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vercetti2021

(10,111 posts)
Mon Nov 6, 2023, 07:18 PM Nov 2023

Something I keep thinking about

Just a little over 10 years ago during the 2012 election. Romney shot himself in the foot when the hidden video came out with his 47% comment. That alone killed his chances, outside of binders full of women and corporations are people too. Now this is literally a decade ago when these types of comments were campaign killers.

Now hypothetically. Imagine what is being planned if Trump does indeed get put back in about becoming a dictator and turning America into a fascist shit hole. Now apply those words and plans a decade ago. People would have been absolutely shocked and appalled if Romney or any other conservative that might have gotten the nom would have uttered their plans to install a dictatorship. Obama literally would have ended up well above 400 ECV's because people would have been absolutely terrified by the idea of that.

Now fast forward to now. Where these words actually don't fuck your campaign, they actually might boost you. Now this is my question. Where the fuck in this timeline did people become so desensitized to this crazy shit that they are actually okay with giving up being free?

38 replies = new reply since forum marked as read
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Something I keep thinking about (Original Post) vercetti2021 Nov 2023 OP
I think it was having a Black President that broke them Nictuku Nov 2023 #1
But how is one so small that such a historic thing could break you? onecaliberal Nov 2023 #11
Because they're serious racists, such an event "shouldn't" have happened. ... electric_blue68 Nov 2023 #29
A black man was elected President. MOMFUDSKI Nov 2023 #2
I get this is likely a huge catalyst vercetti2021 Nov 2023 #4
It was an electoral college landslide, and the popular numbers were impressive but it was still Scrivener7 Nov 2023 #9
Ehh Polybius Nov 2023 #14
It wasn't a landslide Polybius Nov 2023 #15
It didn't inthewind21 Nov 2023 #30
If a black women gets elected maybe they'll go all mad and jump in the lake !! uponit7771 Nov 2023 #38
What is with it with DUers who seem incapable of writing a few paragraphs without using profanity? elocs Nov 2023 #3
Really? vercetti2021 Nov 2023 #5
That is one kick-ass fucking question you pose there, elocs! Scrivener7 Nov 2023 #6
Well la-dee-da nt Tree-Hugger Nov 2023 #7
What is it with DUers Ferrets are Cool Nov 2023 #13
There was profanity in the OP? Niagara Nov 2023 #19
+1 well said LuckyCharms Nov 2023 #21
Whew. Niagara Nov 2023 #23
Whewwww!! LuckyCharms Nov 2023 #24
Profanity is a legitimate tool when expressing a thought. LuckyCharms Nov 2023 #20
"sign of a limited vocabulary' - nope, exactly the opposite. TwilightZone Nov 2023 #26
Wht is it with DUers inthewind21 Nov 2023 #31
Well shit I_UndergroundPanther Nov 2023 #33
Social scientists have found that very few cachukis Nov 2023 #8
What about people I_UndergroundPanther Nov 2023 #34
You are in the 20% who have it together. cachukis Nov 2023 #37
That is a scary thought senseandsensibility Nov 2023 #10
Ypu missed one thing. Ferrets are Cool Nov 2023 #12
I cannot understand how KentuckyWoman Nov 2023 #16
The 2012 election was all about the economy, "Romney's trickle-down economics on steroids betsuni Nov 2023 #17
Yes. Many rural whites do not know many Black people. raging moderate Nov 2023 #28
A county over from where I live I_UndergroundPanther Nov 2023 #35
That is quite good KentuckyWoman Nov 2023 #32
That is striking to think about, the contrast between those two. Xavier Breath Nov 2023 #27
Then you're forgetting the 2012 primary clown car... JHB Nov 2023 #36
Lots of bigots out there and Joinfortmill Nov 2023 #18
I see several contributing factors. Niagara Nov 2023 #22
Yeah they dislike black and brown people but, they hate Dems and Libs with every fiber of their being. Hotler Nov 2023 #25

onecaliberal

(32,121 posts)
11. But how is one so small that such a historic thing could break you?
Mon Nov 6, 2023, 08:36 PM
Nov 2023

If there was a god, these people would not exist.

electric_blue68

(14,354 posts)
29. Because they're serious racists, such an event "shouldn't" have happened. ...
Tue Nov 7, 2023, 10:19 AM
Nov 2023
...Twice!!!!!

imho think that President Obama being elected twice is what did it.

How so?

Well it happened only once some could argue it was a fluke, they "momentarily" got shifted into The Wrong Timeline - and now they were back where they "should" be, and all's right with the world. ("Phew!", they think)

But Twice?!!!
That's some kind of trend. "Omg" - there's less racist white people!

Cue panic, rage for then, and misery for the rest of us when drumphf was elected. 😒😔

MOMFUDSKI

(4,730 posts)
2. A black man was elected President.
Mon Nov 6, 2023, 07:28 PM
Nov 2023

That is exactly the moment a load of normal white people lost their minds. I watched it happen close up to a good friend of mine who I have had to walk away from.

vercetti2021

(10,111 posts)
4. I get this is likely a huge catalyst
Mon Nov 6, 2023, 07:31 PM
Nov 2023

But given Obama had a landslide victory 4 years after his first victory, I feel the minds weren't completely busted just yet. I just wonder where in the years following between 2012 and 16 where the timeline got fucked up.

Scrivener7

(50,367 posts)
9. It was an electoral college landslide, and the popular numbers were impressive but it was still
Mon Nov 6, 2023, 07:43 PM
Nov 2023

66 million to 61 million. A 5 million difference which is not that much if you figure we have about 150 million adult people in the USA.

I do think some people left the political arena and all the people who absolutely hated the idea of the Obama presidency but didn't habitually vote came out of the woodwork when the defendant began spouting his dog whistles.

Polybius

(14,982 posts)
14. Ehh
Mon Nov 6, 2023, 10:37 PM
Nov 2023

I don't even consider it an Electoral landslide. A true landslide hasn't happened since 1988, and consists of 400+ Electoral Votes. Here's a great thread on the topic:

Will there ever be another true Presidential landslide (400+ Electoral Votes) ever again?

Polybius

(14,982 posts)
15. It wasn't a landslide
Mon Nov 6, 2023, 10:39 PM
Nov 2023

In fact, he got less Electoral Votes than he did in 2008, and far less than Bill Clinton did both times. Last true landslide was 1988.

 

inthewind21

(4,616 posts)
30. It didn't
Tue Nov 7, 2023, 10:44 AM
Nov 2023

It literally happened in 2008. That was when the doors to asylum opened and the loons came flooding out into the public. Think the Tea Party and Sarah Palin. These loons have ALWAYS been here, they just weren't as vocal and in your face so the warning bells that have been ringing for decades and steadily getting louder (especially after 2008) were dismissed, ignored or completely missed.

The issue as I see it, the left, center and sane republicans (if there is such a thing) failed to recognize/acknowledge the huge problem charging right at us and it was assumed "that would/could never happen here" and then there was the election 2016, and it was too late. I wish I had a dollar for every time pre 2016 election night I heard from liberal friends or family members "don't worry, Trump will never be elected, don't worry, ROE is decided law or Oh that would never happen here" etc., hell I was even hearing that well into election night 2016. And now, the rest is history.

elocs

(22,351 posts)
3. What is with it with DUers who seem incapable of writing a few paragraphs without using profanity?
Mon Nov 6, 2023, 07:30 PM
Nov 2023

I have used profanity, usually at home alone, not in public and never in over 50 years of writing, especially if what I've written is public.
But then I did go to college for newspaper writing and was taught that the use of profanity is the sign of a limited vocabulary. I agree.

vercetti2021

(10,111 posts)
5. Really?
Mon Nov 6, 2023, 07:32 PM
Nov 2023

That's your take away? Because I dropped a few curse words? This isn't about how I write my FUCKING threads, it's about where in this ten year gap where shit started to become bad.

Scrivener7

(50,367 posts)
6. That is one kick-ass fucking question you pose there, elocs!
Mon Nov 6, 2023, 07:35 PM
Nov 2023

Let us all ponder the fucking scourge of cussing.

Niagara

(7,036 posts)
19. There was profanity in the OP?
Tue Nov 7, 2023, 08:28 AM
Nov 2023

Anyways ... Science says that people who curse actually have more intelligence, are more honest, have a higher pain tolerance and have a much larger vocabulary compared to those that don't. Swearing is also a way some people deal with stress.


I'm not sure what the BFD is, we're all adults here. Even Pres. Biden has dropped a few profanities in his day. It's all good.

Niagara

(7,036 posts)
23. Whew.
Tue Nov 7, 2023, 09:08 AM
Nov 2023

Thank you, Baloney Butt.



I'm simultaneously typing responses and trying to get ready for work at the same time. It's not really panning out. I'll try to get to your dermatologist thread in a few hours.


LuckyCharms

(17,144 posts)
20. Profanity is a legitimate tool when expressing a thought.
Tue Nov 7, 2023, 08:43 AM
Nov 2023

It is colorful, and can be used for emphasis.

I cannot relate to people who never swear.

I grew up being chastised by my older siblings because I sometimes use profanity.

It took me years to overcome that guilt, and realize there is nothing wrong with swearing.

With all the problems in the world, profanity use isn't even on my radar of undesirable things.

 

inthewind21

(4,616 posts)
31. Wht is it with DUers
Tue Nov 7, 2023, 10:56 AM
Nov 2023

who seem incapable of entering a discussion without announcing their own imagined superiority first?

I_UndergroundPanther

(12,336 posts)
33. Well shit
Wed Nov 8, 2023, 12:52 AM
Nov 2023

If you dont like profanity dont post it.

However its not my responsibility to avoid setting off your particular peeves.

Some people cuss others dont sometimes oh poopy does not express what needs to be said.

Besides cussing is psychologically healthy and tends to be a trait of honest people. Look it up.

cachukis

(2,099 posts)
8. Social scientists have found that very few
Mon Nov 6, 2023, 07:41 PM
Nov 2023

people, less than 10%, want the responsibility of leadership. Religion has capitalized on that reality very well.

The demigods of history are made on this factor.

Look at the Soviet Union's attempt at democracy. Look now at China's inept response to Hong Kong economics.

Autocrats rule because they can.

We were born out of the Enlightenment. It's like we wouldn't be here if a giant asteroid hadn't done in the dinosaurs.

I believe in the 20% rule. We are where we are because 20% of us have it together. 80% don't have a clue but will manage what they accept.

If we let it go it will be gone forever. Because there is another 20% who want to take it away.

I_UndergroundPanther

(12,336 posts)
34. What about people
Wed Nov 8, 2023, 12:58 AM
Nov 2023

That tend to get put in leadership roles when they arent even thinking of it?
This kind of recruitment has happened to me a few times in my life. I have great leadership skills they say and I think, who me? Oh hell no.

Sometimes my moral compass gets me in that position.I cant stand bullies abusing or taking advantage of people. So I stand up even when nobody's standing up because I cant let the bullshit continue or my conscience will kick my ass.

cachukis

(2,099 posts)
37. You are in the 20% who have it together.
Wed Nov 8, 2023, 07:09 AM
Nov 2023

My point was that very few people want the job. Those who rise to the occassion are generally more humble and considerate.

senseandsensibility

(16,281 posts)
10. That is a scary thought
Mon Nov 6, 2023, 08:11 PM
Nov 2023

It's the crux of the matter, really. And to answer your question, enough voters have become desensitized to the crazy largely because the media enables it.

Also, although I don't use swear words because I do think it's more interesting to find other ways to communicate intensity of feeling, I don't blame you at all. It was warranted.

KentuckyWoman

(6,635 posts)
16. I cannot understand how
Mon Nov 6, 2023, 10:47 PM
Nov 2023

How the GOP went from Mitt Romney to Donald Trump in one election. It makes no damn sense. None.

All things considered, I don't understand how in the blue smithereens so called Conservatives would support him in a primary, let alone in an election. Sure social media propaganda will work on some, but 74 million? That just hurts me.

betsuni

(24,820 posts)
17. The 2012 election was all about the economy, "Romney's trickle-down economics on steroids
Mon Nov 6, 2023, 11:46 PM
Nov 2023

versus Obama's focus on the middle class" "the issue that exposes the contradiction between GOP policies and political imperatives. By (accurately) painting Romney as a plutocrat fighting for his fellow plutocrats, Obama claimed the populist mantle and easily won reelection ... won in rural, very white midwestern areas on the strength of his economic message.

"Afterwards, Republicans dissected Romney's political carcass to determine cause of death. The RNC released a report that called for the party to be less racist (LOL). ... There were analysis of data, technology, and campaign spending. The Republicans were simply out-messaged in quality and quantity. ... The Republicans needed the ability to change the subject to issues that animated their base. ... What came next were more media outlets, better data, more digital ads, and a souped-up messaging operation.

"Four years later, the economy was barely an afterthought in the presidential campaign. ... By controlling the narrative and centering the campaign on racially divisive cultural issues, Trump turned out Republican voters, won over a shocking number of people who had voted for Obama in 2012, and helped convince more than 4 million 2012 Obama voters to stay home. The 2016 election proved that disinformation-based politics was a necessary ingredient of Republican success. ... True, conservatives could abandon their unpopular corporatist policies and racist rhetoric, but that would anger their donors and the base. ... So, rampant disinformation and propaganda it is!"

Dan Pfeiffer, "Battling the Big Lie: How Fox, Facebook, and the MAGA Media are Destroying America"

raging moderate

(4,251 posts)
28. Yes. Many rural whites do not know many Black people.
Tue Nov 7, 2023, 10:00 AM
Nov 2023

Many rural whites in the northern United States hardly ever see a Black person, except on TV or the internet. I lived in various small towns up and down the state of Illinois during my lifetime. No matter what was going on, no matter what verifiable facts I stated, these people were determined to keep their prejudices intact. I remember one man, about 45 years ago, fulminating on how he would chase off any Blacks who tried to invade his little town. Another man in this school district said at some point that Hitler actually was not a bad leader. I remember a woman in another town, about 30 years ago, fulminating how how awful it was that a white girl she knew was dating a Black kid. "What's wrong with him?" I asked. "Nothing. He's a nice kid," she said. "Well, then, why are you upset?" I asked. She turned away, fulminating under her breath. As I spoke to whites in this town, a few of them finally told me that they believed they had managed to get a small band of only the finest Black people to settle in their town, and they did not want to stretch their luck by allowing any others in.

I_UndergroundPanther

(12,336 posts)
35. A county over from where I live
Wed Nov 8, 2023, 01:05 AM
Nov 2023

In Cecil county
There is an actual sunset town,Rising Sun.

That place is creepy and has 1 traffic light a yellow blinking caution light . Its a small town,tiny.

At dusk the racist butthole sheriff will chase you out of town and follow you out aggressively if there is a black person in the car with you..

Its like a trip back to the bad old days.

Xavier Breath

(3,407 posts)
27. That is striking to think about, the contrast between those two.
Tue Nov 7, 2023, 09:55 AM
Nov 2023

It would be like saying in 2012 that your personal hero was Mr. Rogers, but by 2016 that had changed to Ted Nugent.

JHB

(37,105 posts)
36. Then you're forgetting the 2012 primary clown car...
Wed Nov 8, 2023, 01:16 AM
Nov 2023

...and how the base wanted "anybody but Mitt", but they spent the whole season cycling through the darlings of the moment. One guy would say something they liked, they'd all go "YAY!", then their opposition would turn up other things they said and the mob would turn on him: "BOO!" And this happened for what? Five? Seven? different candidates. They all got a piece of the action, but the only one consistently racking up delegates was Mitt. Once Mitt was a lock, the base grumbled but went with him. Well, except the ones who wouldn't vote for him because he was Mormon.

In 2015, the base was still pissed at the establishment for losing in 2012 (despite how much FOX had assured them Mitt would win), Trump roared out with the sort of unvarnished bile they'd been suckling on from Rush and FOX and the whole RW echo chamber for decades, and they all thought "He says what I'm thinking". Of course he did: he'd had people research what was most popular in RW media and fed it back to them at full volume, not in code like the regular politicians.

So he got the anti-establishment faction behind him right out of the gate, while Jeb proceeded to demonstrate that there was no such thing as "the smart Bush", and all the others -- Cruz, Rubio, etc. -- were inept clods whose only hope was for Trump to flame out, but the base they'd all built wouldn't budge from him. The base was Ahab, and Trump promised them white whale steak dinners for life, and the hagfish would pay for it.

Trump didn't change the party, he stripped off the last bit of glossy varnish and exposed the rot.



Niagara

(7,036 posts)
22. I see several contributing factors.
Tue Nov 7, 2023, 09:00 AM
Nov 2023

The first was already mentioned, we had a black man as President and the bigots lost their minds.


The second is there is a cult leader running his cult. I remember two different instances where what TFG said riled people up and there were people hell-bent that it was the absolute truth, even though it wasn't.

Early 2011, he falsely accused PBO of being born in Kenya and people believed him, and some still do.

Back in 2014, Ralph Wilson the owner of the Buffalo Bills died. There were two people seriously considering buying the team, John Francis Bongiovi Jr also known as Bon Jovi and TFG before he was the former guy. TFG enlisted a man named Michael Caputo (doubt he ever paid him) to convince the entire City of Buffalo that if Bon Jovi purchased the team, it would become a Canadian team. Bon Jovi said no that wasn't true, but the damage was already done and it was so bad that the Buffalo DJ's refused to play Bon Jovi songs. Again, people still believe to this day that Bon Jovi would have moved The Bills to Canada. In the end, Terry and Kim Pegula purchased The Bills.


It looks to me that we also have a programming problem with certain Media outlets. Unfortunately, I was subjected to Right Wing Hate Radio on station WBEN during two separate jobs that I had in the past. When people are generally subjected to this nonsense, they fall into being brainwashed and I continually zinged them out loud and during work hours when I subjected to this type of programming.

Hotler

(11,212 posts)
25. Yeah they dislike black and brown people but, they hate Dems and Libs with every fiber of their being.
Tue Nov 7, 2023, 09:34 AM
Nov 2023

It gnaws at them 24/7. If they take power, they will come for us.

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