If Susan Rice is The President's first choice for SoS, should he nominate her?

[onehandle]

No nuance. Just answer the question.

44 votes, 0 passes | Time left: Unlimited
	Yes
	41 (93%)
	No
	3 (7%)
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[madokie]

1. I hope he does

She is a good smart woman who would be great as SoS

[ProSense]

2. Here's what I think:

I'm going to wait until the President announces his choice. Fuck Republicans, especially the useless and irrelevant fucking House Republicans.

People need to stop giving these assholes the leeway to talk shit, play head games and pretend they're relevant. Fuck 'em.

[onehandle]

4. We know his choice and so do they. This is about vacating Senator Kerry's seat...

...and re-electing Scott Brown. Brown is still inexplicably popular there.

[ProSense]

7. No we don't. He hasn't announced it.

Republicans are playing games.

This is why McCain is now saying he doesn't want to confirm anyone.

He is about as relevant as Mitt.

[aaaaaa5a]

3. Yes.

Plus, giving Kerry a cabinet position could cost us a Senate seat. We can't take the risk. Its time we were as strategically tough as the GOP.

[bigwillq]

5. I hope he doesn't.

I am not a big fan, even before the Benghazi debacle.

[Tx4obama]

11. What did she do 'before' Benghazi that you didn't like. Just curious. n/t

[bigwillq]

59. Didn't think she handled things well in Rwanda

under Clinton. She seems to make a lot of mistakes. Not sure she's up to the task of being SOS.

[Cha]

34. She did no wrong in the Benghazi.. It's pure republicon horse SHIT. Yeah, and

why don't you like her?

[spanone]

6. 'if' she's his first choice, by all means nominate her. i wouldn't give the opposition a thought.

[CTyankee]

8. I say yes. Obama should follow thru on his best instinct if that is Susan Rice and not give in to

republicans shit fits.

The American electorate is tired as hell of this stuff coming out of Congress. They want progress on the issues that matter to THEM, not this crap!

[The Second Stone]

9. He definitely should go to battle on this.

It is an easy winner and will weaken the Republicans. Plus Hillary should stay on until she is confirmed. Republicans hate Hillary as much as they hate Obama.

[Auntie Bush]

20. Is that a fact? ReThugs hate Hillary as much as Obama?

I really doubt that... but I haven't talked in depth to any ReThugs

[left on green only]

32. I agree with the upthread original hyphothesis.....

.......I live in the pulse of right wing, red neck, rural America, and I can easily testify that hate radio here has done a real job on Ms. Clinton. Almost everyone here *hates* her with an intense passion. It appears to me that it has been this way, going all the way back to when she was First Lady.

Funny thing is, I don't think anyone even knows, or can state *why* they feel that way about her; but I get the impression that it's an emotional thing that was washed into their tiny brains by everyone's favorite talk hate radio hosts. I mean, we're not dealing with people who hail from a region of this state that is known for its' intellectual prowess. So I can easily imagine what it's like in most parts of the red states.

There is a part of me that thinks it all started back when she didn't divorce Pres. Bill for his, umm revealed indiscretions.

[Laura PourMeADrink]

45. Really? I am stuck in Rethug country too - and I have found that these people like her - isn't

her approval rating in the 60's? Gotta be pulling many reps.

What's interesting with the bigots is that they hated her when she was FL. (remember the baking cookies comment?)

Then, when she was up against a black man, they gave up on their "females can't run things" philosophy and ran to her for cover to hide their blatant racial bigotry.

[left on green only]

68. The way it worked in this right wing arena, back when she was running....

....against President Obama for the Democratic nomination, was for them to say, "They are both despicable " "Can't figure out which one I *hate* more". "But it really doesn't matter because 'America's party' is going to win the next election." But the way they used to deny her existence was to refer to her in conversation as just, "Hillary". And it was spoken with a snarl in the voice, so as to indicate their total disdain for her.

So I punked them all on November 7th, on the morning after the election, by silently placing a box of Kleenex tissues on each of the tables in this town's cafe.

[Laura PourMeADrink]

69. OMG, that's so funny (Kleenex)....did anyone say anything to you?

I know the snarl. Kind of like the way they say "OBAMACARE"

What state are you in? I'm in central TX

[left on green only]

71. Yes! Yes!! Yes!!! You know what I mean exactly.

It is the *exact* same snarl that they use when they say the word OBAMACARE.

I live along the southern rim of Yosemite (Bass Lake), but perhaps I am being a bit cruel in my characterization of the total population here. I mean, now that I think about it, I did notice a bumper sticker on a local car that said "Mountain Democrats" on it. That was about 2 weeks *before* the election, and I was so moved that I approached the driver, who was completely unfamiliar to me, and I complimented them on their courage. At first there was a look of total bewilderment on their face, so I pointed to the bumper sticker. Then they said that it isn't really all that bad in this area, and they told me about their group "Mountain Democrats", and invited me to attend a meeting, sometime.

Now, in the weeks since the election, I have noticed two more cars driving about town with the same bumper sticker; and I'm pretty sure they were different cars.

But you have to understand my trepidation. Most of the people here drive pick-up trucks, and *all* of the pick-up trucks have gun racks in the windows.

Another way to describe it is to say that I was a bicyclist when I moved here. I came from a metropolitan area where cycling was a respected means of transportation. I even used to get paid a monthly stipend by my employer for riding my bike to work every day, because it meant that they didn't have to expend energy in finding a place for me to park my car.

But after I came here, when riding my bicycle, I became sport for the pick-up truck drivers, just like most of the animals lying along the road that they award themselves points for. I kid you not.

As far as my punking them with the boxes of Kleenex tissues went, it was received by them just like I calculated it would be. It was one of those type of things that I am sure didn't even phase them, until much later that night. You know, about the same time they realized that they had the same plug of chew in their mouth since just before dinner. And I don't even want to tell you what I suspect the men were doing when they realized it.

[vaberella]

52. They do. n/t

[Walk away]

54. They will in 4 years! nt

[liberalmuse]

10. To hell with the misogynist, revisionist Republican shills.

They are mindlessly ganging up on her because they can. Someone needs to slap these old fuckers right down.

[Lucinda]

12. She was approved for her current position with unanimous consent from the senate

I haven't heard much of anything that would lead me to believe that there is serious objection to her being put forward...unless I am missing something that she has done re: the UN since 2009 which would prove her unfit for the job...

All this current noise is political posturing.
That said, I don't have a favorite nominee for the SOS position.

[hrmjustin]

13. I wanted kerry but now i want him to pick a fight.

[JVS]

14. This appointing thing isn't the president's forte. He should delegate the appointing to Biden.

[OldDem2012]

15. Is the President going to let the GOP dictate how he conducts foreign policy? Hell, no! nt.

[GoCubsGo]

43. Nail, meet Head.

That is EXACTLY what they are trying to do here. And, I doubt they will stop at foreign policy. They'll probably pull the same shit with every other nomination he makes. John Kerry's name has come up for the position, too, and they are already starting to pull the "Swiftboater" shit again on him.

[Eleanors38]

61. The GOPers want to resume the narrative that Obama..

is easily rolled by the far right, and they esp. want the Demo rank & file to see it.

[WillyT]

16. Yes... Spineless Dems Need Not Apply !!!

[City Lights]

17. Absolutely!

He should not let the crank repukes influence his choice.

[Raine]

18. YES, absolutely ... nt

[MzShellG]

19. Absolutely! As long as they are both up for a fight......

Susan Rice is more than qualified. Regarding Benghazi, Dr Rice was just doing her job. She has impeccable credentials.

[brentspeak]

21. Absolutely not. She didn't demonstrate much intelligence

by uncritically accepting and relating to Congress what was clearly erroneous information concerning the attacks. An elementary school child would have had the basic common sense to realize that a coordinated terrorist plot was behind the attacks and not some stupid YouTube video.

[yardwork]

24. It was not her job to question the intelligence that she was provided.

In the hours and days immediately after the attack it was not at all clear what had happened. Have you read the transcript of her actual words - not what the Republicans are saying she said, but what she actually said?

[brentspeak]

26. Yes, I did read what she said

And it was obvious to the entire world at the time that the attacks were pre-planned.

Libyan President Mohammed el-Megarif, not a Republican, said the following on September 16:

http://www.npr.org/2012/09/16/161228170/consulate-attack-preplanned-libya-s-president-says

Consulate Attack Preplanned, Libya's President Says

snip

"The idea that this criminal and cowardly act was a spontaneous protest that just spun out of control is completely unfounded and preposterous," he says. "We firmly believe that this was a precalculated, preplanned attack that was carried out specifically to attack the U.S. Consulate."

[yardwork]

57. Why aren't you blaming Petraeus for the false information, then?

It was the CIA that put together Rice's talking points, according to Petraeus's testimony. He claimed in testimony that the message had been revised somewhat by "other agencies" but he was extremely vague on that. The fact remains that the CIA was the source of Susan Rice's information, an approved message given to her and to the White House. Now we know that the CIA was deeply involved in this entire mess. That CIA - the one run by Petraeus until he resigned days after the election.

[Cha]

35. You are spouting rw talking points .. ugly stupid ones.

[magical thyme]

40. It is not her job to speculate, share her personal suspicions, or everything she may or may not know

It is her job to be a diplomat and to relay *approved* messages.

Believe it or not, and despite GOP yelling to the contrary, Americans do NOT automatically have some 'right to know' everything that is going on every minute of the day. There is such a thing as secret, classified information that is shared based on security clearance and need to know.

[Laura PourMeADrink]

46. I think she lacks political savvy. But, what I don't know is ...was she asked to make the comments

she did. Or, did she speak on her own accord.

[yardwork]

58. Petraeus himself confirmed that the CIA gave Rice the talking points.

Last edited Wed Nov 21, 2012, 12:00 AM - Edit history (1)

People in Susan Rice's position don't "speak on their own accord." When they testify to Congress their responsibility is to report official information that was provided to them by intelligence agencies.

We have no idea whether Susan Rice believed that information or not, and if we did, that would be a sign that she wasn't doing her job. Again, it is not her job to go off script.

[Laura PourMeADrink]

62. was it really necessary to add the "try to keep up" comment?

[yardwork]

64. No. I'm just irritated with the right-wing talking points.

[Laura PourMeADrink]

66. Ok, I hear ya. I do wish it would someday be ok for us to give opinions

on our own people and not be labeled a "right-wing-talking pointer" I have never really liked her....but it is nothing based on anything factual or her sterling background - just a reaction to her tone and personality. I just think it would be better for the future to have someone more respected by the other side (I do believe there are people like that). Otherwise, if we ram her through, they will be picking her every single word and move apart for the next four years. And, before people say they will do that with anyone, I don't recall too much of it with Hillary, do you?

[yardwork]

70. Those are good points.

I don't know much about Rice. There may be good reasons why she is not right for SoS.

I apologize for being rude earlier.

[Laura PourMeADrink]

22. No. Please don't. Why create a firestorm? It's just not worth it. Isn't UN Ambassador

a great enough reward? I know, she's brilliant and totally qualified - but I do think she lacks political savvy.

[magical thyme]

42. The GOP is creating the firestorm. He has to get through it...and the fastest way through

through is a straight line.

There is no getting around them. They've made their intentions clear for some years now, and certainly McCain's announcement that he won't support *anybody* that the President nominates makes clear they have no intention of changing.

[Laura PourMeADrink]

44. you have to pick your battles....although pushing her through may make them look bad....why do it?

There are plenty of people who would be better

[Paladin]

47. Gotta Keep Our Powder Dry, Huh?

Sorry, not this time around. What's the point of trashing the repubs, if we don't make the most of it?

[Laura PourMeADrink]

48. On the other hand, what happened in Benghazi was a tragic event that calls to light

the fact that someone, some group, did not protect our people. There may be tons of mitigating circumstances, but it's a fact that they weren't safe and they died.

All we can do is focus on making others safe now. I see no value to this administration by dredging up this unfortunate incident even more...which would surely happen in confirmation hearings. She would have to say "well, I just said what they told me to say" which sounds weak.

[Paladin]

63. Sorry, I'm Not Going For It.

Embassy duty in much of the word is a dangerous business, and tragic things happen. If Obama craters to repub droolers like McCain and Graham this early in his second administration, there will be unmitigated hell to pay.

[Laura PourMeADrink]

67. Don't cave on tax revenues, something infinitely more important. We just don't agree,

no problem. >

[magical thyme]

53. Re-read the title of the thread.

Note that it is *not* about whether or not Susan Rice is President Obama's first choice. It is *if* she is his first choice, should he nominate her? She may not be his first choice, in which case he shouldn't nominate her.

President Obama chose his battles for the last 4 years. How many nominations did he make in his last term that were deliberately derailed? Bucket loads of them.

The GOP is baiting him. Note that McCain has already stated he intends to block anybody President Obama nominates. It's not about Susan Rice. It's about President Obama and he shouldn't take the bait. If she is his first choice, he should nominate her. If she is not his first choice, he shouldn't nominate her.

Personally I think he should re-nominate everybody for every position that has been left hanging for years and if the GOP plays obstruction, then appoint them all during a recess. No more bogging the government down in endless fights over nominations.

As far as the security failure at Benghazi, it is being investigated. General Patreaus has already said it was an intelligence failure. The CIA failed. Security failed. There may have even been prisoners held. That is something we the people may never know because much of what happened or didn't happen is likely classified and shouldn't be released. Not that that will stop the GOP from outing more CIA agents and operations, putting more lives at risk and wasting more of our precious resources.

None of which has *any* bearing on Susan Rice doing her job as a *diplomat* and sticking to approved talking points, versus personal speculation. She did what she was supposed to do in her position, plain and simple.

[Laura PourMeADrink]

65. I understood the title completely, and I still say he shouldn't nominate her. We disagree nt

[Rowdyboy]

23. McCain is bluffing...the party can't afford to attack a well qualified Black woman right now and

they know it. The president should appoint whoever the hell he wants to.

[David Zephyr]

28. +1,000

Absolutely. (Edited for my idiotic spelling.)

[Rowdyboy]

31. Especially if they start making them actually "Talk" when they filibuster...The PR nightmare

would be gut-wrenching for Republicans.

[yardwork]

25. If the president thinks that she is the best choice, why wouldn't he nominate her?

The Republicans have got nothing.

[David Zephyr]

27. Yes. It's the President's choice.

She's brilliant. She is more than qualified

And now, she has shown class, grace, dignity and patience throughout all the vile attacks upon her.

Absolutely.

[Blasphemer]

29. Absolutely he should

It would be an important statement making nomination and I have no doubt she would be easily confirmed. If they want to put on a dog and pony show, let them. After Clarence Thomas, the GOP has no room to talk about the qualifications of nominees put before the U.S. Senate.

[left on green only]

30. I think he should nominate her just out of spite. n/t

[Cha]

36. That ain't gonna happen.

[quinnox]

33. A firm No

There are many better choices. Rice is tainted and the longer this goes on the more convinced I am that she should step aside gracefully.

[Laura PourMeADrink]

50. +1000. And, if he pushes her through they will be critical of her throughout her tenure. why

create this situation. Pick someone everyone respects

[Cha]

37. Of course.. who gives a shit about John McCain, Lindsey Graham, Kelly Ayotte,

and the rw teabagger republicon House?

[leftlibdem420]

38. Please.

And pass filibuster reform to make McLame's heart give out.

[quaker bill]

39. after filibuster reform

make them get up behind the podium and explain why using CIA talking points and how not disclosing heavily classified information about who we were hunting over the attack was a disservice to the country.

[magical thyme]

41. Absolutely. The GOP has already made it clear their intention is to obstruct anything and everything

McCain's insistence that he won't approve *anybody* until he knows everything that happened (which has been hashed to death in the hearings he couldn't be bothered with attending :eyes make it clear they intend to continue with obstruction.

The President should nominate whoever is his 1st choice for every cabinet position and judge position and every other position opening up. And then should make a big fat steaming pile of recess appointments so he can get on with his job.

[treestar]

49. Of course. Would it not be "caving" not to?

[vaberella]

51. My question is: Why not? n/t

[Walk away]

55. Exactly. nt

[ceeRoy]

56. If John Kerry wants it fine!

It seems like a job that would fit the character of a mediator...a hostess if you will....suited more for Susan Rice. John Kerry would be more of a SoDefense to me.

[Jennicut]

60. Of course. Don't back down from empty Repub threats.

Screw them. Obama's approval rating has gone up after the election. I am sure the Repubs will only look foolish in trying to stop Rice from being SOS.