The Cost of White Discomfort

[sheshe2]

It's near impossible to find language visceral enough for the rage I feel about the murder of Jordan Neely. Not because it is foreign to me. No, this rage is familiar and practiced. It rises in my chest like fire every time another Black name becomes a hashtag, every time one famous flag has reason to fly: “A man was lynched yesterday.”

That fire has taken up residence in my body; it has occasion to visit me often and knows each nook and cranny. And since May 1, when Jordan, a Michael Jackson impersonator and unhoused man complaining of thirst and hunger on the New York City subway, was choked to death by a white former marine, the fire has stayed.

Across social media, lamenting onlookers privileged enough to think America’s racism dissolved after the protests of summer 2020 have asked how this could happen. Marginalized people know the answer. Intimately understanding the ways of an oppressive world is the only way we can survive. Black people know the many manifestations of supremacy well; we take and share copious notes each time it raises a hand against us. Anything less would be unsafe.

In the wake of Jordan’s murder, Kenneth Jones’s and Tema Okun’s definition of the “right to comfort” haunts me: “The belief that those with power have a right to emotional and psychological comfort … I have a right to be comfortable, and if I am not, then someone else is to blame.”

When Daniel Penny was not comfortable on the F train, he single-handedly decided that Jordan was to blame.

https://www.thecut.com/2023/05/jordan-neely-paid-the-price-for-white-discomfort.html

You really must read the full article. Four paragraphs does not do it justice.

[brer cat]

1. K&R

[enough]

2. Another paragraph from the article:

There is not a Black person in America who, somehow, some way, has not seen this in action. Even those who refuse to believe their own eyes know, deep down, that disrupting white comfort is a crime punishable by death. It is a sentence upheld not only by violent perpetrators, but by everyone who casually advances a culture that prioritizes white comfort above all else. That culture killed Jordan before his murderer ever approached him.

[sheshe2]

6. Thank you for adding that, enough.

Four paragraphs are not enough to tell the story. Many don't read to the end.

[NotVeryImportant]

3. Powerful.

[img][/img]

[LoisB]

4. That was powerful. Thank you for posting this.

[LoisB]

7. I hope everyone reads the entire article.

[sheshe2]

9. Thanks, LoisB.

[blm]

8. Seriously important read.

Especially as a sibling to a schizophrenic sister who has had numerous public episodes.

[sheshe2]

10. Hugs to you and your sister, blm.

Thank you so much for reading.

[Bernardo de La Paz]

11. magats love extra-judicial killings. . . . nt

[canuckledragger]

12. To answer one of the questions posed in the article...

About if it would be me that would stay silent on a subway car if I saw someone getting choked to death...the answer would be no.

My childhood consisted of being the scapegoat for my abusive alcoholic step-father whenever his ego or whatever was hurt. Trump's narcissistic behaviour comes to mind.

I can't stand by now if I see someone abusing someone else who can't fight back easily...and learned from my step-father's example that they usually won't try that shit with someone who can fight back.

I'll get physically involved if I have to, because my conscious would never leave me alone if I allowed an idiot like that to kill someone in front of me. Consequences be damned, but hope they'd fall on the asshole that tried to hurt/kill someone who couldn't fight back.

[malaise]

13. Must Read

Painful but so true

[sheshe2]

16. It is, malaise.

[LuckyCharms]

14. My hope is they can upgrade the charge to murder.

A former marine would know that if you keep someone in a choke hold for 15 minutes, they're going to die.

Jordan Neely was a strikingly handsome young man who was in need.

He was murdered. He was purposely killed.

[MomInTheCrowd]

15. Important to also read the comments.

[sheshe2]

17. I have reached my limit over there and can't go back to read them.

Could you post a few?

[liberalmuse]

21. I wish I hadn't. Collectively Americans are leaning towards evil.

The comments were very defensive and the commenters seemed to be doing exactly what they are accusing the author of the piece of doing. We hear enough on a daily and even hourly basis from the bigots, classists and racists who are so fearful of anything outside of that tight little bubble they exist in that they can justify murdering a man who did not in fact assault anyone on that train, "But he might have!". They are not too far from those who gun down children playing near their house or someone knocking on their door. How many horrors and atrocities are committed by people who justify it all by stating such and such a person or entire population "may" pose a "potential", "possible", "theoretical" threat at some undetermined point in the future? God this shit gets old.

[liberalmuse]

18. "White Discomfort" - perfect phrasing.

That was a powerful piece.

[SpamWyzer]

19. I find it simply incredible

that not one person offered to buy Jordan Neely a meal. In China the standard greeting translates to "Have you eaten?" A death and prosecution have resulted because we do not understand that HUNGER is the RIGHT TO EAT. As if there isn't enough food to give it away while we dump it in dumpsters daily...RIP Jordan Neely. "I was hungry and you fed me..." I know those words from somewhere.

[sheshe2]

22. Well said, SpamWyzer.

[MLAA]

23. +1

[Lucky Luciano]

32. People on subways usually just avoid any eye contact with...

…the various people begging for money etc. if they are particularly loud or unkempt/smelling of something bad. It definitely is uncomfortable, but I don’t know what would possess someone to get physical with them if they were just being loud. Usually, I would just switch subway cars at the next stop.

I did move to Chicago from NYC two years ago for work and have only ridden the train three times to Cubs games, so I don’t think about train safety too much. Grabbing a coffee one day near work, a random homeless scumbag took a sucker punch swing at me while I was minding my own business walking down the street in his direction. Luckily, I ducked and he missed and I just kept walking. It was actually pretty smooth and nonchalant. If he wasn’t so unkempt, I probably would have punched back, but I really didn’t want to be anywhere near this guy or even touch him and I moved on. Another homeless guy was walking behind me. A minute later, I asked him, “did you see that?!” He said, “Yeah, motherf$&@er tried to take you down!” Then I slipped back into the office 15 seconds later. I have wondered if the second homeless guy was working with the first one to try to rob me and it just didn’t work. I think that’s part of the reason I spoke to him. To make it clear that I was aware of my surroundings.

People like that with clear mental problems will make people uncomfortable. They are unpredictable.

[oldsoftie]

38. And if you hadn't been as quick as you were? Who knows

THIS guy had been arrested dozens of times. He's assaulted people. He punched a 67 yr old woman in the face. He's not just "a Michael Jackson impersonator". And he was threatening people on that train, not just asking for a meal. We've all seen numerous videos of aggressive people on subways. I'd like to hear statements of those who were sitting there BEFORE this happened before I slam this guy for what he did.

[The Wandering Harper]

49. but did he deserve to be executed?

no, he needed help. If he had only been restrained and not killed, maybe. But no

[Haggis 4 Breakfast]

50. He did NOT physically threaten anyone

And NO passenger on that train said otherwise.

This marine - trained to kill - put that man in a chokehold that is ILLEGAL in all fifty states. He chose to be judge, jury and executioner on a homeless man who posed him NO threat.

As a retired military guy, I am sickened by these former grunts who think they're somehow doing the community a service by taking matters into their own (unelected, unwarranted and unsolicited) hands and dispensing "justice".

It further ignites my rage when I see a fascist swinging dick like Ronda Santis gush over the guy like he's some kind of hero. deSantis needs to stay in FL where he's been elected (to do a job that seems to bore him) and STFU.

[Sympthsical]

51. He did threaten people.

Witnesses told police Neely had been begging for food and acting erratically on an F-line train before Penny intervened. According to witnesses, Neely was screaming about being hungry and tired but didn't attack anyone.

According to prosecutors, several witnesses saw Neely making threats and scaring passengers. Penny approached Neely from behind and placed him in the chokehold, taking him to the floor, prosecutors said in a bail application Friday.

https://www.cbsnews.com/news/daniel-penny-surrenders-jordan-neely-subway-chokehold-death-manslaughter-charge/

You know, the people charging the crime who we hope have been interviewing witnesses in all this.

Did Neely deserve to die? Of course not. No one does in that situation.

However, this "Just hungry and asking for food and didn't do anything wrong until this random guy just leapt in and took him out from a clear blue sky" is absolutely the purest gas-lighting. In fact, I'd call it willful dishonesty.

If people cannot be honest about circumstances when discussing events, what's the point? And this dishonesty and wrong claims have been perpetuated everywhere. Why bother with truth when narrative is more fun?

[Haggis 4 Breakfast]

52. As I said,

Neely DID NOT PHYSICALLY THREATEN ANYONE.

This was murder.

Penny chose to put Neely in a lethal chokehold that is ILLEGAL in ALL 50 states.

Those are the FACTS. Sorry they don't matter to you.

[Sympthsical]

54. People are not obligated to wait until violence is done

The reasonable threat of violence is sufficient.

No, Penny should not have done what he did. He has been charged, and a jury will now decide if he's guilty and deserves punishment. That is right and proper.

However, what is ignored is that two additional people also restrained Neely. One of them was a black man. Was he also acting out of *checks OP* white comfort?

Do you see why these kinds of ideologically driven pieces fall apart upon first glance? They only work if you absolutely ignore every piece of context humanly possible to narrow events down into what you want them to be.

I do not want to live in a world where you have to actually wait until someone puts a steel pipe to your face before acting. That happened to someone on a bus I was on in Berkeley a few years back. The person was clearly agitated - I was definitely keeping an eye on him the entire time - then conk. Got a random rider right in the face. That three people all felt there was sufficient threat should speak to the circumstances at the moment.

I don't want to live in the world people are advocating for, where threats and potential violence are things to be tolerated. And if you don't want to tolerate them, you're somehow racist?

That's cuckoo bananas.

[NotVeryImportant]

58. What do you think "white comfort" means?

Do you think it means you're white?

No, it means doing things to promote white comfort.

[Sympthsical]

61. Not tolerating threats is comfort

Last edited Sun May 14, 2023, 10:59 AM - Edit history (1)

I love this framing. The author's concept is so stupid-on-the-surface bone-jarringly dumb, but no, we're going to pretend this is somehow a sensible thing.

Only people who have disappeared way, way up their own could possibly write these things.

Sometimes, I almost cannot believe it isn't some kind of self-aware parody or joke being played on others to see what a writer can get people to go along with just for giggles.

[NotVeryImportant]

57. Key quotes from your link...

1. According to witnesses, Neely was screaming about being hungry and tired but didn't attack anyone.

2. According to prosecutors, several witnesses saw Neely making threats and scaring passengers.

3. Penny approached Neely from behind and placed him in the chokehold, taking him to the floor,

4. While Neely was in the chokehold, two other males helped Penny by restraining Neely's arms. When Neely stopped moving, Penny continued holding him for a period of time and released him,

5. "There was no attack," Mills told reporters. "Mr. Neely did not attack anyone, he did not touch anyone, he did not hit anyone. But he was choked to death, and that can't stand. That can't be what we represent."

6. Last week, the attorneys said Neely was "aggressively threatening Daniel Penny and other passengers," and that Penny and others "acted to protect themselves."

So, within this report there are conflictions.

That being that he threatened people. In other reports, before this one, they quoted witnesses, none of which stated that he actually threatened anyone.

Common sense dictates that had Neely actually threatened someone, this report would have quoted those words.

Bottom line, he didn't threaten anyone, certainly not the killer specifically.

An honest, non-biased jury will convict that son-of-a-bitch.

[Sympthsical]

60. A jury will decide

I agree with charges being brought. You take a life, you answer for it.

However, I strongly disagree that when someone is threatening others with violence - even if they have not yet committed the violent act - everyone is obligated to just sit there, do nothing, and hope nothing happens.

If people feel they are reasonably under threat, I have no issue with restraint until law enforcement arrives. Common sense dictates that if three separate people felt the need to intervene - including another Black man - circumstances were such that they felt the threat being presented warranted it.

We'll see what evidence is presented and what the jury decides.

However, I reject wholly this idea of "white discomfort" and the underlying assertion that people should just live to learn with threats or else they're exerting racial privilege.

That is the kind of nonsense only people writing from the safe enclosure of a pajama'd existence on the internet could actually believe. Others must always bear the burden for one's self-satisfied righteousness. It's tired, predictable, and see-through at this point.

And it makes society just a tiny bit worse so others can signal their own piety to others. It's gross.

[NotVeryImportant]

65. Who did he threaten with violence?

What's the quote?

[BlackSkimmer]

62. He has so many arrests on his record, and some of them are violent. Easy to research.

Of course he didn't deserve to die, but I've been on subway trains where people are acting erratically and been scared to death.

It's very frightening because things can change on a dime.

When I was 16, in Paris, I got on the subway with my parents after a nice visit to some site or other.

All of a sudden I heard my father saying "Merci, merci" in a voice I'd never heard. A guy was reaching into my dad's pocket for his wallet. My dad was a big man, over 6 feet, slim and strong, and he had ahold of this fellow's wrist with a death grip. The thief had waited so he could grab the wallet and jump off as the doors closed.

It probably only lasted a few seconds, but it seemed like forever. The thief relinquished the wallet, and dad shoved him, none too gently out the door as they began to close. I remember him screaming French obscenities at us as the train pulled away.

My sister and I were in awe, never having seen my dad act in such a way.

But though a successful American businessman by then, he had grown up in the slums of London. He didn't hesitate to act. People who've never been stuck on a train carriage with an obviously disturbed person UNDERGROUND just have no idea how frightening that is. There is no way if knowing, especially in this country, if the person is armed.

Wish I could rec your last paragraph.

[XanaDUer2]

63. Longtime nyc subway rider here

In the 70s, even, when it was bad. If they had moved, and he followed, what to do? Of course he should'nt have been killed. But subway spaces are SMALL and tight.

[NotVeryImportant]

66. So now you're bringing up a scenario, that didn't happen.

If they moved, and he followed.

Why are you doing this?

BTW, I rode the subways for over a decade myself.

Dig this, I once went clubbing, took the subway late night/early morning from Manhattan going to the Bronx, and woke up in Brooklyn, so you know what that meant.

I was fine.

I've seen it all on the subways, the homeless are mostly just talking nonsense. Nobody has to kill them for it.

[BlackSkimmer]

72. "Dig this", I'm guessing you're a male.

I’ve been on subways in several different countries, and I’ve seen some scary incidents. I’ve also seen passengers terrified, especially the elderly, who are afraid to move to another sear or car because they don’t want to draw the disorderly person’s attention, or ire.

Your experience as a sleeping and drunk male means absolutely nothing to most of us who might be in a small space with an apparently uncontrollable person.

Nobody thinks this guy should have been killed, but you’ve obviously never been in a situation where you genuinely feel trapped and afraid.

How fantastic for you that you think passing out on a subway is a cool story.

[malaise]

55. Well said

That is all

[NotVeryImportant]

56. You are lying.

What did he threaten anyone with?

Please quote it.

Include links as well.

Thank you.

[oldsoftie]

59. Comfy calling people "liars" huh? Did you watch the news when it happened? No.

Have you read any stories about it?
https://www.thecut.com/article/jordan-neelys-death-what-we-know.html

"Neely began aggressively threatening Daniel Penny and the other passengers, Daniel, with the help of others, acted to protect themselves"

https://nypost.com/2023/05/12/jordan-neely-chokehold-death-witness-praying-for-daniel-penny/

“This gentleman, Mr. Penny, did not stand up,” the rider said. “Did not engage with the gentleman. He said not a word. It was all Mr. Neely that was … threatening the passengers. If he did not get what he wants.”

But I'm sure you'll dismiss these accounts for whatever reason. You can find other stories with similar accounts if you like. I'm not lying about that either.

[NotVeryImportant]

64. What's the account exactly?

It doesn't state exactly what he did that was threatening.

Just some vague mention of "being threatening."

What is/was the threat?

Again, I refer to previous accounts from witnesses that stated that Neely didn't swing at anyone, didn't lunge at anyone, didn't physically touch anyone, didn't even come CLOSE to anyone.

However, what we KNOW is that Penny came up from behind, with all the training, might and power of his Marine experience, attacked and strangled to death an unarmed man half his size.

These are facts, so yes, I'm comfortable calling you a liar.

[oldsoftie]

70. You move the goalposts of course. You're full of shit. I gave u links; you dont like them.

You asked for "links" to ANYONE saying he was threatening. I gave you TWO. One of them quotes a passenger; she said they were being threatened. You said that wasnt the case. I also said from the very beginning "lets see what the people there said" Well, THAT older lady said the guy was threatening them. But she didnt specify exactly HOW he was doing that so to you that means it didn't happen.
You say "Again, I refer to previous accounts..." You NEVER mentioned any "previous accounts" in your post calling me a liar; just that it never happened. Neither of us KNOW it did or didnt; I showed you two stories that say it did just like you asked me to do. The jury will hear from all of them.

[NotVeryImportant]

71. I acknolwedged your post, however, I said that's rather vague

It's the same flimsy standard racist and ultra-violent cops use whenever they kill an unarmed Black American without warrant.

"I felt threatened."

Again, I'm asking what was the "threat."

Did he come close to you? Did he swing at you? Did he even say he was going to kill you.

You will notice, there is zero evidence of anything like this taking place.

Doesn't this concern you?

BTW, it's the same standard used by the Emmitt Till racist lady, "he looked at me and I felt threatened."

America has a sordid history of this when it comes to Black Americans. Somehow white feelings leads to Black death.

[orthoclad]

33. I would have offered him a meal

or at least money for one, in preference to attacking him.
Honestly. I've fed people.
I don't know how much good that would do for someone suffering systemic hunger and homelessness, but judging by what I and others have done in the past, that would be a reasonable, human reaction. Not killing him for inconveniencing me.

There are a number of times I've avoided eye contact with disturbed people, but if they're screaming that they're hungry, that's different.

[RobinA]

45. Have You Ever Been

on an NYC subway?

[MustLoveBeagles]

20. Bookmarked for later

Thank you for posting sheshe

[ismnotwasm]

24. Excellent!

Thank you Sheshe2

[sheshe2]

26. Hey, ismnotwasm.

I really didn't think anyone would read this. I am thrilled that they did.

This one hit me hard. Really hard.

Thanks my dear, miss seeing you.

[MLAA]

25. Thank you sheshe2 for the article.

I hope the killer finds plenty of discomfort in prison. I don’t mean being attacked or sexually assaulted, just extreme and constant discomfort from being incarcerated.

RIP Jordan Neely.

[Sympthsical]

27. Wishing to be free of violent threat is not "comfort"

This article diminishes the right of people to feel secure and dismisses it as privileged comfort.

As if wanting security is in itself a wrong-headed view only the privileged retain. Accepting threats in public, accepting the uneasiness around potential violence is really the only acceptable path here. Get used to crime, get used to mental illness, get used to drug addiction.

If you are not used to these things or do not want to be, well, you're kind of racist, aren't you?

Accepting this view - and let's be honest, you have to be comfortable and patronizingly racist to accept this view - is ironically one of the most comfortable things imaginable. Who accepts these views? The most comfortable people who know that what they applaud is not something they themselves will ever personally be subjected to.

It is an endorsement of squalor, of degradation, of toxic societal corrosion. And it is endorsed so as a bizarre act of awareness and righteousness. No one's going to actually get out of their chairs and help the homeless, feed the hungry, or calm the agitated. No, they're just going to write things like this or read things like this and pat themselves on the back for having done so. "Look, I read the article. This makes me a good person if I let others know I've read it."

Absolute. Bare. Minimum.

I often understand people do not often read what is said. However, in this case, I not only studied this knowing no one read or thought it through, I achieved that rare realization that the author herself put just about zero thought into writing it. If she actually followed her own logic to its conclusion, our society would be arguably much worse. We would accept things we should not accept and be comfortable with things we should not be comfortable with.

If you don't want to feel under threat by what is happening in many of our cities, you're just privileged and comfortable.

What did everyone do for Jordan Neely before he was killed?

I'll wait for the receipts. I suspect they will be rather sparse. But the crocodile tears, well, at least they're visible. That visibility is very much the point, I expect.

[Raine]

30. +1 👍

[Lonestarblue]

39. I rode the NY subway system many times to and from work when I lived in New York.

And, yes, violent behavior in such a contained space is threatening. Most people tried to just ignore the behavior. I would occasionally get off at the next stop just to escape someone who was threatening and catch another train. So I understand the discomfort, but I do not understand the reaction by the passenger who killed Neely. Surely two people on the train could have prevented him from attacking anyone and could have gotten him off the train at the next stop. I’m not sure that privilege comes into this situation as much as over-reaction to a perceived threat that was perhaps more annoyance than threat. Is it the same reaction that saw an elderly man shoot a teenager twice just for ringing his doorbell or the man who killed a young woman when the car she was in was simply turning around because they were lost? I don’t know if the former Marine intended to kill Neely, but he surely knew that a chokehold could cause death. Some people in this country think that violence is their right even with minor irritations.

[oldsoftie]

40. Now THIS is a reasoned well written response.

As I stated in another post, I'd like to hear from those who were sitting there before the guy grabbed Neely. He was known to be violent, he wasnt simply "a Michael Jackson impersonator". What level had he reached on that day on that train? And as you say, just how much are we supposed to accept as "Oh well"?

[llmart]

46. +1

Excellent response.

[NowISeetheLight]

28. My Belief

I have a right to not expect to be a victim when I go out. That doesn’t make me racist, comfortable or anything else. It makes me a human being. I see nothing wrong with hoping I can go out without being threatened (or worse). It may happen anyway, but there are things you can do to reduce the odds.

[electric_blue68]

29. Will go and read the rest. Just so happens MSNBC Alex Wagber 9 o'clock repeat just had Jumani...

Williams - NYC Public Advocate on speaking about the cracks in the Mental Health system, and trying extend, and link continuing care once a patient leaves the hospital after a psychiatric crisis.

The man should not have been murdered. If he hadn't touched anyone, or, say, swung at anyone - he probably shouldn't have restrained either.


And I've ridden NYC's subways for about 58 years. (not much these past 3 yrs re Covid) Had one really crazy thing happen. Been uneasey on occasion.


ETA can't read the re used up my free articles for the month
At least I'll go read posts here

liveralmuse:

, "But he might have!". They are not too far from those who gun down children playing near their house or someone knocking on their door.

Alex W also brought this up before talking to Mr Jumani

[live love laugh]

31. The fact that he and others could've simply moved

to another part of the train makes this all the more unacceptable. They seemingly attacked him like the folks on that 9/11 flight when there really wasn’t any danger.

All who attacked him should be punished.

[oldsoftie]

41. You dont think he would've simply followed?

I'll wait till I hear from those who were there but not involved in the restraint. Right now as far as I know, we do NOT know what level of threatening actions this guy was taking. And until we do know, I'm not going to judge the guy charged.

[live love laugh]

42. LOL

[orthoclad]

34. A link from The Cut article

https://resourcegeneration.org/wp-content/uploads/2018/01/2016-dRworks-workbook.pdf

"Dismantling Racism
2016 Workbook"

VERY worth reading/saving. Long read.

A sidebar quote from the Workbook:
Civil disobedience is not
our problem. Our
problem is civil
obedience. Our problem
is that numbers of people
all over the world have
obeyed the dictates of
the leaders of their
government and have
gone to war, and millions
have been killed
because of this
obedience.... Our
problem is that people
are obedient all over the
world in the face of
poverty and starvation
and stupidity, and war,
and cruelty. Our problem
is that people are
obedient while the jails
are full of petty thieves,
and all the while the
grand thieves are running
the country. That’s our
problem.
Howard Zinn

[live love laugh]

37. ✔️+

[Goddessartist]

35. Thank you - must read!

Everything in it is so true. It's so heartbreaking.

[Tickle]

36. Are they going to arrest the other two? NT

[Sky Jewels]

43. It's been almost 40 years since the Bernhard Goetz shootings/murders on

the NYC subway ... and here we are. Still in Hell.

[Beacool]

44. Powerful article, but I don't think this case is about "white comfort".

I live in NJ, a few minutes away from Midtown Manhattan. Anyone in this area who rides the subway can tell stories about how it has become drastically more unsafe since the pandemic. Every New Yorker has stories about experiences they had on the subway, but it has gotten worse, even deadly. There are far more violent crimes in the subway system, some committed by regular crooks and some by the mentally ill. Neely had been arrested numerous times, yes he was mentally ill, but that's no comfort when you're on the subway and a person starts acting in a threatening manner. Riders are in fear, and justifiable so. When someone acts in a threatening way, you don't care if that person is white, black, or purple; you only care about your safety. Did Neely deserve to die? Of course not, but I understand why some people support Penny's actions. Do I think that he deliberately killed him? That's hard to tell, he only knows the answer to that question.

The conversation should be about how mental illness has become a huge issue in this country and people are not receiving proper treatment.

[Otterdaemmerung]

47. Should Neely have been restrained, in order to keep him from harming someone? Arguably, yes.

That didn't, however, give anyone the right to murder him.
As a country we seem to have leaned toward an exaggerating "stand your ground" kind of posture: that defending yourself from any sort of threat from others always justifies using lethal means. It doesn't.

[sheshe2]

48. Good post.

Welcome to DU.

[Torchlight]

53. Broke my heart last week listening to coworkers

I otherwise like attempt to justify his actions, minimize the consequences, and rationalize it as something other than what it was. But given enough time, I suppose we all wind up advertising our true character, whether for good or ill.

[GP6971]

68. Welcome to DU. n/t

[Torchlight]

69. Sounds serious.

Gooid luck