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Donkees

(31,270 posts)
Sun Nov 26, 2023, 08:00 PM Nov 2023

'Hunger, desperation, and destruction': UN team on northern Gaza

Samer AbdelJaber, the head of the World Food Program (WFP) in Palestine, has recounted a UN mission to provide food to Al-Ahli Hospital and surrounding areas.

AbdelJaber said that while being able to deliver food to the hospital in Gaza City was a “promising step”, the UN team saw “hunger, desperation, and destruction”.
“The [UN] team recounted painful stories from the people who haven’t received any aid in weeks,” he said.

Central and northern Gaza, including Gaza City, the largest city in the Gaza Strip, have been largely cut off from humanitarian aid since Israel claimed it cut the Gaza Strip in two in early November.







Samer AbdelJaber
@SamerWFP

https://www.aljazeera.com/news/liveblog/2023/11/25/israel-hamas-war-live-israeli-officials-say-39-palestinians

29 replies = new reply since forum marked as read
Highlight: NoneDon't highlight anything 5 newestHighlight 5 most recent replies
'Hunger, desperation, and destruction': UN team on northern Gaza (Original Post) Donkees Nov 2023 OP
Al Jazeera is a Hamas propaganda arm. nt LexVegas Nov 2023 #1
you dispute the content of this video then nt msongs Nov 2023 #2
UN remains alarmed by multiple reports of multiple rapes of Israeli women and children on October 7. lapucelle Nov 2023 #3
Al Jazeera-speak for "hostage". lapucelle Nov 2023 #4
I feel that the word 'captive' is ... Think. Again. Nov 2023 #5
Oh let me help! I have a dictionary handy! lapucelle Nov 2023 #6
Yes, thanks!... Think. Again. Nov 2023 #7
"Hamas didn't take [the hostages] to use in making any demands." lapucelle Nov 2023 #8
I don't understand this response. Think. Again. Nov 2023 #9
Civilians are not prisoners of war. nt yagotme Nov 2023 #13
The definition supplied by the post I responded to... Think. Again. Nov 2023 #21
You don't think Hamas kidnapped these people TexasDem69 Nov 2023 #10
They were "taken and held as or as if a prisoner of war"? Think. Again. Nov 2023 #12
No, no demands, only getting a 3-1 exchange rate for them... nt yagotme Nov 2023 #14
If the exchange had been initially demanded by hamas... Think. Again. Nov 2023 #19
Searched several spots, this is the best detailed account I can find: yagotme Nov 2023 #26
Thanks for sharing that... Think. Again. Nov 2023 #28
YW nt yagotme Nov 2023 #29
A 10 month old baby is not a POW pinkstarburst Nov 2023 #18
STOP. Think. Again. Nov 2023 #20
The amount of people on here whatabouting a humanitarian catastrophe Eko Nov 2023 #11
Yep Goddessartist Nov 2023 #27
''The Palestinian Red Crescent Society has said its teams have not been able to deliver any aid to northern Gaza today'' Donkees Nov 2023 #15
Update: Aid trucks now getting through Israeli checkpoint ... Donkees Nov 2023 #17
Why would Hamas do this to their own people? Bonx Nov 2023 #16
hamas has been working against the well-being of Gazans... Think. Again. Nov 2023 #22
Hopefully the items making their way to the north are helping a significant portion of the population David__77 Nov 2023 #23
The plan to finally open a humanitarian aid corridor by sea from Cyprus will be a big help too Donkees Nov 2023 #25
Ceasefire NOW LiberaBlueDem Nov 2023 #24

Think. Again.

(7,658 posts)
5. I feel that the word 'captive' is ...
Sun Nov 26, 2023, 08:35 PM
Nov 2023

...just as bad as 'hostage', no? I mean if there is a major difference in the semantics, I really don't see it.

lapucelle

(18,160 posts)
6. Oh let me help! I have a dictionary handy!
Sun Nov 26, 2023, 08:51 PM
Nov 2023
captive
: taken and held as or as if a prisoner of war


hostage
: a person taken by force to secure the taker's demands

https://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/

Glad I could clear that up for you!


Think. Again.

(7,658 posts)
7. Yes, thanks!...
Sun Nov 26, 2023, 09:06 PM
Nov 2023

...so it seems ''captive" is a more correct word, seeing that hamas didn't take them to use in making any demands. Taking them 'captive', as if prisoners of war during a terrorist massacre, is in my opinion, even worse.

But really, I think this is all trivial in the face of how horrific this entire thing is.

lapucelle

(18,160 posts)
8. "Hamas didn't take [the hostages] to use in making any demands."
Sun Nov 26, 2023, 09:28 PM
Nov 2023
"Civilians abducted from their homes (including children) are really prisoners of war, not hostages."






Think. Again.

(7,658 posts)
21. The definition supplied by the post I responded to...
Mon Nov 27, 2023, 03:39 PM
Nov 2023

....states:

captive: taken and held as or as if a prisoner of war.

My response was appropriate to that definition.

TexasDem69

(1,630 posts)
10. You don't think Hamas kidnapped these people
Sun Nov 26, 2023, 10:35 PM
Nov 2023

From their homes to use as bargaining chips? Why do you think they seized these civilians then?

Think. Again.

(7,658 posts)
12. They were "taken and held as or as if a prisoner of war"?
Mon Nov 27, 2023, 02:36 AM
Nov 2023

Last edited Mon Nov 27, 2023, 03:41 AM - Edit history (1)

Considering that hamas has not made any 'demands' in which these people would be "used as bargaining chips", I don't see how the rigid definition of 'hostage' that lapucelle supplied in post #6 applies.

Of course, perhaps hamas had indeed planned to make some sort of demands for less violence in the West Bank or something (but I don't think hamas has ever been concerned with the well-being of Palestinian civilians), but they have given no indication that the intention of taking the Israeli civilians was as hostages to bargain with, so that leaves me no other explaination except that they were taken captive as if prisoners of war.

Think. Again.

(7,658 posts)
19. If the exchange had been initially demanded by hamas...
Mon Nov 27, 2023, 03:28 PM
Nov 2023

...I would agree with you, do we know if that's the case?

yagotme

(2,909 posts)
26. Searched several spots, this is the best detailed account I can find:
Tue Nov 28, 2023, 10:37 AM
Nov 2023
https://www.cnn.com/2023/11/21/politics/negotiations-israel-hamas-hostages/index.html
Doesn't specifically say that Hamas asked for that ratio, but prior exchanges have usually been in the terrorists favor.

Think. Again.

(7,658 posts)
28. Thanks for sharing that...
Tue Nov 28, 2023, 10:46 AM
Nov 2023

...from that account, it seems that both sides were reluctant to do any kind of deal and that it was really the Biden team that got it all together.

pinkstarburst

(1,326 posts)
18. A 10 month old baby is not a POW
Mon Nov 27, 2023, 01:56 PM
Nov 2023

A 3 year old toddler girl is not a POW. These are hostages, taken by brutal terrorist savages. That you want to play word games and try to soften or justify the actions of these animals is disgusting. There is no justifications. Every person involved in October 7th should be found and executed.

Think. Again.

(7,658 posts)
20. STOP.
Mon Nov 27, 2023, 03:33 PM
Nov 2023

I did not start these word games, I responded to another that did.

I do not believe the words used are any more or less damning than each other.

I have posted numerous times that I believe no justification is needed for taking out hamas entirely and permanently.

Donkees

(31,270 posts)
15. ''The Palestinian Red Crescent Society has said its teams have not been able to deliver any aid to northern Gaza today''
Mon Nov 27, 2023, 01:41 PM
Nov 2023

Donkees

(31,270 posts)
17. Update: Aid trucks now getting through Israeli checkpoint ...
Mon Nov 27, 2023, 01:49 PM
Nov 2023

2m ago (17:40 GMT)
Update: Red Crescent manages to deliver aid to north Gaza
The Red Crescent says 40 trucks with humanitarian aid were able to enter Gaza City and the northern areas through the Israeli checkpoint that dissects the besieged coastal enclave.

Earlier, we reported the PRCS saying that it was not able to send aid to the north of the Strip. (10:30 AM)

Think. Again.

(7,658 posts)
22. hamas has been working against the well-being of Gazans...
Mon Nov 27, 2023, 03:43 PM
Nov 2023

...since they took office, and Gazans do not agree with it;

From foreignaffairs.com:

"The argument that the entire population of Gaza can be held responsible for Hamas’s actions is quickly discredited when one looks at the facts. Arab Barometer, a research network where we serve as co-principal investigators, conducted a survey in Gaza and the West Bank days before the Israel-Hamas war broke out. The findings, published here for the first time, reveal that rather than supporting Hamas, the vast majority of Gazans have been frustrated with the armed group’s ineffective governance as they endure extreme economic hardship. Most Gazans do not align themselves with Hamas’s ideology, either. Unlike Hamas, whose goal is to destroy the Israeli state, the majority of survey respondents favored a two-state solution with an independent Palestine and Israel existing side by side.

(Full article: https://www.foreignaffairs.com/israel/what-palestinians-really-think-hamas )

David__77

(23,302 posts)
23. Hopefully the items making their way to the north are helping a significant portion of the population
Mon Nov 27, 2023, 04:27 PM
Nov 2023
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