor, put it in a trash bag, dumped it behind a Target store, and went to the hospital, where she repeatedly denied ever having been pregnant. The coroner concluded that this was a live birth.
I am pro-choice, but cannot support the notion that women should be permitted to engage in "do it yourself" abortion procedures in their third trimester of pregnancy.
tea and oranges
(396 posts)Lee-Lee
(6,324 posts)Many women can't afford a doctor or are in desperate places in their lives.
Your either pro choice in all circumstances, or your not pro-choice at all.
At most the only possible crime here was improper disposal of hazardous medical waste.
newcriminal
(2,190 posts)
Dorian Gray
(13,574 posts)as the coroner said.
LanternWaste
(37,748 posts)"cannot support the notion that women should be permitted to engage in "do it yourself" abortion procedures..."
We have no idea if she had access, transport or money to meet the following requirements for an abortion in Indiana:
A woman must receive state-directed counseling that includes information designed to discourage her from having an abortion and then wait 18 hours before procedure is provided. Counseling must be provided in person and must take place before the waiting period begins, thereby necessitating two separate trips to the facility.
Health plans that will be offered in the state’s health exchange under the Affordable Care Act can only cover abortion in cases when the woman's life is endangered, her health is severely compromised, rape or incest.
Public funding is available for abortion only in cases of life endangerment, physical health, rape or incest.
A woman must undergo an ultrasound before obtaining an abortion; the provider must offer her the option to view the image.
One may imagine her action will be repeated as more restrictions are placed on this wholly valid medical procedure.
AnotherDreamWeaver
(2,856 posts)
Live and Learn
(12,769 posts)
moriah
(8,312 posts)That's what started the investigation in a criminal light right there. Because of the way the fetus was disposed, they had to rule out the possibility of it being a live birth.
"They allege that they found text messages between the defendant and a friend in which Patel discussed her pregnancy and admitted obtaining drugs from Hong Kong that she took in an attempt to abort the baby."
I don't think it's correct to criminalize a woman who has sought a non-medical abortion. Those women are most likely absolutely desperate and in Indiana very well may not have had any access to a safe abortion provider. That's what Indiana's current law criminalizes and it's wrong.
However, to suggest that this is over a pregnancy outcome, rather than an alleged illegal abortion attempt, is a bit OTT.
SheilaT
(23,156 posts)I wonder what our world would be like if men could get pregnant.
niyad
(114,869 posts)
JustAnotherGen
(32,292 posts)1 million. 
justiceischeap
(14,040 posts)This woman took pills to force a late-term abortion and when the fetus was born, threw it in a dumpster.
I looked for more information on the story and found the fetus was at least 6 1/2 months along and the coroner ruled it had taken a breath.
http://www.abc57.com/home/top-stories/Formal-charges-filed-in-death-of-baby-found-in-dumpster-215891341.html
I am most decidedly pro-choice and I think the government has gone too far into the legislation/control of women's bodies but I just don't know if that is the case here or if outrage is warranted unless one believes late-term self-induced abortions are okay.
Response to justiceischeap (Reply #14)
Name removed Message auto-removed
moriah
(8,312 posts)It's unsafe for mother and fetus (I'm for procedures like labor induction or early c-section in the extremely rare case of a late-term elective "abortion" with the child becoming the ward of the state if they are born alive) and more of a testament to the fact abortion access is still very rare in states like Indiana if you don't have the resources to pay for it and likely travel as well.
I live in a state with three abortion providers -- only one providing surgical abortion, the other two are Planned Parenthoods that offer RU-486. Last quoted price from someone who had one locally was $600 for an early first-trimester vacuum curettage.
To a person without the ability to travel to our capital city, stay overnight or have Internet access before they go to print out the counseling materials, and at least $600.... and the longer you have to wait, the more it costs and could end up requiring two nights in town if you have to wait long enough.... a coathanger looks pretty handy.
While I'm for the "safe, legal, and rare" idea (rare through access to effective birth control methods for everyone), it seems people are trying to make them "rare" by denying access. In those cases, desperation can lead people to do horrible things to themselves, and turning a desperate woman into a criminal isn't just.
hifiguy
(33,688 posts)hifiguy
(33,688 posts)What is this country coming to? There seem to be a lot of people in this benighted land who look at Saudi Arabia and ISIL and say "Yup, looks good to me!! But WE will do it in the correct name of dino-ridin' Jebus."
to infinity.
ETA - well, there seems to be a bit more to this than the OP states, but there is no way this should be a criminal matter. And 50 years in the slammer? You can get less time for first- or second-degree murder.
Initech
(100,374 posts)Seriously what the fuck is going on in this country? 