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Donkees

(31,381 posts)
Mon Nov 20, 2023, 05:19 PM Nov 2023

Jeff Merkley: "I am calling for a ceasefire''

Merkley, who represents Oregon, in a post on X said: “I am calling for a ceasefire – a cessation of hostilities by both sides”.

“To endure, the ceasefire and the following negotiations must accomplish other essential objectives, including the release of all hostages and a massive influx of humanitarian aid,” he said.



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Jeff Merkley: "I am calling for a ceasefire'' (Original Post) Donkees Nov 2023 OP
I'm calling for peace throughout the world FBaggins Nov 2023 #1
The alternative isn't working so hot gratuitous Nov 2023 #2
So glad to see him adding his name. Nanjeanne Nov 2023 #3
Great news! RainWalker Nov 2023 #4
Yes ! More must do this. Thank you Senator Merkley. Autumn Nov 2023 #5
This message was self-deleted by its author Autumn Nov 2023 #6
Good to see! Basic LA Nov 2023 #7
The thing is that there was already a ceasefire in place when totodeinhere Nov 2023 #8
Yeah and if Israel keeps bombing more innocents including the hostages will die. It has to fucking stop Autumn Nov 2023 #9
If Israel stops bombing then Hamas will regroup and rearm and totodeinhere Nov 2023 #14
Not going to stop it's been going on all my lifetime. Nuttyahoo should stop keeping Hamas in power. Autumn Nov 2023 #16
Bibi is not keeping Hamas in power now. Iran is. totodeinhere Nov 2023 #17
He kept Hamas in power a lot more than the early years. Try more like he was still supporting Hamas in 2021. Autumn Nov 2023 #18
You have your facts wrong. totodeinhere Nov 2023 #19
You are wrong. Autumn Nov 2023 #20
What you quoted are opinion pieces totodeinhere Nov 2023 #21
If Israel stops bombing then Hamas will regroup and rearm and totodeinhere Nov 2023 #15
The bombing campaign appears to have slowed. maxsolomon Nov 2023 #10
Now time to stop military aid. David__77 Nov 2023 #11
Must be real easy to say when you don't have ISIS living in the next state over. GuppyGal Nov 2023 #12
Very important paragraph BlueCheeseAgain Nov 2023 #13

FBaggins

(26,727 posts)
1. I'm calling for peace throughout the world
Mon Nov 20, 2023, 05:39 PM
Nov 2023

I demand no more anger or hatred. Swords must be turned into plowshares.

gratuitous

(82,849 posts)
2. The alternative isn't working so hot
Mon Nov 20, 2023, 05:41 PM
Nov 2023

But we've sure gotten used to it; so accustomed that it's the height of hilarity just to posit another way of conducting our affairs.

Response to Donkees (Original post)

totodeinhere

(13,058 posts)
8. The thing is that there was already a ceasefire in place when
Mon Nov 20, 2023, 06:42 PM
Nov 2023

Hamas attacked on October 7th. And if there is another ceasefire Hamas will regroup and re-arm and then attack again cease fire or not,

Autumn

(45,055 posts)
9. Yeah and if Israel keeps bombing more innocents including the hostages will die. It has to fucking stop
Mon Nov 20, 2023, 07:10 PM
Nov 2023

and maybe the people in Israel will get rid of that fucking Trump clone Netanyahu who has kept Hamas in power for the last 16 years. Also I'm pretty damn sure there is no limit on ceasefires.

totodeinhere

(13,058 posts)
14. If Israel stops bombing then Hamas will regroup and rearm and
Tue Nov 21, 2023, 01:51 PM
Nov 2023

kill more innocent people in Israel. And the fact that more hostages may die is the fault of Hamas. They are the ones who took the hostages after all. And as I said before a ceasefire will not work simply because Hamas will not honor the ceasefire and will continue with their killing spree. Terrorist groups do not honor ceasefires. The only way to deal with a terrorist group is to eliminate it. And eliminating Hamas is a goal that President Biden agrees with.

Regarding Bibi, yes he needs to go. But his exit from the political scene will not change the dynamics of this conflict. There is broad agreement across the Israeli political spectrum that Hamas must be eliminated.

Autumn

(45,055 posts)
16. Not going to stop it's been going on all my lifetime. Nuttyahoo should stop keeping Hamas in power.
Tue Nov 21, 2023, 02:26 PM
Nov 2023

totodeinhere

(13,058 posts)
17. Bibi is not keeping Hamas in power now. Iran is.
Tue Nov 21, 2023, 02:33 PM
Nov 2023

Yes there are reports that the Israeli government enabled Hamas in its early days as a counterweight to the Palestinian Authority. And that strategy is now widely regarded in Israel as a mistake. But Bibi certainly is not keeping Hamas in power now. Quite the contrary actually. And please do not infer that I support Bibi because I vigorously oppose him and his right wing government. But that is a topic to pursue once Hamas is gone from the scene.

Autumn

(45,055 posts)
18. He kept Hamas in power a lot more than the early years. Try more like he was still supporting Hamas in 2021.
Tue Nov 21, 2023, 03:16 PM
Nov 2023

totodeinhere

(13,058 posts)
19. You have your facts wrong.
Tue Nov 21, 2023, 03:39 PM
Nov 2023

In the summer of 2014 Israel and Hamas waged a 50-day war. The Israeli government was not supporting Hamas at that time. They were fighting them.

https://www.unrwa.org/2014-gaza-conflict

Autumn

(45,055 posts)
20. You are wrong.
Tue Nov 21, 2023, 05:01 PM
Nov 2023
https://www.timesofisrael.com/for-years-netanyahu-propped-up-hamas-now-its-blown-up-in-our-faces

For years, the various governments led by Benjamin Netanyahu took an approach that divided power between the Gaza Strip and the West Bank — bringing Palestinian Authority President Mahmoud Abbas to his knees while making moves that propped up the Hamas terror group.

The idea was to prevent Abbas — or anyone else in the Palestinian Authority’s West Bank government — from advancing toward the establishment of a Palestinian state.




Keep Hamas alive and kicking'

https://www.cbc.ca/news/politics/netanyahu-israel-gaza-hamas-1.7010035

This symbiotic relationship between Netanyahu and Hamas has been remarked on for years, by both friends and enemies, hawks and doves.
Yuval Diskin, former head of Israel's Shin Bet security service, told the daily newspaper Yedioth Ahronoth in 2013 that "if we look at it over the years, one of the main people contributing to Hamas's strengthening has been Bibi Netanyahu, since his first term as prime minister."

In August 2019,former prime minister Ehud Barak told Israeli Army Radio that Netanyahu's "strategy is to keep Hamas alive and kicking … even at the price of abandoning the citizens [of the south] … in order to weaken the Palestinian Authority in Ramallah."
The logic underlying this strategy, Barak said, is that "it's easier with Hamas to explain to Israelis that there is no one to sit with and no one to talk to."
March 12, 2019 Netanyahu defended the Hamas payments to his Likud Party caucus on the grounds that they weakened the pro-Oslo Palestinian Authority, according to the Jerusalem Post:
"Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu defended Israel's regular allowing of Qatari funds to be transferred into Gaza, saying it is part of a broader strategy to keep Hamas and the Palestinian Authority separate, a source in Monday's Likud faction meeting said," the Post reported.

"The prime minister also said that 'whoever is against a Palestinian state should be for' transferring the funds to Gaza, because maintaining a separation between the Palestinian Authority in the West Bank and Hamas in Gaza helps prevent the establishment of a Palestinine state.
Netanyahu insisted that neither the money nor the construction material given to Hamas would be diverted to military purposes. But today, the IDF finds itself showing how Hamas has done exactly that — by diverting and converting civilian funds and materials to warlike purposes.

The military tried to warn him at the time, former IDF chief of staff Gadi Eisenkot told the Ma'ariv newspaper. He said Netanyahu acted "in total opposition to the national assessment of the National Security Council, which determined that there was a need to disconnect from the Palestinians and establish two states."


It is well know that at least up till 2021 he was still supporting Hamas.

totodeinhere

(13,058 posts)
21. What you quoted are opinion pieces
Tue Nov 21, 2023, 05:22 PM
Nov 2023

based only partly upon verifiable facts. During the same time period Israel has fought several skirmishes with Hamas so how could they be supporting them and fighting them at the same time?

It is a very complicated matter and remember that former PM Barak is Bibi"s political opponent so his comments should be approached with that context in mind

totodeinhere

(13,058 posts)
15. If Israel stops bombing then Hamas will regroup and rearm and
Tue Nov 21, 2023, 01:51 PM
Nov 2023

kill more innocent people in Israel. And the fact that more hostages may die is the fault of Hamas. They are the ones who took the hostages after all. And as I said before a ceasefire will not work simply because Hamas will not honor the ceasefire and will continue with their killing spree. Terrorist groups do not honor ceasefires. The only way to deal with a terrorist group is to eliminate it. And eliminating Hamas is a goal that President Biden agrees with.

Regarding Bibi, yes he needs to go. But his exit from the political scene will not change the dynamics of this conflict. There is broad agreement across the Israeli political spectrum that Hams must be eliminated.

maxsolomon

(33,310 posts)
10. The bombing campaign appears to have slowed.
Mon Nov 20, 2023, 07:22 PM
Nov 2023

The fighting is more direct, and theoretically more targeted on militants. The Palestinian Health Ministry isn't claiming as many deaths since the ground operations have started - that I've read.

Aren't many innocent civilians in the tunnel network. A temporary ceasefire for hostage exchange and humanitarian aid may work, but the IDF isn't going to pull back yet.

BlueCheeseAgain

(1,654 posts)
13. Very important paragraph
Mon Nov 20, 2023, 08:05 PM
Nov 2023
Hamas must release all the hostages without conditions and lay down their arms. And Hamas, which continues to defend the savage slaughter of Israeli citizens on October 7th and advocate for the obliteration of Israel, has to go. It can no longer have operational control of Gaza.


I suspect if Hamas did all of this, Israel (or at least the reasonable majority within it) would be very happy to have a ceasefire.
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